You know I have creative, imaginative kids. Olivia especially beleives in all sorts of mythical things; fairies, unicorns, selkies, etc. Matthew's latest is that he is sure the Harry Potter books are real. He thinks when he turns 11 he will get a letter from Hogwarts. Neither dh or I have any problem with this. BUT- my neighbor, with whom we are good freinds, for some reason cannot deal with this. For some months now she has been telling me that I need to 'pull Olivia into the real world, sooner rather trhan later". I have told her we have no problem with Olivia's beleiving this stuff. Last night she was over for pizza, and the first time Matthew mentioned going to Hogwarts, she ghave the speech again. I told her that I see NO reason to try and force the kids to stop beleiving , that in fact if someone is determined to keep beleiving in something you CANNOT make them stop. I said that many people think any religion is as unbeleivable as fairies and wizards but we ( she and I) both teach our kids our religions. Lastly I said I know people who beleive in magic and yet have degrees, jobs, and take care of their homes and families- as long as my kids grow up to be reasonably responsible, happy adults I don';t care what they believe. So next time Matthew mentions Hogwarts she sakes her head sadly. I let it pass - man I do not want to lose a good freind over this but if she keeps it up, I will have it out with her.
Posted by T_Smith (Member # 3734) on :
Well, we all know Unicorns are just a tool of Satan. ::to stage left:: Isn't that right, Jack? Sure, it starts out innocent with unicorns and wizards, but then it turns to D&D and we all know where that leads to. Cheetos and Mountain Dew, thats what! I totally agree with your neighbor. Save your childrens souls now and crush their imaginations under the soles of your feet right in front of their eyes.
Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
Some people get so sad and bitter when their faeries fade.
Posted by Phanto (Member # 5897) on :
She does it either because she truly cares about your children and thinks her course of action is the best, or for some other reason.
Posted by Damien (Member # 5611) on :
Cheetos and Mnt Dew... you're my hero for today. >_> *goes to liquor store for snacks*
Posted by jexx (Member # 3450) on :
I agree with kat. Further, I think that your neighbor's a wee bit jealous of your children's delight in whimsy.
I come up against this sometimes with my six-year-old and his friends. This year someone (someone MEAN) told him that Santa Claus wasn't real. Luckily, my son is very smart. I asked him what HE thought. Turns out, Santa Claus IS real. He also worked out that if Santa Claus wasn't real, it was okay, because the Spirit of Christmas does exist, in people's hearts.
I hope that your friend finds her sense of whimsy soon.
Posted by Synesthesia (Member # 4774) on :
*still believes in faeries* *points to faery ring*
Gets annoying trying to explain that to the few people who come over here, so I don't.
Posted by T_Smith (Member # 3734) on :
Pixies stole my shoes and my homework when I was a kid. And bloody mary hid my clothes.
Also, Jexx, that is amazingly cute.
[ June 14, 2004, 04:57 PM: Message edited by: T_Smith ]
Posted by romanylass (Member # 6306) on :
Jexx, that is very cool. Good for him. ( For some reason, the mythos my hubby chose to emply was that of the Christmas Goblin ).
Hmm, maybe she is just bitter. She has not actually given me a reason she thinks this is bad for my kids.
Posted by Farmgirl (Member # 5567) on :
Bright kids often have very vivid imaginations. I love hearing all my kids explain the things they imagine.
It is kind of sad now that they are teenagers and are losing some of that. I wish we could all keep our imaginations going like that through adulthood.
Tell her real life will creep in on it's own soon enough -- and there isn't a lot in real life to entertain them.
[glad I don't have neighbors]
Farmgirl
Posted by Olivetta (Member # 6456) on :
Ron keeps telling the kids about Jesus Claus and the Tooth Beaver. We are SO screwwed when this starts leaking out.
Posted by Chris Bridges (Member # 1138) on :
I like Ron more every day...
Posted by mackillian (Member # 586) on :
Posted by Chris Bridges (Member # 1138) on :
Tell your neighbor that you want your kids to believe in intangible things. Things like honor, and sacrifice, and dignity, and respect, and joy.
If your kids believe that Harry Potter is real, then they know that sacrifice and honor and selfless friendship have a real place in the world. If they believe in Santa Claus they know that happiness comes from giving to others without expecting anything back (well, maybe acookie or two...).
Posted by pooka (Member # 5003) on :
I can sympathize with your neighbor, but it's still none of her business how you raise your kids.
Posted by karen.elizabeth (Member # 6345) on :
quote:Ron keeps telling the kids about Jesus Claus and the Tooth Beaver. We are SO screwwed when this starts leaking out.
Thanks to my mother's boyfriend, my younger sister was absolutely certain that the Easter Bunny was actually Santa Claus trying to earn enough money to build all his toys (and pay the elves) in the off season.
Posted by mackillian (Member # 586) on :
On a car trip to memphis, I got my sister to believe that there were trolls underneath every single bridge and if she didn't lift her feet, they'd eat her.
She was eight at the time. And this was a four hour trip.
Sadly, my aunt ruined the whole deal by telling my sister this wasn't true.
Posted by Olivetta (Member # 6456) on :
Sounds like somehing Ron would say.
What was really funny was when we visited my folks, and Robert lost his first tooth. Liam went around jabbering about the "Fairy Beaver" or the Beaver Fairy. Eyebrows were raised. Posted by Lupus (Member # 6516) on :
how old are your kids now? If they are still young, I think your neighbor is rather silly...as young kids are told to believe in Santa and the Easter Bunny...not to mention the tooth fairy and such. I don't see how Harry Potter and such is any stranger than that. Of course as a kid gets older it could cause problems...mostly in that they will be mocked at school. Heck, I remember kids who believed in Santa for "to longer" were made fun of.
Regardless, they are your kids and it seems to be that it is not your neighbor's place to bother you about this sort of thing.
[ June 14, 2004, 05:44 PM: Message edited by: Lupus ]
Posted by pooka (Member # 5003) on :
My 7 year old still really likes Barney. And I don't mean the protagonist of Half Life.
Posted by Dagonee (Member # 5818) on :
I'm pretty sure it's because she was expelled and had her wand broken.
Posted by littlemissattitude (Member # 4514) on :
Maybe I'm just in a cranky mood today, but if that person was my neighbor, I think I'd just give her my condolences for not having any imagination at all and tell her that I encourage my children to excercise their imaginations so that they don't lose theirs.
Is that way, way too mean?
Posted by porcelain girl (Member # 1080) on :
i agree with the sentiment that real lifes creeps in on its own. i think most people have problems with imaginings that defy the traditional social norms.
i would think its okay save for things that cause discomfort to the point of inconvenient behavior.
you'd be surprised which imaginitive beliefs can cause discomfort i was a child that was simultaneously intrigued and terrified of faeries, sleeping with my shoes pointed in towards the bed and with my clothes turned inside out to repel mischief. i use the term "child" loosely....
and yes, i know my tag is showing. it's supposed to.
Posted by pooka (Member # 5003) on :
I think the nasty comeback approach is going to be counterproductive. What have your children said about it? Is her attitude affecting them?
Posted by Alucard... (Member # 4924) on :
I say invite her over for a round table session of D&D. Just make sure you serve the Cheetos and Mt. Dew in spades...
Posted by porcelain girl (Member # 1080) on :
go sing carols at her door around dusk. in mauve cloaks.
Posted by jexx (Member # 3450) on :
Thank you, Nathan and romanylass, I think my kid is pretty cool, too.
I want to say something smart and thoughtful about the use of mythos in society to produce good and able citizens, but I have lost my will to elaborate.
Sinuses.
Bleah.
But you all know what I mean, because from the posts I am reading, I am getting that gist. I'm totally insightful that way. *grin*
Olivia, I would love to have you and Ron and the kids over for a bbq. I think our families would mesh very well. We are wicked silly here, too.
And to all you faerie-lovers: don't forget to turn widdershins before getting into bed. Or is it: don't turn widdershins before getting into bed? Hmm...I may be doing it wrong, hence the spoiled milk in my fridge. Posted by Mabus (Member # 6320) on :
I had a friend in college who insisted she believed in fairies. I never knew whether to take her seriously or not.
As for me, I believed in Santa Claus till around third grade, I think...mostly due to a staged event where whoever left the presents kicked the coverboard off my grandparents' old fireplace, scattered ashes around, and left a broom as a present.
Posted by gnixing (Member # 768) on :
i still believe in Santa Claus... but maybe that's because every year at Christmas-time, i see my dad drop off presents to various people and take pictures every once in a while at a couple of the local malls. and then, there's that red suit and the white beard and the seemingly empty black bag that almost always has something special in it.
plus, i always knew it was him and my mom that got me presents every year (because i found them lying around a few times)
Posted by Kayla (Member # 2403) on :
We ran into a friend at the grocery store whose LDS neighbor is moving out and felt the need to tell him that he hated him and his roommates. Apparently, 3 single people living together, along with another neighbor who is in a similar situation have "ruined the whole neighborhood."
Now, these three people that live together all work together at the local residential mentally disabled thingy, place. They are nice as could be and the most obnoxious they get is to have 6 people over on Thursday nights to play poker. They don't even drink!
But the three singles living together, who knows what they are doing in there?
Neighbors are weird. Well, people in general are weird. You just have to smile and roll your eyes when they aren't looking. Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
I don't think it is fair at all that everybody seems to be equating the desire for kids to know what is real and what is not with a lack of imagination. It also doesn't make sense to equate a love of fantasy, D&D, etc. with a good imagination. I have known people into fantasy, D&D, etc. who had almost no imagination.
I personally am into fantasy, sci-fi, D&D, etc., and I don't teach falsehoods to my kids as though it were truth. I am always telling fantastic stories to my son, and he always asks me if it's real or pretend. I tell him the truth.
I don't understand the neighbor's strong feelings about a neighbor's kids, but what's wrong with telling children the truth?
Posted by Chris Bridges (Member # 1138) on :
I don't think the problem is that the neighbor advised her to tell her kids the truth. I think the problem is that the neighbor continued to press the issue even after it was made clear that the advice was unwanted.
Posted by Misha McBride (Member # 6578) on :
quote: Well, we all know Unicorns are just a tool of Satan. ::to stage left:: Isn't that right, Jack? Sure, it starts out innocent with unicorns and wizards, but then it turns to D&D and we all know where that leads to.
I actually had a friend when I was 8 who told me that unicorns were against God, and her mother wouldn't allow her to own anything having to do with unicorns. When I went to spend the night I wasn't allowed to bring my stuffed unicorn there either.
At the time I thought her mother was very silly for thinking that harm could come to her daughter from me bringing a plush unicorn.
Posted by pooka (Member # 5003) on :
My mother in law thought they had something to do with homosexuals. But it is highly likely she was getting it mixed up with rainbows. I bought my daughter a plush unicorn, though.
I didn't think the flying scenes in "Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon" were farfetched, but apparently a lot of people do.
Posted by Mabus (Member # 6320) on :
Misha, I once innocently brought the Ultimate Powers Book (a character generation system for the old Marvel Supers RPG) on a visit to my dad's.
The moment he got a look at it he went into a tirade about how role-playing games were evil and satanic. If it'd been mine instead of borrowed, I think he'd have burned it.
Posted by Taalcon (Member # 839) on :
quote: I said that many people think any religion is as unbeleivable as fairies and wizards but we ( she and I) both teach our kids our religions.
So what's stopping them from, when realizing you've let them believe that Hogwarts is real when it's not, from figuring all your religious stories must be lies as well? Or is your religion a 'tradition' more than a 'belief'?
For me, I see these kind of circumstances as an establishment of trust between parents and kids.
If you give an ambiguous answer when then ask if something fantasy is real -- that's one thing. But if you flat out lie and say "Yes, Hogwarts is real, and we're waiting for the letter to come too.", then I think that CAN and WILL be damaging toward a parent-child trust relationship - ESPECIALLY when it comes to religion and faith.
Just so you know, when people condemn the Harry Potter books for children not being able to establish fantasy from reality, you're the kind of parent that helps give them creedence. You have no right to complain about those who make such accusations.
But if you're fine with all that, then by all means - go right ahead. It is your life. I'm just saying that I can understand the neighbor's point of view. Some people just don't like to see people lying to their kids. That doesn't mean she can't still be a whacko
[ June 14, 2004, 08:21 PM: Message edited by: Taalcon ]
Posted by Chris Bridges (Member # 1138) on :
But she hasn't said that she gives anything but ambiguous answers. At this point you don't know what kind of parent she is, other than that she doesn't go out of her way to correct her kids' beliefs.
Posted by Taalcon (Member # 839) on :
That's true. Which I stated as such above.
Posted by romanylass (Member # 6306) on :
My kids are 7, 5 and 2.
OK, I have to clear up one thing- I am not telling my kids these things are real, in fact I have told Matthew at one point that Harry Potter is fiction, but he DOES NOT wish to believe me. Likewise with fairies. If you tell Olivia, point blank, that fairies are not real, she will tell you you're wrong. I gain nothing from pressing the issue, except my kids burying their ideas and beliefs and feeling crappy.
Hmmm, an evening of D&D would be fun, but Cheetos and Mtn Dew- those are the work of Satan.
Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
I think kids figure out soon enough what is verifiable and what isn't.
And of course y'all think Hogwarts isn't real. You're supposed to.
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
Thanks for the clarification, romanylass. I can see better now why you might be annoyed with your neighbor.
Posted by unicornwhisperer (Member # 294) on :
Unicorns are not evil. They're exactly the opposite... excuse me while I get my one year old away from watching Barney (he doesn't know any better)
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Some people get so sad and bitter when their faeries fade.
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