So, I made a mushroom stew yesterday, and it was lovely. But it contained about a cup of red wine, and it got me thinking.
I'm a borderline tea-totaler, drinking about one serving of alcohol in any given month. I'm far, far more likely to cook with alcohol than drink it. Beer batter, risotto... Mmm.
So I was wondering if anyone has knowledge of how stringent various religions' restrictions are on alcohol used in cooking. I might have a Moslem or Mormon at my table one day. Some argue alcohol mostly "cooks out" if the food is heated above boiling for a significant period of time, but I've also heard this may be fallacious. I'd like to hear peoples' thoughts.
Please note, this query is straight up. I'm not looking to catch anyone in some contradiction or hypocricy of religious minutiae; I just want to respect my guests, whatever their dietary preferences.
But my risotto is really good. Posted by jeniwren (Member # 2002) on :
I think you should ask your guests prior to planning the meal. Just like you might ask about food allergies. Regardless of facts, if someone is uncomfortable with having wine in their food (even if the alcohol is cooked out) it's good to know so you can prepare something else.
Posted by Brian J. Hill (Member # 5346) on :
I'm a Mormon who has never drank alcohol. However, when I was in France, I ate food that had been cooked in wine without any moral qualms. The alcohol amount is negligible even if it doesn't "cook out," and it's kind of hard to get food at a nice French restaurant that HASN'T been prepared with some kind of wine or liquor.
For the record, red wine sauces are delicious, white wine sauces are OK, and the chicken/beef fajitas I had that were grilled in a bourbon sauce were disgusting.
Posted by ludosti (Member # 1772) on :
Jeniwren has the best idea - ask your guests, because different people (even within the same religious group) may have different opinions.
Case in point: I, like Brian, am a Mormon who doesn't drink alcohol. However, I choose to avoid foods that have been cooked with alcohol, because of the amount of alcohol that remains after cooking in many cases (See here). While I am not fanatical about it (there have been times I've found out, after the fact, that something I ate had alcohol in it), I try to avoid it as best I can. Some people are even more rigid - I once had a friend who, after finding out that something she had eaten that evening had alcohol in it, made herself throw up to have it out of her system. Like I said, everyone is different. Posted by Speed (Member # 5162) on :
I personally like fajitas that have been sauteed in weed. Or stir-fry marinated in black tar heroin. Mmmm... tasty.
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
I cook with sherry and some occasional wine (I don't like the flavor of red.) Some people don't. I only keep cooking sherry in the house.
I know strict Moslems don't eat anything cooked with alcohol.
Posted by Swampjedi (Member # 7374) on :
My strict Independent Baptist mother will not eat food with wine in it.
Maybe I need to start a thread for "what justification do non-Mormon Christians give for being teetotalers?" It intrigues me.
BTW, I'm "nondenominational" (or as some have so nastily said, "uncreeded") Christian.
Posted by jeniwren (Member # 2002) on :
Swampjedi, I'm a teetotaler Christian just because I don't personally like the feel of alcohol in my system. I really don't like being in an altered state...it's a control thing, I think. I resist taking otc drugs for the same reason. I make an exception for my migraine meds, because reality just sucks too much when I have a migraine.
In other words, it's a personal preference, not a religious one. From a religious perspective, I really don't have much of an opinion. If it's not damaging, I don't see the harm.
Posted by Yozhik (Member # 89) on :
I'm a Mormon, and I'll eat food that has been cooked with alcohol, because there's so little alcohol in food that you're not going to get addicted or even get a buzz from it.
Like my cousin's awesome cowboy-style baked beans, which are flavored with whisky. I figure that I'd have to eat an AWFUL lot of beans to get enough alcohol for it to have an effect on me.
(I don't want to think about what happens to ANYBODY who eats that many baked beans, even the alcohol-free kind.) Posted by Yozhik (Member # 89) on :
(And we can tell that this is not the Nauvoo Forum, because nobody has called anybody to repentance yet.)
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
quote:(And we can tell that this is not the Nauvoo Forum, because nobody has called anybody to repentance yet.)
So true...
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
Most strict Muslims will not eat anything cooked in alcohol.
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
Uh, jinx?
Posted by romanylass (Member # 6306) on :
I would always ask. Even if your guest is not LDS or Muslim, they may be in recovery.
(mmmmm, risotto...I love way more chard in it than my kdis like).
Posted by Swampjedi (Member # 7374) on :
Jeniwren, those are my sentiments exactly, down to the OTC drugs.
Posted by Sterling (Member # 8096) on :
Thanks for the input. And for the chart, Ludosti- that's very interesting.
I've never noticed any kind of significant mental change in myself from taking OTC medicines- or even a single serving of alcohol, for that matter- so I don't tend to worry about it. Caffeine, though- eugh. I've started weaning myself back off of caffeine ever since I realized just how irritable it could make me.
I wouldn't miss the effects of alcohol if I gave it up entirely. But I'd miss the flavors.
One could probably use a non-alcoholic beer for beer batter. But I've never encountered a non-alcoholic wine that I liked the taste of, and as a general rule, flavor-wise, if you would never drink it you shouldn't cook with it.
Posted by Joldo (Member # 6991) on :
There's lots of good substitutes, too. I've found Fresca gives you almost the same flavor in a sauce as white wine with the alcohol "cooked out".
<----puts whatever he's drinking into whatever he's cooking
Posted by sarcasticmuppet (Member # 5035) on :
Well, from what I understand about cooking with wine, all it really adds is a little acid (which can be done with something else), a little fruityness (can also be substituted with something else), and a little alcohol--most of which burns off, but still effects the taste of certain foods (I keep hearing AB talk about 'alcohol-soluble flavors' in tomatos and somesuch).
Just like it's impossible to create 100% pure alcohol, it's impossible to burn off 100% of the alcohol in a liquid (evaporation issues, I think).
I for one don't have a problem with it, as long as it's not taramisu or rumcake or something else that has uncooked alcohol as one of the predominant flavors. I once had a fabulous dessert that was flambe'd apples and crepes that was cooked in alcohol.
[ October 08, 2005, 01:15 AM: Message edited by: sarcasticmuppet ]
Posted by andi330 (Member # 8572) on :
quote:Originally posted by Swampjedi: My strict Independent Baptist mother will not eat food with wine in it.
Maybe I need to start a thread for "what justification do non-Mormon Christians give for being teetotalers?" It intrigues me.
BTW, I'm "nondenominational" (or as some have so nastily said, "uncreeded") Christian.
My Grandparents are Church of the Bretheren, my father was raised that way too. He once had a Sunday School class that determined that Jesus turned the water into "non-alcoholic" wine at the wedding at Cana.
Posted by andi330 (Member # 8572) on :
quote:Originally posted by romanylass: I would always ask. Even if your guest is not LDS or Muslim, they may be in recovery.
This is very true. People in recovery often don't want even the taste of alcohol in what they're eating. Also, there is a very rare allergy to alcohol that some people have. It's generally very severe, to the point of Epi Pins and emergency room visits if they get any in their system (I knew someone with this allergy once, you wouldn't believe some of the things alcohol is in) so always check first.
Posted by plaid (Member # 2393) on :
I don't drink, but I like cooking with alcohol. (Strange, because when I've tried sipping alcohol, it takes horrible to me.)
Something I've wondered about, but haven't tried yet -- does anyone know if adding alcohol to grains or beans at the beginning slows down their cooking time? (Like tomatoes do -- I learned the hard way once that adding tomatoes to beans at the beginning majorly slows down their cooking time...)
Posted by Theaca (Member # 8325) on :
quote:Originally posted by jeniwren: I really don't like being in an altered state...it's a control thing, I think. I resist taking otc drugs for the same reason.
I'd be curious to know which otc drugs you think would cause an altered state. Or why.
Well, I agree that sudafed and weight loss drugs and ephedra and caffeine pills can be a problem.
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
Benedryl causes an altered state in me.
Posted by Theaca (Member # 8325) on :
That's true, benadryl and otc sleeping pills can be a problem for some people.
kq, phenergan and benadryl are in the same drug class. So is the morning sickness pill diclectin. The phenergan doesn't have the same effect on you?
Posted by Dagonee (Member # 5818) on :
quote:Well, from what I understand about cooking with wine, all it really adds is a little acid (which can be done with something else), a little fruityness (can also be substituted with something else), and a little alcohol--most of which burns off, but still effects the taste of certain foods (I keep hearing AB talk about 'alcohol-soluble flavors' in tomatos and somesuch).
There's also something about cooking with the wine to be served at dinner, especially if you don't have professional wine-matching skills. Not an issue if you're not drinking wine at dinner, of course.
Beyond that, good wines can add a lot of complexity to a sauce, and beer can add good taste to a lot of beef dishes.
Posted by Tante Shvester (Member # 8202) on :
Soy sauce is alcoholic?
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
I believe almost all soy sauce available in the United States is partially fermented, yes. It is definitely not halal. There are halal sauces available, but those that are tend to be made on-site; as I understand it, the fermentation is part of the commercial bottling process.
Posted by theCrowsWife (Member # 8302) on :
Sauerkraut is fermented, too. So is any yeast bread.
--Mel
Posted by mackillian (Member # 586) on :
I know that I have a low tolerance for alcohol. Half a drink and I'm dizzy, flushed, and nauseated. Just feel awful. However, I do cook with wine and occasionally beer (oh man, cocktail weenies cooked in beer. mmmm), and haven't had a problem.
Posted by Primal Curve (Member # 3587) on :
I am the anti-teetotaler.
Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
Fahim won't have anything that has vanilla extract in it even though it's a teaspoon of the stuff in a whole cake, for example, because it's not Halal. Me, being LDS, am not quite so strict and have no problem with vanilla extract or eating things cooked in alcohol, although it's not my most favorite thing in the world.
I read labels vigorously. Pasta sauces that have cheese in them are out because the cheese could be made with animal rennet which is not Halal. Vinegars have been argued as both Halal and not Halal depending on what you read - the vinegar usually comes from wine or some other fermented liquid. Gelatin is okay as it's far enough removed in processing from non-Halal animals.
Yep, like others have said, ask your guests.
Posted by jeniwren (Member # 2002) on :
Theca, re: otc drugs: I take Tylenol and other pain relievers occasionally for minor aches and that sort of thing, though I can't say they help much. I don't take Benedryl or Sudafed. They either make me feel disconnected, like I'm floating, or wig me out and make me nervous where I want to crawl out of my skin. It's that feeling I can't stand. If I can feel the drug working, unless something is really bugging me, like I can't sleep at all because I'm coughing so bad (broncitis last year made me a big believer in the joy of codeine laced cough meds), I generally won't take it because I really don't like the feeling of not quite being me.
edit: I should add that for allergies, I steal my husband's Zyrtec. That's fantastic stuff. Works FAR better than Benedryl or Sudafed without the nasty side effects. And as I mentioned earlier, I take Zomig for migraine. It occasionally does have a disconnecting effect, but it removes the haze of pain, nausea, and scent and light sensitivity, which makes the minor side effect inconsequential.
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So true...