This is topic This is absolutely horrible... in forum Books, Films, Food and Culture at Hatrack River Forum.


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Posted by Farmgirl (Member # 5567) on :
 
Teen killed after being tied to tracks

This happened in our area of Kansas. Horrible thing -- this kid was valedictorian of his class, very active in sports and popular.

He was tied (alive) to the railroad tracks with baling wire -- and killed by a train.

Rumor has it (and these are pretty good sources I'm hearing it from in small town America), that this kid's brother came home to find a note that said something like "Jake pissed off the wrong people", and it included a map to where they could find him.

The map was hard to read, and the family was driving up and down the area looking for him, and was about a mile away from the site.. when the train passed.

so close...... that is horrible to think about.

Farmgirl
 

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Posted by Lalo (Member # 3772) on :
 
Jesus.

My guess would be he either tried to screw over his drug source or was the victim of a hate crime. Was he known as a drug dealer, or was he openly homosexual?
 

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Posted by Dagonee (Member # 5818) on :
 
Horrible. Absolutely horrible.
 

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Posted by Noemon (Member # 1115) on :
 
Wait a minute--this kid was tied to the railroad tracks, and there is some question as to whether this should be viewed as a homocide case? What, do they think it might have been a suicide?
 

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Posted by Bob the Lawyer (Member # 3278) on :
 
I imagine they're not yet done gathering facts, Noemon, and so aren't ready to issue a statement. Consequently, it's simply a death at this point.

It's rare that something on Hatrack makes me physically ill. I don't think anything has to date. This one, though, seems to be setting a new bar for me.
 

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Posted by Kwea (Member # 2199) on :
 
I feel so bad for his family now....imagine all the second guessing they are doing right now...

If only's....

Kwea
 

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Posted by PSI Teleport (Member # 5545) on :
 
I'm with you, BtL. I'm nauseous right now. I wonder if the people that tied him up expected him to be found before the train came? Not that it should affect anything, but it makes me wonder if they are having remorse right now.
 

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Posted by Jim-Me (Member # 6426) on :
 
It's very difficult to be anti-death penalty when there are people that sadistic and callous out there.
 

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Posted by Farmgirl (Member # 5567) on :
 
Noemon -- yeah, the press isn't up to date on what I personally know from law enforcement contacts down there. They definately consider it a homocide, but are dotting their i's and crossing their t's before they say that to the press. I think they actually already have at least one person they are holding

Farmgirl
 

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Posted by Eruve Nandiriel (Member # 5677) on :
 

That's terrible!
It's really sad to think that there are people out there that are that sadistic, sick, and twisted.
 

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Posted by Farmgirl (Member # 5567) on :
 
I wonder if the people who did it were trying to "scare" him and thought the family would find him before the train.

FG
 

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Posted by Jim-Me (Member # 6426) on :
 
even if they did, that's an incredibly callous, or stupid, disregard for human life... and it doesn't make them any less sadistic-- being tied down *waiting* for the train was the torture, his actual death was probably mercifully quick.
 

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Posted by Kwea (Member # 2199) on :
 
I hope they catch him/them and make them pay to the full extent of the law.

Not that it will help the family much, but whatever little bit can be done for them should be done.
And the b@st@rds should pay.
 

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Posted by Noemon (Member # 1115) on :
 
I'm very glad to hear that Farmgirl. I had the same thought as you did, that this may have been intended as a threat.

I keep thinking about the terror this guy must have felt as the train approached. My god, what a horrible thing to experience.
 

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Posted by Farmgirl (Member # 5567) on :
 
This is terrible - but one of my first thoughts was...

..And Then Along Came John.....

(old-time music fans will know what I'm referring to)

Farmgirl
 

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Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
 

quote:

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I hope they catch him/them and make them pay to the full extent of the law.

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Is it wrong for me to hope that this doesn't happen, but that something worse happens?
 

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Posted by Noemon (Member # 1115) on :
 
You know what's weird? I keep feeling around inside myself for anger toward the guy's murderers, but I can't find any. I find what they did to be horrible, of course--any normal person would, I think. It seems like I should feel rage toward them, and want them dead or something, but I just...don't. Pretty much the only thing I feel when I think of them is sadness and pity, somehow. They need to be punished--society can't let this kind of thing go unpunished and still remain a society--and they need to be kept in a position in which they're unable to do anything like this ever again, but I don't bear them any ill will. I feel really sorry for them, for being so warped that this was something that they were capable of doing to another human being. I'm actually pretty surprised to feel this way about it.
 

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Posted by PSI Teleport (Member # 5545) on :
 
I'm surprised too. I want them to pay.
 

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Posted by Erik Slaine (Member # 5583) on :
 
I believe the police are just remaining closed-mouthed about their investigation. Any disclosure at this stage might tip their hand. It sounds like they're on the trail.

Of course, they may be clueless, and are clever enough to sound like they are.

We are missing part of the story, obviously. But what a horrible way to go.
 

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Posted by Pixie (Member # 4043) on :
 
How can you do that to someone else? How can you look at yourself in a mirror even once afterwards? And...

I don't know why, but one of the most saddening things to me about this is that it is even within our potential as human beings to do something like this. We really are some of the most inhumane creatures on this planet sometimes.
 

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Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
 
They have to be nuts. Seriously - you have to be disconnected from reality to pull a stunt like that. That's what I think it was - they were acting some sort of mental fantasy stunt. I don't think it went wrong - I think it went just as planned - I just think that the people involved were not thinking. That isn't a defense, and it's scarier, because such evil was done so casually, but it's the only way it makes sense in my head. I hope they get caught and punished to the fullest extent of the law, and I...dread the moment for everyone around when it sinks in what has truly happened.
 

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Posted by Insanity Plea (Member # 2053) on :
 
I'd just like to say: I hate people.

I feel anger and pity towards whoever did this. I say throw them into a cell and let them think about what they did...for a very long time. Let them suffer in their mind's prison, and maybe they'll learn.
Satyagraha

[ July 09, 2004, 12:14 PM: Message edited by: Insanity Plea ]
 

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Posted by ssywak (Member # 807) on :
 
This is a horrible event.

Thought going through my head: Another case of anti-intellectualism taken to its violent, moronic extreme.

Pixiest: "inhumane"???
What other animals, besides humans, act this way either towards their own, or towards their prey? I think you'll find that we're the only ones. So it can't be "inhumane," because it it is within the range of human response--and ONLY human response.

The question is: did those morons who tied him to the track remove an element that would have eventually lead to a "nobilizing" of overall human behaviour, or are we all, deep-down-inside capable of this monstrous behaviour?

I feel so sad for this boy's family, but also sad for the long-term survival of our species if this is how we treat "our best."

--Steve
 

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Posted by Noemon (Member # 1115) on :
 
Well, chimps have been known to do pretty awful things to each other, and apparently some of them have a habit of catching hyraxes and beating them against trees until they die, seemingly for fun. Male dolphins, I've read, appear to engage in gang rape every now and then. It seems to me that whenever a species develops a high enough level of cognitive functioning to be capable of it, some of its members engage in acts that violate their group's "morality" in ways that, from our perspective, seem evil.

I was really hesitant about using the word "morality" there. It isn't quite the right term, but I'm not entirely sure what would be.
 

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Posted by Lupus (Member # 6516) on :
 
that is just insane. It is nuts what people can do to other people.
 

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Posted by AmkaProblemka (Member # 6495) on :
 
We do have an ennobling element that is lacking in some people. It is empathy. We can imagine the pain of others and imagine ourselves in their place. As a result, we would wish to prevent their pain and feel angry, helpless when we can't. This thread is strewn with it.

Sometimes we turn this off, when we are angry, for instance. Or sometimes we justify it, by thinking they deserved what they got, by believing that if it isn't them, it would be us, or imagining that their hurt is an acceptable price to pay for our success. If we do it enough, we may lose the ability to empathize entirely.

There are also some psychological causes such as attachment disorder and _severe_ ADHD (in this case, the child is not able to predict realistic outcomes or control their responses, and so the ability to empathize is short circuited even if they are otherwise compassionate individuals.)

Attachment disorder is usually the result of neglectful parenting or institutionalized care (orphanages or poorly run daycares). So we see that a lack of empathy can actually be taught, and is usually a survival mechanism in those cases.
 

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Posted by TMedina (Member # 6649) on :
 
I'm interested in what spawned this particular event.

Were they imitating a stunt in a movie? I remember an incident involving some idiots duplicating a movie stunt where you lay down in the middle of the freeway as traffic roars by.

Was this some sort of punishment or retribution?

One advantage to a small town - it's hard to get away with a major crime.

-Trevor
 

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Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
 
Unless you're Emily.
 

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Posted by Chris Bridges (Member # 1138) on :
 
FG: psst (looks around), "Along Came Jones," not John...
 

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Posted by Space Opera (Member # 6504) on :
 
Geez, this makes me afraid to know that I share a world with people like this.

space opera
 

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Posted by Farmgirl (Member # 5567) on :
 
Thanks Chris Been a long time since I heard the song...

TMedina -- they are all being real hush-hush about possible motive. I suppose they need to build up their case first.

FG

[ July 09, 2004, 01:37 PM: Message edited by: Farmgirl ]
 

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Posted by Annie Mayhem (Member # 6203) on :
 
TMedina wrote:
>>Were they imitating a stunt in a movie? I >>remember an incident involving some idiots >>duplicating a movie stunt where you lay down in >>the middle of the freeway as traffic roars by.

Tying someone to the railroad tracks is an old serial cliche (and it may be even older than that). In the serials, of course, the Helpless Love Interest is always rescued by the Hero (which may be what the perpetrators were counting on, otherwise why provide the family with a map?).

The driver is an innocent victim, too. I remember reading years ago (probably in Ann Landers) how traumatized the drivers are whenever someone commits suicide-by-subway. They try to stop the train (you can't be HUMAN and not TRY to stop!), but there's no way to do it in time with all that mass and intertia. They know this intellectually, but emotionally it's still difficult.

The family must be devastated.

-=AM=-
 

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Posted by J T Stryker (Member # 6300) on :
 

quote:

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It's very difficult to be anti-death penalty when there are people that sadistic and callous out there.

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