Just discovered this forum after re-reading the Ender books (except for SotG), so I thought I'd bring up something that bothered me from EG/ES. Why is it "logical" that the bugger homeworld is further away from Earth than the rest of their worlds? I would think any species that is colonizing new worlds would search in all 6 directions for habitable worlds. I would also think that the homeworld would be the primary source of colony fleets, so that habitable worlds closest to the homeworld would be settled first. So the bugger empire would be roughly spherical with a majority of the worlds farther from Earth than the homeworld.
Writing this post, it occurs to me that perhaps Earth simply sent fleets to planets along the route taken by the first fleet as the years went by and more ships were built. But then it seems incredibly fortunate (or terribly unfortunate) that all the living queens were gathered on the homeworld, otherwise mankind could have spent decades or centuries embroiled in a prolonged conquest of the entire bugger empire.
I apologize if this topic has been brought up before, but I am interested in what other people think.
Posted by Boon (Member # 4646) on :
Hmm...I think I understand what you're asking.
SPOILERS***
However, I think that no one but Mazer Rackham understood that if you kill the queen, the drones would die also.
Thus, they didn't destroy *all* the Bugger home worlds, just the ones on the way to the big one.
Posted by Wowbagger the Infinitely Prolonged (Member # 7476) on :
What if the bugger homeworld is futher down the galactic arm than earth is? Say the bugger homeworld is at the edge of the galatic rim. The only way to expand would be one way: toward the galatic center.
Posted by LTC DuBois (Member # 7661) on :
What I'm trying to say is, how did the I. F. know that the battle at the bugger homeworld would be the final battle? If they targetted all the bugger worlds, then why was the homeworld furthest away? If they only targetted worlds on an 'invasion path' to the homeworld, I can't see how they'd know all the queens were there.
I can postulate some sort of comic feature that would force the buggers to expand in earth's direction solely, but there's never any mention of something of that sort in the books.
Posted by Meshugener (Member # 7601) on :
they also never mention that they knew all the bugger queens would be there. they find it out later, but they didn't know in advance. They do mention that all the buggers on the other planets stopped moving, so thats how they know all the queens were there.
Posted by Wowbagger the Infinitely Prolonged (Member # 7476) on :
When the I.F. launched the initial invasion fleet Mazer was the only person who believed the bugger queen theory. My belief is the generals in charge planned to little doctor every planet in the bugger empire. The first I'd strike would be the homeworld. Later, when scientist confirmed Mazer's belief, the strategy was changed. When the invasion occured the buggers would fight harder for targets closer and closer to the homeworld. And by using recon we'd see that the homeworld has far more ships protecting it than the other worlds. I'd say the theory of the day would say the bugger homeworld contained all the queens. Like someone said, we didn't know for sure that all the queens were there til they saw that all the other buggers stopped moving. It was a theory til it was proved by the sudden deaths of all other buggers.
[ March 28, 2005, 09:51 PM: Message edited by: Wowbagger the Infinitely Prolonged ]
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
The bugger homeworld wasn't necessarily the furthest away. It was the first planet attacked, and consequently the oldest -- and slowest -- ships were sent there. There are also hints that there were other planets and other battles on the "schedule," later on, but that these were largely academic due to the lack of queens.
Posted by Meshugener (Member # 7601) on :
by the way, i just noticed your screenname, and i want you to know that i LOVE that book. it was way ahead of its time, and its amazing.
Posted by Orson Scott Card (Member # 209) on :
Habitable worlds are relatively rare, and the hive queens expanded to the worlds they happened to find. Pure coincidence that all their colonies ended up on planets nearer to us than their homeworld.
OR:
The home world was right in the middle, but the first fleet launched was launched toward it, and that fleet had slower ships, being the oldest models, so they were last to arrive.
PICK ONE.
[ March 30, 2005, 05:04 AM: Message edited by: Orson Scott Card ]
Posted by Jon Boy (Member # 4284) on :
Ooh! I love choose-your-own-adventure books!
*flips ahead to see the outcomes before deciding*
Posted by Wowbagger the Infinitely Prolonged (Member # 7476) on :
That's why I love OSC. He leaves alot of things up to the imagination of the reader.
Posted by LTC DuBois (Member # 7661) on :
Thank you Mr. Card.
To Mesh, I figured at least a few people here would get the Starship Troopers reference. One of my favorite books, along with Ender's Game of course Posted by Wowbagger the Infinitely Prolonged (Member # 7476) on :
Starship Troopers is one of favorite books. I was horrified by the movie and its low budget "sequal." How can you leave out Powersuites? I hope OSC can prevent that sort of thing from happening with the Enders game movie.
Posted by Meshugener (Member # 7601) on :
yeah, if Ender's Game ends up like starship did, i'm gonna be depressed for eternity. oh, and OSC, i cant help but LOL at your response to this thread...you're so commanding! Posted by LTC DuBois (Member # 7661) on :
I thought it was laughable how in the movie the soldiers were scarcely better equipped than our current infantry but expected to fight these creatures 3 times their size. The power suits were the coolest 'hardware' part of the novel.
Don't let the movie people do that to Ender's Game, Mr. Card. Otherwise the battleroom will end up being laser tag, with no zero-g element.
Posted by Suri-cool (Member # 7599) on :
Also in the first meetings copy I just found there are illustrations that are wierd. In the battleroom it's like they are using the force in star wars. With the lasers coming out of their open palm and strangeness.
Posted by jongo05 (Member # 7580) on :
In Ender's travels after Investment Counselor and before Speaker he visited a lot of worlds. I wonder what pattern he took in his travels, and how far away Trondheim was and as I write this I remember instant travel via Jane making future travel for the characters not time related. Should be interesting to see Ender-in-Peter take on Starways Congress.
Posted by Orson Scott Card (Member # 209) on :
The "lasers from the gloves" idea is mine. In the movie, knowing that we will of course have marketing, we didn't want to show kids playing this cool game with GUNS that look like guns. What's the marketing of the toys? "Buy these guns and get shot by cops who think they're real"?
So we made the decision that the guns in the movie will be built into the glove. The rays will be aimed along the fingers. You point the glove and its built-in gun apparatus, and shoot.
Thus marketing shapes art and gives the illusion that we were "creative."
Posted by Meshugener (Member # 7601) on :
but...but...thats not in the book!!!!!!
lol.
thats a pretty good idea, so i wont complain about it. I actually...sort of...prefer it to the guns idea.
Posted by Sid Meier (Member # 6965) on :
uuuuuh wouldn't the guns in Ender's Game look like pisyols with a crystal barrel?
Posted by Puppy (Member # 6721) on :
Sid, you don't seem to be getting it. It doesn't matter what you thought the guns looked like in the books. They'll be different in the movie.
At one point, I worked with some unrelated Ender's Game concept art that depicted the flash guns as having two barrels, one on each side of the hand, which extended from behind the wrist to end even with the knuckles. So the soldiers fired beams out of their clenched fists, rather than their pointed fingers. I thought it looked cooler, and less like casting Magic Missiles
But that art had nothign to do with the movie, so ... it's irrelevant.
Posted by Sid Meier (Member # 6965) on :
The sacrifices the fanatical readers go through for a movie... Posted by JHamilton (Member # 7683) on :
The "lasers from the hand" idea is a good one. Not only is it safer (from a cop's perspective) but it is also more logical. A weapon that you can simply aim by pointing your finger is about as "user-friendly" as you can get. So, that would be a logical evolution of personal weapons.
Now, I have a different question, which might be asking a bit. How is the subject of Ender killing other children bare-handed going to be handled? I imagine it's difficult to show a 6 year old kicking another 6 year old's ribs in, or a pre-teen cracking another's skull without getting an R rating.
I've got 2 theories on this: one is that the fights can be filmed but the damage "implied" without actually showing it. Leave it up to the audience to decide whether or not Stilson and Bonzo died.
Another is to have the fights happen but afterwards show the boys in an ICU. The idea being that they survived, but just barely.
Any other opinions on how this should work?
--Joshua
Posted by Verai (Member # 7507) on :
I cast entangle on Puppy.
(Sorry, mostly unrelated. I couldn't help myself after seeing the D&D reference.)
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