This is topic Mr. Card: how much of the Ender/Shadow Saga was 'planned'? (SPOILER WARNING) in forum Discussions About Orson Scott Card at Hatrack River Forum.
If Mr. Card replies: awesome. If not, you guys can too; I don't really mind I just included his name in the hope it stands out a little.
Anyway, spoiler warnings and so forth.
In Ender's Game we meet Ender's parents and get to think of them as a bunch of clueless people who really have no idea about what the frak is going on with their children. For example, Valentine pitying/patronizing her father because he believes Demonsthenes' diatribe. However in "Shadow of the Hegemon" we learn that Ender's parents are pseudo-geniuses as well and they've known about Locke/Demonsthenes for as long as the two have been blogging. This is interesting, because if the events in SotH are actually a part of Card's original 'notes' then this adds a new layer to Ender's Game.
So, with this example in mind, how much of the Ender/Shadow Saga was actually planned from the get-go? I know sometimes writers leave 'open threads' which they can explore later to add creative new stories/themes, however they are seldomly as 'tight' as when a saga/story is planned from the beginning. Foreshadowing is great when done right, and reading Ender's Game after Ender's Shadow definitly, you'll find that it (ES) adds a new layer to everything in Ender's Game. So were the events in Ender's Game/Shadow planned from conception or were they invented as you thought of new stories to add?
Just curious.
Posted by Ginosion (Member # 7066) on :
none
Posted by clod (Member # 9084) on :
starter,
I think your question applies to all literature. Any analysis of a literary work can break the work down into this or that theme, this or that use of symbolism and archetype, etc. These elements of a story are without a doubt choices made by the author, but whether those choices were made unconsciously or with intent is difficult to discern without comment from the author.
That's not much of an answer. You could also consider the commercial aspects of a successful writing career and the history of the genre. And, the difficulty of outlining such a large endeavor AND executing it.
Posted by Alex Johansen (Member # 9090) on :
Pseudo means fake...
Do you mean quasi- or semi- (both mean half)? Or some other prefix? I can't find one for hidden, disguised, or masked, but I'm sure someone will be able to bring a prefix to all our attention.
Posted by 0range7Penguin (Member # 7337) on :
I think alot of a good story writes itself and evolves as the author goes. Thats why the first copy and the final book are different. Becuase later plot developments change early ideas. -I actually whether that would limit an author when it comes to sequals? If they think up a cool idea but it doesn't jive with the previous book then they are stuck.
Posted by vonk (Member # 9027) on :
i, personally, would assume that OSC always knew the characters of Ender's parents to be incredibly intelligent, if only for genetic reasons. It would be highly unlikely that the minds of Peter, Valentine and Ender would be the fruits of dullard loins.
but i would also be interested in knowing how much, if any, of the Shadow series was planned at the time of EG's publication as a novel. or a short story for that matter.
Posted by camus (Member # 8052) on :
I couldn't find any quotes, but I'm pretty sure that none of the Shadow series was planned when the novella of EG was originally published back in 1977. Remember that EG was later expanded to its current version so that OSC could use the Ender character for the Speaker for the Dead novel.
Posted by starter (Member # 9073) on :
quote:Originally posted by Alex Johansen: Pseudo means fake...
Do you mean quasi- or semi- (both mean half)? Or some other prefix? I can't find one for hidden, disguised, or masked, but I'm sure someone will be able to bring a prefix to all our attention.
"apparently similar"
I used "pseudo" the same way programmers say "pseudo code", which just implies "almost but not quite". It was an expression - I sometimes forget that people view these threads with a dictionary.com filter so I apologise if I've caused any grievance on your part. But I'm glad you've brought this to everyone's attention so people can finally demistify themselves on the term "pseudo-genius" - you really are a man/woman of cause.
Posted by starter (Member # 9073) on :
quote:Originally posted by camus: I couldn't find any quotes, but I'm pretty sure that none of the Shadow series was planned when the novella of EG was originally published back in 1977. Remember that EG was later expanded to its current version so that OSC could use the Ender character for the Speaker for the Dead novel.
That's another thing. I'm sure you've all noticed the huge change from EG to Speaker For The Dead - if EG was a 'prequel' of sorts to SotD how come the tone and style of the two are so different? Hmmm...the mind boggles.
Posted by ricree101 (Member # 7749) on :
quote:Originally posted by starter: That's another thing. I'm sure you've all noticed the huge change from EG to Speaker For The Dead - if EG was a 'prequel' of sorts to SotD how come the tone and style of the two are so different? Hmmm...the mind boggles.
One of the author's introductions (I think it was for Speaker for the Dead) mentiones that Speaker was not related to Ender's Game in its earliest form. As the story evolved, it eventually became a continuation of Ender's story. If I remember correctly, this was what prompted the novel version of Ender's Game.
I think that's pretty much the gist of things. On the other hand, it's been a while since I read Speaker so it would probably be a good idea to check for yourself.
Posted by airmanfour (Member # 6111) on :
*demistifying myself on the term "pseudo-genius"*
Wow, so cool and refreshing, I must demist myself more often.