This may be an option for me (going to study in Tokyo over the summer). I was wondering if anyone had any experience with studying abroad and wanted to offer any opinions. I'm trying to weigh costs and benefits for it, and I thought I'd get Hatrack's input (and also possibly get some interesting stories out of it). Posted by Stephan (Member # 7549) on :
The experience you will gain is priceless. Do it.
Posted by KarlEd (Member # 571) on :
I haven't studied abroad, but I'm whole-heartedly in favor of everyone having the experience of living abroad at least once in their lifetime. If you can afford it and it doesn't disrupt higher life priorities, I say "Go for it!"
Posted by Megan (Member # 5290) on :
I haven't had any experience doing it, but I sooo wish I had. That doesn't help you make your decision, I know, but my (uninformed) opinion of it is, go for it!
Posted by pfresh85 (Member # 8085) on :
Well one of the programs I'm looking at is roughly $5000, although that most likely doesn't include airfare and it may or may not include the housing. So it may be a costly thing, but at the same time, my student loans have been really small thus far because I've been on a fairly large scholarship. Maybe I could afford it. I'm not sure. As I said, I'm trying to weigh costs and benefits.
Posted by JennaDean (Member # 8816) on :
I'm really, really in support of staying out of debt. That said, education is a fair reason to go into debt.
Don't spend your adult years remembering how you could have studied in Tokyo and didn't take the opportunity!
Posted by advice for robots (Member # 2544) on :
I don't think you'll regret the experience.
Posted by pfresh85 (Member # 8085) on :
I don't like debt (which is why I'm happy my loans have been really small for school), but again this may be a once in a lifetime experience. Plus it sort of works in with my growing interest in Japanese History (I'm starting to think I may write my senior thesis about it).
I keep hoping someone will have had experience with studying abroad though. The only person I've heard from about it gave a sort of negative report.
Posted by KarlEd (Member # 571) on :
I don't know specifics of the negative report you mention (of course), but travel abroad is entirely what you make of it. I was abroad for two years as a missionary (Brazil) and two years in the Airforce (Korea). For most people I traveled with it was a greatly enriching experience. For a handful it was a terrible time of homesickness or negative attitudes for everything that wasn't American. In short, you have to consider the source and the specifics of negative reports.
That is, criticisms of a specific program, school, or teacher might have some validity, but a general negative opinion about studying abroad is almost certainly a product of individual bias.
That said, $5k is a lot of money, but it's also purchasing something that you can never lose. It's also something that won't be the same later in life (for good or bad) and will flavor your later life experiences.
Posted by KarlEd (Member # 571) on :
quote:I keep hoping someone will have had experience with studying abroad though.
What do you think specifically studying abroad would entail that other forms of long-term living abroad wouldn't (aside from studying)? I'm asking because it seems that the "studying" part would depend very much on the specific program and what is expected of you in it. In other words, it could change dramatically based on the program, instructors, course work, etc., right? Is there anyone you know who has done the specific program you're looking into? That would be the most valuable source of opinion, I'd think.
Posted by Carrie (Member # 394) on :
Woo! I studied abroad! In fact, two years ago today I was in Greece. I think we might have been on a field trip through the Argolid, but really, I don't remember. Studying abroad is mostly a big blur for me
First and foremost, the only advice I can give you is this: DO IT. Run, do not walk, to the study abroad office and sign up now. I wouldn't trade the worst day I spent abroad for the best day I've had back in the States for anything. At the very least, you'll get the experience of being somewhere completely different, somewhere where you can't (probably, I'm not sure about your skills in Japanese) get around easily - and you'll really learn who you are. I know it sounds trite, but it's true.
I'll be back with more stories, if you want to hear them. I have lots... Posted by Altáriël of Dorthonion (Member # 6473) on :
I'm studying abroad during the summer! I'll be spending 11 weeks in France at the Chateau de Pourtalles. They'll take us to the Louvre Museum and the Palace of Versailles!!!! *So excited*
Posted by Nell Gwyn (Member # 8291) on :
In the words of everyone else, DO IT!
I spent two semesters in London (2002 and 2004), and those were undoubtedly the most awesome semesters of my life! And I really wish I could do it again...I'm planning on moving to London someday. As soon as I figure out how I'll get a work visa, that is.
It will definitely open your eyes to other cultures and perspectives - I'm sure this'll be even more true for Tokyo than it was for London - and it'll highlight things about your world at home that you might not have realized before. And you'll become more self-sufficient and more confident too - for example, I grew up in a cornfield and I'm really shy, so after living in a huge city full of strangers, moving by myself from rural IL to NY for grad school was a lot easier than it would have been otherwise. And when you come home, you'll have tons of great stories and pictures and memories. *gets warm fuzzies thinking about London*
I think your experience really depends on your attitude and expectations going into it. Culture shock is pretty much inevitable, especially if you've never traveled out of the US before, but how you handle it is up to you. I've seen some people end up having a bad time because they focused on the differences in a negative way and got all upset about it not being like home, which just made me want to shake them and scream, "But that's the whole point in going!" Or they went with this chip on their shoulder and these preconceived notions that everyone would hate them because they're American, so they interpreted everything through that lens, or they somehow expected it to be like a giant theme park catering to their whims or something equally silly. But those people were in the minority, and otherwise everyone else had a great time and learned a lot about themselves, their home country/city, the rest of the world, etc. You just have to remember that you're going to a real place with real people who have real lives, and respect it all accordingly since you are the foreigner. I'm sure that sounds obvious, but a lot of people forget that. And yeah, there'll be bad times, but the good ones make up for them 200%.
As far as finances go, the school I went to is actually a sister school of my college, so my scholarship and financial aid were able to be applied to the London school as well, which definitely helped a lot. I wouldn't have been able to afford to do a summer thing because that was the only time for me to earn money since I didn't work during the school year, but your situation might be different. And I did take out some extra loans and rack up some significant credit card debt those semesters (which I'm still paying off), but it was absolutely worth it and I don't regret it at all. Probably at least half of what I spent, though, was on traveling around Europe on the weekends (we only had class Mon-Thurs). That's based on my spending money only, not including tuition and room/board.
I would check with your school's study abroad office and see if there might be any programs where there's a relationship between the two schools that might work well financially, or even just to compare all the different options - you may already have your heart set on that particular program, but there's no harm in seeing what else is available too.
I have lots of stories too, but I think I've gone on long enough for now, so I'll just say Yay studying abroad!! And if you have questions, I'm happy to help as best I can.
P.S. Studying abroad also looks awesome on your resume. Posted by Nell Gwyn (Member # 8291) on :
Alt, I'm so jealous! I've been wanting to do a language intensive in France for years. What kind of program is it?
Posted by pfresh85 (Member # 8085) on :
Well I was going through programs listed on my school's International Studies website. I've found two (possibly three) that would take me to Tokyo. I have to talk to someone in the honors department though, as I am partly doing this out of an honors requirement (they say in your last 4 semesters, you either do an internship, study abroad, or take 12 more honors credits, but due to the weirdness of my education, I only have 2 semesters left for this so it's either internship, study abroad, or having no electives and all honors classes my last 2 semesters). We'll see how it goes though.
Posted by Altáriël of Dorthonion (Member # 6473) on :
Its for my art school, which means I'll be taking courses in art history and fine art. My major is Media Arts and Animation but it always helps to know about fine arts just as much as you'd know about animation. It's all art and I'm an artist, so I figure it ought to help me.
Posted by Fusiachi (Member # 7376) on :
Many study abroad programs are considerably cheaper than $5000, when done through your school's department of global education(or whatever they choose to call it.) Of course, cost shouldn't be the deciding factor. An experience abroad can be intensely fulfilling--I spent half a year in Paraguay, and it was hands-down the most rewarding experience of my life, to date. Go for it.
Posted by pfresh85 (Member # 8085) on :
Well I didn't write down the price of the second program I saw. The first was $4900, covering (*looks it up*) educational costs, housing, a commuter pass, and medical insurance. As I said though, I am trying to talk to people in the honors department about this, since maybe they know something I don't. At the moment though, I haven't heard back from them.
Posted by Altáriël of Dorthonion (Member # 6473) on :
Well, my program will cost around $12,000 plus tuition cost...
X.x
Posted by pfresh85 (Member # 8085) on :
$12,000 = ouch. Just ouch.
Posted by Nell Gwyn (Member # 8291) on :
Wait, is that $12k without tuition?! What on earth is it for, then? Posted by pfresh85 (Member # 8085) on :
Mandatory "we're going to take all of your money, ha ha ha ha" fees?
Posted by Altáriël of Dorthonion (Member # 6473) on :
No, I'll be there for 11 weeks. It includes flights and food too. Besides, I'll be staying at de Chateau de Pourtales and at some hotel rooms while we are in Paris, Frankfurt and London.
Posted by pfresh85 (Member # 8085) on :
Ah, well that makes a little more sense. I think the one I was looking at factored in another $2750 to cover flights, personal expenses, meals, books/supplies, and local transportation.
Posted by Nell Gwyn (Member # 8291) on :
Oh, so the $12k is the grand total (minus personal spending) for the whole thing? I thought you meant that you still have to pay for tuition in addition to that amount.
Posted by Altáriël of Dorthonion (Member # 6473) on :
No, tuition is about another 5k...
Posted by pfresh85 (Member # 8085) on :
So about $17k in all? Dang, that's expensive.
Posted by Carrie (Member # 394) on :
Mine was around $10k not including flight or personal expenses - tuition, books, room, field trips were all included. We also got our flights through STA and they were considerably cheaper - less than $550 per person from Chicago to Athens.
Posted by pfresh85 (Member # 8085) on :
Mine's looking like it will be roughly $8000 with either program (now that I've checked into it). That's not horribly bad, but it's also not money I just have laying around. Still if the honors program approves it and my parents approve, then it may be something I can't pass up.
Posted by Altáriël of Dorthonion (Member # 6473) on :
I agree, it's expensive, but considering all the places we are going to, I think its a fair price.
Posted by fugu13 (Member # 2859) on :
$12k?! What's included in that?
That's an extraordinarily high total for study abroad (absent tuition).
Posted by Celaeno (Member # 8562) on :
While I think it's very important to weigh the cost of the program against its benefits, It's probably not a good idea to think, Ouch, $12k, I won't do it..
Last summer I went to Durham to study for six weeks. The program cost $6k and that did not include airfare, books, half of all meals, most local transportation, weekend travelling, and personal spending. But, you know what? It was probably the best experience of my life, and I'd do it all again even if it was double that.
If you CAN'T afford to go, then doing so would be frivolous and ridiculous. If you CAN afford to do it, but it'll be a stretch, then I say go. You'll never have this opportunity again. Once you enter the "real world," will you really be able to pick up and live in Japan for a summer? If you go as a student, you'll have all the fun of going as an adult without nearly the same load of responsibilities.
If you end up going, I have some advice. Do all the touristy things you need to do, but try to approach them from a nontouristy angle. Keep a journal. Take lots and lots of pictures. Don't go with friends; instead, make new ones there. If you don't have a good time at first, don't automatically assume that the rest of the trip will be awful. Be open to change and try all the new things you can. I hope you have a great time.
Posted by Altáriël of Dorthonion (Member # 6473) on :
Room and board, international flight all over Europe, food, aside from a whole bunch of places we're going to be taken to like the Louvre, the Museum of Modern and Fine Art amongst other things in London.
Posted by pH (Member # 1350) on :
fugu, the program I was looking at for two months in Ireland was about $12K.
Alas, I am hypercrazyoverachievingstudent. So I'm going to graduate before I have a free summer to go.
-pH
Posted by pfresh85 (Member # 8085) on :
Ah, I'm overachieving as well (graduating a year early and all), so that's why it basically has to be this summer or never.
Posted by fugu13 (Member # 2859) on :
Its all the flight raising the price. Still far too expensive, IMO.
Posted by Nell Gwyn (Member # 8291) on :
Oh. Wow.
I'm still jealous of you, Alt, but I'm glad I'm not the one paying for it.
I think one of my semesters (they were both the same price) cost about $12k for tuition and room & board, but I only had to actually pay about $3500 of that. (Thank goodness for scholarships!) I didn't have to buy books since all the textbooks were in the library, which was nice, and both semesters I managed to find plane tickets for Chicago-London for about $300, which was really lucky.
It's kind of sounding like everyone else did a summer program. Am I the only one who went for a semester?
Posted by Swampjedi (Member # 7374) on :
I spent 6 weeks in London with Emory's summer abroad program. Best $12k I ever spent. Good think $10k was covered by a scholarship.
The biggest part was the insane fee for credit hours. It was an 8hr class, at... some insane number of dollars per hour. $1500? Something like that.
Stupid Emory.
Posted by Celaeno (Member # 8562) on :
Also, if you're looking for cheap(er) tickets, try Student Universe if you haven't already
Posted by Nell Gwyn (Member # 8291) on :
Celaeno has really good advice. Listen to her.
I'd also look into getting an ISIC card - it's an international student ID card that you can use for a lot of discounts on almost anything. They have country- and city-specific lists of all the places that accept it. It's usually just around 5%, but that adds up to a pretty good chunk at the end of your trip. Plus I think it's required for you to get the discounted fares on Student Universe.
Posted by Dante (Member # 1106) on :
You know, you can get many of the same benefits of studying abroad for a fraction of the price by visiting a country/countries on your own (especially if you bring along a friend).
Posted by Celaeno (Member # 8562) on :
But at the same time, it's one thing to visit a country and an entirely different thing to live in it.
Posted by Celaeno (Member # 8562) on :
quote:Originally posted by Nell Gwyn: Celaeno has really good advice. Listen to her.
I'd also look into getting an ISIC card - it's an international student ID card that you can use for a lot of discounts on almost anything. They have country- and city-specific lists of all the places that accept it. It's usually just around 5%, but that adds up to a pretty good chunk at the end of your trip. Plus I think it's required for you to get the discounted fares on Student Universe.
Thanks.
As for the ISIC card, t's not required for Student Universe (at least, I wasn't required to have one), but it will definitely be beneficial to havet. I saw lots of ISIC "stops" around England that members could go to and get help if they needed it.
Posted by pfresh85 (Member # 8085) on :
I'll look into the ISIC card if I do get to go.
Posted by Altáriël of Dorthonion (Member # 6473) on :
Oh yeah, I forgot to mention that it is financial aid that pays for all this, so I only pay around 1/3 of the cost. Posted by Nell Gwyn (Member # 8291) on :
Independent traveling is indeed a wonderful thing, but I wouldn't say it can replace studying abroad.
The classes themselves were among the best things about my semesters. I don't really mean just the academic aspects of them. I mainly took classes whose topics were unique to where I was (statistics being the exception *shudder*) and that tended to involve field trips, but the thing that really made them special was that I was studying theatre, art, history, etc from another culture's perspective, which was really interesting. Sure, I could conceivably have done the same in a non-classroom setting, but it would have taken a lot more research on my part, and I don't think it would have been as effective because I wouldn't have known what I was looking for.
I also really appreciated the structure that being in school gave the experience. If I'd spend that same total amount just on traveling around, I definitely wouldn't have spent as much time staying in one place and I wouldn't have experienced life as a resident of London. Having an account at the local Blockbuster, or a favorite restaurant on a little side street, or a favorite duck in the park were just as cool to me as getting a ton of photos of famous things.
That said, I also fully encourage independent backpacking trips all over the world. Posted by Dante (Member # 1106) on :
<shrug> I've just never seen the use in spending all that money. "Visiting" doesn't just mean popping in for six hours to see a museum and then heading to the next city. You can live in a foreign country quite independently of a study abroad program. If anything, such programs can be a detriment to getting to know the culture, as you are surrounded by students, professors, etc. who provide all the "comforts" of your home culture. If you're traveling, you have to get out on your own more.
Then again, maybe other people just have a lot more money than I do. Or have very different priorities on how to spend it.
Posted by Nell Gwyn (Member # 8291) on :
Well, the money isn't just for the traveling - most of the classes I took were electives that applied to my graduation requirements, two of them got applied to my minor, and two were for my major. Plus the scholarships and student loans take out a lot of the costs. If all I'd been working with was the amount I paid out of pocket, I wouldn't have been able to travel as widely or for as long as I was in Europe.
Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
I haven't studied abroad, only lived abroad (Sri Lanka), and I definitely agree with the others. If you can make it happen, do it. Do not hesitate - just do it! It's an invaluable experience.
Posted by andi330 (Member # 8572) on :
GO! GO! GO! I spent about 5 1/2 weeks working at an archaeological dig in Israel and all I can say is that it was one of the best experiences I have ever had. If you need money, ask your professors about research grants that you might be able to tie in to your travels. You'd be amazed at what's out there if you're willing to look for it.
Posted by pfresh85 (Member # 8085) on :
Well if I had a mastery of the Japanese language, a research grant might be more plausible in my field. There are still possible scholarships out there though.
Posted by pfresh85 (Member # 8085) on :
I sent in my application along with other forms (transcripts, some sort of approval form, and such) last week. They sent me an e-mail saying they got it and that it usually takes one to two weeks to process and send out approval or not. The people in the Office of International Education here said I was a shoe-in, so I may be in no matter what. Now it's time to scrounge for money (and scholarships). Posted by Celaeno (Member # 8562) on :
That's so exciting!
Keep us updated. Posted by pfresh85 (Member # 8085) on :
I have officially been accepted into the program. I'll be going to Tokyo this summer. Hooray! Now to continue digging for scholarships so I don't have to take out a big loan.
Posted by Nell Gwyn (Member # 8291) on :
Woohoo! I'm jealous. Good luck with the scholarship hunt! Posted by pfresh85 (Member # 8085) on :
I've found I'm only eligible for one scholarship (the one my school offers). I'm going to try for it, but I don't know how good my odds are. It may be loan time for me.
On a good note, I found out that my study abroad credits will count towards my honors requirements. This is good because I was worried about being low on credits for the honors program. Posted by pfresh85 (Member # 8085) on :
Well time for a big update. I didn't get any scholarship (or at least the scholarship I applied for still hasn't announced the winners). I ended up taking out a $8000 loan.
I'm off to Tokyo on Friday. I leave from Houston at 10:50AM. Then it's a 13.5 hour flight to Tokyo. Then I'll be in Tokyo for six weeks straight, the first week staying with a Japanese family and the rest staying in the Olympic Village. It's both really exciting and really stressing. I just can't wait to get there, since some of my stress will drop once I arrive and get settled in.
Posted by fugu13 (Member # 2859) on :
Get online after you're there, I may be able to connect you with some people I know in Tokyo from my exchange trip . . .
Posted by kojabu (Member # 8042) on :
In the words of everyone else, do it.
I spend a semester in Rome and while it wasn't the best while I was there (for personal reasons, not program or living abroad reasons), I value the experience greatly and really want to go back to Rome.
I also visited a few friends who spent a semester in London and they loved it as well.
Posted by pfresh85 (Member # 8085) on :
I should be back on the net after the first week. They have free wireless internet at the Olympic Village, so I should be able to post from there then.
Posted by pfresh85 (Member # 8085) on :
I received an e-mail today from the daughter of the people I will be staying with my first week. She seemed very nice and eager to meet me. Apparently it will be me and one other person staying with this family for the week. It should be an interesting experience. Let's just hope the stress building up to my departure doesn't kill me.
Posted by Soara (Member # 6729) on :
There are two foreign students at my (high) school right now, a junior from Argentina and a senior from Finland. You can tell just from being around them that it has been incredible for them to spend a year in the US. They are friends with over half the people in the high school (small school) and are both really sad about going home. Also, I don't know how important this is for you, but their English has improved amazingly. Neither of them hardly spoke English at all when they came, and now the way they use words and things sounds like they're native speakers. It's amazing. Also two of my friends are going to be studying abroad next year, one in Argentina and one in Costa Rica. Neither of them have ever studied Spanish in their lives, but they still really wanted to do this. I predict it will be scary at first for them, but they'll learn quickly. I'm sure it will be a totally life changing experience for both of them.
Posted by pfresh85 (Member # 8085) on :
I only have minimal knowledge of Japanese (I've been memorizing hiragana and katakana for the last few months, and I've also been working on some basic conversational stuff). I'm hoping to learn a great deal in my six weeks there, between the classes and being immersed in the culture/language.
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And if you have questions, I'm happy to help as best I can.![[Confused]](confused.gif)
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