This is topic A Question about Mormons in forum Discussions About Orson Scott Card at Hatrack River Forum.

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Posted by Jonathan Howard (Member # 6934) on :
This question was asked by my father mere minutes ago; he's too *bashfull* to join The Forum:

"How come the Mormons and the Mormon Church have done such extensive research regarding genealogy? They've got one of the most extensive databases regarding genealogy.


Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
Two good sites to get information on Latter-day Saint beliefs, "from the horse's mouth", so to speak:

Short answer: we believe we can stand as proxies for our dead relatives and have ordinances performed for them in the Temple that they can choose whether or not to accept in the afterlife. In order to do that, we need to know who our ancestors are.

Ask me for the long answer when I'm more awake. [Wink]

You were very respectful in the tone of your questioning. Thank you for that.
Posted by Jonathan Howard (Member # 6934) on :
Thank you.

Thank you.

Thank you.


Jonathan Howard
Posted by Will B (Member # 7931) on :
I looked up "ordinance" at, and it says it's a rite or a ceremony. It specifically lists 4: faith, repentance, baptism, and gift of HS. Are these the things that you can proxy for dead relatives? Would baptism be the main one?
Posted by Boris (Member # 6935) on :
Since, in our church, the last two (Baptism, Gift of the Holy Spirit), are ordinances we perform in life, we do perform them as proxies. Faith and Repentance, however, are up to the individual.
Posted by maui babe (Member # 1894) on :
Faith, repentance, baptism and the gift of the Holy Spirit are the first principles and ordinances of the gospel...

Faith and repentance are principles, and baptism and the gift of the Holy Spirit are ordinances.

There are a few other ordinances too, but those are the first that have to be done (either for oneself or by proxy).
Posted by estavares (Member # 7170) on :
The core of the doctrine is that God is no respecter of persons (which means he looks upon all his children equally) and since he commanded baptism of water and the spirit to all of his children, what about those that didn't get the chance?

Here's a more specific page on the doctrine:,8672,1477-1,00.html

Hope that adds some light...
Posted by Jonathan Howard (Member # 6934) on :
You have illuminated me, but all this religious talk is confusing. I've read some of the Kozari book, but I'm not in for heavily Gospelised spirituality.

I do, however, greatly appreciate the help. My father got the answer to what he wanted.
Posted by Occasional (Member # 5860) on :
Curious, JH, what you mean by Gospelised spirituality. Do you mean spirituality with a specific or denominational message?
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
Or do you mean Christianized spirituality?
Posted by Jonathan Howard (Member # 6934) on :
*Confuzzled: does not see clear terminological connection between words.*

I have not read much of the New Testament, and basically oppose Jesus as a messiah for reasons that Mattheus 1 & 2 supply me. Ahhh, Jeremiah with Rashi is a very pleasing book to read... Anyway, "gift of the Holy Spirit" is enough to say spirituality, and since it's one of the ordinances of the Gospel, it is Gospel spirituality...

Bah, theology is a mess! Why couldn't we all remain pagan?
Posted by Portabello (Member # 7710) on :
I still have no idea what you mean by gospel spirituality.
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
Me, neither.

"You keep saying that word. I do not think it means what you think it means."

Your terminology is too ambiguous and non-specific.
Posted by Jonathan Howard (Member # 6934) on :
"The record of Christ’s life and teaching in the first four books of the New Testament."

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