Long story short, I've eaten there twice, and gotten food poisoning twice. Avoid at all costs.
[ May 21, 2012, 03:29 AM: Message edited by: Stone_Wolf_ ]
Posted by Samprimary (Member # 8561) on :
*unpacks car*
*cancels road trip*
Posted by Ginol_Enam (Member # 7070) on :
Its horrible you got food poisoning, but its pretty unlikely that every Charley's Steakery everywhere is a cess pool of unsafe food practices just because your local one is (apparently).
Also, unless you were diagnosed with food poisoning by a doctor it is possible (unlikely, maybe, but possible) that you didn't have food poisoning at all. You were just coincidentally ill round about the same time. Or, perhaps even less likely yet still possible, you got food poisoning from something else that you just happened to consume just prior or after eating at Charley's Steakery. Twice.
Posted by Stone_Wolf_ (Member # 8299) on :
While all these things are possible, why risk it? Trust me, while the food is tasty, the adverse effects are...well, let's just say, substantial.
Posted by Stephan (Member # 7549) on :
What did you eat?
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
quote:Long story short, I've eaten there twice, and gotten food poisoning twice. Avoid at all costs.
Woah! I've also gotten food poisoning twice! This is a bigger deal than we thought!
Posted by AchillesHeel (Member # 11736) on :
I would naturally be distrustful of any establishment that spells charlie with a y.
Posted by Stone_Wolf_ (Member # 8299) on :
First time was BarBQ cheddar steak sandwich. Second time was spicy Asian BarBQ steak sandwich.
Oh MPH, you rouge, did you happen to eat at Charley's, or are you just making fun of my sentence structure?
Posted by just_me (Member # 3302) on :
quote:Originally posted by Stone_Wolf_: First time was BarBQ cheddar steak sandwich. Second time was spicy Asian BarBQ steak sandwich.
Oh MPH, you rouge, did you happen to eat at Charley's, or are you just making fun of my sentence structure?
Are you sure you're not just allergic to their bread, their steak or the BBQ sauce? I actually find that more likely than getting food poisoning twice in a row from the same place, assuming the place is inspected and your state has decent health codes.
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
Oh! I just remembered! I've also had two automobile accidents! Coincidence or causation? Perhaps we'll never know.
Posted by Stone_Wolf_ (Member # 8299) on :
quote:Are you sure you're not just allergic to their bread, their steak or the BBQ sauce?
I have no food allergies. It is possible that I am devolving some, but I doubt it, and my symptoms are not indicative of an allergic reaction.
It was at least 9 months between incidents.
Posted by aspectre (Member # 2222) on :
Actually, agribusiness has succeeded at accomplishing what PETA could never have done: made meat too dangerous to eat.
"Meat and poultry sold in the United States is widely contaminated with drug-resistant strains of Staphylococcus aureus, a bacteria that can cause serious illnesses in humans, a new study contends. The types of health problems linked to S. aureus range from mild skin infections to life-threatening diseases, such as pneumonia, sepsis and heart infection. In the new nationwide study, researchers analyzed 136 samples of 80 brands of beef, chicken, pork and turkey purchased at 26 retail stores in five cities: Chicago; Flagstaff, Ariz.; Fort Lauderdale, Fla.; Los Angeles; and Washington, D.C. The results showed that 47 percent of the samples were contaminated with S. aureus, and that 52 percent of the bacteria were resistant to at least three classes of antibiotics."
In other words, short of carrying a biolab around with you, the only safe way to eat meat is in McDonalds-gray slabs or chunks... the near opposite of which most people go to steakhouses for.
Posted by maui babe (Member # 1894) on :
I worked for many years as a disease investigator, and now work as a sanitation inspector, doing another facet of the same job.
I have to echo what was said above... unless you have laboratory evidence that the illnesses that you experienced were definitely food poisoning, or were part of a very large group of unrelated people who all ate at Charleys and all got sick at around the same time (and a great deal of epidemiology and statistical analysis was done), there is no way to state that you had food poisoning OR that your illness was caused by Charleys.
People frequently believe that the last thing they ate was the cause of their gastrointestinal illness (we call this "last meal bias") or that something they ate that the rest of their household didn't eat, or possibly something new (sashimi or sushi perhaps) that they've never tried before caused them to be sick. These are almost never the case.
Again, until you've ruled out every other exposure you've had in the last 24-72 hours (or longer depending on the causative organism) -not just food exposures, either... GI illness can be caused by environmental exposures, animals, person-to-person, food sensitivities, stress, autoimmune problems, and many other causes - you can not state with any amount of certainty that you even HAD food poisoning, let alone implicate a specific restaurant or food.
Posted by maui babe (Member # 1894) on :
quote:Originally posted by aspectre:
"Meat and poultry sold in the United States is widely contaminated with drug-resistant strains of Staphylococcus aureus, a bacteria that can cause serious illnesses in humans, a new study contends. The types of health problems linked to S. aureus range from mild skin infections to life-threatening diseases, such as pneumonia, sepsis and heart infection.
This is such bushwah. Of course there is bacteria on our meat. Everyone knows that, or should know it. That's why we have to handle meat carefully, making sure it's kept refrigerated until it's prepared and then making sure we cook it to proper temperatures. The only real risk of S. aureus in food is Staph intoxication, which occurs when a prepared food, such as potato salad or a meat soup or stew, is contaminated (after it's cooked) with Staph organisms and then subject to time-temperature abuse (being left in the "danger zone" for 4 hours or more). This allows the Staph to grow and contaminate the food with its toxic byproducts which make us sick.
If you are careful in your food handling to prevent cross-contamination, time-temperature abuse and cook your meat to recommended temperatures, it's perfectly safe to eat.
Posted by Jon Boy (Member # 4284) on :
quote:Originally posted by Stone_Wolf_: Long story short, I've eaten there twice, and gotten food poisoning twice. Avoid at all costs.
I've eaten there twice and didn't get food poisoning either time. I must be immune to food poisoning!
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
Or you gave it to me!
Posted by Jon Boy (Member # 4284) on :
Either way, I think we can safely conclude that I have some sort of superpower.
Posted by AchillesHeel (Member # 11736) on :
Great, we can write comic books about how well you can eat my grand-mothers cooking.
Posted by dkw (Member # 3264) on :
I ate there once a week almost every week for 2 years and never got sick. Clearly I share Jon Boy's superpower!
Posted by Jeorge (Member # 11524) on :
I'd never even heard of the place until today, but now I'm feeling sick just thinking about it...
Is that some sort of supperpower, maybe?
Posted by PSI Teleport (Member # 5545) on :
Was that an intentional pun?
Posted by Jeorge (Member # 11524) on :
what? me? pun?
noooooooo...
Posted by Glenn Arnold (Member # 3192) on :
quote:This is such bushwah. Of course there is bacteria on our meat. Everyone knows that, or should know it.
Two problems with this. First, the link referred to drig resistant strains of bacteria. Of course there is bacteria in the meat, but the only reason it's antibiotic resistant is because livestock is fed antibiotics.
Second, Cows' natural food is grass, which is normally fermented in the cow's rumen. Sure there is bacteria in there, but the chemistry doesn't support the kind of bacteria that can survive in the human gut. Once you change the cow's diet to grain, it becomes acidic, and can support the e-coli we've been hearing so much about lately. It also causes the cow to get sick so they have to feed it antibiotics to keep the bacteria in check (see point one).
Posted by just_me (Member # 3302) on :
quote:Originally posted by Stone_Wolf_:
quote:Are you sure you're not just allergic to their bread, their steak or the BBQ sauce?
I have no food allergies. It is possible that I am devolving some, but I doubt it, and my symptoms are not indicative of an allergic reaction.
I'm confused by your statement that your symptoms aren't indicative of an allergic reaction.
Because I have an allergy to mussels, and the symptoms are pretty much what I would expect someone would use to describe food poisoning. In fact, at first that's what I thought it was.
So what kind of symptoms did you have that aren't "indicative of an allergic reaction"?
Posted by Stone_Wolf_ (Member # 8299) on :
I do appreciate your interest in the topic, but I'd prefer not to get into those details.
Posted by scholarette (Member # 11540) on :
My husband had a few hospital trips with digestive problems that we assumed to be food poisoning and they tested him for food allergies and suggested we do the exclusion diet to figure out if he was allergic to something. This experience convinced me that food allergies and poisoning have pretty much identical symptoms.
Posted by Jon Boy (Member # 4284) on :
quote:Originally posted by dkw: I ate there once a week almost every week for 2 years and never got sick. Clearly I share Jon Boy's superpower!
We should form a league of heroes!
Posted by Sterling (Member # 8096) on :
You might want to contact the manager. It may not be a chain-wide epidemic (as the overabundance of snark advises, in its roundabout way), but it's certainly possible there's one or more employees on a shift at that particular branch who are doing something wrong and/or are themselves contaminated with something and don't know of it.
Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
quote:Originally posted by Sterling: it's certainly possible there's one or more employees on a shift at that particular branch who are doing something wrong and/or are themselves contaminated with something and don't know of it.
But it's considerably more likely an allergic reaction or a coincidence. See the post from maui babe, for instance.
Posted by CT (Member # 8342) on :
quote:Originally posted by aspectre: "...The types of health problems linked to S. aureus range from mild skin infections to life-threatening diseases, such as pneumonia, sepsis and heart infection...."
Just for perspective, S. aureus is one of the most common bacteria in the normal skin flora. We pretty much are exposed to it all the time. It can cause serious infections -- and I'm not likely voluntarily to chug S. aureus smoothies -- but it is quite literally everywhere.
You aren't going to avoid exposure by avoiding beef. Even just rubbing your own eyes likely inoculates your mucous membranes with it. (Yum! )
quote:Originally posted by Glenn Arnold: Once you change the cow's diet to grain, it becomes acidic, and can support the e-coli we've been hearing so much about lately.
That's been raised into serious question relatively recently. steven had posted about this here some time ago, and I kept up on the literature.
quote:But between 2000 and 2006, scientists began to take a closer look at the effect of diet on E. coli O157:H7 specifically. A different set of findings emerged to indicate that this particular strain did not, in fact, behave like other strains of E. coli found in cattle guts. Most importantly (in terms of consumer safety), scientists showed in a half-dozen studies that grass-fed cows do become colonized with E. coli O157:H7 at rates nearly the same as grain-fed cattle. An Australian study actually found a higher prevalence of O157:H7 in the feces of grass-fed rather than grain-fed cows. The effect postulated (and widely publicized) in the 1998 Science report—that grain-fed, acidic intestines induced the colonization of acid-resistant E. coli—did not apply to the very strain of bacteria that was triggering all the recalls.
The initial articles were based on assumptions that didn't hold up. It is explained in the Slate article, but I think there is at least one summary in the research literature, if it would make a difference to anyone.
[ April 18, 2011, 10:13 AM: Message edited by: CT ]
Posted by Stone_Wolf_ (Member # 8299) on :
I won't say it isn't an allergic reaction (as it is a possibility), but I will say that what made me suspect food poisoning is that bread, lettuce, tomatoes, steak, onion, cheddar cheese, provolone cheese, bar-b-q sauce and spicy Asian type sauces are all things I have had before and since without problems AND the timing of when I ate and when my symptoms began, the similarity of the symptoms and the fact that I have a pretty iron clad stomach and super rarely have a strong reaction AND I have zero allergies to food/drugs/pollen/etc, all lead me to believe as I do.
Is it possible that it is a huge coincidence? Stranger things have happened. I still don't believe it though.
Regardless, I will not eat there again, and now all of you can make that choice for yourself knowing that there is a possibility of extremely negative gastrointestinal side effects.
Posted by dkw (Member # 3264) on :
quote:Originally posted by Stone_Wolf_: Regardless, I will not eat there again, and now all of you can make that choice for yourself
Since we have no idea which Charley's location you ate at, you haven't actually given us any form of useful warning even if your illness was due to a defect in their product.
Unless you're suggesting that whatever it was was caused by their recipes or corporate policies?
Posted by Stone_Wolf_ (Member # 8299) on :
Location: Ventura CA, Pacific View Mall
I'm not suggesting either way. It could be that a supplier of one ingredient is tainted, and went out to every single restaurant, or it could be that the fry cook doesn't wash his hands.
Or something else entirely.
Posted by Kwea (Member # 2199) on :
quote:Originally posted by maui babe:
quote:Originally posted by aspectre:
"Meat and poultry sold in the United States is widely contaminated with drug-resistant strains of Staphylococcus aureus, a bacteria that can cause serious illnesses in humans, a new study contends. The types of health problems linked to S. aureus range from mild skin infections to life-threatening diseases, such as pneumonia, sepsis and heart infection.
This is such bushwah. Of course there is bacteria on our meat. Everyone knows that, or should know it. That's why we have to handle meat carefully, making sure it's kept refrigerated until it's prepared and then making sure we cook it to proper temperatures. The only real risk of S. aureus in food is Staph intoxication, which occurs when a prepared food, such as potato salad or a meat soup or stew, is contaminated (after it's cooked) with Staph organisms and then subject to time-temperature abuse (being left in the "danger zone" for 4 hours or more). This allows the Staph to grow and contaminate the food with its toxic byproducts which make us sick.
If you are careful in your food handling to prevent cross-contamination, time-temperature abuse and cook your meat to recommended temperatures, it's perfectly safe to eat.
QFT
Thank you for sparing me the effort of posting that same info. I appreciate it. Posted by Kwea (Member # 2199) on :
quote:Originally posted by Stone_Wolf_: Location: Ventura CA, Pacific View Mall
I'm not suggesting either way. It could be that a supplier of one ingredient is tainted, and went out to every single restaurant, or it could be that the fry cook doesn't wash his hands.
Or something else entirely.
Yeah, with chains I would stay away from that location. I do understand, though.....I got violently sick after eating at a Krystal's here in Ocala FL, and both times I wasn't the only person to get sick. It was actually food poisoning, caused by improper food handling techniques. They got cited for it.
But even though I know it was one person causing it, at one location, I can't eat at the chain any more, it just makes me ill thinking about it.
If you really like the food, try going to another location and trying it. Most food poisoning cases are caused by improper storing of food, or improper handling of food, not because of problems with the food itself. Another location would not have the same issue, usually.
If that doesn't work it is probably a newly developing food allergy.
Posted by Parkour (Member # 12078) on :
Bacteria? In my meat? Its more likely than you think. Click here to find out more.
Posted by AchillesHeel (Member # 11736) on :
And now that little rhyme will be taunting me all day. Thanks.
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
I've heard Charley's Steakery only poisons those with evil intentions.
Posted by Kwea (Member # 2199) on :
I've heard they only do it to people who mistake correlation for causation.
I'm actually in favor of it if that is true.
Posted by Stone_Wolf_ (Member # 8299) on :
Forgive me if I lack humor as it was 5 hour ordeal that lead to dehydration and lying in the fetal position wishing for my own death.
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
Only 5 hours? That doesn't sound like any food poisoning I've ever heard of.
Posted by scholarette (Member # 11540) on :
Did others eat there with you? Did they also get sick?
Posted by Stone_Wolf_ (Member # 8299) on :
The restaurant is in the food court, so no, my wife had something else, both times.
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
quote:Originally posted by Stone_Wolf_: Forgive me if I lack humor as it was 5 hour ordeal that lead to dehydration and lying in the fetal position wishing for my own death.
I'm sorry if I wasn't sympathetic. My record for longest time with food poisoning is seven days. Living in the third world, I've probably logged many months of time with food poisoning.
I'm glad we both survived.
Posted by Jon Boy (Member # 4284) on :
I don't think this thread is working. I really want a bacon three-cheese steak sandwich right now.
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jon Boy: I don't think this thread is working. I really want a bacon three-cheese steak sandwich right now.
You should try the Angus three-cheese sandwich at Arby's. If you don't get food poisoning you should still qualify for cardio-vascular disease.
Posted by Stone_Wolf_ (Member # 8299) on :
quote:I'm sorry if I wasn't sympathetic. My record for longest time with food poisoning is seven days. Living in the third world, I've probably logged many months of time with food poisoning.
I'm glad we both survived.
Thanks. Seven days? Yowser! Where do you live BB?
Posted by Glenn Arnold (Member # 3192) on :
CT: Interesting.
The article you posted didn't mention the antibiotic aspect of grain fed beef, though. Do you have any feedback on that?
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
quote:Originally posted by Stone_Wolf_:
quote:I'm sorry if I wasn't sympathetic. My record for longest time with food poisoning is seven days. Living in the third world, I've probably logged many months of time with food poisoning.
I'm glad we both survived.
Thanks. Seven days? Yowser! Where do you live BB?
I was living in Taiwan at the time. But if you go to most countries in South East Asia you're gonna get sick.
Posted by CT (Member # 8342) on :
quote:Originally posted by Glenn Arnold: CT: Interesting.
The article you posted didn't mention the antibiotic aspect of grain fed beef, though. Do you have any feedback on that?
For my part, I'm sure we are breeding resistance there. Are you asking for my opinion or for documentation? I can dig for the latter if you like, but it'll have to be squeezed in during free time.
Life has been ... pressing. Posted by Stone_Wolf_ (Member # 8299) on :
quote:But if you go to most countries in South East Asia you're gonna get sick.
Do the locals get sick too or just foreigners?
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
quote:Originally posted by Stone_Wolf_:
quote:But if you go to most countries in South East Asia you're gonna get sick.
Do the locals get sick too or just foreigners?
In Taiwan, and indeed all of China from what I have seen, there's absolutely no shame in one mentioning that one has diarrhea. That should tell you something about the prevalence.
Posted by Rawrain (Member # 12414) on :
4 day, 1 week ):
I had stomach flu from white castles new jalapeno cheese burgers, 2 solid weeks of suffering (quite literally everything was coming from EVERYWHERE!) over the throne and my family finally decided to take me to the hospital, I got an I.V. tap with water and after 2 hours I was magically better.. On tap of that due to the severity of the sickness I became lactose intolerant.
---- Stone if you're pretty sure it was food poisoning call a health inspector, though to be honest I don't think it was, maybe the food upset your stomach? You don't have to be allergic to food for it to have a bad reaction.. (If you think you have food poisoning, call Public Health at 1-800-265-7293 extension 4752.)
For instance, hot breakfasts make me sick for hours after eating, however I can eat the same food cold and it does nothing .___. ------- I'm food safety certified, as it was required to be certified on a military base to handle food, but it's not required in most other places despite the fact it should be, them military bases had EXCELLENT sanitary score .__.
Posted by Glenn Arnold (Member # 3192) on :
quote:Originally posted by CT:
quote:Originally posted by Glenn Arnold: CT: Interesting.
The article you posted didn't mention the antibiotic aspect of grain fed beef, though. Do you have any feedback on that?
For my part, I'm sure we are breeding resistance there. Are you asking for my opinion or for documentation? I can dig for the latter if you like, but it'll have to be squeezed in during free time.
Life has been ... pressing.
Just wondering. Specifically regarding the issue of whether the acidic nature of cows' stomachs while fed corn really necessitates the use of antibiotics. That's the argument that was presented. No, I don't expect you to do research for me, I just wondered if you had heard anything.
Posted by CT (Member # 8342) on :
I don't do cow medicine (thankfully), but it looks like the scary form of E coli is as likely to reside in the guts of grain-fed cows as in corn-fed -- possibly even more likely, by at least one of the studies.
So if any cows need to be treated with antibiotics for E coli, it's likely the grain-fed ones that need it most.
However, I think the main reason cows are often on antibiotics is not to treat bacteria, but instead at subtherapeutic steady low levels just to promote weight gain. That is, for economic rather than veterinary/medical reasons. I could be wrong. I'll nose about when I get the chance.
Posted by Samprimary (Member # 8561) on :
quote:Originally posted by CT:
However, I think the main reason cows are often on antibiotics is not to treat bacteria, but instead at subtherapeutic steady low levels just to promote weight gain. That is, for economic rather than veterinary/medical reasons. I could be wrong. I'll nose about when I get the chance.
Pretty much.
Great way to drive superbugs right back into our face in a single generation, too: nice, low, steady use of antibiotics in livestock, generation after generation, in big pools of potential contamination of more and more resistant forms.
Posted by Wingracer (Member # 12293) on :
quote:Originally posted by Stone_Wolf_: The restaurant is in the food court,
Right there is the problem. I don't know about CA malls but most other places I have been to, food court food is nasty.
Posted by Jake (Member # 206) on :
Maui babe, it's great to see you again (this is Noemon, btw). Hope your life has been going well!
[ April 20, 2011, 11:42 AM: Message edited by: Jake ]
Posted by maui babe (Member # 1894) on :
Thanks Jake. I still lurk and read regularly, but my new job doesn't allow me as much time to post.
Posted by Stone_Wolf_ (Member # 8299) on :
Just wanted to update you all...it turns out I have a food allergy (as many of you suggested) to black pepper.
Difficult for me to eat out these days.
I officially apologize to the Charley's Steakery for besmirching their name.
Posted by Jeff C. (Member # 12496) on :
Sonny's is better. If you are in the south, try that place for an affordable BBQ (sweet sauce = win). Smokey Bones is even better, but much more expensive.
Posted by Jake (Member # 206) on :
Wow; a black pepper allergy would be difficult to deal with. My wife is allergic to corn and soy, so I'm familiar with the pain that is having to check ingredients before being able to eat anything in a restaurant, and often having to leave the place.
The silver lining is that I would imagine you've lost a ton of weight, mostly eating home cooked food.
Posted by Aros (Member # 4873) on :
quote:Originally posted by BlackBlade: I was living in Taiwan at the time. But if you go to most countries in South East Asia you're gonna get sick.
I'm not really sure about that. I was in the Navy, stationed in Guam, and we spent some time in South-East Asia (Malaysia, Singapore, Hong Kong); no one I knew had any problems. And we ate a lot of street food. Maybe it's just Taiwan?
It might have been BECAUSE we ate the street food, actually. I have a theory that it's generally the safest (even though that may seem counter-intuitive). It's the scientific method -- more people eat it. If some yahoo decides that he'll woo the tourists and opens a "fancy" restaurant, they're not as likely to have the traffic nor trained personnel. Therefore, you're much more likely to get sick.
Bottom-line: follow the locals.
Posted by Stone_Wolf_ (Member # 8299) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jake: The silver lining is that I would imagine you've lost a ton of weight, mostly eating home cooked food.
Sorry for your wife...naw, my body stays just about the same now for over a decade...guess that I'm as lucky as I am cursed.
Posted by kmbboots (Member # 8576) on :
"Erroneously" always reminds me of "Singing in the Rain".
Whoops ta doo be doo!
Posted by CT (Member # 8342) on :
[Hah! I re-replied with the same message.
Oy. ]
Posted by CT (Member # 8342) on :
quote:Originally posted by Stone_Wolf_: Just wanted to update you all...it turns out I have a food allergy (as many of you suggested) to black pepper.
Difficult for me to eat out these days.
I officially apologize to the Charley's Steakery for besmirching their name.
Thanks for the update. Sorry about the difficulty. Posted by Stone_Wolf_ (Member # 8299) on :
Thanks CT! It's not big, with the kiddies and tight budget I don't eat out much anyway.
Anywho, now that I know what to avoid it's not so bad.
Afterall, knowledge is half the battle!
Posted by Stone_Wolf_ (Member # 8299) on :
The other half is violence!
Posted by dkw (Member # 3264) on :
You would not believe how hard I've been trying to restrain myself from making a pepper spray joke here.
Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
Posted by Stone_Wolf_ (Member # 8299) on :
I officially give you permission to lift all restraint! Posted by GaalDornick (Member # 8880) on :
quote:Originally posted by BlackBlade:
quote:Originally posted by Stone_Wolf_:
quote:But if you go to most countries in South East Asia you're gonna get sick.
Do the locals get sick too or just foreigners?
In Taiwan, and indeed all of China from what I have seen, there's absolutely no shame in one mentioning that one has diarrhea. That should tell you something about the prevalence.
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