Ok... I must admit something. I'm Goth! Yes... a creature of the night. Walking around in flowing black velvet robes and black makeup. When I'm not working of course. Damn ties and suit coats. Am I a little old for this? Not at all!
After work on the weekends (and sometimes on Wed nights) I'll dress up in my lovely period outfits with my long coat and lots of lace and head out to the goth clubs and listen to industrial/darkwave/gothic music while sipping my jagermister. My favorite place is 'City Club' in Detroit... one of the (if not the) oldest alternative clubs in the nation, over 30 years old now.
How many others are into our lovely Gothic subculture? And what places do you like to hang out?
Posted by Olivet (Member # 1104) on :
I'm the one in the red and black replica of a dress Arwen wore in RotK.
At WenchCon, we went to the movies in costume. Posted by Slash the Berzerker (Member # 556) on :
Dude, Telperion, that is soooo gay.
Posted by Suneun (Member # 3247) on :
Heh. I hope you have seen my goth photos.
I loosely associated with goth culture. I don't hang out with them, sit around in cemetaries, write dreary poetry, or do some of the other stereotypical things. But I do wear a lot of black, like industrial and goth music, hang out at a goth club, and appreciate a bit of counter-culture.
The age range at the local goth club (MyrddinFyre and CalvinMaker have been to it!) is 18 to late 30's. I think there's a group of mid-20's lesbians, a group of 18 year old punks, and a group of mid-30's old-skool, along with all the other cliques. Heh.
What I was amazed to discover early on, is the huge amount of anger, nastiness, and condescension that exists in what I thought would have been an open, accepting community. Pfft, how innocent of me.
[ March 16, 2004, 06:01 PM: Message edited by: Suneun ]
Posted by Storm Saxon (Member # 3101) on :
That looks like the picture of some super hero group...maybe 'The Legion of Nerds'. Posted by Olivet (Member # 1104) on :
Jealousy looks good on you, Saxon. Posted by Suneun (Member # 3247) on :
here it is for those who may not have poked in on my webpage (shame on you!)
Posted by Olivet (Member # 1104) on :
Suneun, I had no idea you were so beautiful!
Um, Goth clubs... I'd go if I knew where one was, and had someone to go with. I have enough clothes to pick from... and , you know, boots and stuff. I wish I didn't look so bad in black. Heh.
Posted by Suneun (Member # 3247) on :
thank you for that sweet compliment.
Posted by beverly (Member # 6246) on :
Gorgeous pics, Suneun! Did you make those?
My husband (porteiro) told me just a couple days back that I look like I would make a great goth. (Very dark hair and pale skin).
Neither one of us could imagine it fitting my personality though.
Posted by skillery (Member # 6209) on :
I used to listen to Clan of Xymox. Does that count?
I'm too old to dress up without getting arrested. Sorry.
Posted by Jeni (Member # 1454) on :
Off the goth topic, but... check out those trapeze pictures! Very cool. Posted by Telperion the Silver (Member # 6074) on :
Olivet, Suneun, beautiful outfits! I'll dig some of my pics out of the computer at home and post them in a day or so.
Slash, you are too cute for words. Posted by pooka (Member # 5003) on :
I wasn't able to go to wenchcon
I was never into Goth music. I decided all musicians were corrupt when The Bangles sold out.
[ March 16, 2004, 06:17 PM: Message edited by: pooka ]
Posted by Suneun (Member # 3247) on :
Unfortunately, no, I don't make any clothes. Martha, who posts on hatrack, did make me the poet's shirt in the rogue outfit, but you can't see the shirt very well in that photo. She also made me a dress for faires, but it's not gothy so it's not up on that page. I'll put it up somewhere appropriate on my homepage, but for now it's here: dress martha made me Posted by beverly (Member # 6246) on :
*drools*
*gasp*
I want a dress like that!!!
Good job, Martha!
Posted by Suneun (Member # 3247) on :
heh. I don't think personality has too much to do with a goth. At least with all that dreary death and tattoo talk.
Many of the 'goth' regulars identify themselves more with the clothes specifically, or certain music groups (like 80's goth!), or even piercings/tattoos in general. But I was surprised at all the very down-to-earth non-morbid "goth" folks I met. Embrace the term, win it back for all of us happy perky goths!
heh
Anyone here like Wolfsheim, or Project Pitchfork, or Apoptygma Berzerk? Mmmm...
Posted by pH (Member # 1350) on :
Well, I can't find any of my old pictures. Yet. But I did find a picture of random people a club I used to do merch at. Okay, not entirely random. Fishnet-boy was in the band I worked for. Posted by beverly (Member # 6246) on :
Hmmm, if it's just about the clothes, I could go for that. I have a couple of renaissancesque/mideval outfits. I am a big fan of costumes and dressing up.
Posted by Zalmoxis (Member # 2327) on :
for skillery...
quote:A hundred times a year The wind blows A hundred times a year The wind blows through my skin Through my skin
All the choices and many voices Keep on telling me It's you, Evelyn It's you, Evelyn
Posted by Suneun (Member # 3247) on :
pH, what an awesome photo.
You have to really have a high tolerance of "outfits" to hang out in a goth scene. There's this really nice, quiet, unassuming kind of guy at Club Hell who wears all black and is covered with spikes (spike collar, spike belt, spikes all over his jacket, etc etc). He has such a gentle face, it's great.
Posted by pH (Member # 1350) on :
Yeah, but it was also great fun working for them...it gave my 6' tall self an excuse to wear 5" vinyl platforms. Posted by Slash the Berzerker (Member # 556) on :
quote: Slash, you are too cute for words.
Gay men love me. If I ever switch teams, I will never lack for company.
Telperion, we need more people with a good sense of humor here at Hatrack. Glad you came.
Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
quote:Slash, you are too cute for words.
Okay, I like the newbie.
Added: I swear I was posting this before I saw Slash's.
[ March 16, 2004, 06:46 PM: Message edited by: katharina ]
Posted by skillery (Member # 6209) on :
Thanks for that, Zalmoxis. Now I have to hurry home and give that old CD a listen.
quote:Anyone here like Wolfsheim, or Project Pitchfork, or Apoptygma Berzerk
Yes. There's a goth/darkwave channel that I listen to on MusicMatch. Recently I've gotten into some old Orbital, Crystal Method, Massive Attack, and even black metal like Opeth, but eventually they play Nine Inch Nails, and I have to turn it off. There's a fine line between a dark sound and a satanic sound. My wife says it's all satanic and forbids me from listening to it at home.
Posted by beverly (Member # 6246) on :
Sun, I guess all those spikes might creep me out a bit. I probably wouldn't dress up quite that extreme myself either. But maybe one of these days I will go goth for Halloween.
Posted by Suneun (Member # 3247) on :
skillery: neato. I listened to a few goth internet radio stations, but never found quite the perfect one. One of the first gothy songs I heard had this line: "We are the dead of night; We're in the zombie room" and it's by Depeche Mode! I never would have guessed. If anyone's interested, it's carried on iTunes store (called "The Dead of Night"). Not much else of the goth/industrial scene is. A lot of the music is german.
I still think it's a funny song. But now I dance to it happily.
Posted by Suneun (Member # 3247) on :
beverly: you should definitely go goth some halloween. it'd be fun!
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
I should confess that I would have been Goth -- I liked the music, the scene, and the girls (especially the girls; I dated moody girls in black lipstick almost exclusively for a decade, to my shame) -- but for the fact that I'm fat, and there's nothing more laughable than a fat Goth man. You can be a fat Goth chick, a thin Goth chick, or a thin Goth boy, but FAT Goth boys have to skip straight over to biker punk. They don't make capes in 3X sizes.
Posted by Stan the man (Member # 6249) on :
Does Type O Negative count as Goth? 'Cause they are one of the best groups (if still around) I have heard yet. I wear black clothing as everything else just looks so loud on me.
Posted by Olivet (Member # 1104) on :
*snort*
Tom, have I told you lately that I love ya? *giggles*
I guess I was sort of a proto-goth in high school. But that has been a very, very long time ago. Most of my friends were gay, and I was this semi-morose, frustrated little churchling.
But, since I have kids now, I almost never get to hear new music. I sort of met Trent Reznor once, before anybody cared who the hell he was. Heh.
Since I'm a mommy now, I'm not sure I could be called a Goth. The picture that the words "Goth Mom" conjure up... doesn't seem like me. Posted by Slash the Berzerker (Member # 556) on :
Tom, you could have gone on meth. Meth would thin you up and give you the cool, "Goth drug addict" twist. I know many goths who think its cool to be an addict. So angsty.
Posted by pH (Member # 1350) on :
Olivet, a couple of the girls down the hall wrote Trent bad ad-lib poetry and left it in his mailbox. It was wonderful. I'll see if I can get a copy of it from them.
Posted by Unmaker (Member # 1641) on :
:sighs deeply:
Posted by jexx (Member # 3450) on :
Olivet, There is a goth.parenting newsgroup on my newsreader, but it doesn't get much traffic, sadly. The folks who post there are pretty genuine, though, when they DO post. They're kind of neat to lurk at.
I am too cheerful for goth, I think. I tried to be Goth in H.S., but the goths I knew were so saaaad. What a bummer.
I get Gother as I get older, but I think I'm rebelling at my military family lifestyle. *grin*
Posted by Suneun (Member # 3247) on :
Hey unmaker, why the sighing? Expressing your true goth-self?
Posted by John L (Member # 6005) on :
quote:What I was amazed to discover early on, is the huge amount of anger, nastiness, and condescension that exists in what I thought would have been an open, accepting community. Pfft, how innocent of me.
*shrug* just like any other subculture that thinks it's not one of the many mainstream subcultures, and has disdain for anything "mainstream." Same applies for punks, emos (emus to me), and even the nerd/geek crowds. The "wicca/pagan" crowd is becoming very much the same (I mean the subculture based on them, not the belief systems). I've been friends with enough of each of these "alt" groups long enough to know that obviously not everyone is like that. It's just the general attitude that becomes pervasive. I stopped joining my friends at the popular goth club in Philly because I get a little sick of dealing with the disdainful looks and comments for not being goth enough (I wear black almost exclusively, but not "goth" black: khakis and plain shirts, never any makeup. I have no fashion sense, so I take the easy way out and don't try to match colors). It's kind of annoying coming from people who complain about being made fun of for trying so hard to stick out like a sore thumb (in the real world) to begin with.
Me by the time I was going to clubs. Who'd have guessed I'd have turned out liking Harleys and computers and wanting to teach history to teenagers?
Posted by Suneun (Member # 3247) on :
oh I completely agree, NOW, John. My innocence was bashed and I realize that every subculture has its in-fighting, politics, emotional backstabbing, and condescension. It's such a shame.
I hoped that the goth culture would celebrate Being Different and letting people express themselves, however that might be. But that's just an idealism, something concocted from the dream-world, not reality.
Yes, even the pagan communities are beginning to have a lot of tension. A friend related to me a story of a huge fight between pagan store owners involving curses that occurred recently.
I think I can only say that it's human nature. As sad as that is.
Posted by Suneun (Member # 3247) on :
btw, you look like an awesome goth. =)
Posted by John L (Member # 6005) on :
Danke. My brother sometimes teases me and says I still look goth, but it'd be tough for me to pull it off now. Now, though, I come off as either looking like a wannabe-FBI or, as my friend Jim says, like "Matrix-Man."
One friend of mine is an ordained Wiccan priestess (minister?), and she won't even get together with anyone she hasn't know for years any more because of the cattiness.
Oh well. That's what happens when something becomes a "thing" involving more than a dozen or so people (more than three is a risk IMnsHO). Posted by jexx (Member # 3450) on :
Yes, John is a pretty, pretty man.
(I simply haven't been fangirling him enough lately--seriously, though, John makes a very Handsome Goth)
Posted by Suneun (Member # 3247) on :
it's the boots and the brooding face, heh
Posted by John L (Member # 6005) on :
Yeah, I traded the boots and brooding for sunglasses, a long jacket (leather, but not near a trench), and a bit of quirky wit. Once I get enough to get another Harley, though, I'll be grabbing engineer boots like those again, since they're best for riding (or, more exactly, for shifting)
Posted by Kama (Member # 3022) on :
OMG!!!
Leto pics!!!111!!!!
*faints*
Posted by Telperion the Silver (Member # 6074) on :
Ahhh.. back for another day of posting...
Wow! Look at all the posters! Fun goth type people and pictures abound!
Still haven't gotten mine up yet. Moved my mom to the nursing home last night so she can recover for a week or two from her knee surgery (she still can't use the bathroom on her own yet so moving to the house would be bad without constant care), so I didn't have time to search for my pretty goth pics. Soon! *hugs*
Posted by Telperion the Silver (Member # 6074) on :
quote:Gay men love me. If I ever switch teams, I will never lack for company.
Telperion, we need more people with a good sense of humor here at Hatrack. Glad you came.
Thanks Slashman! And I'll give you my number just in case.......
[ March 19, 2004, 04:13 PM: Message edited by: Telperion the Silver ]
Posted by Mabus (Member # 6320) on :
Besides some other problems with dressing Goth (mentioned in Suneun's landmark), I live not far from Paducah (where the Trenchcoat Mafia incident occurred). No point in being mistaken for someone planning to shoot up the professors.
Truthfully, I've always found it too much trouble to try and meet anyone's standard of appearances, beyond a little basic grooming.
[ March 19, 2004, 06:17 PM: Message edited by: Mabus ]
Posted by Belle (Member # 2314) on :
Tom they do so have capes in 3x sizes! I can make a cape in any size. Capes is easy sewing work.
You want one, you can have one. You just have to pay more for material than a thin-Goth guy would.
Posted by Geomancer (Member # 6299) on :
People always call me a goth, but I'm more emo than anything. I'm into graveyards and the comsumption of blood , and the all-black thing, but I'm usually a pretty upbeat person. Until recently, my hair was to my nose, but I was required to cut it because I'm in a play. >_< The things I do for drama... Posted by ReikoDemosthenes (Member # 6218) on :
I have yet to decide if I remotely qualify as goth...I still do not understand exactly what it is, whether it's a style of dress, a mindset, a preference in music...a combination of any of the above and/or more...
[Edit for grammer]
[ March 20, 2004, 12:50 AM: Message edited by: ReikoDemosthenes ]
Posted by Suneun (Member # 3247) on :
Reiko, as far as I know... many people do only identify with one segment of the subculture. But the true goths are probably the ones that enjoy exploring the dark side of things, whether it be depression, evil, death, sadness, anger, hate, or despair. For starters.
But I know LOTS of 'perky goths.' These are generally very happy goths, while they may have interest in a few of the other parts of goth culture. Some of these are happy while they hang out in cemetaries. Others are happy when they hang out on their computer, far away from dead things.
That's my take, though I wouldn't be surprised if it's regional.
Posted by ReikoDemosthenes (Member # 6218) on :
thanks for the summery
*re-reads the first part...confirms* definately goth...it wouldn't do me much good to deny it...most people who know me would just laugh at me if I tried...*looks at the second part...remembers nearly falling asleep in a cemetary once...when the sun was warm and the moss a perfect bed*
Posted by twinky (Member # 693) on :
I find tall, pale, dark-haired girls very attractive.
I, however, am not goth. I don't self-identify with any subcultures, with the exception of engineering school camraderie.
Posted by Starla* (Member # 5835) on :
Twinky--that means you're halfway to the goth look--pasty white from never seeing sunlight or the outside world (my sis is an engineering major--haven't seen her in ages, and we go to the same school)
Most of my goth friends were the perky happy types--except for a couple--one had a tendency towards callousness, the other just had anger problems (and is now what one would call "jerry springer material"). Both had a penchant for saying "I was goth before he/she was doing it..."
I felt like saying "Who cares?"
I kinda do it--not as often as I used to b/c it takes a bit of work, especially with makeup, which I'm too lazy to put on half the time, even when I dressed goth. Most of my formal attire is what one would call gothic, including my senior prom dress.
I occasionally go to the nightclub in Philly that JohnL mentioned, but haven't been there in a few months. I never really interacted with the people there---I'm usually there with friends and I enjoy dancing, so that's normally what I do.
My stepfather makes fun of me--askes me if I'm going to hang out with 12 yearolds. He just doesn't get it. I'm beyond the age of trying to be "radical." I like dressing like that, sometimes, it's fun!
*sigh* Now I wish I had time to go to Shampoo...maybe I'll go for graduation.
Maybe I'll scan and post pics...
Posted by Telperion the Silver (Member # 6074) on :
Here's a link to see my pic.
I'm to the right and my friend Lindsy is to the left.
[ April 06, 2004, 02:31 PM: Message edited by: Telperion the Silver ]
Posted by MyrddinFyre (Member # 2576) on :
This thread is overflowing with hotness. Just thought I'd point that out. Posted by Suneun (Member # 3247) on :
Hey Myr, poke poke on the Boston trip.
Tel, you look awesome.
Posted by MyrddinFyre (Member # 2576) on :
Hehe, I'm going home today (in two hours, actually), so I can see about getting the car... good news is my class was cancelled that day!
I've been suffering from club hell withdrawl Posted by skillery (Member # 6209) on :
I saw The Cure on the Tonight Show this evening, and I wanted to know if The Cure has much of a following among the goth culture. I don't know why, but I've always thought of The Cure, or at least Robert Smith as gothic. Maybe it's Robert's ratty hair. Maybe it's because Robert reminds me of Edward Scissorhands. Maybe it's the makeup.
So are The Cure, Tim Burton, and Danny Elfman all gothic?
I've been listening to Portishead a lot lately, and I'm wondering if they're considered gothic.
Sorry to ramble. Just wanted to get my sub-cultures straight.
Posted by MyrddinFyre (Member # 2576) on :
Yes, the Cure is considered "Goth." I never really understood why, though Posted by skillery (Member # 6209) on :
The idea of wearing black, hanging out in shadowy places, and listening to dark music has always appealed to me, but I was married and settled before the goth culture congealed.
Life with my wife is sunshiney, pastel, and happy.
And now I'm too old to go goth, unless they bury me on a rainy day under the ruins of some old church.
Posted by Suneun (Member # 3247) on :
unlikely you're too old for goth. I see a lot of folks in their 30's, 40's, and 50's bumming around at the club.
And if you're not in the mood to look old among the punks, you can always listen to goth music on your own. You can also go stand around in cemetaries and such.
Silly goths.
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
Yes, the Cure -- along with My Bloody Valentine, Type O Negative, Concrete Blonde, Bauhaus, The Swans, Sisters of Mercy, etc. -- are considered one of the primary "Goth" influences, even if only one or two of their albums (most notably Disintegration, and the "Burn" single off The Crow soundtrack) are really all that Goth.
Most Goths I know consider both Danny Elfman and Tim Burton to be demigods.
[ May 01, 2004, 12:23 PM: Message edited by: TomDavidson ]
Posted by Ralphie (Member # 1565) on :
btw - Slash isn't kidding on that gay men love him thing.
My husband, WHO FREAKING LOOKS LIKE KEVIN SPACEY (whom all gay men love), is completely outclassed around Slash when it comes to the same sex lovin'.
Slash even has gay men hit on him when he is quite obviously with his wife. They can't help it. It's like he has them under hypnosis, or summin.
Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
Sisters of Mercy Posted by Telperion the Silver (Member # 6074) on :
Mmmmmm Mmmmm Mmmmm...
Slash, you need to put a picture of yourself up! I'm curious.
[ May 03, 2004, 03:45 PM: Message edited by: Telperion the Silver ]
Posted by gwan (Member # 6194) on :
"I should confess that I would have been Goth -- I liked the music, the scene, and the girls (especially the girls; I dated moody girls in black lipstick almost exclusively for a decade, to my shame) -- but for the fact that I'm fat, and there's nothing more laughable than a fat Goth man. You can be a fat Goth chick, a thin Goth chick, or a thin Goth boy, but FAT Goth boys have to skip straight over to biker punk. They don't make capes in 3X sizes."
Tom, I myself, am a goth girl. I know MANY the goth girl who enjoys fat men, MYSELF INCLUDED. Did you ever see The Butterfly Effect? Thumper, VERY HOT! (Until he screws all those girls.) You can make your own capes out of anything. Store-bought goth clothes are so lame anyway. Posted by skillery (Member # 6209) on :
I remember reading an article in Salt Lake's Deseret News about Mormon Goths a few years ago. It seemed at the time that there were also television news reports about whole congregations of Goths attending Mormon Church meetings in a little community called Eagle Mountain south of Salt Lake City. They may have sensationalized it a bit on the news. I don't think they were wearing Goth garb to church, and I don't think the LDS bishop was a Goth. But that would have been kinda cool.
Anyway I liked the part in the article about the community services that the Goths participated in. It said they were involved in the adopt-a-bat program.
Posted by Javert (Member # 3076) on :
Olivet, I don't know if it's the pic or what, but you look exactly like my girlfriend without her glasses on! The likeness is totally wild.
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Damn ties and suit coats. Am I a little old for this? Not at all! ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
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