quote:The Defense Department began working yesterday with a private marketing firm to create a database of high school students ages 16 to 18 and all college students to help the military identify potential recruits in a time of dwindling enlistment in some branches. . . . Privacy advocates said the plan appeared to be an effort to circumvent laws that restrict the government's right to collect or hold citizen information by turning to private firms to do the work. . . . According to the Federal Register notice, the data will be open to "those who require the records in the performance of their official duties." It said the data would be protected by passwords.
The system also gives the Pentagon the right, without notifying citizens, to share the data for numerous uses outside the military, including with law enforcement, state tax authorities and Congress
The price of safety?
I really like the part where you're allowed to "opt out" by providing the same information to a suppression list so you can't be contacted.
Um...the point is that up until now, the government couldn't legally HAVE the information, let alone contact you...
Oh well.
quote:Yesterday, the New York Times reported that the Social Security Administration relaxed its privacy policies and provided data on citizens to the FBI in connection with terrorism investigations.
And I'm sure in every case this has been and will continue to be about "fighting terrorism." Right. (Of course, the definition of terrorism will include a lot of things no-one ever knew were terrorist-like precursors before.)
Posted by Alcon (Member # 6645) on :
Alright, that does it. Soon as I'm done with grad school I'm moving to Mars.
Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :
They're worse there.
Posted by Alcon (Member # 6645) on :
Fine, then Jupiter. Or Saturn, or the moon. Somewhere uninhabited where I can live how I want and not have to put up with idiot governments and idiot active radical religious majorities. Anyone who wants is welcome to join me, so long as they don't try and step on my rights, i won't step on theirs. Oh wait what does this sounds like? What America was supposed to be!
Maybe we just need to start over every 300 years or so. Maybe what we need is a good revolution.
Posted by Kayla (Member # 2403) on :
What's scary is that my son just got his learners permit and at 14 1/2 his information was sent to the Selective Service. We've already been hounding him about recruiters and showing him the news stories about what they'll say/lie about to meet their quotas.
That said, I have one nephew currently in the Army who just returned from Iraq and might be going back in 6 months and one nephew who died while in the Navy, and my husband was in the Army and National Guard, so it's not like I'm unpatriotic or anti-American.
Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :
quote:so it's not like I'm unpatriotic or anti-American.
Yes it is. If you aren't with the President, you are a terrorist and a treasonous scoundrel.
That's it! You're going on a list.
Posted by Kayla (Member # 2403) on :
Ha! Like I wasn't already on the list! I bet I couldn't get into a town hall meeting if I donated my kidney to the President.
Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :
Yeah, not likely for me either. Of course, I'd only donate my kidney to the guy if I knew it was diseased and he'd be incapacitated trying to fight off it's rejection of his body.
Posted by Farmgirl (Member # 5567) on :
I guess I don't understand how this is different than present. Currently schools have to tell the government when the kids are nearing their 18th birthday for selective service registration. Both of my boys got notices and reminders to register just before they turned 18 -- so the information was coming from somewhere.
And as my oldest boy said as he registered -- "I don't know why they are asking me all this (name, birthdate, social security # etc) because they already know it! I is already on the information they sent to tell me to register."
FG
Posted by Kayla (Member # 2403) on :
People are aware of that information. It's told to you when you go for a driver's license.
Of course, they also keep other data, but I don't like to talk about that without my tin foil hat on.
::dons tin foil hat::
I mean, they already keep public health records.
::feels the tin foil isn't totatlly protective and flees::
Posted by Rakeesh (Member # 2001) on :
quote:That said, I have one nephew currently in the Army who just returned from Iraq and might be going back in 6 months and one nephew who died while in the Navy, and my husband was in the Army and National Guard, so it's not like I'm unpatriotic or anti-American.
I fail to see how this has any relevance at all, actually. To your American-ness and patriotism, I mean, Kayla. To me it seems entirely irrelevant. The only thing those facts indicate to me is that many men in your family have served in the military-they indicate little about you.
I guess it raises my hackles when people tout the military careers of people other than themselves. I'm not saying you aren't a 'good American' (whatever that is), or unpatriotic, etc.
Posted by mackillian (Member # 586) on :
Perhaps she's trying to say that due to a personal connection, she does support the troops themselves?
Posted by Kayla (Member # 2403) on :
Um, yeah. My husband served the country, as did my father, and grandfather. My husband, his brother and sister, his father, his grandfather died in the service, as did his nephew and he currently has a nephew and a cousin in the service.
I'm just saying, the government has had enough of my family and it's not like my family hasn't been represented in the military. They just don't need my son. Especially since I was against this war from the beginning.
And I do support the troops. Literally. I'm still sending stuff to my medics in Iraq and getting letters and got a CD the other day that has over 400 pictures the Lieutenant has taken in Iraq.
Posted by fugu13 (Member # 2859) on :
Telling the gov when they're near their 18th birthday is different from telling them their grades, their classes(, their extracurriculars?) and lots of other information.
Posted by Rakeesh (Member # 2001) on :
Um, yeah. I did not say you didn't support the troops. I didn't say you weren't a good American or unpatriotic. In fact, I specifically said I was not saying those things.
I stand by my point that the military records of other individuals says something about them, and other much less tangible things about their family members. The most that could be said, I think, is that one has a tendancy to value the qualities in an individual that lead to military service (you marrying your husband, I mean).
Your support and patriotism are evidenced by the things that you do, I believe, as is true of everyone. Undeniably you do hold the virtues of patriotism and you do support the troops, because of what you have yourself done for them and in support of them.
Posted by aspectre (Member # 2222) on :
If they didn't have the right to vote for or against the politicians who start and run the wars, they shouldn't be eligible for combat duty.
Either lower the voting age or raise the enlistment age.
Posted by AC (Member # 7909) on :
The voting age and the age at which you can be DRAFTED are the same (at least in the US), 18 years old. However, you can enlist VOLUNTARILY at 17, if your parents sign a form allowing you to do so
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
I say lower the drinking age to match that the voting and enlistment age. It's ridiculous that at 18 you're considered old enough to elect your nations leaders, and to make life and death decisions in combat, but still you are too immature to drink responsibly.
I think Rakeesh has a point. Family members in the military do not a patriot make. My brother was in the marines, both grandfathers served in world war two, two uncles were in the air force during Vietnam. But none of that says anything, good or bad, about my patriotism, it just makes me lucky to get all those people home alive.
But I understand Kayla's point. I think the military has had enough of my family too.