the name for a grouping of crows is "a murder of crows."
I mean, c'mon. It's just too tempting to use that in a story.
We should change it and make authors work a little harder for their metaphors.
How about "a plenary session of crows?"
Posted by tern (Member # 7429) on :
What about "a quorum of crows"?
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
a Congress of Crows
Posted by RunningBear (Member # 8477) on :
"A Most Esteemed Association of Flighted Crows"
Posted by Steev (Member # 6805) on :
or a bunch of damned birds who make themselves a nuisance.
Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :
A fleet of crows.
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
A school of crows.
Posted by King of Men (Member # 6684) on :
Too late. There must be any number of 'murder of crows' stories out there. Not to mention 'unkindness of ravens', 'parliament of rooks' - incidentally one of my favourite Gaiman stories - and 'pitying of turtledoves'. In fact, considering the amount of dreck Turtledove is putting out these days, a pitying of turtledoves is most apropos.
Posted by airmanfour (Member # 6111) on :
How is Gaiman? i've read some of his comic stuff, but i couldn't bring myself to read a real book of his. And turtledove really gets old quick.
Posted by Icarus (Member # 3162) on :
There was actually a short story called "A Knot of Toads" in one of the fantasy slick mags a month or so ago.
Posted by LadyDove (Member # 3000) on :
One of my favorite groupings is an implausibility of gnus. Far as I know, it isn't the title of anything yet, but I'd pick it up as a book, just for the title.
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
I'm half-tempted to write something called "An Assortment of Chocolates." Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :
Would that be with or without thumb holes in the bottoms?
Posted by Will B (Member # 7931) on :
A gehenna of meetings A squirm of puppies A yecch of worms
Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :
A pox of auditors.
Posted by Scott R (Member # 567) on :
>>Things that encourage hack writing
Paying me.
Posted by Noemon (Member # 1115) on :
A bunch of stuff.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
EXCUSE ME!? DRECK? Harry made some AWSOME books, "In the Midst of Mine Enemies" is going to become an all time favorite for me, that and Days of Infamy.
Posted by tern (Member # 7429) on :
Hey, that works!
"A dreck of Turtledove novels".
Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :
Noemon
A snifter of poets.
Posted by Uprooted (Member # 8353) on :
A concatenation of Hatrackers.
Posted by Orson Scott Card (Member # 209) on :
Turtledove is a wonderfully inventive writer, who found a niche that he has made his own. I like his work, and only don't read him now because he's so darn prolific I just can't keep up. Also because while I loved his Byzantine stories, I have a hard time caring much about alternate civil war history ...
Meanwhile, there was a spate of deliberate inventions of collective nouns a few centuries ago, like "a murder of crows" etc.; they never never arose as a natural function of language. They were devised like a parlor game. So it's not as if you can be "wrong." And no rule that says you can't invent others.
I, for one, think a Nasty of Crows is just as appropriate. I think I heard from someone else "A cacophony of crows," which is superb. How about a Bathtub of Ducks? And how about the obvious "A Hat of Rackers"? Or is that a Rack of Hatters ...
Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :
A fog of debaters.
Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :
You know, I think I would've enjoyed parlor games. It's a pity we don't go in for that kind of amusement any more.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
woah who would ever of thought I would have to look up "prolific"....
Posted by Stephan (Member # 7549) on :
quote:Originally posted by Orson Scott Card: Turtledove is a wonderfully inventive writer, who found a niche that he has made his own. I like his work, and only don't read him now because he's so darn prolific I just can't keep up. Also because while I loved his Byzantine stories, I have a hard time caring much about alternate civil war history ...
Meanwhile, there was a spate of deliberate inventions of collective nouns a few centuries ago, like "a murder of crows" etc.; they never never arose as a natural function of language. They were devised like a parlor game. So it's not as if you can be "wrong." And no rule that says you can't invent others.
I, for one, think a Nasty of Crows is just as appropriate. I think I heard from someone else "A cacophony of crows," which is superb. How about a Bathtub of Ducks? And how about the obvious "A Hat of Rackers"? Or is that a Rack of Hatters ...
I did notitce your blurbs on his early hardbacks.
Posted by Stephan (Member # 7549) on :
quote:Originally posted by Blayne Bradley: EXCUSE ME!? DRECK? Harry made some AWSOME books, "In the Midst of Mine Enemies" is going to become an all time favorite for me, that and Days of Infamy.
While a fun read, In The Presence of Mine Enemies had a few too many card games described way too intensely.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
Are you kidding? That was the best part!
Seriously now, the card games I actually enjoyed since I'm a Magic: The Gathering and YuGiOh! fan and I like card games once in a while.
But what, it had like 5 games of Bridge in total?
Posted by Stephan (Member # 7549) on :
I just thought they were a little drawn out. I guess it was partly because I have never played bridge before. But no complaints otherwise.
Posted by pooka (Member # 5003) on :
So whales don't really come in pods? I'm so disillusioned.
Posted by tern (Member # 7429) on :
I thought whales came in sandwiches.
Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :
Actually, I thought whales came in the ocean.
Posted by tern (Member # 7429) on :
Yes, but then sandwiches.
Posted by RunningBear (Member # 8477) on :
No No No.
Whales do come in pods, but not what you think. They come in large green sacs, similar to pea pods. These sacs are then placed in sandwiches. which are eaten by ocean dwelling sand witches.
Posted by King of Men (Member # 6684) on :
Yes, well, I loved the Worldwar series. The first time I read it. The second time, I noticed how much he repeats himself, and how much he talks down to his readers. And how every time he makes some clever little historical allusion, he insists on drawing attention to it, like a three-year-old proudly holding up his latest masterpiece. It distracts from the story when characters are constantly having thoughts that serve no other purpose but to draw attention to something that happened in our timeline, not his, but this action is going on in the same place, and isn't that wonderfully clever!
Then there is the issue with all his characters being cardboard two-dimensional figures, the obligatory sex scene in each book, and and the way he always has to point out how characters never consider the other side of any given issue - mainly when someone is thinking something that a modern lioberal wouldn't approve of, of course.
Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :
Well...now you've opened a whole new discussion on formulaic writing.
Posted by Noemon (Member # 1115) on :
I can't really dispute what KoM says about Turtledove's writing, but I will say that Turtledove's flaws as a writer don't stop his books from being an enormous amount of fun for me. I haven't read all of his latest stuff; as OSC says, he's just too prolific for that to really be feasible, but I've read most of his older stuff, and have enjoyed it flaws and all. Turtledove's strength isn't in his writing so much as it is his ideas. He's like Niven in that, I think, although the types of ideas the two authors have occupy different enough spheres that it's never occurred to me to compare them before.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
While I noticed the repetitions and were extrenely annoyed in the least by them it also didn't spoil the books for me, I simple glanced through when ever he repeated himself.
However he seems to have fixed some of his flaws in his newer books: Settlings Accounts Trilogy, In the Presense of Mine Enemies, and Days of Infamy.
The first one is a series that had relatively few (if any) repetitions (though he killed off some good characters *cries*) and its going to be a series starting from "How Few Remain" that will supposedly get around to OUR time.
The second one I enjoyed very greatly it kept me fearing just as the characters were fearing for the day that they might be discovered as Jews and when one of the children's teacher one morning walks in and yells "JEWS!" I jumped like 5 feet.
Days of Infamy is interestingly enough a novel that has the smallest ambition as a alternative novel yet, rather then making some catastrophic change its something small, a simple decision, the decision to invade Hawaii with army troops and launch the third wave of attack. This is a novel that no matter how much I want a sequel for I'm content with it as a stand alone.
The Worldwar series I loved so much simple because he had aliens invade in 1942 forcing the war to screach to a halt.
What I believe makes Turtledove's books fun to read is not his writing but primarily the idea's behind the writing that makes it great to read.
So dreck does not describe his work IMHO.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
However, as for the POV of his characters I think that's one of his greatest abilities, it allows the audience to some certain extent understand the motivations of the characters, thus I don't really think their 2 Dimensional but accurate portrayals of human beings, the very grittiness within his novels spells realism not some fantasy world, the very hero's in the novels aren't particularily heroic and have their flaws its how they cope with circumstances and their particular contribution to the overal story thats makes his characters one of the pillars that holds his books up high.
Posted by Dan_Frank (Member # 8488) on :
quote: Actually, I thought whales came in the ocean.
The same way salmon come in the river?
Another reason not to drink seawater.
Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :
Dan...thank you. I was wondering if anyone would get it.
Of course, now you and I have both violated the user agreement and must turn ourselves in.
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
quote:You know, I think I would've enjoyed parlor games. It's a pity we don't go in for that kind of amusement any more.
Some of us do. My almost-step-mother has a book of Victorian parlor games, and I've been known to suggest them now and again-- word games and romp games both. Posted by Dan_Frank (Member # 8488) on :
quote:Originally posted by Bob_Scopatz: Dan...thank you. I was wondering if anyone would get it.
Of course, now you and I have both violated the user agreement and must turn ourselves in.
You can take the fall for both of us.
...
Get what? I have no idea what you're talking about.
Posted by calaban (Member # 2516) on :
an ipod of technophiles
Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :
l337
a stack of bibliophiles.
Posted by aiua (Member # 7825) on :
A Parliament of Owls- as found in The Silver Chair, by C.S. Lewis. I'm not sure if that's an actual term, but reading that made me think of this, so naturally, I had to post it. ^o^
Posted by Noemon (Member # 1115) on :
Your emoticon looks like a snitch, aiua.
Posted by aiua (Member # 7825) on :
~o~
Posted by Uprooted (Member # 8353) on :
A zizag of snitches.
Posted by Eaquae Legit (Member # 3063) on :
A smackdown of puns.
Posted by jamesbond007 (Member # 8513) on :
All This TimeI have wondered why Sting used Murder of crows is his song titled All This Time
Now I know what the metaphor means. I no longer wonder...
I learn alot here and don't feel worthy Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :
A lazy river of politicians.
A handbasket of legislators.
Posted by Megan (Member # 5290) on :
A shiver of snow shovelers.
A yawn of early risers.
Posted by Noemon (Member # 1115) on :
quote:A handbasket of legislators.
Posted by Steev (Member # 6805) on :
A spittle of time.
Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :
A pup-tent of desires.
Posted by Orson Scott Card (Member # 209) on :
Ha ha ha ha ha!
Which suggests: A jot of Post-its, a tittle of bustiers.
Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :
Actually, a less than 100% wholesome interpretation of that pup-tent one just now occurred to me because of what you posted. That was entirely unintended. <insert innocent look here>
A pot pourri of Martha Stewart-wannabees.
Posted by Icarus (Member # 3162) on :
Huh. I can't for the life of me think of a different interpretation than the salacious one.
Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :
Neither can I. . . anymore.
Posted by King of Men (Member # 6684) on :
A fantasy of collective nouns? An archaicity? An artificiality?
Posted by Steev (Member # 6805) on :
...the election was caught in a grapple of swing-voters.
Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :
A slick of used car salespersons.
An involuntary manslaughter of doves.
Posted by advice for robots (Member # 2544) on :
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
![[ROFL]](graemlins/rofl.gif)
![[Hail]](graemlins/hail.gif)
![[Blushing]](graemlins/blushing.gif)
Actually, a less than 100% wholesome interpretation of that pup-tent one just now occurred to me because of what you posted. That was entirely unintended. <insert innocent look here>