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» Hatrack River Forum » Active Forums » Discussions About Orson Scott Card » When can we expect the next Alvin and Ender books? (Page 1)

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Author Topic: When can we expect the next Alvin and Ender books?
TheSeeingHand
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I know this may seem a little selfish but I'm dying to know when the next White Prophet and Master Alvin and the next Ender book are coming out. Any idea?
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B34N
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That is a very good question that I have yet to get answered? OSC has mentioned that he is working on them but has given no specific dates or even a timeline that I know of.
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pooka
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It's not listed in Works in Progress.
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Jay
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I still think White Prophet is a book Papa Moose is trying to name!!!!
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Blaine
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From what I've read here, White Prophet will probably not happen.
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Orson Scott Card
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Master Alvin is the final volume in the Alvin Maker series. White Prophet was an interesting idea that I had completely forgotten about, and which is not under contract and is unlikely to be written.

My preference these days is to write what I write and only announce it when it's done. Better to surprise people with a book they weren't expecting than disappoint them with late delivery.

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TheSeeingHand
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quote:
My preference these days is to write what I write and only announce it when it's done. Better to surprise people with a book they weren't expecting than disappoint them with late delivery.
That's a good idea.

It is kind of disappointing about White Prophet but I'm still as hyped as ever about Master Alvin and Christmas at Battleschool!

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Jqueasy
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What is White Prophet?
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Icarus
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Nothing. [Wink]
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TheSeeingHand
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quote:
What is White Prophet?
It was going to be a short story in the Alvin Maker series but I guess not anymore.
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neo-dragon
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quote:
Originally posted by Orson Scott Card:
Better to surprise people with a book they weren't expecting than disappoint them with late delivery.

Can't argue with that!
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Soara
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White Prophet is a bad title anyway. [Razz]
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TommySama
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"My preference these days is to write what I write and only announce it when it's done. Better to surprise people with a book they weren't expecting than disappoint them with late delivery."

It's both cruel and well intentioned...


[Party]


(Sorry, I'm from ornery and we don't have as many smilies [Cry] ... hehe)

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Lisa
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quote:
Originally posted by Orson Scott Card:
Master Alvin is the final volume in the Alvin Maker series. White Prophet was an interesting idea that I had completely forgotten about, and which is not under contract and is unlikely to be written.

My preference these days is to write what I write and only announce it when it's done. Better to surprise people with a book they weren't expecting than disappoint them with late delivery.

Bless you. Would that David Gerrold would emulate you.
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trance
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quote:
Better to surprise people with a book they weren't expecting than disappoint them with late delivery.
Goodkind has a habit of being late-often a full year to the point where bookstore owners get peeved. I find that I'm always waiting for stuff I can't wait to own. Square-Enix is bad for that as well. Card, I think what your fans are asking for is not an exact date but rather an estimation so they know whether they will be waiting one year or five looooooonnnnngg years [Grumble] . (i.e. somewhere between 2007-08) I'm fine with waiting though, I got my vids to play and Phantom to read. [Cool]
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trance
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Can't forget Empire either....looks good Card-props to you!
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Reshpeckobiggle
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quote:
Originally posted by Soara:
White Prophet is a bad title anyway. [Razz]

I agree. You know what I do? Anytime I see the word "White" used in a title or something, I replace it with "black" to see how it sounds. Give it a shot. See how how that works out for you. If it doesn't make you laugh, then that means you are secretly a racist.
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cfheinz
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Has the relase of Alvin Master been scheduled?
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Stephan
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Nope.
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MeMyselfAndI
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quote:
Originally posted by Orson Scott Card:
My preference these days is to write what I write and only announce it when it's done. Better to surprise people with a book they weren't expecting than disappoint them with late delivery.

Understood. I'm really looking forward to the conclusion of the Alvin Maker series. I wasn't even aware there was going to be a final book until recently.
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ih8bills
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quote:
Originally posted by Orson Scott Card:
Master Alvin is the final volume in the Alvin Maker series.

My preference these days is to write what I write and only announce it when it's done. Better to surprise people with a book they weren't expecting than disappoint them with late delivery.

I understand your preference sir, but the suspense is KILLING me, [Wink]
I await the ending with great anticipation ! [Hail]

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Kelly1101
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LMAO at how old this thread is.
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w6zrd
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quote:
Originally posted by Orson Scott Card:
Master Alvin is the final volume in the Alvin Maker series. White Prophet was an interesting idea that I had completely forgotten about, and which is not under contract and is unlikely to be written.

My preference these days is to write what I write and only announce it when it's done. Better to surprise people with a book they weren't expecting than disappoint them with late delivery.

I agree with the last statement. I love being shocked when I find out that a book is out I was not expecting, however like what happened in Sept. 2007 an author that I really like that had a series that had 3 books left, passed away. I was heart broken that I would not be able to finish the books. Luckily they had planned for that and had someone in mind to finish the books. The final book will be out soon.

I'm looking forward to the last Alvin Maker book and the next Ender book along with the Ender movie. I love the fact that they got Ford to play Graff, can't wait.

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Stand Watie
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quote:
I agree with the last statement. I love being shocked when I find out that a book is out I was not expecting, however like what happened in Sept. 2007 an author that I really like that had a series that had 3 books left, passed away. I was heart broken that I would not be able to finish the books. Luckily they had planned for that and had someone in mind to finish the books. The final book will be out soon
I know and then feel terrible after that a guy is dying and your first thought was selfish.

I had just started that series when Robert J. announced his terminal illness. Looking forward to January.

Mr. Card, you are not allowed to have any terminal illnesses for at least 40 years D) Stay away from the booze and tobacco, I know what party animals the LDS are [Wink]

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fraktik
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From interview (http://www.listener.co.nz/culture/books/orson-scott-card-interview-the-extended-version/ - Warning - SPOILER INCLUDED!):

The question that seems to follow on most naturally from the one about Ender’s continued presence in your creative life is one you’re probably tired of hearing, but I have to ask. The Alvin Maker series: did you deliberately decide at some point that this was something you were not yet ready to finish? When do you plan to finish it, and what will you bring to Master Alvin that you couldn’t have given it 20 years ago?

The problem is that the underlying story that provides the bare bones of my plot — the life and assassination of Mormon prophet Joseph Smith — has finally led me to the point where the last volume of the Alvin Maker series overlaps with my historical novel Saints. Since I already wrote about the building of Nauvoo/Crystal City in exhaustive detail in Saints, I have been trying to find a way into that portion of the story that is all its own. Saints is in some ways my magnum opus, my most substantial novel; in my own life and mind, it casts a wide shadow. But I believe I see a way through it now — which involves skipping a lot of story and leaping ahead to a point much nearer the climax. This will avoid the thing I feared — that the final volume, Master Alvin, would be longer than the first six books combined. Instead, it will be about the length of all but the very-short first volume.

Mormons will persist in seeing Alvin Maker as the story of Joseph Smith, but that’s just the plot skeleton. It’s taking Joseph Smith’s life as a premise – it’s really my book about America. More than anything else I’ve written. It’s my “great American novel”. The essence of what it means to Americans to be Americans. The deep rifts caused in the American soul by the relationship between whites and Indians and between whites and their black slaves. Those are really the two great themes in American history, and both of them still colour our national identity, they’re the bleeding wounds in the internal organs of our society. That’s what I’m really trying to work with. So in Master Alvin I’m going to be true to what I’m really doing, and I’m going to show the civil war. That’s what Master Alvin‘s about. And he fails to prevent it. That’s where my focus will be and that’s how I’ll be able to write it.

I can’t promise I’ll get to it soon, though. I’ll certainly finish the trilogies begun with Pathfinder and The Lost Gate first, along with the two remaining Ender volumes, Shadows Alive (bringing together the storylines of Speaker and the Shadow books) and Fleet School, the direct kids-in-space YA sequel to Ender’s Game.

That’s a lot of writing you have lined up. How’s your health?

Not great. And it’s a weird situation… I know absolutely how to get into good health, and that is lose the weight, do the exercise, get down to somewhere under 230 pounds. And I’ll be fine. I’ll be good for another 20 or 30 years. But right now I’m about 75 or 80 pounds overweight, and the vicious circle is that my fiction doesn’t come from nowhere. It comes from deep close focus and attention. And in the pattern of my life, I have learned that any day when I exercise, when I get enough exercise, I get that sense of accomplishment that I also get from writing my day’s quota of fiction. When I’m writing fiction, I find it very hard to exercise; when I exercise, I find it very hard to write. I have to write in order to make a living. I have to exercise in order to stay alive. But they seem to be mutually exclusive propositions. I’m really trying to overcome that – and it sounds like the easiest thing in the world, to run in the morning, take a break, then sit down in the afternoon and write. But truly, it is almost impossible for me to squeeze out any sentences of any kind once I’ve exercised, because I can’t write without caring. And if I feel like I’ve already accomplished the day’s work, I don’t care.

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mulrich
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Thanks for posting! I'm glad OSC hasn't forgotten about the Maker series, even if it's #7 in his writing cue. Based on his current publishing rate we're probably 3-5 years out from a conclusion to the series.

I'd love to see him get through his list but I hope he takes care of his health above his writing. 20-30 years of living is worth more than a few books.

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Jeff C.
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I'd rather he live longer than finish any of those books. Honestly, and I hate to say this, but he's no Shakespeare or T.S. Eliot. He's a scifi writer and he's already written the book that people will remember him for. He needs to focus on his health. Furthermore, he's rich and can afford to take his time anyway. Ender's Game will keep paying him for the rest of his life.
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Jake
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I reject the idea that the fact that he writes science fiction necessarily means that he's a lesser writer than Shakespeare or T.S. Elliot (note that I'm not arguing that he is on par with them). There's nothing about the genre that precludes someone working in it from having that level of talent. I would also question the idea that he's rich. He's had a lot of success with Ender's Game and the resulting franchise, but I have no idea of either his income or his financial obligations, and I'd be pretty surprised if you did either.

But yeah, if he can afford it I hope that he chooses health over career.

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bCurt
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quote:
I'd love to see him get through his list but I hope he takes care of his health above his writing. 20-30 years of living is worth more than a few books.
Amen to that.

quote:
Furthermore, he's rich and can afford to take his time anyway.
I think you might be assuming he is richer than he actually is.
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Gwen_Owens
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Mr. Card, what about writing first thing in the morning and THEN exercising! Please, please, please take care of yourself. For your family, your friends, and for all of your adoring fans who are just waiting on pins and needles for you next books to come out!

By the way... my vote is more Ender books! There are 3,000 years to work with here. I especially like the one short story I read of yours about when Ender first realizes that Jane is watching his back (making sure nobody steals all of Ender's money). I got done reading that short story and I'm obsessed with the idea of making Jane more central to a book. Telling her history more. Especialy since she is such a huge role in the last 3 Ender books (Speaker, Xenocide, Children of the Mind).

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millernumber1
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Those are pretty cool suggestions. Jane is one of my favorite characters too, and Investment Counselor is really fun. I would love seeing Bean's children/their children and Jane hanging out.
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vineyarddawg
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I hope this doesn't come across the wrong way, since I've immensely enjoyed all of the Enderverse books, with the possible exception of one*. With that said, I think the Enderverse stories are pretty well played out now, with the exception of the one final book to come. Shadows Alive is kind of like Alvin Master for the Alvin Maker series... it's the capstone, the final episode, and really probably should be the final word on the matter.

I know more Enderverse books will probably be written, because lets be honest, that's probably where the most money is likely to be made, and there are 3,000+ years of history with which to fiddle. I'd really like to see some more books like Enchantment or Pastwatch, though. And, for that matter, now that I'm getting into the Mithermages saga, I'm really interested to hear more about that universe, too. (I agree with OSC's assertion that the magic in that universe is, to paraphrase his words, the "best way to 'do'/explain magic.")

* - (For the record, that "one" is Shadows in Flight, which I thought was unusually simplistic and straightforward.)

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DustinDopps
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Well, we already know that "Fleet School" is coming. So the Enderverse isn't done yet...

Variety magazine has an article talking about how a movie sequel might actually happen. If it does, all bets are off, neh?

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millernumber1
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Ugh, I read that too. I hope not, since they were all saying that any sequels would likely not be based on the books.

So frustrating.

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vineyarddawg
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Ender's Game: Fleet School

Act 1, Scene 1: The final minutes from the first movie whiz by, Rocky style. Then, Ender wakes up in his commander's bunk in Battle School, screaming.

Then we find out that in the "real world," he just killed that little kid who was picking on him (you know, that Hanna Montana dude), and he had run to his bunk and passed out from the trauma. All that other stuff from the first movie was a dream. Harrison Ford grumpily huffs into the room to growl at him that he's been promoted... to Fleet School.

(Sorry, I can't write any more. I'm already dry heaving.) [Cry]

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tertiaryadjunct
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quote:
Originally posted by bCurt:
quote:
Furthermore, he's rich and can afford to take his time anyway.
I think you might be assuming he is richer than he actually is.
He said quite explicitly in his last interview with Wired that after his stroke, he realized if he'd died he'd have left his family a pile of debt (advances on unfinished series), and that's why he's been writing so much. So yeah, he can't afford to take his time.
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Jeff C.
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quote:
Originally posted by tertiaryadjunct:
quote:
Originally posted by bCurt:
quote:
Furthermore, he's rich and can afford to take his time anyway.
I think you might be assuming he is richer than he actually is.
He said quite explicitly in his last interview with Wired that after his stroke, he realized if he'd died he'd have left his family a pile of debt (advances on unfinished series), and that's why he's been writing so much. So yeah, he can't afford to take his time.
Was this before or after the movie came out? If he's broke after writing so many successful books, managing a magazine, teaching full time, running a writing workshop, and writing a weekly column (and let's not forget the movie rights he sold), that's kind of sad. Ender's Game has been on the NYT bestsellers list multiple times for decades.

If all of the debt is coming from his contractual obligations, then maybe he should slow down a little and stop signing so many. Seriously, a Pathfinder trilogy, a Mithermages trilogy, and more Ender sequels? That's too much for anyone to handle all at once.

Hopefully he's okay. It would really sad if he died and his family had a ton of debt left, especially considering how successful his career has been.

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millernumber1
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I don't think he's broke - he's just not rich enough to shrug off non-completion of his contracts. And he's said several times that he's stopped signing contracts for books that he isn't actively writing.
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scifibum
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Not wanting to leave his family in the position of having to pay back advances is not the same as being broke, or being in debt. It doesn't even really speak to HOW difficult that might be for the family (although I admit it suggests they haven't caught up to the Waltons). I think the amount of information we have on his precise financial situation is basically bupkis. As it should be.
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tertiaryadjunct
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quote:
Originally posted by Jeff C.:
Was this before or after the movie came out?

Just before the movie - but by all accounts, he was paid for the movie rights a decade ago. I think you vastly overestimate what writing pays (seriously, you list his Rhino Times column as if $25-$50 per week is even worth discussing). Rich authors are few and far between.

It is also worth noting that one of his children had special medical needs that were probably quite costly. And then there's the extra 10% his church wants a piece of (granted, that's his choice).

I think millernumber1 hit it on the head - OSC isn't rich or broke, he's just (money-wise) your average middle-class person.

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Jeff C.
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I have several friends in the writing industry (a few of which who are actually writers), so I have a pretty good idea of how much they make. I also just acquired my masters in Creative Writing, so I've spent a fair amount of time researching traditional publishing pay rates versus indie.

OSC, given how many books he has sold, has made a pretty good amount of money on royalties over the years. Just go into any bookstore and look at the science fiction section. You'll usually find an entire shelf dedicated to the man's work, not to mention what the publisher puts on the Nook and Kindle. Bookstores only do that with older books if the author is popular. He sells a LOT of books, especially Ender's Game (and the rest of the series), which is still, as I said, on and off the NYT Bestseller list. It's also a book that's taught in schools all over the US (including in military academies), so there's always money coming in with that. We can sit here and debate his exact finances all day, but unless he has been very stupid with his money, he is at the very least upper middle class.

Writing also isn't his only means of income. He's a professor, last I heard, at BYU. He also teaches his workshops, which are pretty expensive, considering they only last a few days. And I doubt he's only getting 25 dollars a week to write those articles, either, considering how established he is (I got paid 50 to write an article for cracked, and I'd never even published before). Then you've got his online magazine, his Formic War novels he's "co-writing", the comic books, the movie rights, etc.

A friend of mine has written three novels independently (the first one is free, too) and currently pulls in approximately 25k a year just off of those books. Her numbers don't come close to what OSC pulls in, and that's her only job now.

I'm telling you, OSC isn't broke. He's not even close to it. Unless he's working on a really poor contract with Tor (his publisher) and he has a terrible agent, there's no way he's in as much debt as you're implying, even if he doesn't fulfill all his contracts.

I mean, who knows. Maybe I'm missing something.

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donya
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(Post removed by JanitorBlade. Multi-lingual Spam.)

[ March 10, 2014, 08:47 PM: Message edited by: JanitorBlade ]

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w6zrd
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quote:
Originally posted by w6zrd:
I love the fact that they got Ford to play Graff, can't wait.

However I was disappointed with the movie. OSC had too much changed. The special effects were awesome, but the storyline was heartbreaking.

NOW, back to Master Alvin................ It has been around 6 years since OSC has made a comment on that book, I hope he has not forgotten about our 7th Son. [Dont Know]

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vineyarddawg
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From an interview that was published on 10/30/2013:

quote:
I can’t promise I’ll get to [Master Alvin] soon, though. I’ll certainly finish the trilogies begun with Pathfinder and The Lost Gate first, along with the two remaining Ender volumes, Shadows Alive (bringing together the storylines of Speaker and the Shadow books) and Fleet School, the direct kids-in-space YA sequel to Ender’s Game.

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mulrich
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At least he's thinking about Alvin Maker. I really enjoyed the interview and hope he takes care of his health.

Currently, he averages about two books per year. Earth Awakens is scheduled for release on June 10 and Pathfinder #3 (Visitors) is scheduled for release on Nov 4. That fills up this year and leaves three books (Lost Gate #3, Shadows Alive, and Fleet School) before he'd have time to even consider getting Master Alvin. So we're looking at 2016 at the earliest.

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kacard
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Check out the home page -- OSC wrote a new Alvin Maker Story appearing in the anthology Dean Man's Hand edited by John Joseph Adams.
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Magson
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http://www.rhinotimes.com/uncle-orson-reviews-everything-heaven%2c-k-pak%2c-western-fantasies.html

Quote from final paragraph:

quote:
So for the six of you who are awaiting the last Alvin Maker novel, this is as close as I’m going to get for some time to come.
[Frown]
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Vasslia Cora
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Hey, I'm one of those six! (Trying to look at the bright side)
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Sean Monahan
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So am I.
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mulrich
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Me too! That's half of the six right there. I wonder who the others are.
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