1) To what extent can an science fiction/fantasy idea be protected under copyright as to prevent its use in independant stories and prevent their publishment?
2) Any chance can anyone provide me with what I am sorry to ask is a rather tall and probably exshaustive order. A List of Hebrew names (common, uncommon, rare) and places.
Actually make it three things, to Hatrack Hebrew Scholars (HHS), if you were to picture Judaism now in your mind and contrast it to Judaism of 5000 years ago and use any subtle differences in language and culture as a base, imagine what Jews would be like say 30,000 years in the future what would you imagine Jewish culture to be like? Assume we've colonized a large portion of the galaxy and that Earth has faded out of living memory for the majority of the human population to keep things simple.
Posted by Dagonee (Member # 5818) on :
Blayne, you've got to read the Dune books. You'd have to get all the way to the end to see why Dune is relevant to your third thing.
Not that I think FH's prediction was all that accurate, but it would provide one very deep thinker's take on the issue.
Posted by Flaming Toad on a Stick (Member # 9302) on :
So you want a Judaism with no Holy Land? Not sure that would work.
Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
quote:1) To what extent can an science fiction/fantasy idea be protected under copyright as to prevent its use in independant stories and prevent their publishment?
Not at all, and that has nothing to do with science fiction/fantasy, but applies to all genres.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
I don't have the Dune books all I have is God Emperor of Dune and I dislike the idea of readings books in a screwed up chronological order.
The idea is not that there is or is not a current Holy Land for all you know the "future" Jews know it exists and where and it is everyone else who does not, but that would mean I'ld be lying to you.
You see I am currently writing the backstory for a science fiction game (using the RPG Maker 2003) but I'm writing the story in the form of a novel, the thing is I do not, and I really do not like the idea of science fiction where "Earth" as we know it has been destroyed or something flat out where the author is in-your-face about it.
Its a certain amount of emotional significance to me that I have trouble getting my head around. One of the reasons why I never caught on to Gene Roddenberries Andromeda.
So I simply choose not to confirm or deny Earth's existence in my current work so I won't have to carry the emotional burden of offing my home planet. While this may cause complications if not contradictions with Jewish theology as I have yet to know it for now to keep things simple, I am ignoring the question of Earths existence and to what extent Jews know of/remember of it.
Otherwise I won't be able to sleep at night, what happens if Earth suddenly ceases to exist because of my writting?! How could I live with myself? What if I give people the wrong ideas? So for now I play it safe.
Posted by Eaquae Legit (Member # 3063) on :
Blayne, please, some punctuation? I'd love to discuss, but I can't even read it.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
But at least I didn't make any spelling mistakes
one moment please *plays elevator music*
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
Okay I think I added punctuation, although that would be falsely assuming I even know the meaning of what punctuation is.
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
Blayne, go read the Dune books. Seriously.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
I don't have them! And I don't wanna download them either! I'm watching Children of Dune Mini series and I've seen the Original Dune movie (one with Patrick Stewart) and I'm unsure of how it ties in with my #3.
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
Blayne. Watching movies is never a substitute for reading the original.
Dune is the most popular (in terms of copies sold) science fiction novel ever. You can find a copy. I promise it will be a lot cheaper than a video game.
Also, as Dag said, the things that tie in with your #3 are toward the end of the series.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
I live in Rigaud, which is a rather remote far away from civilization kind of place, my only means of transportation to civilization only occurs during school.
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
Get thee to a libary.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
I live in Rigaud FRENCH village town thingy, I wouldnt be able to read Dune assuming they had it.
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
Blayne, you're a smart, resourceful guy. If you want to, you can find a way to read those books.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
I'm just saying why i wont be able to read them in the next little while when school starts up again I'll borrow them.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
But ya #3 doesn't prevent the first two form being anwsered, since I'm terrible with names and such.
Posted by Tinros (Member # 8328) on :
Blayne, did you even TRY to so a google search for Hebrew names before asking that question? You realize you're asking people to take time out of their day, when you could just as easily type "List of Hebrew Names" into google and get all the answers you need?
That qualifies as rude in my book.
And don't try to tell me there aren't any comprehensive lists out there- I jsut did a search on them a couple of weeks ago for a character description I was writing up.
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
To answer #1 again -- ideas cannot be copyrighted.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
Tinros while I could undoubtably google it, I just wish to involve the very dear people of Hatrack who I enjoy their said company and friendship with my work.
But to be more specific what about concepts though?
The working title is Activity Displacement, basically I wanna use the idea/concept of Stargate system as a means of intergalactic transportation/communication but at the same time having nothing to do with the SG1/SGA universe, although various homages to the series will probly be included to give thanks to them as inspiration.
Posted by Chanie (Member # 9544) on :
You can find a whole list of Hebrew names in the Bible. Or you can just go with Chana .
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
im geussing thats your name ^^
as for looking in a bible... its buried in the dugneon known as my sock drawer, it is very dangerous place to traverse I might not make it back out :S
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
is Chana a girls name? and if so whats the meaning behind it I may just use it.
Posted by Valentine014 (Member # 5981) on :
Blayne, there are whole books in the library on Hebrew names and their meanings. I know this for a fact because about a year or two ago, I looked through one.
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
(I agree, though-- libraries are wonderful places. My two-year-old will tell you so if you let her.)
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
I hereby grant her permission to tell me.
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
quote:Originally posted by quidscribis:
quote:1) To what extent can an science fiction/fantasy idea be protected under copyright as to prevent its use in independant stories and prevent their publishment?
Not at all, and that has nothing to do with science fiction/fantasy, but applies to all genres.
Didn't some ding-dong try and patent a plot a couple of years ago?
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
quote:Originally posted by Flaming Toad on a Stick: So you want a Judaism with no Holy Land? Not sure that would work.
There could be a memory of the Land of Israel, and intent to someday find it.
Posted by Dagonee (Member # 5818) on :
While this case found no violation, it does make it clear that there is some amount of a story that will constitute copying if duplicated, even if no actual expression is copied.
So while no idea may be copyrighted, it's not clear that writing a story with the same elements as another story does not amount to violation.
So the answer to question #1 is "it depends." The idea of an ansible almost certainly can't be protected at all. The idea of a prescient youth becoming a symbiote with the larval vector of a giant sandworm which produces a life-prolonging, mind-expanding drug and ruling the known universe for 3500 years might be protected a little bit. Tack on masters of genetics who achieve pseudo-immortality by cloning themselves from the cells of their corpses and recovering their previous memories, a machine-culture of technologists, and an ancient society of women who can access the memories of all their female ancestors, and you might have a little more protection.
(Well, you wouldn't, of course. Frank Herbert's estate would.)
Posted by fugu13 (Member # 2859) on :
quote:The idea of a prescient youth becoming a symbiote with the larval vector of a giant sandworm which produces a life-prolonging, mind-expanding drug and ruling the known universe for 3500 years might be protected a little bit. Tack on masters of genetics who achieve pseudo-immortality by cloning themselves from the cells of their corpses and recovering their previous memories, a machine-culture of technologists, and an ancient society of women who can access the memories of all their female ancestors, and you might have a little more protection.
Infringer!
Posted by Dagonee (Member # 5818) on :
You infringed on my infringement!
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
quote:Originally posted by Lisa:
quote:Originally posted by quidscribis:
quote:1) To what extent can an science fiction/fantasy idea be protected under copyright as to prevent its use in independant stories and prevent their publishment?
Not at all, and that has nothing to do with science fiction/fantasy, but applies to all genres.
Didn't some ding-dong try and patent a plot a couple of years ago?
So the answer to question #1 is "it depends." The idea of an ansible almost certainly can't be protected at all. The idea of a prescient youth becoming a symbiote with the larval vector of a giant sandworm which produces a life-prolonging, mind-expanding drug and ruling the known universe for 3500 years might be protected a little bit. Tack on masters of genetics who achieve pseudo-immortality by cloning themselves from the cells of their corpses and recovering their previous memories, a machine-culture of technologists, and an ancient society of women who can access the memories of all their female ancestors, and you might have a little more protection.
(Well, you wouldn't, of course. Frank Herbert's estate would.)
Well obviously I would never dare to add any kind of plot device invovling the gould or the whatchamacallits from Dune. The idea of a metallic ring (in my universe its made of metal) capable of instantious travel is as far as I go. Which I hope is ok otherwise no one could write scifi involving space ships right?
Posted by Chanie (Member # 9544) on :
quote:Originally posted by Blayne Bradley: is Chana a girls name? and if so whats the meaning behind it I may just use it.
Yes, the English version is Hannah.
Posted by Raia (Member # 4700) on :
Hi Chanie!
Where are you from? I'm just curious, because I'm an Israeli living in the US, and I don't see the Hebrew spelling of Chana in this country very often...
Posted by Chanie (Member # 9544) on :
I'm from the NY area. My parents just chose to give me a name that is hard for most people to pronounce. I answer to Chain-ee all of the time .
Posted by Will B (Member # 7931) on :
Luke Skywalker and Darth Vader are protected by Lucas's copyright, but that copyright doesn't protect the idea of someone using a spiritual force to guide him in blowing up a space station that can destroy an entire planet.
Characters are copyrightable in that anything they appear in is considered a "derivative work." But you can reuse plot. And a good thing.
You'll run into more problem from people saying, "Wait, this is just Star Wars rehashed!" and getting disgusted.
--
I think for your Judaism in 5000 CE, you'd do well to imagine 5000 CE culture, then imagine how Judaism would fit into it. Then you can add tweaks of historical events like Neo-Hannukah in 3560, and updates of doctrine.
Of maybe you have some doctrinal question and would like to postulate what if there was a change. What if we develop Re-Reform Judaism that says that the chosen people are now all of humanity, except those with more than 4 arms? Or cyber-implants that help you meditate on Hashem 24-7.
Recommneded reading: Characters & Viewpoint by OSC, specifically the Thousand Ideas in an Hour part.
More recommended reading: John Barnes, Apostrophes and Catastrophes, specifically the essay on building a future.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
luckily for all of us I don't intend to write scifi involving 4 armed people as humans. but the rest is damn good advice.
Posted by GaalDornick (Member # 8880) on :
"My parents just chose to give me a name that is hard for most people to pronounce. I answer to Chain-ee all of the time [Smile] ."
Wow. We must be related. My real first name is Chaim (which means "life" in Hebrew, Blayne) and whenever I go somewhere where they call me by my real first name I go by Chaym. Posted by El JT de Spang (Member # 7742) on :
Funny, that how I always thought Chaim was pronounced (I've only read it, never met a real life 'Chaim').
How do you say it?
------
Also, I suppose I'm gonna have to pick up the rest of the Dune books. I think I made it to book 3 or 4 before the story lost me.
Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
It's chah-yeem (or -yim).
Chanie and Gaal, my sister and my son empathize with you.
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
Tova is lucky that we gave her an easily pronounceable name (though I imagine she'll eventually run into people who pronounce the o as in pot). My partner's name, though, is Havah. She deliberately chose not to spell it Chava in order to avoid this problem.
Posted by GaalDornick (Member # 8880) on :
Yeah, what rivka said, except try to make the Hebrew CH sound, not the ch sound like in "chin" but like...well I can't think of any English equivalent. And if you can't make that sound then just say it with an H. Like "Hi-yeem".
Posted by Chanie (Member # 9544) on :
The two commonly known words with the sound are Channukah and challah.
My sister's name is Sarah, perhaps because my parents were so sick of my name being mispronounced. She decided it was too plain when she was about 12, and started going by Tzeitel (common nickname for Sarah). So I guess you can't win.
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
Think the ch sound in Achtung. Except a little less harsh.
This is why I write Hanukkah.
Posted by Tante Shvester (Member # 8202) on :
Jewish names? It's like asking for a list of English names -- there's a lot of them.
Here are some of the boys from my son's school: Dovid, Doniel, Ephraim, Eli, Tzvi, Kivi, Moshe, Avi, Menachem, Yitzchak (known as Yitzi), Yosef (known as Yosie), Benyamin, Gershon (known as Gershie), Ariel, Aryeh, Ari, Yaakov, Shraga, Yehudah, Shlomo, Pesach, Simcha, Shmuel (known as Shmueli), Chaim, Reuven.
Did that help at all?
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
Israeli names would include Rami (short for Avraham), Kobi (short for Yaakov), Tzachi (short for Yitzchak), Seffi (short for Yosef), Dudi (short for David), Shai (sometimes short for Yishayahu, and sometimes not short for anything), Shuwi (short for Yehoshua), Alon, Yuval, Yigal, Gai (sounds like "guy"), Ehud, Tomer, Barak.
Posted by Liz B (Member # 8238) on :
For another vision of future isolated-planet Judaism, try Hyperion by Dan Simmons. In his universe, Earth has been destroyed, so it's definitely Judaism without the Holy Land.
Benefit: You don't have to read multiple novels like with Dune.
Drawback: Worst ending for a book EVER.
I'm still mad about that one and refusing to read the sequel. (Dune is really good, though!)
Posted by crescentsss (Member # 9494) on :
quote:Originally posted by Lisa: Israeli names would include Rami (short for Avraham), Kobi (short for Yaakov), Tzachi (short for Yitzchak), Seffi (short for Yosef), Dudi (short for David), Shai (sometimes short for Yishayahu, and sometimes not short for anything), Shuwi (short for Yehoshua), Alon, Yuval, Yigal, Gai (sounds like "guy"), Ehud, Tomer, Barak.
for clarification - these are boys' names
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
quote:Originally posted by crescentsss:
quote:Originally posted by Lisa: Israeli names would include Rami (short for Avraham), Kobi (short for Yaakov), Tzachi (short for Yitzchak), Seffi (short for Yosef), Dudi (short for David), Shai (sometimes short for Yishayahu, and sometimes not short for anything), Shuwi (short for Yehoshua), Alon, Yuval, Yigal, Gai (sounds like "guy"), Ehud, Tomer, Barak.
for clarification - these are boys' names
True. I had just seen Esther's list of boys names. Israeli girls names include Lilach, Liora, Liat, Lital, Liel, Mali (short for Malka), Tali (short for Avital), Shevi (short for Elisheva), Sari (short for Sarah), Tzippora, Yael, Shani (short for Shoshana), Shoshi (also short for Shoshana), Dasi (short for Hadassah), Tami (short for Tamar), Miki (short for Michal), Maayan, Meital, Meirav.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
quote:Originally posted by Tante Shvester: Jewish names? It's like asking for a list of English names -- there's a lot of them.
Here are some of the boys from my son's school: Dovid, Doniel, Ephraim, Eli, Tzvi, Kivi, Moshe, Avi, Menachem, Yitzchak (known as Yitzi), Yosef (known as Yosie), Benyamin, Gershon (known as Gershie), Ariel, Aryeh, Ari, Yaakov, Shraga, Yehudah, Shlomo, Pesach, Simcha, Shmuel (known as Shmueli), Chaim, Reuven.
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