Has anyone tried either Coke's C2 or Pepsi Edge? I recently bought a bottle of C2 from a vending machine. All I can say is yuuuuck! Coke simply removed half the sugar or high fructose corn syrup and replaced it with aspartame.
You can get the same thing by mixing half regular Coke and half diet coke in your glass.
Where will this low carb insanity end? Posted by mackillian (Member # 586) on :
Actually, I like it. Tastes better than diet, though still has a pretty good amount of calories.
So there. Posted by Derrell (Member # 6062) on :
I thought aspartame was bad for one's health. Maybe it would've tasted better if it hadn't gotten warm. I was sitting at a bus stop while I drank it. I'll have to give it another try. Mack, which do you like, the Coke or the Pepsi?
Posted by maui babe (Member # 1894) on :
I agree. I bought a bottle of C2 from a vending machine out of curiosity and I thought it was nasty - even cold, but it did get worse as it warmed up.
Posted by King of Men (Member # 6684) on :
Hehe, I thought the low-carb wine that I saw advertised the other day was even better. Clearly, wine is 99 - x percent water, where x is the alcohol content. What can it matter what is in the final one percent? If this is actually a serious contribution to your carbohydrate intake, you have a serious problem.
Posted by Toes (Member # 4603) on :
I can't wait until the whole low-carb fad goes away. Not only because I love pasta, bread, etc, but because it's pretty ridiculous. Food pyramid people! Food pyramid! Balance your diet and you'll be just peachy. Posted by mackillian (Member # 586) on :
SOME people have low carb diets for legitimate reasons. Despite my love of carbs (mmmm...pasta) I can't consume much of them at one time (pasta is the really bad one for some reason).
I tried to C2 and really, it wasn't bad. A nice change from straight diet, but I certainly won't switch. Still too many calories and sugar.
But hey. At least it isn't Pepsi Clear Posted by pooka (Member # 5003) on :
I'm not saying the food pyramid is bad, just that there are a lot of foods that say "This is part of the foundation of grains, breads, and other carbs" when if you really ate a foundation of, say, Cap'n Crunch you may wind up peachy- as in spherical.
I do think low carb versions of processed foods are silly.
Wine is made from grape juice, so whatever hasn't been turned to alcohol is still pretty sugary.
Posted by Teshi (Member # 5024) on :
I've always heard aspartame is worse for you than sugar, or at least as bad. Is this true? I always steer clear of super sugar-intensive drinks anyhow, but I'd kind of like to know.
...Or perhaps I'll do my own research...
EDIT:
quote: SOME people have low carb diets for legitimate reasons.
I have a friend who's been low-carb for years, because diabetes runs heavily in her family. That's one reason...
[ July 15, 2004, 10:30 PM: Message edited by: Teshi ]
Posted by drumsntolkein (Member # 6095) on :
Actually, considering that I'm diabetic AND I have Celiac Disease (an allergy to wheat, rye, and barley), this low carb fad is really great! People don't give me weird looks when I ask for no bun, or stuff like that...
edit:
You can't get diabetes from eating carbs, however...it just kind of happens. I have no history of diabetes in my family, but I got it when I was three. Major bummer.
[ July 15, 2004, 10:33 PM: Message edited by: drumsntolkein ]
Posted by mackillian (Member # 586) on :
Want to read my research proposal about the effects of phenylalanine (half of what aspartame is) on sertonin regulation in the intestines?
It's a interesting theory. Aspartame is broken down into aspartate and phenylalanine, both of which are taken into the bloodstream through normal dietary pathways (through the intestines). 95% of the body's serotonin receptors are actually in the intestines. Serotonin is largely responsible for bowel regulation and pain regulation. Low serotonin levels can can lead to irritable bowels (constipation, diarrhea) and/or abdominal pain (often called "abdominal migraine"). Now, the neurochemical precursor to sertonin is tryptophan. Phenylalanine competes with tryptophan uptake pathways...so the question is, is there a connection between intake of phenylalanine through aspartame consumption and the development of abdominal migraine?
I've done a lit review and have come up with some interesting results if anyone wants to read.
But yeah, aspartame isn't good for you. But, in the end, everything isn't good for you in large amounts. All about the moderation . So if the sugar is bad for you in regular soda, the aspartame is bad for you in diet soda, and you want caffeine...the choice is yours.
Posted by mackillian (Member # 586) on :
Well, I'm a reactive hypoglycemic. It means that when my body gets a substantial influx of simple carbs, it freaks out and produces way more insulin than it needs, the insulin drives out all the sugars, and then the insulin is left wandering around the bloodstream. Since the balance is off in the bloodstream and it's got too much insulin, my body is tricked into thinking it's got low blood sugar. Apparently this is some sort of precursor to diabetes if not kept in check--probably because constant exposure to too much insulin could trigger resistance. I think.
Posted by Da_Goat (Member # 5529) on :
I've had C2. I thought it tasted like diet and regular Coke mixed together, so it's better than diet but not as good as regular. I only had it once, though, and I doubt I'll have it again. Aspartame gives me a headache.
Posted by T_Smith (Member # 3734) on :
Ok I tried both, and yeah, the Coke one was noticably different at first, however, the more I drank, the better it got. The Pepsi one, though, I happened to REALLY like from the get go.
Coke: the original is better. Pepsi: the new one is alright in my book.
Posted by Rockmuffin (Member # 6683) on :
I don't know what... well rather I don't remember what soda tastes like. I haven't had it in like eight years... so I really can't agree or disagree. However, I just want to know... why do people like soda? Is it the bubbles?
Posted by blacwolve (Member # 2972) on :
Today's Fox Trot illustrates how I feel about low carb diets very nicely.
Posted by TMedina (Member # 6649) on :
Part of the problem, as I understand it, if you consume too many carbs without burning the energy, you put on weight.
And being overweight has been linked as a contributing factor to adult onset diabetes.
However, if you actually hit a stable "carb intake versus energy burned output", eat all the pasta, starch and whatnot you like.
For most of us, it's easier to diet than to exercise. At least, that's what we keep telling ourselves.
-Trevor
Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
If you consume more calories than you burn -- be they in the form of proteins, fats, carbohydrates, or any combination -- you will put on weight. Use more than you consume, and you lose weight. Carbs are not special or unique in this process.
It really is that simple, a billion-dollar diet industry aside.
Posted by ak (Member # 90) on :
Well, it's not quite so simple. Americans are in the middle of an epidemic of obesity and diabetes. Some scientists think this is the fault of the classic food pyramid, which emphasized carbs. There has been a sea-change in the thinking of nutritional experts over the last 10 years, I think it's fair to say.
As a diabetic I am delighted at the new low carb fad. I hope it lasts. I have had such a hard time finding food I can eat for so long, and now it's suddenly everywhere. New products, new menu selections in restaurants and everything. It's wonderful! Posted by TMedina (Member # 6649) on :
However, carbs are more likely to be stored as fat whereas protein isn't.
-Trevor
Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
Unused protein gets transformed to glucose, same as anything else. The whole "carbs become fat! EVILEVILEVIL!" thing is part of the Atkins mythology. I challenge you to find a source that is NOT a low-carb-diet site that supports it.
From some neutral (government-sponsored, making no money off ANY diets) sites: Link Link
quote: Well, it's not quite so simple. Americans are in the middle of an epidemic of obesity and diabetes. Some scientists think this is the fault of the classic food pyramid, which emphasized carbs.
quote: There has been a sea-change in the thinking of nutritional experts over the last 10 years, I think it's fair to say.
Not according to any of the nutritionists I have discussed this with. Or my doctor. Or my kids' pediatricians. Or . . . etc. Have some experts changed their minds? Certainly. Is it the majority? I'd say that it's pretty clearly not even close.
And again, many of those who have gone over to that way of thinking are making money off it, or trying to do so.
[ July 18, 2004, 02:42 PM: Message edited by: rivka ]
Posted by pH (Member # 1350) on :
I actually like the lower-carb Pepsi...I thought it was pretty tasty. DOES it have aspartame in it? I didn't look at the label; I kind of just wanted to try it.
I've had to switch to a low-carb diet for legitimate reasons, as well, so I'm actually kind of happy about this whole low-carb food thing, since it makes things much easier for me.
What about things that are sweetened with Splenda? Is Splenda bad for you?
-pH
Posted by TMedina (Member # 6649) on :
Sorry - government studies are still out on the "all protein" craze as it's just that new.
Early indications suggest high protein does help weight loss, although such a diet can lead to it's own complications.
-Trevor
Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
High-protein diets have been pushed (off and on) since the 1970s.
Posted by TMedina (Member # 6649) on :
Splenda is in the new and no confirmed studies one way or the other category.
I don't trust anything that's so completely man-made and weighs absolutely nothing.
Call it a quirk.
-Trevor
Posted by TMedina (Member # 6649) on :
Sigh.
You're going to make me look, aren't you Riv?
-Trevor
Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
I have looked. I don't think you'll find any -- all the government studies/sites I've seen seem anti-high-protein. *shrug* But there may be some that aren't.
Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
There is some anecdotal evidence that it may cause stomach upsets, among other things.
Then there are those who are sure Splenda = DOOM! I'm skeptical. (CT says I should be! )
And it's hardly a totally synthetic substance -- it's plain old sucrose that has been chemically modified to substitute a chlorine atom for some of the hydroxyl (OH-) groups in a normal sugar molecule. That keeps the enzymes that digest sugars from grabbing the sucralose molecules, so they can't digest them.
*shrug* There is some evidence that non-nutritive sweeteners trigger you to eat more, because your body's reaction to the sweet taste is to increase digestive enzymes, making you feel hungrier. IMO, this does seem to occur. So I keep them around for guests (blue, pink, AND yellow ) but mostly avoid them myself.
Posted by beverly (Member # 6246) on :
Rivka, those were some interesting sites you gave links to. I myself have felt that this low-carb fad is not necessarily healthy for the average healthy individual. (I understand that those with diabetes, hypoglycemia, or other conditions may benefit.) I believe that sensible eating of nutritious, not overly-processed foods in sensible amounts combined with exercise is the best road to a healthy body and figure.
But I am curious. One of the sites says: "May result in a condition called ketosis where fat instead of carbohydrate is used for energy. This is a dangerous condition. ."
I have heard whispers of this before, but never heard it explained. Can someone provide more information on this subject? (I am also doing internet research, but I don't know what I will find.)
Posted by TMedina (Member # 6649) on :
It's a fascinating idea - that the human body can adapt to its environment so relatively quickly.
-Trevor
Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
Ketosis occurs sometimes in healthy individuals. The main problem is, as I understand it, when it goes from an occasional thing to a (semi-)permanent state. Keep in mind that ketosis means your body thinks it is STARVING, and goes into "safe-mode."
Ah! So burning fats leads to ketones in the blood having too many ketones in the blood is a bad thing. I see. So perhaps drinking lots of water might help eliminate them? And probably some people have health conditions that make it very difficult to eliminate them regardless. Interesting.
I do remember hearing that ketosis was bad during pregnancy, that ketones are toxic to the fetus, and thus burning too much fat during pregnancy is bad for the baby.
And so too many ketones in the blood means your blood is too acidic. So now I am wondering what are some known dangers of having highly acidic blood?
[ July 18, 2004, 04:22 PM: Message edited by: beverly ]
Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
Major changes in blood pH can be fatal. Short-term, high blood acidity can make you breathe harder and less efficiently. Also makes the liver and kidneys work harder.
Yes, increased water intake helps -- quite a bit, actually. But some of the major dangers of ketosis are not so much the acidity (which is bad enough, long-term). Rather, the fact that it generally indicates that the body is in starvation-mode, and will get calories from wherever it can -- cannibalizing its own organs, if necessary -- causes more problems. There is some indication that long-term ketosis can cause permanent metabolic changes.
Posted by blacwolve (Member # 2972) on :
Wow, thanks Rivka! That is very informative and helpful.
Blacwolve
Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
Today Hatrack seems to have decided that it is time for me to start prepping for teaching my classes.
Who am I to argue? Posted by mackillian (Member # 586) on :
With hypoglycemic folks, we can also end up eating too much because of the insulin surge. Our body is lead to believe by the excess of insulin that we're hungry--so we eat again in order to quell the famished-type hunger depsite having eaten an hour before.
Sooo...for us to eat low-carb, we reduce the number of times we get hungry.
Posted by ak (Member # 90) on :
rivka, low carb doesn't necessarily mean high protein. The straw man you are taking down seems to be the extremely high protein diets. What my endocrinologist and many others who are not trying to make money on this but are trying to cure people of the twin diseases of obesity and diabetes in order to alleviate suffering and improve the quality of people's lives (I really don't like your characterization of my dear brilliant friend Dr. Joey as a greedy opportunist) recommend is a measured amount of carb, protein, and fat that is much lower carb than the old-fashioned food pyramid. The Zone diet is one such balanced diet.
The diet I eat is lower in carb, even, than that, because of my body's bad reaction to carbs.
It is not true that low carb equals high protein.
Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
There are three choices: fat, carbohydrate, and protein -- neh? (Ignoring for a moment the more important distinction between types of each.) So looking at someone's diet proportionately, if the percentage of carbs is lower, then that of fat or protein must be higher. Most of the diets that encourage ketosis push high-protein to prevent organ-cannibalism.
Now, I heartily agree that most people eat too many calories overall; that too many are over-processed; that an excess of simple carbohydrates is bad for a number of reasons.
And I was actually not characterizing anyone as a "greedy opportunist." But MANY of those (if not the vast majority) who push specific diets are making money off of them. Any there is no way that does not cause bias. Does it turn them into "greedy opportunists" -- unlikely in most cases (those that are were almost certainly so before they latched on to a diet to promote). Does it make their pronouncements more suspect? Of course.
Does that mean that everyone who is promoting low-carb diets is some kind of huckster? No at all! People can hold those beliefs for the best of intentions. I simply am skeptical of ANYONE who makes claims they are making money from.
I am even MORE skeptical of anyone who is convinced that the "best" diet for diabetics, hypoglycemics, and those with neither of those conditions is the same.
I am glad that low-carb works for you, ak, and for mack. Given your medical histories, and the fact that your particular diets were recommended by doctors familiar with your histories, I would certainly not debate the efficacy of your plans/choices for you.
But to claim that low-carb diets are effective or healthy for the average person simply is not supported by the unbiased (well, as close as I've seen to unbiased) research I have seen. And I have read a lot of research on the topic -- and likely will read much more.
[ July 18, 2004, 07:55 PM: Message edited by: rivka ]
Posted by Ryuko (Member # 5125) on :
(hugs mack) My mom's like that. (sigh) I don't think I am, but she seems to think so. Maybe in the future I will be... :/
Posted by King of Men (Member # 6684) on :
We will know that the craze has reached its logical endpoint when some idiot offers low-carb potatoes for sale, courtesy of the closest genetics lab.
Posted by Ryuko (Member # 5125) on :
Oh, I agree rivka. I was on the low-carb diet for a while, and it made me very sick. But I guess I wasn't following it very well. Too much meat. I like meat, what?
Posted by Lupus (Member # 6516) on :
nothing like seeing someone order a giant cup of diet coke. If you were really that interested in dieting...wouldn't you get a smaller cup?
Low carb beers are funny as well. If you want to cut out the fat...drinking beer is not a good idea...even if it is 'low carb'
Posted by Theca (Member # 1629) on :
quote:nothing like seeing someone order a giant cup of diet coke. If you were really that interested in dieting...wouldn't you get a smaller cup?
Huh? Why assume diet coke drinkers are dieting? Why should diet coke drinkers get smaller cups? Posted by mackillian (Member # 586) on :
Why would you get a smaller cup of a drink that has zero calories?
Posted by Mr.Gumby (Member # 6303) on :
If you drink low-carb beer I don't think low-carb is the biggest problem in your life.
(for those who didn't catch it, I'm suggesting that beer is a more serious problem than low-carb)
[ July 18, 2004, 10:29 PM: Message edited by: Mr.Gumby ]
Posted by TMedina (Member # 6649) on :
Because it's a scary thought that people might drink Diet Coke for the taste.
And yes - while I haven't had a "low carb" beer...ugh.
-Trevor
Posted by mackillian (Member # 586) on :
It grows on you.
Like mold.
Posted by Ron Lambert (Member # 2872) on :
They should sweeten all diet sodas with sucralose (marketed under the name Splenda). It is just as low calorie, tastes much better than Aspartame/Nutrasweet, and unlike Aspartame/Nutrasweet, you can cook with it--heat does not make it break down. Sucralose is now being used as the sweetener in diet sodas sold under the brand name "Clover Valley," available in Dollar General stores.
Posted by PSI Teleport (Member # 5545) on :
quote: I agree. I bought a bottle of C2 from a vending machine out of curiosity and I thought it was nasty - even cold, but it did get worse as it warmed up.
Some of us knew it would be nasty and didn't even bother.
quote: Well, I'm a reactive hypoglycemic.
Hey, me too. Eat a cookie, and feel like you haven't eaten all day. Eat more cookies, repeat. Begin to shake violently.
quote: Huh? Why assume diet coke drinkers are dieting? Why should diet coke drinkers get smaller cups?
No, I understand. There are alot of people who don't drink Coke because they're afraid they'll get fat, or because it's bad for them, so they drink tons of Diet Coke instead. How about some water?
Posted by TMedina (Member # 6649) on :
And while I adore Coke, I have to admit it has massive amounts of sugar which I do without now.
I still have one from time to time, but I no longer buy the six and twelve packs to store in my fridge.
I tend to rank the diet drinks in the same category, although they tend not to be as sweet - I just never feel like my thirst has been sated as it usually does with water.
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Has anyone tried either Coke's C2 or Pepsi Edge? I recently bought a bottle of C2 from a vending machine. All I can say is yuuuuck! Coke simply removed half the sugar or high fructose corn syrup and replaced it with aspartame.![[Dont Know]](graemlins/dontknow.gif)
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Blacwolve
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