Hatrack River Forum: Why is Jeb! touring Indonesia?

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Posted by Storm Saxon (Member # 3101) on :

I'm pretty sure I know the answer why, but just to check, is anyone else's governer personally inspecting the tsunami destruction?

Posted by vwiggin (Member # 926) on :

Arnold would be right there with him, if not for that pesky Constitution thing.

Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :

Colin Powell was in Sri Lanka. A friend of mine in the air force was responsible for organizing the helicopters for his tour. Does that count?

Posted by newfoundlogic (Member # 3907) on :

Is anybody elses governor the veteran of four major hurricane strikes in one season? Granted the death toll doesn't compare, but Jeb is obviously far more qualified than anyone else in the entire country. Everyone is obviously jumping to presidential grooming and an extension of the Bush "monarchy," but whatever is done now will be forgotten in four years and Jeb has repeatedly stated he isn't running in '08. I could see him running later than that, but this trip won't affect his presidential prospects.

[ January 11, 2005, 09:30 PM: Message edited by: newfoundlogic ]

Posted by Dan_raven (Member # 3383) on :

He is there because he is absolutely, positively, promised and guaranteed not to be running for President to continue the Bush dynasty, in 2008.

No honest, he's not.

Nope.

no chance.

Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :

I don't believe for a moment that Jeb! had anything to do with actual delivery or coordination of aid in Florida following the Hurricanes. Anymore than GWB had to do with coordinating responses to 9/11.

The people who should've been sent to South Asia to assess the situation are the folks who actually planned and later conducted the disaster relief there.

This is just a show, not anything that will help the people there.

Posted by Teshi (Member # 5024) on :

What's with the exclamation mark?

Posted by Storm Saxon (Member # 3101) on :

quote:

Granted the death toll doesn't compare, but Jeb is obviously far more qualified than anyone else in the entire country

So, in order to give his 'expert' opinion, he had to tour the country and give a press conference? *snort* I doubt anyone is asking Jeb what should be done, but you go ahead and prove me wrong.

More to the point, what the froglok does the tsunami have to do with being governer of Florida?

But, hey, I'm just some schmuck. Maybe, despite the vast resources of the federal government and the U.N. and the Red Cross, etc, who, let's not forget, basically do this kind of thing all the time in many countries; maybe, despite all these resources being available, ol' Jeb's personal opinion was needed such that he had to personally tour the tsunami sites. Could be.

We need to get some kind of (very cheap) bet going about this, NFL. [Smile]

Posted by newfoundlogic (Member # 3907) on :

Bob, I would be very suprised if the people who performed the nitty gritty work aren't there as well, but they obviously aren't going to be headlining the efforts. Since you're judgement on Jeb Bush is most likely based on what you've seen of his brother, I have to tell you that Jeb is definitely very intelligent and very capable. I say this not because I'm a Republican, but also because of what I've been told about him by those who have met him in person and are Democrats.

Directed at Bob, not Storm.

[ January 11, 2005, 09:48 PM: Message edited by: newfoundlogic ]

Posted by Storm Saxon (Member # 3101) on :

I live in Florida, NFL.

I'm not saying Jeb Bush isn't intelligent, but why would he know more about disaster relief halfway around the world than the more obviously qualified candidates?

Posted by newfoundlogic (Member # 3907) on :

Is there or is there not another executive or former executive with as much experience as Jeb Bush in dealing with natural disasters of this nature? If the answer is no, then you should understand why he along with the chief diplomat was charged with the mission of going to the affected areas.

I'd definitely be willing to bet money that Jeb will not run in 2008 for President. He may run for President in 2012 or later, he may run for Senate in '06 even though he's claimed he doesn't intend to, but at the very least two in a row and three out of four does begin to look very uncomfortably like a monarchy.

Posted by Teshi (Member # 5024) on :

I agree with newfoundlogic. It does start to look a bit like a ruling family.

On the upside, I'm sure political scientist would come up with some name, like a "familial non-parallel oligarchy" or something

Posted by vwiggin (Member # 926) on :

"But, hey, I'm just some schmuck."

Yeah, but you're our schmuck and we like ya. [Smile]

Posted by newfoundlogic (Member # 3907) on :

Well actually I expect some of the more extreme conservatives I know would be just as happy to yell, "Hail King Bush II.5!"

Posted by Teshi (Member # 5024) on :

Ha, what a let down to be merely 2.5!

Posted by Storm Saxon (Member # 3101) on :

quote:

Is there or is there not another executive or former executive with as much experience as Jeb Bush in dealing with natural disasters of this nature? If the answer is no, then you should understand why he along with the chief diplomat was charged with the mission of going to the affected areas.

NFL, weathering four hurricanes inside the U.S. and navigating *that* bureaucracy to get and give aid is, I would guess, very different than doing the same thing in several different countries half the world away. Different people. Different government. As I mentioned before, there are several international organizations who do this ALL the time that it just doesn't make sense that Jeb Bush would need to be brought in *personally* to handle things. I mean, come on, think about it. He has to personally be there to give his 'expertise'? Can you not admit that this sounds a bit ridiculous.

If Jeb has any 'expertise', it would be knowing who the people and organizations are that might handle relief efforts and rebuilding. That's all. And to give that information, he can just send an email to the appropriate people.

quote:

I'd definitely be willing to bet money that Jeb will not run in 2008 for President. He may run for President in 2012 or later, he may run for Senate in '06 even though he's claimed he doesn't intend to, but at the very least two in a row and three out of four does begin to look very uncomfortably like a monarchy.

I'll bet you, say, twenty bucks to the charity of your choice that he does run for Pres in 2008. [Smile]

[ January 11, 2005, 10:03 PM: Message edited by: Storm Saxon ]

Posted by Dagonee (Member # 5818) on :

It's not about Jeb inspecting anything. It's about Jeb being the President's brother - his direct representative - as a way of showing condolences.

The press conference is necessary to fulfill that mission.

Dagonee

Posted by newfoundlogic (Member # 3907) on :

You've mostly been questioning not why the US is sending anyone as representative of the government, but why the representative is Jeb Bush. If you want to argue the former, than your points apply, but at the very someone needs to be sent to show good faith. If we accept that someone needs to go, than clearly the most qualified should go. You still haven't provided reasons why Jeb isn't as qualified as another member of the US government. Keep in mind that Powell is also going so there is a diplomat too.

I can handle $20. [Smile]

Of course, what I can't garuantee is that I'll remember in three years.

[ January 11, 2005, 10:11 PM: Message edited by: newfoundlogic ]

Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :

The thing about a "ruling family" is that you can sell it to the public fairly easily. It's like product branding.

You liked the first George Bush? You loved the new, improved second George Bush? Now try Jeb Bush: he's less filling, but still tastes great!

*laugh* In other words, the people who would vote for Jeb will still vote for him whether he runs in '08 or '12.

Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :

1) Jeb! is what the Bush campaign used in his re-election bid for governor of Florida. Like we should just be surprised. Jeb! What the F...??!!!

2) A senior executive in any government in the US that is responsible for disaster planning has resources to call in. The governor has to make decisions like when to call in the National Guard, when to declare a place a "disaster area," what to do about insurance companies that are not mobilizing quickly enough or are threatening bankruptcy rather than pay off claims, etc. The governor has a role in initiating efforts that are already well planned and from that point forward are directed by people with specific expertise in transportation, medical aid, supply distribution (logistics), law enforcement, and a variety of other specialties.

Jeb may be a VERY intelligent person. (I think FL got the best of the Bushes so far in terms of governing ability.) But he is not an expert in disaster assessment.

3) I sincerely hope he is there with a team of experts. If he puts a face on the American relief effort, I suppose that's fine. Who's it for? Do the Indonesians care that Jeb Bush has arrived on the scene? Maybe it's a nice gesture -- the president sending his younger brother. But, really, it plays to America.

4) I don't care, really as long as the American aid is delivered to those who need it and we don't see wholesale corruption of the assistance process.

Posted by Dagonee (Member # 5818) on :

quote:
But, really, it plays to America.

No, it also says a lot to send a personal family member of the head of state to represent the country in issuing condolences and demonstrating solidarity.

Dagonee

Posted by Storm Saxon (Member # 3101) on :

Send Neil then. [Wink]

Posted by Storm Saxon (Member # 3101) on :

No one cares about the 'dynasty' issue at this point. If Fearless Leader's points are in the tank come 2008, it might be an issue, but I doubt it.

I agree with Tom for the reasons that he gave.

As for what political monkey is more qualified than Jeb, I will concede that Jeb weathered more hurricanes than anyone else, but it still doesn't make sense that this somehow makes him some kind of international expert on disaster relief. Dagonee's rationale makes a lot more sense, frankly, than sending Jeb over there for some dubious expertise.

As to the bet, it's just a fun bet. We'll see in the coming years. I'm sure one of us will remind the other. [Smile]

Posted by newfoundlogic (Member # 3907) on :

Again, its not about international experience, because no one else is better in this country. You send the best you have, not the undersecretary for the Department of the Interior.

Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :

I think GWB should send Jeb? over to Iraq. After all, he's got the most experience of anyone in the US with running a flawed election process.

Posted by Storm Saxon (Member # 3101) on :

[ROFL]

I am so going to start using 'Jeb?'.

Posted by Trisha the Severe Hottie (Member # 6000) on :

Jeb in 08? Well that would explain why W has held on to Cheney [Razz]

Posted by Storm Saxon (Member # 3101) on :

What did you expect him to do with him?

Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :

"Again, its not about international experience, because no one else is better in this country."

I'd wager that this, too, is also incorrect. He is probably the one current sitting governor with the most experience in dealing with relatively minor flooding. Does that make him qualified to head up our relief efforts? And did he not rely on his own advisors at the time? Presumably they would be the actual experts.