Hatrack River Forum: between shadow puppets and shadow of teh giant

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Posted by Omer Zauber (Member # 12566) on :

Hi!

im new here, and what im about to write might have been noticed by others, if that is so, im sorry

first of all, i must say that i live in Israel and any Ender book i've read, i did so in Hebrew.

im rereading the books now because finally i can read them all acording to a single certain time line (with the Ender in Exile concluding the Bean series and making a good start for the older books)

i was not looking for mistakes between the different books, but i still couldnt help but finding 2 things that were looking a bit weird to me.

(i know the names only in Hebrew, so i most likly will mispell them, and for that i apologize in advance)

1) Peter Wiggin tells Petra just before they meet Alai that no one has chosen him and therefor his Hegemoncy is ilegal, but.. in the Hegemon's Shadow it's written that peopel wanted Locke to be the Hegemon and that's why Peter revealed himself, no?

2) in chapter 5 of the book it's being said that Peter doesnt know Virlomi, but hmm... didnt she work for him once bean and his thai army collected her in india and untill Peter freed Achiles from the chinese?

didnt mean to be petty about these, just 2 points to think about,

Omer

Posted by umberhulk (Member # 11788) on :

2. Yeah, but I dont think they worked together directly and I dont imagine Peter interacted much on a personal level.

Posted by Kelly1101 (Member # 12562) on :

1) Don't have the book in front of me, but I think he doesn't call his Hegemony illegal, he calls it... illegitimate, maybe? Basically the comparison he is drawing is-- Alai was chosen by God. Peter simply came to power through being clever and wanting the job. Yes, he also got many people to want him to have the job. But his position wasn't a religious one like Alai's, he wasn't the "Chosen One" in that respect. I think. If I'm remembering correctly, that's the way I took it.

2) What umberhulk said... she was in the compound but it seems not in a position of major importance, and she and Peter didn't seem to have come into contact much.

Hope that helps [Smile]

Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :

Shalom, Omer!

Welcome to Hatrack. [Smile]

Posted by Omer Zauber (Member # 12566) on :

Shalom, Rivka [Razz]

and ty

1) a rought transaltion back to english (hope it's not -too- terrible) "petra: who chose you? peter: since i dont have any real authority over anyone, petra, why does it matter if i wasnt legaly chosen" and later in that chapter he's wondering if anyone recorded their conversation and was warried if they would poblish it.

but again, maybe the transelator's word picking wasnt acurate..

2) the book is saying his compound in brazil was small, but i guess it was relativly. i'd just guess that he would like to know someone who's been a part of the battle school that was working for him, no?

these 2 points -do- seem a little less important now, though, after these clarrifications (the only thing that matters, eventually, is what written latest, because the story after that part lays on the facts as they are displayed there)

P.S. For YEARS i was sure Alai's name was Alli [Razz]

only realised i was mistaken when i got to the point with the indonasian cab driver that didnt recognize the name "Alai" and thought that Bean said "A lie" (which was difficult to understand, since it was lost in the transelation. And i guess the transelator didnt figure it herself, since there was no comment about it as in the usual case)

Posted by Kelly1101 (Member # 12562) on :

"1) a rought transaltion back to english (hope it's not -too- terrible) "petra: who chose you? peter: since i dont have any real authority over anyone, petra, why does it matter if i wasnt legaly chosen" and later in that chapter he's wondering if anyone recorded their conversation and was warried if they would poblish it.

but again, maybe the transelator's word picking wasnt acurate.."

That's pretty spot on, it's just a subtle difference in a few words. I found my copy, and here is the actual wording in English:

"It's the democratic part I missed," said Petra. "Who elected you?"
"Since I don't have any actual authority over anyone, Petra, how can it possibly matter if I'm not legitimately authorized?"

I think Peter was halfway being ironic, anyway-- earlier in the conversation Petra was mocking him for not having as much power as other "world leaders" like Alai (for the muslims) and the Pope (for the catholics).

But now you have me wondering, how DID Peter get the office of Hegemon? Was he elected or appointed? I can't remember. Maybe they were talking about how he wasn't elected to be the leader of the ENTIRE world, which is his aspiration at that point.

Posted by Kelly1101 (Member # 12562) on :

Oh-- and yeah, these are small things, but I can't help but nitpick sometimes, too. [Big Grin]

Posted by Omer Zauber (Member # 12566) on :

hmm...... he got someone to name Locke as a possibility for the hegemon, so he came clean saying who he is and that he is too young for it, so when the real war started, they came to him saying they -do- need him, regardless of his age

Posted by dlaxd (Member # 12540) on :

i'm pretty sure he was elected when the war started because graff brought his name up when he was still locke