I was reading this article from TIME magazine when I saw the link to the blog. I'm having some very mixed reactions to the blog. I guess to a degree they really aren't talking about me (except they think they are), like the TIME article says, it's about a socio-economic subset of whites, mostly. I don't like at least half the things on their big list of things, but some of them nail me pretty good.
For example, #86 is white people and shorts, and how especially young white men refuse to admit that it's cold outside and they wear shorts because it's supposed to be warm outside. Well, it was 70 on Monday, SEVENTY. It was like the first unofficial day of Spring (even though it's been Spring for weeks, it's been below freezing and snowy), hell, of Summer even. Earlier tonight I went out to get a slurpee and it was 40 degrees out and I was still wearing shorts...AND sandals. But come on, seventy...Monday!
I think there are a lot of things on that list that transcend race, that aren't true across the board for whites, and a fair bit of it is somewhat condescending. I was surprised to learn the authors of the site were white.
But here's my dilemma, more so than whether or not these things are true and how they apply to me personally. On one hand, a lot of them are VERY funny. Some of them are even observations I've made to friends or just thought to myself. But on the other hand, reading the comments at the bottom of the page, there are some REALLY malicious people out there. Obviously not everyone is taking the site with a grain of salt and a good sense of humor, some people really think there is malicious intent in the posts and they are out to hammer that home.
I think in the end I come to this: It's funny, and some of it is dead on, and even if it isn't, it's still funny and meant to be funny, so I'll take it that way. I think it says good things that we can laugh at ourselves (we as a people, not a race), and that we can recognize how minorities might feel about living in a culture dominated by another race they don't necessarily share a bond with. But I worry about the undercurrent of people who think ALL white people are like that, and the negativity flying around.
Posted by Synesthesia (Member # 4774) on :
In the stuff Educated Black People Like one thing was moving to Georgia I will NOT move to Georgia. It's too hot and I hate the south. No offense, but the summers are too hot down south so I won't go there. But, stereotypes are funny because they are kind of stupid.
Posted by pooka (Member # 5003) on :
I wonder if I still have that 88 ways to know if you're Chinese e-mail. The funniest one to me was you don't take the protective film off electronic devices.
Posted by C3PO the Dragon Slayer (Member # 10416) on :
The April 1 entry was very good.
Posted by C3PO the Dragon Slayer (Member # 10416) on :
Reminds me of the Super Paper Mario geek levels (to gain access to his secret rooms, you have to answer "yes" to the geekiest questions)... which is surely another part of the stuff white people like.
Posted by Richard Berg (Member # 133) on :
If you interact with (or better yet, embody) the demographic the authors are targetting, the site is absolutely hilarious. But I can see how a lot of people might find their caricature confusing.
Posted by Mucus (Member # 9735) on :
Heh, check out 11, the second most popular post if I'm reading this right (or rather don't, the long length of the comments nearly destroyed Firefox).
quote: ... White men love asian women so much that they will go to extremes such as stating that Sandra Oh is sexy, teaching English in Asia, playing in a coed volleyball league, or attending institutions such as UBC or UCLA ... Another factor that draws white guys to asian women is that white women are jealous of them.
Spare an "ouch" for poor Sandra Oh
#20 is amusing, are you entirely sure that all the contributors to the site are white?
quote: White people can also take passing interest in film, politics, music or art from these countries. When they actually meet someone from that country, or at least who has parents from that country they cannot wait to engage you in all the details that they have learned.
“Have you heard the new Andy Lau CD? It’s awesome!”
It is imperative that you recognize how special and unique this white person is for knowing about your culture. Acceptable responses include “Wow, I’ve never seen a white person order chicken feet,” or “How did you find about that film? I didn’t think they had dubbed it yet.”
I mean, Andy Lau?
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
I know the guy who runs it is white, but I don't know about everyone who contributes stories or material.
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
Huh. It turns out that not only am I not white, but I only know a handful of white people.
Does that mean I can now be a good person without hating myself?
Posted by pooka (Member # 5003) on :
Was the bit about being bought by Target the April 1st post? I couldn't quite tell.
The part about white people and illegal music downloads struck me as particularly funny. I mean, I'm less music literate than the average Amish person, so it may just be me.
Posted by Mucus (Member # 9735) on :
Awesome #75:
quote: Often times, white people get frustrated with the state of their country. They do not like the President, or Congress, or the health care system, or the illegal status of Marijuana. Whenever they are presented with a situation that seems unreasonable to them, their first instinct is to threaten to move to Canada. ... Though they will never actually move to Canada, the act of declaring that they are willing to undertake the journey is very symbolic in white culture. ... Note: Canadian white people threaten to move to Europe.
Note: Europeans are unable to threaten to move anywhere.
I should see if there is an Asian version.
Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
I think the site is absolutely hilarious. Most of them are pretty spot on to me and my general group of acquaintances, especially the ones who live in Philly or NYC(breakfast places, expensive sandwiches, asaian fusion food come to mind).
edit - Some of my favorites are:
Threatening to move to Canada Standing still at Concerts Vintage Awareness Knowing what's best for poor people Indie Music Top 10 hip hop songs all white people like Juno Michel Gondry...
I can go on and on.
Oh, also, I've never read the comments. It seemed a daunting task.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
According to the TIME article, there are knockoff versions. I did a quick Google search earlier and found "stuff black people like," "stuff educated black people like," and "stuff Asian people like" blogs. I didn't check any of them out.
Posted by scholarette (Member # 11540) on :
#53 Dogs is so true! That one I actually relate to. I was beginning to think I am not as white as I thought.
Posted by Nighthawk (Member # 4176) on :
quote:Originally posted by mr_porteiro_head: Huh. It turns out that not only am I not white, but I only know a handful of white people.
Does that mean I can now be a good person without hating myself?
Well, if it makes you feel better, we can continue to hate you. Just to balance things out, you know... Posted by Mucus (Member # 9735) on :
It amuses me Posted by erosomniac (Member # 6834) on :
The Asian one is, sadly, not even close enough to accurate to be amusing.
Edit: and why, after posting, did the board redirect me not to this thread, but to Lyrhawn's recent posts? Posted by Mucus (Member # 9735) on :
I find it roughly as accurate as Lyrhawn seemed to find the white one. That is to say, its not completely accurate but I know a relatively decent number of people that fit into several of the stereotypical groups that it describes and I see several of those attributes in myself as well.
Posted by erosomniac (Member # 6834) on :
We must know very different Asian people.
(Which, given I'm from Hawaii and you're, IIRC, from Canada, doesn't surprise me!)
Posted by Launchywiggin (Member # 9116) on :
I just read the whole White people blog...
I laughed a few times, smiled a bunch, but mostly--I can relate to being a "guilty" white person. I'd point out that the writer paints a very cynical picture of white people's motivations for what they like/don't like (I actually LIKE most of the things on the list). It's frustrating because I am very AGAINST the status symbol/social hierarchy game--it's shallow.
Probably just me wanting to be unique. I need to realize that it's OK to just be another one of the group.
Posted by anti_maven (Member # 9789) on :
Apparently I'm not the right kind of white person.
But being European I have no where to run to.
Very funny blog.
Posted by the_Somalian (Member # 6688) on :
He also lists The Wire! The show was never that mainstream though but it was a bit of a hit with the segment of whites he is parodying.
It's a funny blog and it's making a lot of bloggers jealous because of the suddenness of its popularity. But I too am disturbed by the comments section--it attracts genuine creeps and racists.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
quote:Originally posted by eros: Edit: and why, after posting, did the board redirect me not to this thread, but to Lyrhawn's recent posts?
Maybe Hatrack is trying to tell you something?
(or maybe you accidentally clicked the posts button below my name when you were redirected?)
quote:Originally posted by Launchywiggin: Probably just me wanting to be unique.
I'll bet that's the next thing they add to the list. But then, I don't think that's a white thing, I think it's either an American thing or a human thing.
quote:Originally posted by the_Somalian: But I too am disturbed by the comments section--it attracts genuine creeps and racists.
I went looking for some other blogs, other race related ones. And I spent a little time reading them. Race, at least, my personal relationship to race, is something I don't usually talk about, and for one simple reason: Other than at work, I don't talk to black or asian people on a regular basis. Most of the people I talk to on a daily basis at work are either black or hispanic, and once and awhile we talk about race, but it's mostly joking around.
But all my friends are white, which has less to do with my preference than it does with demographics: Where I live, unless I head to places primarily comprised of minorities (Dearborn for Arabs, Detroit or Flint for blacks, etc), there really isn't anything other than white people around. My point is that I rarely come into contact with and kind of face to face, one on one discussions with every day minorities about race. All I ever really hear are the people on tv, be they Reverands Wright or Jackson, or King, or Barack Obama, or Louis Farakhan. I get extremes, I get anger, I get beautiful poetry, I get a dream, but sometimes? I don't get it. What I've found in some of these blogs is some anger and some dark humor, some sardonic wit, but also hatred, and a whole lot of people in the comments section saying "Damn right!"
The last time I really remember talking to a black guy about race was at work, about a year ago. I can't remember how we got around to it, but somehow we got to talking about how we talk about other races when we aren't in public. And he said a lot of black people call whites all sorts of name in private, and he just assumed that all white people referred to black guys by the N word as a matter of course, automatically. I was rather horrified, and I told him that no, other than my crazy Uncle, I've never been in the home of a white person that referred to black people that way, and that if I said that in MY home, I'd have gotten smacked six ways from Sunday and sent to my room when I was younger. He then said the same was true in his house as well.
It makes me wonder how serious the race bubble we're living in is. Are we making progress, or are we all just getting really good at being polite in public, waiting for the day when that bubble pops and all hell breaks loose? And if the bubble is really that big, do we even understand each other?
I guess I've always thought about race relations in such larger terms, in terms of national legislation, national murder rates or poverty rates. Or in terms of affirmative action, median salaries, the number of minorities in high public offices, in mayor's offices, in governor's mansions. Or in terms of how well Barack Obama is doing, and the speeches he is giving. I never wondered to myself "what does the black guy down the street think of me?" And I also guess that I really don't care what he thinks of me, in the same way that I really don't care what most people think of me except some friends and family, people whom I respect and wish would respect me as well. But this has less to do with what they think of me, Lyrhawn, and more to do with what they think of me, white neighbor guy. And I'm at a loss as to how to address that.
Sorry, I guess I went off on a bit of a tangent there, but between some of the race stuff that's been flying around lately, and this blog, this has been on my mind, and you all caught what I suppose is the summation of my thoughts and questions over the last couple days.
Posted by talsmitde (Member # 9780) on :
Wow--while I only fit a quarter of the list I have friends who fit pretty much all of it. I even have a friend who had such a crappy high school experience (b/c all he talked about was the benefits of socialized health care) that he followed through on his threat to move to Canada. He thinks of moving on to Europe, dates an Asian girl, eats only organic food, and yup, _works_ for NPR, filing stories on "exotic" cultures.
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
quote:Originally posted by pooka: I wonder if I still have that 88 ways to know if you're Chinese e-mail. The funniest one to me was you don't take the protective film off electronic devices.
I guess I'm Chinese, then. I still haven't taken it off of the viewscreen on my camera after like 2 years.
Posted by talsmitde (Member # 9780) on :
Thanks for your comments Lyrhawn. Yeah, I too have tended to think about race relations in sort of the big-picture, abstract way you described.
The U.S. has definitely made progress over the last sixty years, but then again, we had regressed for a solid sixty years after Reconstruction . . .
I spent about a year and a half in South Carolina a couple years ago, and it amazed me how racial differences played out in different parts of the state. In a dying mill town in the upstate, classic racism was very prevalent. White business owners would avoid hiring blacks if they could, a Filipino girl I knew was often considered "colored" by the older residents of town and looked down upon because of this. In Columbia (the state capital) and the rural area around it, and I think this is more how it is in the country as a whole, race was more a function of socio-economic status, especially among teenagers. If you were poor, you dressed/acted/talked differently than if you were rich, but one was considered "black" and the other "white."
When I'm not Hatrack-ing, I'm a grad student in Caribbean history, a story that's rife with racial division. It's important to realize 1) how much the definition of race was changed over time 2) how much b.s. there is in a lot of professors' discussions of race. The idea that Africans or Asians or Europeans were biologically/genetically/fundamentally inferior didn't really get going until the mid-nineteenth century and hit it's peak the first three decades of the twentieth century. We think of race the way we do because of lots of historical/cultural reasons but at the end of the day the existence of different races is a smoke-and-mirrors trick that only works because a lot of people buy into it. It also cuts a lot of ways, despite the sensitivity trainings in college that teach that only whites are capable feeling racial prejudice.
Looking around my apartment complex, I think modern U.S. culture really suffers from a lack of neighborliness. I'm white and I don't really talk to my black neighbors, but that's because I don't talk to _any_ of my neighbors. I've got my friends at school, at church, scattered across the country, but I don't have much buy-in with my really local community--there is no community.
At the end of the day, I think about the scene in Speaker for the Dead, when Ender's talking to Human about the definition of "tribe." We are a particular tribe because we say that we're a particular tribe--I could only talk to LDS historians who were born in northern Delaware, are fairly moderate politically, and are OSC fans, but I'd get very, very lonely.
*End soapbox*
Posted by talsmitde (Member # 9780) on :
quote:Originally posted by Lisa:
quote:Originally posted by pooka: I wonder if I still have that 88 ways to know if you're Chinese e-mail. The funniest one to me was you don't take the protective film off electronic devices.
I guess I'm Chinese, then. I still haven't taken it off of the viewscreen on my camera after like 2 years.
Yeah, what does it say about me when I put protective film on my electronics? Nothing good, I'm guessing. Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
quote:At the end of the day, I think about the scene in Speaker for the Dead, when Ender's talking to Human about the definition of "tribe." We are a particular tribe because we say that we're a particular tribe--I could only talk to LDS historians who were born in northern Delaware, are fairly moderate politically, and are OSC fans, but I'd get very, very lonely.
When I think in those terms and connect it to fiction, I generally use Delenn from Babylon 5 talking about how humans build communities. It's a lovely speech she gives about humanity, and I always get warm fuzzies when I hear it, and not just because Furlan (that's the actress' name right?) is really quite compelling.
But speechifying politicians talk a LOT about how great America is because we're the ultimate exercise in the last few hundred years in building communities. We're the bastard child of the world when it comes to absorbing different cultures, and we've done VERY well at it...so long as they were varying white cultures. Sometimes I think we don't get enough credit for that when you look at the warring history of Europe and the thousands of years of white on white violence there, we mostly nixed any sort of cultural white on white violence through assimilation. But that was the easy stuff, so even if we were deserved credit, it wouldn't be very much. I DO treasure our ability to at least try and build communities, but I think far too often, in our fear of the unknown and unwillingness to change, we build GATED communities. And we make those decisions outside the realm of grand, national scale politics.
I attended a couple seminars on "White Flight" a few years ago at the suggestion of one of my history professors. I knew there was intimidation involved in some white neighborhoods towards some black families, but the scale...it was unnerving. First off, I think a lot of people in the north especially think of race as a southern problem. And while I think there's some validity to the idea that it's worse there than here, that ignores a lot of history. In 1850, when a lot of whites were standing up to say "no" to slavery, they weren't saying "yes" to improved race relations. A lot of northern whites were saying no to slavery expansion in western territory because they didn't want blacks there at all, they wanted the land free for their own settling. That didn't stop millions of them for fighting to end slavery though, which should never be forgotten.
Back to the seminars I attended. I heard stories of mortgage lenders refusing to give loans to black families who wanted to move to the suburbs of Detroit. Families who did manage to get out had windows broken, literally had mobs appear on their front lawns at night with torches threatening them to leave. Black families had to band together for mutual protection from many of their white neighbors. By and large, they left, and went back to Detroit, or moved down south to be with family. All the white were leaving Detroit at the time, and this was in the 60's and 70's. The riots had turned a lot of people off to the inner city, and when they left, the city descended into a sort of madness, and since the blacks in the city couldn't get out, they were caught up in what came later.
Thinking on it some more, for the older generation of black people, I DO see why a lot of them could be angry. But I also feel that with every generation we get better. Every generation is just a little bit, or sometimes a lot more tolerant than the last.
What Delenn in Babylon 5 was talking about was true, but it was an oversimplification of a long, long process. Eventually the gates will have to come down, and the gates in our minds as well. The kind of dialogue I think Obama was talking about recently wasn't a national one, it was a community one. Even if that wasn't what he meant, it's what we need. Barack Obama talking to John McCain about race is about as useful for me and the black guy down the street as Olmert talking to Nasrallah about religion would be for an average Israeli and average Palestinian. Conversations might bring down the gates we can see, the big time stuff that splashes over news headlines so well, but it's the gates in our minds, in our living rooms, and for that matter, the fences between our houses that we need to talk about. "Good fences make good neighbors" was meant to be ironic.
When candidates for the presidency take their first steps into the arena, often one of the first things they have to learn is "retail politics." Generally you do that in Iowa and New Hampshire, meeting people face to face, getting one vote at a time. You spend time in living rooms and VFW halls talking to regular people. It's only months later that you get to rock concert style rallys and national advertising. The problem with America's solution to race relations is that we're applying the rock concert rallys and national advertising before the retail politics.
And I was just going to go into how crappy a role the media has played in the struggle when I realized that I'd devolved into yet ANOTHER long speech on the subject composed of random thoughts I'd just come up with. This is what happens when you haven't been to bed yet and it's almost 9am. Sorry. It's the last time I swear!
Posted by talsmitde (Member # 9780) on :
Maybe it's for a different thread, but I would be interested in your rant on the crappiness of the media in our struggles to forge communities.
I think it's also important to realize that there was still a significant amount of anti-Jewish, anti-Italian, etc. prejudice in the 1920s and '30s, so even building "white" communities has taken some work, but yeah, "white flight" and the real estate industry really are some of the biggest problems we have in developing true communities.
The point about the north is well taken--Ohio was the hotbed of KKK activity in the '20s, and my home state of Delaware has some racial hang-ups I can't even begin to understand.
Posted by The Rabbit (Member # 671) on :
A few year back this would have been called "stuff yuppies like". If it had been called that it would have been a set of accurate comments on a particular demographic and that demographic or those familiar with it would have found it funny. It also would never have made TIME magazine.
What make this site edgy is that it equates that particular demographic with "white people". That makes it racist because most white people don't fit in that demographic and not all people in that demographic are white. I have really mixed feeling about it over all. On the one hand I know a lot of people in that demographic and think some of the comments are spot on for that group. On the other hand I'm offended by the racist assertion that the defining feature of that demographic is that they are "white".
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
quote:But speechifying politicians talk a LOT about how great America is because we're the ultimate exercise in the last few hundred years in building communities. We're the bastard child of the world when it comes to absorbing different cultures, and we've done VERY well at it...so long as they were varying white cultures.
It should be noted that a lot of those cultures weren't considered white at all when they first came over here.
I have every hope that we will continue to absorb and fully incorporate cultures which we seem to be going to such great lengths to alienate.
Posted by Mucus (Member # 9735) on :
quote:Originally posted by erosomniac: We must know very different Asian people.
(Which, given I'm from Hawaii and you're, IIRC, from Canada, doesn't surprise me!)
That is quite possible. Despite the title of "Asian", the intended demographic of the article appears to me to be a schizophrenic mix of either CBC (or I guess ABC) stereotypes in areas with decently large Chinese populations and HK (or to a lesser extent Taiwanese) FOBs.
I can quickly think of certain stereotypical demographics that would not be covered, say Chinese Christians which in my experience would often turn some of those sterotypes right around.
<Insert mandatory comment how sterotypes always have exceptions either way>
quote:Originally posted by The Rabbit: A few year back this would have been called "stuff yuppies like" ... What make this site edgy is that it equates that particular demographic with "white people". That makes it racist because most white people don't fit in that demographic and not all people in that demographic are white.
For better or for worse, this kind of thing dates back to at least 2001* This brand of self-depreciating humour definitely makes the rounds in my university community which has both a large Asian and white contingent. Personally, I don't think its all that bad. Its actually part of the healing process to be able to identify sterotypes, both positive and negative and be able to laugh at them. Better to put all this stuff out on the table for discussion rather than keep it all bottled up.
Granted, this kind of humour is not particularly high-brow and can be offensive in the wrong hands, but it does not seem to be the case here.
* As historical evidence, consider this article from my university in 2001:
quote: White Like Us Have you kissed your white lately?
University of Waterloo is well known for its diversity. Therefore, mathNEWS has embarked on a quest to find the stereotypical Caucasian individual. After interviewing and surveying a large number of students, we have selected the three whitest students in the university.
...
Kenneth Chung Hi. How's it going? Yeah. I'm pretty white. Well, I've been white since I first moved to my hometown in the boondocks. I can prove that I'm white. Here's a list of personal information that proves it.
* I've been to a square dance. * I've tipped a cow. * I've curled. * Pete Love speaks more Chinese than I do. * I don't own a pair of chopsticks and I've used the rice cooker less than both my housemates. * My favourite food is poutine. * I don't drink Canadian or Blue. * My favourite song is What's the D-d-d-dillio? by Mest. * I want to live in a small town. * My idea of a good time is dirting it around town. * I know the definition of "keelers." * Most of my friends from back home are pregnant.
(For those missing context, the source of the humour is that Asians so dominate the math faculty here that the "whitest" people are Asians born in Canada)
Posted by scifibum (Member # 7625) on :
I think it's interesting how we all seem make the mental leap from "stuff white people like" to something closer to one of the following: -Stuff ALL white people like -Stuff ONLY white people like
Because, really, the only reason to be offended or disturbed by the observation that white people like certain things is if that leap is made.
I believe the site authors intend for us to make that leap. I also believe they deliberately leave it to the reader to make that leap, and quietly chuckle to themselves about it. But when it comes down to it, it's the reader who takes a broad generalization and makes it an encompassing one, and then makes the choice to find it amusing, offensive, or anything in between.
I think it's healthy for the least-discriminated-against, least-disadvantaged group - if you can find a way to define that group, and I think "white people" is a fair way to do so - to get a little fun poked at it. I don't think it's divisive or likely to incite any discrimination. If I did find that likely, then I'd be bothered by it. As it is, I just think it's funny.
Posted by Mucus (Member # 9735) on :
Here's an interesting opinion pieces that echoes some of the observations and terms used here:
quote: By "white people," Lander doesn't actually mean the more than 221 million Americans who check that box on the decennial census. But that's part of the fun. Lander is doing to whites what scores of journalists and politicians do to non-white minorities every day, "essentializing" complex identities -- that is, stripping away all variety and reducing them to their presumed authentic essences.
One irony-deficient reader complained that the blog was less about white people than it was about yuppies. And without knowing it, she was cutting to the heart of the joke. Lander is gently making fun of the many progressive, educated, upper-middle-class whites who think they are beyond ethnicity or collectively shared tastes, styles or outlook. He's essentially reminding them that they too are part of a group.
"I'm writing about the white people who think they're absolutely unique and individual," Lander told me. "I'm calling them out and poking fun of myself. The things I post are all the things I like too!"
And what are those things? Recycling, expensive sandwiches, standing still at concerts, Toyota Priuses, natural medicine, irony, public radio, breakfast places, vegetarianism, organic foods and being an expert on ethnic cultures are just a few.
Lander thinks that most of his readers are actually members of the elite group he's lampooning. Some of the comments on the blog suggest that he's right. "Oh, lord, it only hurts because it's true! Love the blog," one reader who calls herself White Lady wrote. But others are more perplexed. Responding to a blog entry claiming that white people like Sarah Silverman, MC wrote, "I'm white and I HATE Sarah Silverman (and would take Monique ... ANYDAY, so there.") Still another offended and anonymous reader listed a lot of racist stereotypes about blacks, Mexicans, Arabs, Jews and Chinese to even the score.
scifibum, What is the point of putting the adjective "white" in the sentence if it is not to imply that the sentence pertains to at least most people who are white and that it is more likely to apply to people who are white than those who are not.
If I made a list of stuff "subaru owners like", it wouldn't be a leap to conclude that I thought many subaru owners had more things in common with each other, beyond subaru ownership, than they had with people at large and that my list had an accurate summary of things subaru owners were likely to have in common.
And while I have no problem in general with poking fun at groups or individuals who are advantaged, the problem I have with this list is that it equates "white" with "younger upper middle class urban professionals".
Since even by a generous definition, the upper middle class constitutes less than 10% of the population and non-Hispanic whites make up ~65% of the population its extremely inaccurate to imply most whites are likely to have things on this list in common.
Posted by scifibum (Member # 7625) on :
The Rabbit, the point is definitely for people to infer "all" or "only". It's still a leap though, IMO. It's one we're conditioned to make because we're on guard against racial stereotyping (and other politically incorrect faux pas*).
I agree with you that it's also meant to make the blog edgy. It's playing with our sense of political correctness. I think it's significant that the yuppies most accurately described by the blog might also be more attuned to political correctness than white people in general. There I go with my own stereotype.
Disclosure: I like a lot of that stuff, I'm white, I'm not urban, and not affluent.
(*What's the plural of "faux pas"?)
Posted by pooka (Member # 5003) on :
Here's the 88 ways to know you're chinese that my sister sent me a couple of years ago. I have a theory that several white people, mostly Porter, will check off more of these than I have.
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
Except for the ones about being extremely frugal, the only ones that applied to me were learning a musical instrument, learning a martial art, and studying engineering.
Posted by pooka (Member # 5003) on :
Right No wonder I didn't even look half chinese to you.
Also, looking over this list, I'm remembering that my sister only sent it to 4 of our 8 siblings. Some of them are kind of offensive. Posted by Dan_raven (Member # 3383) on :
Here is anecdotal evidence of the change in Tribalism in the US.
When my wife's Grandmother married my wife's Grandfather, there was a family feud started that still lingers in some sections of the Italian "Hill" area of St. Louis. My wife's Grandmother's family immigrated from Northern Italy. My wife's Grandfather's family immigrated from Sicily. Such a mixed marriage was devastating. Threats were made and violence almost erupted at the wedding.
When my wife's Mother married my wife's Father there was some snickering. She was a good Catholic, and he was a Protestant. While it was not considered a good or proper match, the level of unhappiness in the family was kept politely hidden.
When I married my wife her family was thrilled to have another good man in the family. I never heard a bad word or comment from anyone in regards to my religion--not even Christian, nor my racial background--a European mix, with Jewish roots.
Communities are built by us Humans, it just takes time.
Posted by MightyCow (Member # 9253) on :
Quick - somebody do "Stuff Hatrack Members Like"
Posted by pooka (Member # 5003) on :
Hatrack members like things that no one else likes. If someone else likes it, it's crap.
Posted by Mucus (Member # 9735) on :
quote: (Pooka's link) >64. When you're sick, your parents tell you not to eat fried foods or baked >goods due to "yeet hay". > >65. You know what yeet hay is.
Heh.
Posted by Sala (Member # 8980) on :
talsmitde, would it matter if I wasn't born in northern delaware, but that I grew up there, married a historian, is lds, loves to read osc, would that be close enough to *your* community? If so, hiya!
Posted by Synesthesia (Member # 4774) on :
quote:Originally posted by pooka: Here's the 88 ways to know you're chinese that my sister sent me a couple of years ago. I have a theory that several white people, mostly Porter, will check off more of these than I have.
Wow. I must be Chinese as I do some of that stuff. Especially yelling Ai-yah when I'm frustrated and Wah as well. And I look about 18 too.
Posted by Samprimary (Member # 8561) on :
quote:The funniest one to me was you don't take the protective film off electronic devices.
I love it when people do that. It's so hilariously pointless.
It's a way of amplifying superficial damage to 'protect' it from superficial damage.
Posted by steven (Member # 8099) on :
"The Target Corporation (TGT) has purchased the popular blog “Stuff White People Like”
Oh dear.
*wipes tear from eye*
A close friend from childhood married this girl (who hates the crap out of me, but that's another story) who takes him to Target, walks around for hours, sort of waiting for something to catch her eye. I don't think I've ever seen her wear anything that wasn't bought at the Gap. When I read that, I thought of her. I just about hate her. That's cool, though. I knew him before we liked girls, and he'll still be my bro whether or not they ever split. I win.
Posted by maui babe (Member # 1894) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mucus:
quote: (Pooka's link) >64. When you're sick, your parents tell you not to eat fried foods or baked >goods due to "yeet hay". > >65. You know what yeet hay is.
Heh.
So, is it forbidden to share what "yeet hay" is? Posted by Richard Berg (Member # 133) on :
quote:What is the point of putting the adjective "white" in the sentence if it is not to imply that the sentence pertains to at least most people who are white and that it is more likely to apply to people who are white than those who are not.
The quote that Mucus managed to post right before you sums it up perfectly.
quote:For better or for worse, this kind of thing dates back to at least 2001*
quote:The funniest one to me was you don't take the protective film off electronic devices.
I love it when people do that. It's so hilariously pointless.
It's a way of amplifying superficial damage to 'protect' it from superficial damage.
What I find more hilarious is people who take off the protective film, then go out and buy screen protectors. Posted by Tatiana (Member # 6776) on :
According to the list, I'm not white, which completely bears out my own feelings. I've been checking "mixed" on race questions for years. My friend who's black, however, IS white.
(I think everyone is actually mixed. And scientifically, I don't think race has any meaning at all. I think it's purely a social construct, in fact. If it weren't for how differently people perceived to be different races are treated in public places, the question wouldn't even exist as a discussion point. I'll be so glad when we finally put it behind us.)
Posted by C3PO the Dragon Slayer (Member # 10416) on :
I share the same perspective, Tatiana. We shouldn't make prejudices based on what people look like, because it really doesn't matter if people decide not to make it matter to them.
Posted by The Rabbit (Member # 671) on :
I'm only white in between the freckles.
Posted by Mucus (Member # 9735) on :
quote:Originally posted by Tatiana: ... I've been checking "mixed" on race questions for years. My friend who's black, however, IS white. ... I don't think race has any meaning at all. I think it's purely a social construct, in fact.
quote: Lander is gently making fun of the many progressive, educated, upper-middle-class whites who think they are beyond ethnicity or collectively shared tastes, styles or outlook. He's essentially reminding them that they too are part of a group.
You also fit *at least* one of the features in that list, "#14 Having Black Friends"
But seriously, as long as people think its relevant, it may be a social construct (I don't necessarily agree, but we can for the sake of discussion) but its still a very important one to be aware of. I'll note that right after you mentioned that you always checked "mixed" you referred to a "black friend," which is a racial categorization.
I also find myself thinking about and will gently echo Tom thoughts here. link
I've come across the idea that race is just a social construct and it will go away if everyone just treats each other *who looks* the same. I still don't buy it. However, this is probably easier when you're some variety of white in a majority-white country. If you're not of the majority skin colour, I think you'll find that race is still very relevant. The other problem is that often people *aren't* just talking about how people look like when they mention race. They often refer to an ill-defined grab-bag of ethnicity, culture, language, and reasoning. As long as these things exist, there will always be *some* term that will be needed to help us distinguish between them, and I do not anticipate that changing for at least hundreds of years.
Consider the illegal immigrant issue and the "we don't want our children to speak Spanish" sentiment and the Obama issue with "we don't want prayer mats in the White House" sentiment. Now you can break that out into language, cultural, and religious issues but most people do not think that way. When people do racial profiling, they "know" what a Muslim looks like and the "Muslim" group is loosely associated with the "Arab" group because let's face it, they are highly correlated. Consider also the rise of the term "islamophobia" and accusations of "racism." The two should be different issues, but many people confuse the two.
No, the race concept *may* be a social construct, but its not going away. It doesn't go away when the majority of the country is white and you only have to "tolerate" scattered in-offensive assimilated minority groups around the country. It doesn't go away when the country has to deal with a large number of immigrants who refuse to assimilate.
It may go away when the number of real "mixed" people grow to a majority of the population, but given the cultural, language, social-economic factors that are often conflated with race and the sheer number of people in countries such as China and India who show little signs of interbreeding, I don't think the ideas behind the terms "race", "ethnicity", "waiguo ren", "gwei lo" whatever you want to call it, are going to go away for hundreds of years at least.
quote:Originally posted by C3PO the Dragon Slayer: I share the same perspective, Tatiana. We shouldn't make prejudices based on what people look like, because it really doesn't matter if people decide not to make it matter to them.
jokes != prejudices
Posted by pooka (Member # 5003) on :
yeet hay It's like it will reverse the polarity of your accupuncture meridians in a non-beneficial way, or something.
Posted by scholarette (Member # 11540) on :
While in some ways race as a social construct is true, there are some genes that are more predominant in groups from certain locations. For example, Ashkenazi Jewish may not be as concerned about sickle cell, but should be concerned about Tay-Sachs disease.
Posted by MightyCow (Member # 9253) on :
I like to think of myself as a Black Man who completely breaks stereotypes by acting white and also by having no dark pigmentation.
It's quite liberating, especially since I only get the benefits of my Blackness, with none of the negative stereotypes. This year I might try thinking of myself as the good things about Chinese too, in honor of the Olympics. Not the oppressing Tibet part though.
Posted by Mucus (Member # 9735) on :
quote:Originally posted by pooka: yeet hay It's like it will reverse the polarity of your accupuncture meridians in a non-beneficial way, or something.
Erm, AFAIK (and not contradicted by that link) "yeet hay" has very little to do with accupuncture and meridians, aside from the fact that both come from Chinese traditions.
(What follows may sound silly, but I will gently remind the audience that one person's silly supersition is another person's truth. i.e. people in glass houses shouldn't throw Bibles)
"yeet hay" is at its core just an mixture of ideas such as balance (ex: yin/yang), the proverb "you are what you eat", and Chinese herbal medicine.
Briefly, if you eat spicy foods (yeet hay) or certain foods containing spices your system will go out of balance and you will need to eat some non-spicy foods to balance that out. Go too far and you have the reverse problem.
Personally, most of it probably is the placebo effect. But with the great variety of Chinese herbs that can be used, I have no doubts that some may have been picked that have active ingredients of some sort and that by sheer trial and error, they happen to be used in an effective manner. The problem is without scientific rigour, there is no way to tell which is which.
No, the reason that I was amused was not the idea, but the high probability that that item in the list immediately raised my probability estimate of the author either being a Cantonese FOB or CBC/ABC. I think Mandarin people have an analogous term, it may even sound similar, but they usually place less emphasis on concepts such as "yeet hay", "feng shui", etc.
Posted by pooka (Member # 5003) on :
They seem related to me, but maybe I'm playing fast and loose with the Zang Fu. "reversing the polarity" was tongue in cheek, though. Somewhat. I mean, that would kill you.
Posted by Irami Osei-Frimpong (Member # 2229) on :
I'm not so quick to dismiss a social contruct as merely a social construct. Marriage, art, justice, and beauty either are or are parasitic upon social constructs. America is a social construct, and I think a rich experience of life is more than what gives itself to the sort of empiricism that brands cultural identity and political disposition with regard to race, a mere social construct.
Posted by Zalmoxis (Member # 2327) on :
quote:What is the point of putting the adjective "white" in the sentence if it is not to imply that the sentence pertains to at least most people who are white and that it is more likely to apply to people who are white than those who are not.
Because it is using white not as a racial/genetic background category but rather as an ethnic category. It is a play on the whole idea of ethnic studies (and white studies has recently become a growing topic of interest in that field).
It's similar to when someone says "I'm so white" or "I'm such a white guy" when confessing to liking a particular thing and/or acknowledging the lack of understanding or capability with a certain thing.
It also comes out of the use of the word "white" by American stand up comics (especially but not limited to African American comics).
But of course the irony of such essentializing of making such admissions of whiteness (as Lander seems also to understand) is that it's a way to both participate in and invalidate ethnic constructs, to be both ironic and sincere and dismissive and to assert power through self-deprecation.
Posted by The Rabbit (Member # 671) on :
quote:Because it is using white not as a racial/genetic background category but rather as an ethnic category. It is a play on the whole idea of ethnic studies (and white studies has recently become a growing topic of interest in that field).
Your begging the question, why identify that ethnic group as "white"?
My original question was in response to the claim that its a "leap" from saying "things white people like" to saying "things all white people like". I categorically disagree. If this site had identified this ethnic group in some other way, the site might be funny but it wouldn't be edgy or new worthy.
The thing that makes this site both humorous and offensive is the conflagration of a racial feature (white skin) with cultural features which are neither exclusively white nor shared by the majority of white people.
Most everything said on this site is tongue in cheek. It pokes fun not just at the ethnic group in question but at racial stereotypes in general. Its a joke that is nonetheless trying to make a some serious social commentary. None of that is in question.
What is in question is whether one is making a leap the authors did not intend when they used the phrase "white people".
Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
The authors of the site are white, I think. That makes me a little uncomfortable - the mocking congratulation is a little too close to real self-congratulation.
Posted by scifibum (Member # 7625) on :
quote:What is in question is whether one is making a leap the authors did not intend when they used the phrase "white people".
Since you were initially responding to me, let me clarify (again) that I think the author(s) absolutely DID intend for people to make the leap. I don't think that's in question.
Posted by MightyCow (Member # 9253) on :
People on Hatrack like to find things to be offended about Posted by The Rabbit (Member # 671) on :
scifibum, I just disagree that "leap" is even the right word. Perhaps "all white" people is stretching the point but it isn't a stretch at all when one says "white people like X", to understand that to mean the overwhelming majority of white people.
And unfortunately, the vast majority of white people in America aren't in the ethnic group they are describing.
Posted by MightyCow (Member # 9253) on :
To see how true it is, you have to remember that there are many subsets of White People, and those who don't fit in the first category may fall under one of the denominations:
Of course, I take no responsibility for the offensiveness of any of those sites. This is Hatrack after all Posted by pH (Member # 1350) on :
quote:Originally posted by Mucus:
quote:Originally posted by C3PO the Dragon Slayer: I share the same perspective, Tatiana. We shouldn't make prejudices based on what people look like, because it really doesn't matter if people decide not to make it matter to them.
jokes != prejudices
Unless the jokes are about non-white people. Then they are bigoted.
-pH
Posted by Mucus (Member # 9735) on :
? I actually was the one that brought up the link to "Stuff Asian People Like" and found it amusing, same with the 88 (rather pooka brought that one up and found it amusing).
Posted by steven (Member # 8099) on :
"I like to think of myself as a Black Man who completely breaks stereotypes by acting white and also by having no dark pigmentation.
It's quite liberating, especially since I only get the benefits of my Blackness, with none of the negative stereotypes. This year I might try thinking of myself as the good things about Chinese too, in honor of the Olympics. Not the oppressing Tibet part though.?
My very pale, totally Caucasian friend Trevor used to pretend to be the "Albino Aborigine: Black Man in Disguise" when he was little. I only found out about this recently.
Posted by Zalmoxis (Member # 2327) on :
quote:Your begging the question, why identify that ethnic group as "white"?
Because they are the antithesis of "black" (and that's black in quotes because what that really means is a certain stereotypical type of African-American culture).
Mind you, I'm not begging the question as I have major qualms about the use of the category, but in my experience there is an undeniably cultural aspect to it. To put it bluntly -- the other types of white people don't really matter in this type of cultural posturing.
Posted by Samprimary (Member # 8561) on :
quote:social construct
you keep using that word.
i do not think it means what you think it means.
Posted by pooka (Member # 5003) on :
OK, white people of Hatrack, we've installed a new hood/vent thing over our stove and my husband wants to leave the protective film on, which is blue, to show that it is new. Does this reasonate with anyone or is this hill worth dying on?
Posted by maui babe (Member # 1894) on :
This seems like a strange thread for that question, but since you asked...
I think leaving the protective film on would be tacky. It looks new because it is new. If he wanted to leave the film on to protect the hood (and thus keep it looking new longer???), I could maybe understand it, but just to show that it's new? That seems odd to me.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
The pre-amble of these discussions always seem to be where people feel so free to share their ignorance and intolerance with a "who me?" shrug. I was glad that got nowhere.
Posted by SenojRetep (Member # 8614) on :
quote:Originally posted by pooka: OK, white people of Hatrack, we've installed a new hood/vent thing over our stove and my husband wants to leave the protective film on, which is blue, to show that it is new. Does this reasonate with anyone or is this hill worth dying on?
I'm only borderline white, but I'd leave it on. My reasoning would be something like: "if I leave this on it will last longer, and the hood will less likely need to be replaced when/if I sell the house." I would not leave it on to showcase that it is new.
Posted by pooka (Member # 5003) on :
He took it off while I was away doing something else... but he still thought he was right. Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
Protective film, in white culture, is associated with age and infirmity. Also, it is generally considered trashy. My grandparents would cover their TV remotes in plastic wrap. The idea was that the wrap could be changed, and the remotes didn't need cleaning. The reality was that they never changed the wrapping, and so the faustian bargain of plastic protection payed off with a greezy, disgusting thing you had to hold in your hand. The suggestion that one might do better with cleaning the thing when it needed it was met with open derision. They were, in their minds, quite innovative.
They were the kind of poor that inflicts harm on itself in an attempt to be sensible. They also watched Jerry Faldwell. That may be a white thing.
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
quote:Protective film, in white culture, is associated with age and infirmity.
I would .sig this, had we .sigs here. You people are loons.
Posted by BlueWizard (Member # 9389) on :
Going back to an earlier post, I once had a list of ways to know if you are from Minnesota. One of the ways to know was whether you had worn shorts and a parka at the same time.
![[Wink]](wink.gif)
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
![[Confused]](confused.gif)
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
![[ROFL]](graemlins/rofl.gif)
![[Dont Know]](graemlins/dontknow.gif)
![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
![[Razz]](tongue.gif)