posted
to stay out of water that has been contaminated with millions of gallons of sewage?
The state of Hawaii has had an unusually wet winter, including some pretty severe flooding in recent weeks. The flooding caused a main sewer line to rupture in Waikiki, and a HUGE amount of raw sewage was diverted into the Ala Wai canal, which empties into the ocean not far from the Waikiki beach. The DoH clean water branch monitors bacterial counts in all recreational waters in the state, and if the counts get above a certain level, signs are posted to warn people away from the water. (This water monitoring is done all the time, but more frequently when a known hazard is present - like millions of gallons of raw sewage.)
Well, there was no secret that the sewage was in the water... I mean seriously, how could you hide it? But it took a few days before the bacteria counts a couple of miles down the shore started increasing. In that time, the beaches remained open, but there were news reports constantly about the situation.
This woman is upset that the DoH didn't put up warning signs earlier. She went surfing after the sewage spill but before the warning signs were posted and got a bad infection from her exposure. (the other case referenced at the beginning of the article is a fellow who fell into/was beaten up and thrown into the canal full of sewage (there are differing accounts of the incident) and is fighting for his life with massive bacterial infections - which is a whole 'nother story)
I just wonder what rational person would choose to swim or surf on a beach a mile or so from a known million+ gallon sewage spill and then blame the government for not putting up signs. It's not like Waikiki is the only beach available for surfing on the island. (IMO it's not even the nicest beach on the island.)
Folks, the ocean near the shore is dirty. All the time - not just after a flood or a sewage spill. Is it too much to ask that people take responsibility for their own choices and not expect the government to take care of them?
Posts: 2069 | Registered: May 2001
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posted
How do you know she was aware of the news? I've gone weeks without listening to, watching, or reading any news before.
Posts: 21182 | Registered: Sep 2004
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Yes, I suppose that's possible that she didn't listen to the news, despite massive flooding and all sorts of damage occuring all over the state.
That's part of my point. As an adult and a responsible member of society, it's MY responsibility to be aware and informed of issues that affect me. If I were a surfer and knew there had been severe flooding (and you certainly didn't have to watch the news or read the paper to know THAT) I would have made it my business to know how that would affect me if I chose to go into the water.
There were regular messages in all the news media about the sewage spill, and the fact that the DoH was monitoring the conditions at the beaches. The DoH is constrained by state laws and their internal protocols as to when they can close the beaches (which is another arguement too... there is some suggestion that we keep the beaches open too long in such cases to have less of an impact on tourism. I'm not really trying to address that here). They go by bacterial counts, because that's an objective measure. There was plenty of "unofficial" warnings to avoid the beaches (although I think even without them it was pretty flippin obvious that the water wasn't very clean).
Posts: 2069 | Registered: May 2001
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posted
I've seen closed beaches that looked the same as open beaches before. And the fact that it took several days to reach levels that caused them to close it means that it might not have been visible, to my mind.
I agree that I would always check water contamination reports after a storm before going in the ocean-- actually, I always do, period, storm or no storm. But not everyone thinks the way I do.
Posts: 21182 | Registered: Sep 2004
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quote:As an adult and a responsible member of society, it's MY responsibility to be aware and informed of issues that affect me.
I am not asthmatic, and I don't have a television or internet at home. If there was a spill of toxic chemicals that was affecting the air that drifted over the street I take to work, those that knew about it had better have put signs up saying that a normally safe area will now make me sick.
Posts: 26077 | Registered: Mar 2000
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posted
I don't live on Oahu, but from what I've heard and read, the water was visibly polluted.
Here is another story. This is the part that disturbed me the most:
quote:If somebody gets an infection or something, they're going to blame somebody," says Stanley.
"If I get sick, who do I go to? What do I do? Who do I blame? Myself for going in?"
It's disturbing that folks in our society are always looking for someone to blame for any kind of misfortune they experience. Sometimes there is no one to blame (or to sue, which is really what most people are looking for).
Posts: 2069 | Registered: May 2001
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posted
I think it very much depends on how obvious it was that the water was polluted.
I doubt that it WAS visibly polluted, since I can't imagine that anyone would voluntarily enter or swim in water that looks like a sewer. I think water usually becomes dangerous long before it is obvious to the naked eye.
Posts: 26077 | Registered: Mar 2000
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quote:Originally posted by katharina: I am not asthmatic, and I don't have a television or internet at home. If there was a spill of toxic chemicals that was affecting the air that drifted over the street I take to work, those that knew about it had better have put signs up saying that a normally safe area will now make me sick. [/QB]
I agree, but sometimes it takes a while for signs to get posted etc. In the meantime, are you going to blithely walk through a green cloud of smoke and assume that just because there are no warning signs that it is safe?
Posts: 2069 | Registered: May 2001
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posted
I think it would be interesting to know exactly where this woman was surfing too. She may have entered the water on the beach where the testing was done and the levels were still below acceptable levels, then surfed towards the mouth of the canal where the spill was. Would that be the state's fault then?
quote:Originally posted by katharina: I think it very much depends on how obvious it was that the water was polluted.
I doubt that it WAS visibly polluted, since I can't imagine that anyone would voluntarily enter or swim in water that looks like a sewer. I think water usually becomes dangerous long before it is obvious to the naked eye.
I used to think so too, but since I've been working in public health, I'm constantly amazed at what people will voluntarily do.
Posts: 2069 | Registered: May 2001
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posted
Would the chemical have ot be at a concentration that would produce a cloud of green smoke before it was dangerous?
If it's dangerous at pre-visible-cloud, then those who have the knowledge and power to disseminate should do so.
Posts: 26077 | Registered: Mar 2000
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posted
The woman clearly has no concept of basic biology: '"When a doctor tells me the only 4 bacteria I have in my body are from human feces, that's not just a bunch of rumors. That's a direct connection in my opinion." '
Because the usual host of bacteria present in every human are magically all gone?
But then again, she and her boyfriend seem convinced the sewage spill was PLANNED! Posts: 32919 | Registered: Mar 2003
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The world around us and in us is a teeming morass of seething microscopic fauna and flora. It's all just a matter of balances. Doesn't mean you should seek out the icky (unlike, say, the Icky), just that you'll never be fully free of it.
quote:Forget your perfect offering There is a crack, a crack in everything That's where the light gets in
At some point, our immune systems seem to need to be challenged to be effective. Mind you, though, that wouldn't be a good reason to wade through a pond of gonorrhea. It's just that -- for example -- her freshly washed washcloths are probably contaminated with E. coli, that merry little poop bug himself. It's just the way it is. No way she had only 4 types of bacteria in her body, and no way that such bacteria's lineage could be traced to a particular poop-pile without some sophisticated genetics typing.
Posts: 14017 | Registered: May 2000
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posted
Well, the four bacteria comment made sense to me. I recall seeing patients in residency who injected themselves with their own poop to get attention. They got VERY sick. Duh. The doctors were quite certain that the source was injected poop based on the types of organisms found and the suddenness and types of infections. Depending on what she has wrong with her, it might be pretty obvious as to the source this time. She might be quoting one of her doctors even.
Posts: 1014 | Registered: Jul 2005
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quote:The world around us and in us is a teeming morass of seething microscopic fauna and flora. It's all just a matter of balances. Doesn't mean you should seek out the icky (unlike, say, the Icky), just that you'll never be fully free of it.
I consistently seek out the virtual Icky.
The virtual icky, however, seems to find it's way into my hotmail account on its own.
quote:In our rags of light, all dressed to kill And end this night, if it be your will
posted
The more I think about it, I'm betting she's just repeating what the doctors told her about her four bacterial types. Four types making her ill that shouldn't be in those locations.
Posts: 1014 | Registered: Jul 2005
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I've seen closed beaches that looked the same as open beaches before. And the fact that it took several days to reach levels that caused them to close it means that it might not have been visible, to my mind.![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
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