quote:

---

Menorah Jones
Gibson's next biblical epic may be Hanukkah tale. He's interested in the Maccabees, the guerilla fighters whose victory is celebrated during the Jewish holiday by Gary Susman



BIG MACCABEES Gibson wants to tell a Hanukkah story next

It's still not clear if the runaway success of Mel Gibson's ''The Passion of the Christ'' means Hollywood will greenlight more biblical movies, or just that Mel Gibson can now make whatever biblical movies he likes. On Tuesday, he told Sean Hannity on his radio show that his next entry in the genre may be the story of the Maccabees, the Jewish guerilla fighters who led a successful rebellion against Greek conquerors 165 years before Christ, inspiring the Jewish holiday of Hanukkah.

Gibson told Hannity that the story has ''always fired my imagination.'' Recounting the story, which occurred in biblical times but is not recounted in the Bible, Gibson said: ''It's about Antiochus, the king who set up his religion in the Temple, and forced them all to deny the true God and worship at his feet and worship false gods. The Maccabees family stood up, and they made war, they stuck by their guns, and they came out winning. It's like a Western.'' (Or like ''Braveheart'' or ''The Patriot,'' he might have added.)

---

Hmm... how do y'all feel about this?

The above is from Entertainment Weekly, but I cannot link because you must have a subscription to enter.
 

---

Posted by T. Analog Kid (Member # 381) on :
 
I think it's in my bible...
 

---

Posted by Mike (Member # 55) on :
 
Whoa. I thought this was a joke at first (I can see the headlines now: "Gibson Deflects Claims of Antisemitism By Making Hanukkah Movie"). Sounds interesting, though. I wonder if it'll be as violent as The Passion.

I think it's in the apocrypha, by the way.
 

---

Posted by Dagonee (Member # 5818) on :
 
It's in mine - Gibson's, too, I presume.
 

---

Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
 
Well, at least the Jews committing the violent atrocities in THIS movie will apparently be the good guys. *wry laugh*
 

---

Posted by T. Analog Kid (Member # 381) on :
 
we Catholics prefer the term "Deuterocanonicals". They aren't apocryphal to us.
 

---

Posted by lcarus (Member # 4395) on :
 

quote:

---

Recounting the story, which occurred in biblical times but is not recounted in the Bible,

---

It is if you're Catholic.

-o-

In any case, wouldn't this be a prequel?

[ March 17, 2004, 02:42 PM: Message edited by: lcarus ]
 

---

Posted by Chris Bridges (Member # 1138) on :
 
You know what I thought of when I saw this thread?

The Passion of the Christ II: The Quickening.

The Passion of the Christ II: Electric Boogaloo

The Passion of the Christ II: Porky's Revenge

The Passion of the Christ II: I can keep this up all day...
 

---

Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
 
I've heard the story of the Maccabees is in the Catholic bible.
 

---

Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
 
*avoids the rush*

*gets offended now*



*sigh*
 

---

Posted by Dagonee (Member # 5818) on :
 
Why?
 

---

Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
 
Generally speaking, Christian interpretation of Jewish history diverges quite a bit from mine. This should not be all that surprising.

Add in Gibson's proven tendency toward stirring up controversy . . .
 

---

Posted by Dagonee (Member # 5818) on :
 
Of course Christian interpretation will differ from yours. Does that mean only people of a given culture/religion/race can make movies about that culture/religion/race? Does it mean that interpretation will automatically be offensive?

Dagonee
 

---

Posted by Taalcon (Member # 839) on :
 
From what I understand, the account in 1 Maccabees is considered to be pretty historically sound, but that the 2 Maccabees telling of it introduces a few more legends and stories that aren't as viable as history. This would be cool, though, I think, because not too many non-Catholics (and honestly, most catholics too) are familiar with 'Inter Testamental History'.

This could be really cool.
 

---

Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
 
*sighs harder*

See, me being offended has never consisted of much more than me refusing to see a movie (or read a book), and I usually don't even SAY anything about it unless someone else brings it up first.

In fact, my original post was mostly a JOKE.

But it's nice to know that my being offended is a problem.
 

---

Posted by Dagonee (Member # 5818) on :
 
rivka, I'm sorry. I didn't mean to attack you. I was genuinely curious, and didn't realize how the repetitive questions came out. I posted in a rush with only 1 minute left before I had to shutdown to move my computer.

It's not a problem if you're offended by Gibson's making a movie. It is a problem for which I'd like to make amends if I offended you, as I certainly didn't intend to.

I just was curious as to why you were offended by the idea of the movie. The Maccabbee story sounds like the kind Gibson is actually good at making.

Dagonee
 

---

Posted by The Pixiest (Member # 1863) on :
 
You forgot:

Night of the Living Jesus
Dawn of the Christ
and Day of the Christ
 

---

Posted by Slash the Berzerker (Member # 556) on :
 
OOooh!

Dawn of the Christ is the best one. All the stuff in the mall is excellent.
 

---

Posted by The Pixiest (Member # 1863) on :
 
Oh, and Return of the Living Jesus where he gets on the radio in the ambulance and says "Send more Pharisees"
 

---

Posted by Dan_raven (Member # 3383) on :
 
I'm waiting for PotC 1.5, where Timone and Pumba show how their lives interwined with the earlier story in more ways that we could guess.
 

---

Posted by Slash the Berzerker (Member # 556) on :
 
Or maybe P2: He's back, and this time it's biblical.
 

---

Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :
 
Remember the rule of the sequel -- the body count is always higher.

He may need to crucify two messiahs next time.

[ March 17, 2004, 05:00 PM: Message edited by: Bob_Scopatz ]
 

---

Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
 
*wince*
 

---

Posted by Chris Bridges (Member # 1138) on :
 
Can he get a wisecracking buddy?
 

---

Posted by Ron Lambert (Member # 2872) on :
 
I realize that Jews lionize the Maccabees and celebrate their victory in driving out the pagans and reclaiming control of their own land. However, this glamorized story is not the whole story. The Maccabees in fact consisted of a father and a bunch of his sons who started out as robbers, and one day decided they would try to rally the people around them and retake control of their nation by force of arms. They made no acknowledgement of their nation's sins and departure from God, which caused God to withdraw His protection and allow them to be subjugated by the southern division of the Greek Empire. All the Maccabees did, they just did in human strength.

The first Maccabeean ruler made himself both high priest and king, thus mingling church and state in a way that the writings of Moses had forbidden. After he died, his sons reigned successively after him, most of them dying from illness. The last of the Maccabeean rulers is the one who signed the fateful compact with Rome, that Rome used as an excuse to place Judea under Roman domination. So the hateful Roman domination was brought on the Jews by the very Maccabeean family they celebrate today as heroes.

Part of the effort the Maccabees made to establish themselves as rulers of Judea involved propaganda--they claimed they were the fulfillment of the time prophecies of Daniel 8:14 and 9:25-27. The way they calculated it fudged a lot, and still did not come out within several years, but they claimed they were the ones who were ordained by God to fulfill the vision of the cleansing of the sanctuary.

All this was predicted in the prophecy of Daniel 11:14. This is how the prophecy described the career of the Maccabees: "And in those times there shall many stand up against the king of the south: also the robbers of thy people shall exalt themselves to establish the vision; but they shall fall. {the robbers: Heb. the children of robbers}"
 

---

Posted by Slash the Berzerker (Member # 556) on :
 
Ron, why are you deleting your post and reposting it to keep it at the bottom of the list?
 

---

Posted by T. Analog Kid (Member # 381) on :
 
and here I thought I was experiencing an extraordinary Deja Vu...

They're reprogramming the Matrix! Look out! Agents!
 

---

Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :
 

quote:

---

Can he get a wisecracking buddy?

---

Chris Rock?
 

---

Posted by Glenn Arnold (Member # 3192) on :
 
Passion '78
Passion '79
 

---

Posted by T. Analog Kid (Member # 381) on :
 
Yeah, Chris Rock was tight with Him in Dogma...

hey... don't start with me... I'm not even supposed to be here today.

[ March 17, 2004, 05:37 PM: Message edited by: T. Analog Kid ]
 

---

Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
 
Dagonee, I came back to this thread to apologize for being snarky. I had a bad headache, and I'm having a rough day.

And I'm not actually offended by the concept of his making the movie. I reserve the right to be offended (if I deem it appropriate) by the actual movie, though.



Ron, while I disagree with your post in several particulars, it is absolutely true that the generations of Maccabean descendants after Yehudah (Judah) and his brothers were far from good role models. I can find you some Jewish writings on the subject, if you (or anyone else) are interested.

I would disagree vehemently with your assessment of Mattisyahu and his sons, though. The very word "Maccabee" is an acronym of "Mi Kamocha Ba'Kelim [Hashem]" -- Who is like You? -- and their rallying cry was "Mi la'Hashem Elai!" -- Whoever is for God, join me!

To us, the miracle wasn't primarily the war -- it was the oil, and the light of Torah that it symbolizes.
 

---

Posted by ReikoDemosthenes (Member # 6218) on :
 
I think I would be interested in learning about this from a Jewish viewpoint...
 

---

Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
 
Sure.

Some history.
 

---

Posted by fallow (Member # 6268) on :
 
*jawdrops*

Well, if this turns out to be the case, I hope Gibson puts his money where his mouth is and turns the project (with hands-off funding) over to a visionary Jew who will tell the story true to faith, culture, and text.

fallow
 

---

Posted by T. Analog Kid (Member # 381) on :
 
Yeah, what about our host's women of the bible? Should he not have the right to tell the stories of old testament women because he is LDS?
 

---

Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
 
I never said anything about rights. Nor would I. Did anyone?

As far as the Women of Genesis, I read the first two. I think I may pass on the third.
 

---

Posted by porcelain girl (Member # 1080) on :
 
a lot of jewish history is also christian history.

same thing with islam. we all worship essentially the same god and hold very similar ideals, it's just that after abraham had sons that we branched off from islam and then jesus was born and we branched off again.

we share parts of the bible, rivka, and we share a common history. i was afraid to see the passion because of my beliefs, and was pleasantly surprised.
who knows, maybe the same will occur with a telling of the maccabees.
 

---

Posted by skrika03 (Member # 5930) on :
 
why?

Of course, I had a bad run of assuming things offended you which didn't.
 

---

Posted by T. Analog Kid (Member # 381) on :
 
perhaps I should have phrased it "should he not have done that?"
 

---

Posted by Taalcon (Member # 839) on :
 
I think you guys are reading WAY too much into what Rivka's saying. Give her a break, won't you? Sheesh.

to Rivka!
 

---

Posted by Sevumar (Member # 4420) on :
 
I've had about as big of a dose of the Passion as I can take without my head exploding. Personally, I wish Gibson had done a little more historical research outside of the new testament.
 

---

Posted by T. Analog Kid (Member # 381) on :
 
I think Rivka knows that I like her and that I'm not trying to antagonize her. If she doesn't I apologize to her. I got way too much support from her on the hug thread to ever think anything negative about her...
 

---

Posted by fallow (Member # 6268) on :
 
porcelain girl,

I think you are right. I think that's why we often hear the phrase "judeo-christian" tradition. On another thread, a curiousity arose regarding how that belief tradition might be related to others. for example, are any western or well-known oriental religions related to the monk-temples of Japan?

fallow
 

---

Posted by fil (Member # 5079) on :
 
"You can take our pigs...but you cannot take... our Freedom!"

Okay...it had to be said...

fil
 

---

Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
 
There are Jews who are of the opinion that they must fight any Christianization of Jewish history. I think that's both an incredibly naive attitude, and a good way to make enemies.

Do I sometimes find reading (or seeing) Christian interpretations of people I see as -- um, *fishes for a good metaphor* ah! family members -- painful and/or offensive? Yes. Although I don't usually feel the need to mention it.

And if I hadn't felt so pummeled by some of the rhetoric in the Passion thread(s) (and some RL discussions about the movie), plus had a miserable headache yesterday, I wouldn't have mentioned it this time either.

Because I'm NOT asking anyone to not write books like this, or make movies like this. So I guess I was just venting.
 

---