Okay, I'll admit it -- I downloaded Jedi Knight II from Kazaa, just to see what the fuss was about. I loved it. I finished the game so quickly that I couldn't justify it to myself to purchase it, though I felt guilty about my piracy -- LucasArts really earned their money on that one.
To make up for my piracy then and to satisfy my hunger created from that crime, I'm going to buy Jedi Knight III -- Jedi Academy. It looks great. Customizable characters, customizable lightsabers, and a choice between the light and dark sides of the Force -- what more can I ask for?
I'm so going with the Dark Side.
I'll wait a month or two for the prices to die down, but when they do, oh boy oh boy... The series doesn't have the brainy fun of, say, Grim Fandango, but I just love the free-for-all duels one can create in the game. Why is it LucasArts can make such great games while Lucas makes such [expletive deleted] movies?
[This post has been edited to get rid of an expletive that should not have been in it. Back off, Lalo. You know better than this.]
[ September 15, 2003, 08:18 AM: Message edited by: KathrynHJanitor ]
Posted by ae (Member # 3291) on :
Just don't go in expecting an actual Jedi Knight III. It's more like an extremely kickass expansion pack.
<---is a pirate and a really bad egg
Posted by Erik Slaine (Member # 5583) on :
Posted by TheTick (Member # 2883) on :
MMM more Jedi Knight goodness. I've a a screenshot of Jedi Academy as my desktop for a while now, showing off the different lightsabers in action. Posted by A Rat Named Dog (Member # 699) on :
The screenshots and the hype are awesome. I thought the demo blew monkey chunks. You can't always trust demos, but in my opinion, it moved weird, the balance was off, and the level layout was impossibly confusing. Still, maybe the demo is a bad representation of gameplay.
Posted by A Rat Named Dog (Member # 699) on :
Jeez, Lalo, can't we agree on anything? Do you like pie?
Posted by TheTick (Member # 2883) on :
That would be unfortunate...How much could they possibly screw it up? It's the same engine! Maybe it's the new moves they added. I'll definitely have to try before I buy.
Posted by Scott R (Member # 567) on :
Do not buy this game.
The customization is a joke. Your character may look different, but that's it-- cosmetic differences. As an CRPG fan I was dissapointed by the lack of options. For example, if you chose to play a human male, you are given three choices of face-- lightskinned Arabian, fair skinned Honkey, and dark haired Honkey.
Take out some of the ridiculously difficult moves, add in more customizability and character development.
The moves-- what difference does it make? Everyone I know who plays these types of games doesn't sit there thinking "Let's see- Jump, walk, and crouch makes me cling to the wall." Because if you're trying to do that kind of move in the middle of a fight, you are a dead man. Just swing the sword, dummy!
I confess to be an absolute spaz when it comes to fighting, though. Maybe it is just me.
The vehicle additions to the game were, for the most part, useless. You get to ride a tonton, for purpose unknown. The swoop bike portion is neat-- but I felt a tad like I was playing Battletoads.
Unfortunately, Eddie, when you finally do get a choice to join the dark side, you have but one mission left. This game would have been vastly improved if the choices made actually were allowed to matter. For example, one of my favorite tactics was Mind tricking someone, then slicing them up. Not nice. Not very Jedi-like. Definitely some dark force badness going down there. But it never mattered (though Kyle Katarn says it does at the beginning of the game. . .)
I chose to go with the light side, BTW.
The levels all generally run like this: run around. Kill some people. Hit a switch-- cutscene, end of level. There were very few puzzles, and very few strategy choices. Again, less time could have been spent in developing cool moves (which go unused), and more on developing a decent game.
The maps are ridiculously convoluted, as Geoff noted.
The addition of dual-lightsabers and saber-staffs is a good one, and the graphics for the default attacks are striking. Graphically, there is a small difference in JKII and JK3; a wavy bubble appears around your hand when use force push/pull. I was using a 16 Meg video card that had difficulty with that. In addition, the Empire has commandos that can cloak-- and the video card I was using had problems rendering that as well. (FYI-- the problems were somewhat alleviated once I figured out I could use Force Sense to see the commandos.)
Speaking of force sense-- this is by far the MOST useful power in the game. It is the best addition to the series, bar none.
The game allows you to choose where to put emphasis on your force powers. In JKII, you were assigned new powers and new power levels every new stage. In JK3, you get to pick. I suppose this is a bone thrown to customizability, but I yawn at it.
If you like FPS' than you may like this game-- I don't really know, because I don't care for FPS.' If you liked JKII, you will almost certainly be disappointed.
Posted by Lalo (Member # 3772) on :
I'd forgotten I made this thread.
I heard bad reviews of Jedi Academy, so I held out for Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic. I'm glad I did. While I dislike the fighting system -- you tell them to attack, and they do it by themselves; no direct control -- the plot's pretty intelligent and gives you tons of choices.
And the acting blows me away. This game alone makes a better movie than any of the Star Wars movies I've seen.
Posted by Scott R (Member # 567) on :
The acting in the cutscenes in JK3 is pretty terrible.
I quote:
"I never could have done it without Kyle."
"Don't go getting all mushy on me, kid."
***
"Are you up for another mission."
"As luck would have it, I am."
Standard fare. Hey, I'm a writer. Why don't they hire me?
Posted by Storm Saxon (Member # 3101) on :
Scott, I ask myself all the time. Why do computer companies not hire a 'real' writer, ie a good writer, to write the dialogue and do plot for their stuff? So many games have good mechanics but awful plots and dialogue, it's almost become a cliche in gaming.
Posted by Scott R (Member # 567) on :
The Baldar's Gate series had some fairly decent writers.
But the absolute, cream-of-the-crop, Best computer game writers award goes to the Quest for Glory series.
Posted by WheatPuppet (Member # 5142) on :
Fallout had some awesome writers. I'm a big fan of the original Fallout studio, which is now the main parts of Black Isle Entertainment and Troika, two of my favorite CRPG companies.
Stay away from Jedi Acadamy... it's fun running around and stabbing people with a lightsaber, and you can disembody people, but it's really just as limited as the last Jedi Knight game. I've heard Knights of the Old Republic is one of the greatest--if not the greatest--Star Wars games ever made. It uses a tweaked version of the Neverwinter Nights game engine, so if you didn't like the way combat worked in NWN, you might not like KotOR.
EDIT: I just realised that the abbreviation for Knights of the Old Republic is almost a palindrome for Return of the King. Coincidence? I think not.
[ November 30, 2003, 07:15 PM: Message edited by: WheatPuppet ]
Posted by fugu13 (Member # 2859) on :
Scott! All the dialog in the game was hand written by George Lucas! How can you so denigrate his elegant and well thought out . . .
Oh wait. Yeah, Lucas probably did write it.
Posted by Storm Saxon (Member # 3101) on :
Note that I am not saying that no games have good dialogue, plot, etc, just as I'm sure you weren't. I was agreeing with the point that you brought up first. For instance, I think Deus Ex did a great job with the plot and writing.
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
Scott, what's the Academy multiplayer like?
Posted by Scott R (Member # 567) on :
About the same as JKII; I haven't looked into it so much, because I always do terribly at multiplayer games that involve. . . you know, pushing buttons and stuff.
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
The reason I ask:
I found that the customizable Force Powers, the Dark Side/Light Side choice, and the "fancy combat moves" were all much more important in JKII:Outcast multiplayer than in the single-player game. If the same holds true here, many of the things you didn't like about Academy are probably due to the fact that you're not really playing it the way it was intended to be played; Academy's meant to be a primarily multiplayer experience, based on the fact that almost everybody played JKII multiplayer obsessively after the single-player experience bored 'em to tears.
Posted by Scott R (Member # 567) on :
People got BORED by the single player game?
WHAT?
But. . . multiplayer has no PLOT! How can people like it better?
That is something I didn't consider, Tom. But given the choice, I'd prefer a stronger single player game. Obviously.
Posted by Lalo (Member # 3772) on :
Tom's got it. Part of the reason why I loved JK II so much was that I could do the cheats that introduced dozens of Lukes and Kyles and Desanns and Tavions into the game, and we could have a free-for-all. Then I'd boost up my Mind Trick and take control of one of the characters, and see how it turns out.
Granted, I'm a geek, but just try to tell me it isn't fun to Jump, then Pull people from the ground to fall, screaming, a hundred virtual feet away.
Of course, I only play the game in my free time between kicking puppies and pulling the fingernails off cute children. But still. Great fun.
Posted by ae (Member # 3291) on :
NPC spawn is even better in JA.
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
"But. . . multiplayer has no PLOT! How can people like it better?"
This is going to sound odd, coming from someone who's as dedicated to the RPG and adventure game genre as I am: in FPS games, it's all about the multiplayer. With very few exceptions, the plots themselves are basically excuses for jumping puzzles -- and the requirements of the plotline generally mean that some of the coolest elements of the combat engine (like special moves, powers, or weapons) are reserved for the end of the game, too late to make any real difference in gameplay. Furthermore, if you're sufficiently good at these games (meaning, for the most part, that you know how to circle-strafe, Force Push, and/or use a sniper rifle), you'll quickly find that the AI isn't much of a challenge unless it's allowed to cheat (which, in single-player, is scripted fairly often).
In a multiplayer FPS, your enemies are as capable of reacting to your tricks as you are of coming up with 'em. All the weapons are available, and all the cool moves and dodges and counters that you never need to use against the stock NPCs become absolutely essential. How many of us, for example, were infuriated the first time we ran up against a guy who maxxed out his Mind Trick and Force Grip and camped one of the Death Star or Bespin bridges -- hiding invisible until some poor soul (i.e. you) ran up to him only to be floated helplessly over a precipice? And how many of us finally realized that skills like Force Sense and Force Pull might, as a consequence, be useful in combat?
I still remember the first time I ran into somebody who had discovered that there was an unblockable, 80-point backstabbing move in JKII (now nerfed, I believe), and as a result always ran BACKWARDS towards his enemies; he looked dorky until he killed you -- until you figured out his game, and then just made sure he looked dorky.
Posted by ae (Member # 3291) on :
And then there were the red stance DFA spammers. People wised up to that real quick, though. I guess it only proves your point.
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