So, Enders game practically took me from B- student to a solid A- student. Well i have bought probably over 28 copies of the book( i lend em out cause my friends say im obsessed about the book), and i number eachone. Well i haver given out all but one,. my first one...i lend them to friends, they never give em back...well i started writing in each cover, please pass it on and mark when u finish it..
well im a freshman in college, and im sitting next to a friend i met here in my comm class, and he is reading Enders game!..i ask him if he has before and he said no, a friend gave it to him, just curious i look in in the inside, and its the 14th copy i bought, with over 15 marks inside...brought a smile to my face
i know 45 copies sounds like alot, but its on all my bday and christmas lists...i really do ask for them back, but i know i wont...so lately i say just give em to soemone you know who might like it.
just found it funny
-edit: pardon the typos, Fell on some ice. landed on my right arm, and my left has always been rather shaky...
[ February 09, 2006, 11:12 PM: Message edited by: Locke2525 ]
Posted by SteveRogers (Member # 7130) on :
I just got one of my good friends to check Ender's Game out of our school's library. She read it in an hour or something and loved it.
Posted by R. Ann Dryden (Member # 8186) on :
Your spelling, grammar and typing skills don't match those of an A student.
Great information, that's wonderful about the books, but on this forum communication skills count. You may want to proofread your post.
Posted by SteveRogers (Member # 7130) on :
I'm glad you said it, rather than I. Because I feel that I've become quite a bother, constantly bugging people about that. Mine isn't that great either, but his is worse. And so are a lot of other people's posts. And it bothers me.
In short, thank you for saving me the trouble of having to correct someone again.
Posted by Jiminy (Member # 7917) on :
quote:In short, thank you for saving me the trouble of having to correct someone again.
Such a burden you bear.
You guys are all asses. How can you people talk like this and still insist that the people here are "more civil" than in other places? Snobbery like this in the real world would get your teeth knocked out.
Posted by Jiminy (Member # 7917) on :
On a related note, Locke, that is a very cool story. Did you tell the guy it was your book?
Posted by clod (Member # 9084) on :
Jiminy,
It's not snobbery. Call it a defect, if you like. But, trying to read through someone else's writing and continually stumbling over poor word-choices and bad spelling is... distracting.
You're trying to follow a line of thought and *bump* tits-over-ass you tumble off your bike and knock yer own teeth out.
It's arduous. It's editorial. It's an inclination. But, it ain't snobbery.
Posted by Jiminy (Member # 7917) on :
I don't care if you don't like his grammar. Dislike it all you want. The snobbish part is making a point of whining about it, and using that god-forsaken superior tone. The guy was telling us he's doing better at school because of Ender's Game, and some moron comes straight out of the gate with "You don't look like an A student to me." What the hell sort of person knocks a guy for this? The guy has thus far shown no ill-will toward anyone, and was perfectly friendly. What the hell was anyone hoping to gain by mocking him?
You are all morons. If I met you in real life, I would spill beer on your shoes and possibly pee on your car.
Posted by Locke2525 (Member # 7554) on :
i edited it,. sry about the typos, my left hand has never been strong, and i slipped on ice and my whole right arm has hurt like you wouldnt believe, ill try and be a bit more eyeful,
i didnt tell him, he is the kind of guy who would give it back to me,so ill just have him give it to someone. im sure ill see another book here or there...
I just REALLY love this book, and i know there are so many good books out there, some get over looked alot...plus
lol this book just got me back into reading..made hw alot mroe bearable. im usually a good typer, but im on some pain medication, and a bit woosy lol. Again sorry about the grammar
im also waiting for one to get to the home of mr.card, he sign it, then it somehow make its way back to me lol
[ February 09, 2006, 11:31 PM: Message edited by: Locke2525 ]
Posted by cheiros do ender (Member # 8849) on :
What on Earth are you on about "superior tone"? There is no tone on the internet. Maybe you've chosen to interpret what we've said as such, but that's your problem.
quote:If I met you in real life, I would spill beer on your shoes and possibly pee on your car.
And you call us morons?
Edit: just so you know, that was a flat out insult; no superior tone needed. Posted by Jiminy (Member # 7917) on :
No tone on the internet? Are you for real? You disagree that my previous post bore a confrontational tone? You're mad.
By the way, I don't think your post was one of the insufferably superior ones. I think it is mildly stupid to whine about the grammar at all, but your original post was more or less snobbery-free. I would probably not pee on your car.
Posted by cheiros do ender (Member # 8849) on :
quote:By the way, I don't think your post was one of the insufferably superior ones. I think it is mildly stupid to whine about the grammar at all, but your original post was more or less snobbery-free.
I suggest you work on you choice of word then. "You guys are all asses" does little to suggest your above statement to be the case.
Of course there is tone behind what is said in forums such as this. But tone comes out in the spoken word, and we can't hear it. Just because you know what tone you're implying doesn't mean we should respond in any way but objective to your tone.
Posted by clod (Member # 9084) on :
quote:I would probably not pee on your car.
Indeed?! That's comforting! I expect you'd pee at will depending on the make and model of my transportation, no?
Posted by Jiminy (Member # 7917) on :
I used "all" for theatrical effect. I agree it was misleading. My apologies, mein freunde.
quote:Just because you know what tone you're implying doesn't mean we should respond in any way but objective to your tone.
Well, yeah. That's what I'm saying. The tone of the posts made by those Steve and Ann folks, for instance, was superior and obnoxious. I responded as such.
Clod: I probably wouldn't pee on yours, either. Not yet, anyway. Unless it's a moped. Then I might, just for the drunken imagery.
Posted by Avatar300 (Member # 5108) on :
quote:It's not snobbery. Call it a defect, if you like. But, trying to read through someone else's writing and continually stumbling over poor word-choices and bad spelling is... distracting.
I've got a quick and painless cure for that. If it bothers you, try ignoring it.
If you really find it impossible to ignore, there are better ways of expressing distaste than R. Ann Dryden's rude comment.
Posted by clod (Member # 9084) on :
Consider yourself free to pee on my moped, Jiminy. It is, after all, just a moped.
Posted by Jiminy (Member # 7917) on :
You actually have a moped?
... what are the odds? (Full circle? Check.)
Can I... uh... can I borrow it?
Posted by clod (Member # 9084) on :
First you want to pee on it, now you want to borrow it?
Posted by Jiminy (Member # 7917) on :
If you don't let me borrow it, I'm gonna pee on it.
Posted by Joldo (Member # 6991) on :
. . .
Uh . . . back to Ender's Game.
Actually, I do this with all my paperbacks. I sign my name inside, hand it to some one else, and tell them to pass it on when they get done with their name written underneath mine. I've yet to come back across one of mine.
Posted by clod (Member # 9084) on :
Jiminy,
Whatever floats yer boat, Jr. Just so long as you return it with a full-tank and a thorough washing.
Posted by Jiminy (Member # 7917) on :
Mopeds have tanks? I thought they ran on cloudless skies and birdsong.
Posted by RunningBear (Member # 8477) on :
Puke...
I am sick of this infantile bickering.
Ooh look at me, I can insult and refute better than you can.
You can set a tone online (ever read a book??? its all text!)
I have had straight A's in English for the past 11 years, and I have bad grammar online because I am getting my idea out and I dont give a bite whether it has correct grammar. Besides, if you are too lazy to read through someones alternate writing type how can you take them down for not spending the time to improve their grammar?
And mopeds run on cloudy skies and mud puddles (I live in Oregon)
P.S. there is no such thing as just a moped. they are the preferred mode of transportation of the gods.
Sheesh
you dam supporting hippies
Posted by Jiminy (Member # 7917) on :
Maybe it's regional. I'm pretty sure my friend told me his runs on cloudless skies and birdsong. I was trying to get him to come to this party, and he was like, "Dude, I can't get there, this snowstorm is killing my moped. Come to think of it, why did I import this thing from New Zealand? I should've gotten one of those Siberian models."
Posted by CalvinandThomasHobbes (Member # 9158) on :
I agree with RunningBear, however, your post, and mine especially are only adding to the "infantile bickering."
p.s. I am anti-moped.
Posted by Jiminy (Member # 7917) on :
Not all confrontation is bickering, and not all bickering is infantile. One of the cornerstones of civility is that the firestarters are told not to.
Thanks for adding to the air of superiority, though.
Posted by R. Ann Dryden (Member # 8186) on :
I certainly had no intent to offend and apologise for doing so. I happen to be a writer and a teacher and find it excruciating to read posts that are nearly illegible.
One of the many reasons I hang out at Hatrack is because by and large people here are able to express themselves using at least some semblance of the English language. I thought it was ironic that such a hard to read post was prefaced by the statement that he was now an A student. The entire purpose of posting is to communicate with others, why not write in such a way that the maximum amount of people can be reached? I don't think that's snobbery. Just common sense.
Anyway, Locke, I am sorry about your arm and I hope it gets better soon.
Jiminy, I think your reaction to my post says a lot more about your character than about mine.
Posted by vonk (Member # 9027) on :
hey locke.... can i borrow a copy of EG? i swear i'll give it back.
(i just wanted to be a part of this fantastically scintillating thread)
Posted by Earendil18 (Member # 3180) on :
Well Locke, despite the parallel thread that has run along side the main one here, you're post was very enjoyable and I hope spring comes for your area soon!
Posted by aarand (Member # 8745) on :
quote:Originally posted by R. Ann Dryden: I certainly had no intent to offend and apologise for doing so. I happen to be a writer and a teacher and find it excruciating to read posts that are nearly illegible.
One of the many reasons I hang out at Hatrack is because by and large people here are able to express themselves using at least some semblance of the English language. I thought it was ironic that such a hard to read post was prefaced by the statement that he was now an A student. The entire purpose of posting is to communicate with others, why not write in such a way that the maximum amount of people can be reached? I don't think that's snobbery. Just common sense.
Anyway, Locke, I am sorry about your arm and I hope it gets better soon.
Jiminy, I think your reaction to my post says a lot more about your character than about mine.
Since suggestions are the order of the day...
I suggest you find more constructive ways to get your point across than being offensive.
Locke, congratulations on both your success and your devotion to a great book! And don't worry so much about grammar and spelling online. Many great characters in books have poor grammar (and some pretty odd colloquialisms) from time to time.
All it means is that as you become more comfortable with writing as prissily as some other posters (myself included) you have Great Character!
Posted by Locke2525 (Member # 7554) on :
ear lol, im in kalammazoo MI, spring hits around august summer-september fall-october winter...all other months lol
Posted by Pinky (Member # 9161) on :
Oh, wow... Pretty hostile in here. I'm in this forum for the first time, and I already feel panic running through my veins. I hope, it is not a habit to attack people because of their writing or grammar skills. My (active) knowledge of the English language still is not the best as well (I just started my studies two years ago and haven't had a lot of contact with "natives" from English speaking countries, yet.) I strongly agree with Jiminy and Running Bear: There is no use to be that infantile, is there? On the other hand, "Locke" is probably not the best choice for a name, regarding our associations with that character's skills.
However, Locke, when you have time enough to start a thread, you might have time enough to write more carefully and slowly, until your arm is okay again.
Posted by Pinky (Member # 9161) on :
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Jiminy: [QB] My apologies, mein freunde.
That reminds me of all the german words I read in the OSC books: ersatz, hinterland, spiel...
I mean, there are words for this in the English language as well, so why don't use them? Does anybody know? Are those words actually part of the English? It's not like "sauerkraut", "bratwurst" or "blitzkrieg", is it?
Liebe Grüße, Pinky
P.S.: It's "meine Freunde" Posted by Pinky (Member # 9161) on :
P.P.S.: How do you quote the way you do? Looks much better. Why does everybody seems to know, but me? That's embarrassing, but I'm willing to learn...
Posted by Avatar300 (Member # 5108) on :
If you want to quote an entire post, click on the quote icon above that post.
Otherwise, place what you want to quote into brackets like this:
[quo]bla bla[/quo]
but use "quote" instead of "quo" when you do it for real.
Posted by Pinky (Member # 9161) on :
quote:[quo]bla bla[/quo]
THANKS!
Posted by GaalDornick (Member # 8880) on :
"Your spelling, grammar and typing skills don't match those of an A student.
Great information, that's wonderful about the books, but on this forum communication skills count. You may want to proofread your post."
I thought the first sentence here was unnecessary, maybe a little rude, but the post didn't warrant the response it got from Jiminy. She wasn't being intentionally mean, the second paragraph was explaining his mistake to him in a constructive way, complimenting him but explaining what he did wrong.
Just my $0.02 Posted by Pinky (Member # 9161) on :
Hi hi, this thread would be a beautiful topic for Litarary or Social studies. We could just print it out and analyse the characters, look for rhetoricals figures and place it in its context,...
Posted by Irregardless (Member # 8529) on :
quote:Originally posted by Pinky: Oh, wow... Pretty hostile in here. I'm in this forum for the first time, and I already feel panic running through my veins. I hope, it is not a habit to attack people because of their writing or grammar skills. My (active) knowledge of the English language still is not the best as well (I just started my studies two years ago and haven't had a lot of contact with "natives" from English speaking countries, yet.)
I think you will find that most people will cut *much* more slack to a non-native speaker, because even many of us that are picky about English know how difficult it is to learn a second language well enough to converse in it.
By the way, I would not have known (from your writing) that you were a non-native speaker if you hadn't told us.
Posted by Irregardless (Member # 8529) on :
quote:Originally posted by Pinky: That reminds me of all the german words I read in the OSC books: ersatz, hinterland, spiel...
I mean, there are words for this in the English language as well, so why don't use them? Does anybody know? Are those words actually part of the English?
I would think you *would* find all of those in a standard English dictionary. Of the three, I'd say the most commonly used in English is 'spiel' where it usually carries the sense of a rehearsed appeal to an audience, something like an advertising pitch.
Posted by Sergeant (Member # 8749) on :
Hinterland is a term I saw in either my anthropology or geography book so I figure it is used in English but not probably part of the average speaker's active vocabulary.
As for spelling and grammer of an "A" student, I managed to graduate from the university with a 3.8 GPA, get into law school and in general get good grades without a great command of grammer. Grammer is not in any way intrinsicly (sp) tied to intelligence, though it usually comes along with education because you read lots of material that exhibits good grammer. On the other hand, if you have a very intelligent person who learns more from listening or doing, they may have very poor grammer. This says nothing of the different types of intelligence.
If you think his grammer or spelling is a poor reflection on his education you ought to see my handwriting.
Sergeant
Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
Hinterland isn't a commonly known word? That surprises me.
I gotta comment on the whole gang-up on R Ann bit that's going on in this thread. She wasn't intentionally mean, but she is correct in that communication skills help. If a post contains numerous spelling errors, incorrect or no punctuation, and no sentence or paragraph breaks, it is more difficult to understand. It is also less likely that it will be read, or, if read, less likely to be understood properly. If someone posts like that, then don't be surprised if you don't get as many responses to it or it's misunderstood.
Having said that, there's no reason to snarky and irritable in condemning Ann for being picky.
Posted by aarand (Member # 8745) on :
Just making it plain that we don't care if someone is a great typist or writer here. What we value is the thoughts they bring. Yes, it may help if the thoughts are conveyed in an easily digestible format, but if everyone is as intelligent as they claim, a little diversity here and there should pose little or no problem.
I have no issue with R Ann whatsoever, just her teaching style in this thread.
Posted by Dasa (Member # 8968) on :
Locke :
Maybe you should take part in Bookcrossing ... You can share the love and have greater fun Posted by Locke2525 (Member # 7554) on :
ok i went back and edited after the 2nd post here.... so why did everyone get so offensive, I fixed it, i was tired but did not want to forget to post this.
So ive appoligized, ive fixed....why do you guys still complain?...
Posted by Princess Leah (Member # 6026) on :
It's now a debate with no real relation to the original topic. Face the truth: Your thread has been derailed. <scary music>
Posted by aarand (Member # 8745) on :
Locke, don't worry about it, you're doing perfectly alright.
Posted by Steev (Member # 6805) on :
quote:Originally posted by Locke2525: ... So ive appoligized, ive fixed....why do you guys still complain?...
Because beating a dead horse can be really fun sometimes.
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
quote:Snobbery like this in the real world would get your teeth knocked out.
I'm glad I don't live in your real world. In my real world, well-intentioned correction is received with thanks.
Posted by clod (Member # 9084) on :
quote:I'm glad I don't live in your real world. In my real world, well-intentioned correction is received with thanks.
KQ,
Not being a grammar-critic, nor a spelling one, but the equating of "snobbery" with "well-intentioned correction" doesn't make a lot of sense to me.
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
Well, I don't see what was said as "snobbery". Make more sense? Posted by Pinky (Member # 9161) on :
After all, there IS a difference in the ways to critizise, constructive or destructive. Whether the criticism is well-intentioned or not doesn't matter that much. If the criticism doesn't help the critisised to figure out how to do better next time, there shouldn't be any criticism at all.
Posted by Pinky (Member # 9161) on :
Oh, and thank you all for your answers on my question.
Posted by Pinky (Member # 9161) on :
quote:By the way, I would not have known (from your writing) that you were a non-native speaker if you hadn't told us.
Wooahh... the time difference between Europe and U.S.A. is just killing me... It is between 11:30a.m. and 2:30p.m. in your world, isn't it?
Posted by clod (Member # 9084) on :
quote: Well, I don't see what was said as "snobbery". Make more sense?
Yes, it does, thanks. The apparent distinquishing factor is "thoughtfulness" and consideration, no? And, by "thoughtfulness" and consideration, I'm referring to the critics not the recipients of critique. Posted by Jiminy (Member # 7917) on :
quote:Originally posted by R. Ann Dryden: I happen to be a writer and a teacher and find it excruciating to read posts that are nearly illegible.
Oh, you're a TEACHER. Well then, that's different! I take back everything I said. You just keep on condescending to everyone who doesn't live up to your silly-assed standards.
quote:Originally posted by R. Ann Dryden: One of the many reasons I hang out at Hatrack is because by and large people here are able to express themselves using at least some semblance of the English language. I thought it was ironic that such a hard to read post was prefaced by the statement that he was now an A student.
Christ, you actually think this made sense, don't you? You actually thought this was a compelling argument. "It's so simple! All I want is for everyone to speak proper English! Is that so much to ask?" Well, yeah, it is, moron. Is it possible that you actually feel improper use of the language to be a deadlier sin than, say, belittling some friendly stranger just to boost your own stupid ego?
"Well, *I* happen to be a teacher." Good god.
Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
Yes, and using profanity and calling someone names just makes your argument so much more, what, truer?
What you - and others complaining about R Ann's rudeness - don't seem to get is that you have been far more rude to her than she ever was initially.
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
quote:The apparent distinquishing factor is "thoughtfulness" and consideration, no? And, by "thoughtfulness" and consideration, I'm referring to the critics not the recipients of critique.
No. The distinguishing factor is saying something that's not overtly rude and is intended to help.
Posted by aarand (Member # 8745) on :
I wasn't aware I was being rude. Thanks for pointing that out. I was only ever intending to help.
Posted by dab (Member # 7847) on :
If you are smart enough you do not need perfect grammer in order to understand what someone is trying to say. To all those complainers: get over it. This was a nice story that Locke had to tell... it't too bad some of you dimwits couldn't appreciate it because of your snobbery.
Posted by clod (Member # 9084) on :
quote:No. The distinguishing factor is saying something that's not overtly rude and is intended to help.
Critics can be thoughtful and considerate.
does that help?
Posted by clod (Member # 9084) on :
quote:If you are smart enough you do not need perfect grammar in order to understand what someone it trying to say.
If I had a nickle...
For everytime I felt compelled to correct someone... I'd make a mint of it.
Posted by skillery (Member # 6209) on :
If we can assume that Locke understands the principles of English composition, I think it would be more helpful to dissect the original post line by line. My writing is not too hot now, but it was even worse before my high school teacher took the time to show me how to express my thoughts coherently.
How about a Snoop Dogg version of the original post?
Posted by Locke2525 (Member # 7554) on :
i went back and fixed it!..this is online, and online for me i just take off my shoes and relax, i have a laid back style. My first post, i was heavily drugged and my arm hurt, never drug and post, ive learned. Whenever i have papers due I am thee most picky person when it comes to grammar and puuncuation in real life, its like going to the beach, and wearing a business suit and judging people for how they put their sun tan lotion..who cares, its their skin not yours. Just drop it already
Posted by skillery (Member # 6209) on :
quote:online for me i just take off my shoes
Don't stub your toe on the apostrophe key!
Posted by cheiros do ender (Member # 8849) on :
How to I set up a Signature?
Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
There are no sigs on this forum.
Posted by Pinky (Member # 9161) on :
quote:..., never drug and post, ive learned.
The internet aquivalent to "don't drink and drive"?
Posted by Morbo (Member # 5309) on :
quote: How about a Snoop Dogg version of the original post?
I tried, but askSnoop.com's Shizzolator bot is down. It's prolly the Man, fo'rizzle.
Posted by Morbo (Member # 5309) on :
Cool story, Locke. Considering the number of books you put out (28 or 45?), it's not that surprising that eventually you would bump into someone with one.
Posted by cheiros do ender (Member # 8849) on :
pH does her sig custom for every single post? Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
I assume so. Posted by CRash (Member # 7754) on :
Some people are dedicated that way. I for one am grateful there isn't a signature option on this forum.
Posted by narrativium (Member # 3230) on :
quote:Originally posted by Pinky: I strongly agree with Jiminy and Running Bear: There is no use to be that infantile, is there?
Excuse me? It seems to me that Jiminy is the most infantile poster on this thread. All I see from him are insults and invective.
Posted by Pinky (Member # 9161) on :
Yes, regarding the word choice and the degree of hostility in Jiminiy's post. The "pissing"- part etc. was all but..uh..mature. But when I read this "don't match those of an A-Student"-stuff, I only thought of how much it must have hurt Locke to read that, whether or not it's true. I would have been hurt, so I was glad that there was someone who did not agree with R. Ann Dryden's first post. Okay? Posted by JLM (Member # 7800) on :
quote:Originally posted by R. Ann Dryden: I certainly had no intent to offend and apologise for doing so. I happen to be a writer and a teacher and find it excruciating to read posts that are nearly illegible.
One of the many reasons I hang out at Hatrack is because by and large people here are able to express themselves using at least some semblance of the English language. I thought it was ironic that such a hard to read post was prefaced by the statement that he was now an A student. The entire purpose of posting is to communicate with others, why not write in such a way that the maximum amount of people can be reached? I don't think that's snobbery. Just common sense.
Your defensive spiel here does indicate (at least to me) that you seem to value form over substance. I have been highly annoyed at how often fellow hatracker waste time criticizing eachothers grammer, spelling and typing. There are forums where such things are important, but an online message board is not one of them. I do try to write well when I post, but doing so takes time and thought since I am not a naturally gifted writer. As a result I post rarely. However, if someone wants to share his or her thoughts, feeling and experineces and doesn't have a natural gift for flowery prose or the time to compose elequently, cut them some slack and reach out to them yourself. If you don't like what you read, go read another thread and keep your grammer sniping to yourself.
Posted by Jiminy (Member # 7917) on :
Nice post, JLM. I would have liked it more if you had questioned her intelligence a few times, and maybe thrown in a crude joke about her sister, but it was still quite good.
Posted by CRash (Member # 7754) on :
I tend to jump on grammar mistakes myself these days. What newcomers eventually realize is that at Hatrack, to be taken seriously, one needs to "talk" in a mature manner, punctuation and all, most of the time.
There seems to be a higher standard here in comparison to other internet fora that I've visited. This is a good thing IMO, and one finds that the people who have been here for the long haul share the opinion that grammar and punctuation matter.
What bothers me is that folks think they can slack off because this is the internet. OSC has said before that he considers Hatrack as his "living room", a place for interesting and intelligent conversations on just about everything. One has to remember that these are real people participating in online discussions, and just because we are using a different mode of communication doesn't mean we can be any less mature about the way we speak to others, especially people we don't know.
That said, I do agree that sometimes jatraqueros come off as a little snooty in the grammar department. But it's a simple matter to avoid--use better grammar or go try a different forum where you can talk to others in the way you like. It really isn't that big of a deal.
Posted by clod (Member # 9084) on :
CRash,
It seems to me that what you are describing is "holding Court".
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![[Wall Bash]](graemlins/wallbash.gif)
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