Who else is in favour of removing "American" from "Books, Films, Food and American Culture"?
*raises hand*
[ February 01, 2005, 04:48 PM: Message edited by: Kama ]
Posted by Telperion the Silver (Member # 6074) on :
*slaps Kama's hand down*
hehehee... Posted by Kama (Member # 3022) on :
You brute!!!
Posted by vwiggin (Member # 926) on :
Wouldn't it be easier if one of us marries Kama and make her an American citizen?
OK, maybe this plan isn't easier, but it is certainly a lot more fun. Posted by CalvinMaker (Member # 2032) on :
I've already tried. She'll only do it if I buy her a big diamond engagement ring. Posted by Troubadour (Member # 83) on :
*raises hand*
Posted by Jonathan Howard (Member # 6934) on :
I'm in, Kama.
Posted by Jay (Member # 5786) on :
BOOOO!!!
Posted by Kama (Member # 3022) on :
Due to the rather large distance and expensive airfare, I will accept marriage proposals sent by letter, handwritten, on scented paper. Please enclose the printout of your bank account, photo, and a cover letter explaining why you would make the best candidate. Thank you.
[ February 01, 2005, 07:10 AM: Message edited by: Kama ]
Posted by Jonathan Howard (Member # 6934) on :
Kama, are you giving in?
Shame on you... You won't even keep your own identity, why instantly become a Yank? That statistically reduces your status!
Posted by Kama (Member # 3022) on :
Jon, you may not know this yet, but I have been on a quest for American babies for quite some time now.
[ February 01, 2005, 07:22 AM: Message edited by: Kama ]
Posted by Jonathan Howard (Member # 6934) on :
Then take that statement as criticism, and add an apology to it. I forgot to write "j/k".
Can't offer you much, I know very few American Americans.
Posted by Corwin (Member # 5705) on :
*raises hand*
I think we're way past being "American only" here...
Posted by Kama (Member # 3022) on :
I would support the change you suggest.
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
"I have been on a quest for American babies for quite some time now."
It's true. She has. We were quite worried for Sophie's safety.
Posted by Kama (Member # 3022) on :
Tom. American babies with my genes in them.
Posted by Kama (Member # 3022) on :
So, is everyone okay with it? Can I change the title to notify the Mrs.?
Posted by Corwin (Member # 5705) on :
Yes, I think you can. Oh, wait, you did it already!
Actually you'll probably get more answers later today, since the poor Americans just woke up!
And I thought you linked to something else... Posted by Kwea (Member # 2199) on :
Kama, while you ARE skinny, I don't think Sophie e would fit in your jeans....
Nice try, baby snatcher!
Kwea
Posted by SteveRogers (Member # 7130) on :
Kama, you shouldn't steal other people's children. That is such a naughty thing to do. Oh and on topic....removing American from this side of the forum's name is a good idea. I support it.....so
[ February 01, 2005, 08:41 AM: Message edited by: SteveRogers ]
Posted by Nato (Member # 1448) on :
quote:Actually you'll probably get more answers later today, since the poor Americans just woke up!
Oh dear! I fear that my sleep schedule is really out of whack now. I need to go to bed for a while.
Posted by Jay (Member # 5786) on :
Why? What is the point of this movement? In this day of so much anti-Americanism why should we participate? Sure we have some international posters but that doesn’t mean anything. American culture is supposed to be multi cultural. If we were talking about setting up a new board and what to name it I might be able to see the point. But on an already established board with the name American in the title I think it would be a slap to do. Especially to our troops, who I imagine a hatracker or two, are in Iraq. Let America stand!
Posted by Bokonon (Member # 480) on :
Kama: Until you are successful in your quest here, it's spelled "favor", dagnabbit.
-Bok
Posted by Hobbes (Member # 433) on :
Assuming Kristine reads this I think this would be an appropriate time to say that she's super-duper great.
Great I tell ya!
Hobbes Posted by Annie (Member # 295) on :
Isn't "American Culture" a bit oxymoronic already?
Posted by Hobbes (Member # 433) on :
No.
Hobbes Posted by Nato (Member # 1448) on :
No, Annie. I don't think it is. (What about Microsoft Works?)
I think American does have its own culture, and much of it is worthy of being called cultured.
Jay, I don't think this proposal has anything to do with anti-Americanism at all. It has nothing to do with the troops in Iraq.
When this board was created, it was probably assumed that nearly all of the posters would be American. As the board has developed, it has internationalized greatly. Wouldn't it be fitting to change the title to reflect that?
Posted by Corwin (Member # 5705) on :
Jay:
quote: Sure we have some international posters but that doesn’t mean anything.
Thanks...
Actually it does mean something, at least in my opinion. We talk about more than just American culture here. The point is: Kama's request isn't "anty-American", it's just a way to get the title back on par with what we're actually discussing in this forum.
quote: But on an already established board with the name American in the title I think it would be a slap to do.
Why? 'Cause it is named "American" it cannot change?! Look, probably Mr. Card didn't think this forum would get so popular and so international at first, hence its current name. But I'm sure that he's more than happy to have people from around the world come and post here.
quote: Especially to our troops, who I imagine a hatracker or two, are in Iraq.
This is NOT a forum solely about supporting American troops. Hmm... I'm really trying to see what you wanted to say with this, but I honestly can't. I've said it before, I'm a supporter of the Irak war and American troops and I wanted Bush to win. But this name change has nothing to do with any political sentiments whatsoever.
If I wanted to give a sensible argument against this name change I'd have worded it like this:
"While this forum has become more and more international in the last few years, the majority of its contents still relate to the American society/culture and therefore I suggest keeping the word "American" in the title."
There you go...
Posted by Farmgirl (Member # 5567) on :
I think this is a great idea, Kama!
I mean -- I see your point -- posters on here, even long-timers, are from all over the world -- Poland, France, Israel, Sri Lanka, Australia. We talk about the culture of all the countries in our threads. Why have limits?
I vote with Kama - let's remove the word "American" just because this forum really does represent so much more than that. I think it has grown beyond what the Card's originally even imagined....
Farmgirl
Posted by Annie (Member # 295) on :
I'm just here to be a brat.
Posted by Nato (Member # 1448) on :
Exactly, Corwin and Farmgirl. I think the Cards are pleased that the forum is doing so well. If I were them, I'd be glad to make the little gesture requred to recognize the more internationalized character of the board.
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
I wonder what the Cards really think about this place. This seems to be a really great place to come to if you want to hear somebody being really nasty towards OSC.
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
Actually, I'm all for the removal of "American," too. It's unnecessarily limiting.
Of course, you can make the argument that a title like "Books, Films, and Culture" isn't necessarily any more accurate. Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
"This seems to be a really great place to come to if you want to hear somebody being really nasty towards OSC."
Not really. That would be Slashdot.
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
Yes, really.
Posted by Brian_Berlin (Member # 6900) on :
I'm also in favor of the removoval of "American"
Posted by Zeugma (Member # 6636) on :
I also approve of the removal of the word "American" to help the title of this forum more accurately reflect the members and topics herein. Posted by Nato (Member # 1448) on :
There are a lot of places on the web where people are quite nasty toward OSC, or many other authors and public figures. Slashdot isn't much worse than the others, and on the whole, I think Hatrack is pretty civil (most of the time).
I guess come to think of it, "Books, Films, Food and Culture" isn't really all that much more accurate... But I don't know if adding "Politics" in there would help any more. We all know that's what comes up every other thread, but we don't identify ourselves as one of those forums. Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
I suppose the odds of more OSC-related conversation are considerably higher here. But in general, I think that conversation is far more likely to be positive here than on most other sites on the Internet. The exception may be P-Web, since it's a big fan site that you kind of have to work to find, and thus doesn't attract the random crazies.
[ February 01, 2005, 10:46 AM: Message edited by: TomDavidson ]
Posted by Storm Saxon (Member # 3101) on :
People have only been 'nasty' to OSC when he is to some other groups. Basically, the only time people are mean to poor, ol' OSC is when he deserves it, as far as I'm concerned.
And no one, that I know of, has been 'nasty' towards him in a while.
And he gets praise on the forum, too.
Posted by sarcasticmuppet (Member # 5035) on :
Lookit lookit! *points up*
Posted by Storm Saxon (Member # 3101) on :
What are we looking at?
Posted by Bob the Lawyer (Member # 3278) on :
The name has changed.
Posted by Zeugma (Member # 6636) on :
Edit: Thought better of it.
[ February 01, 2005, 11:00 AM: Message edited by: Zeugma ]
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
Yay, Kama!
Posted by Farmgirl (Member # 5567) on :
YAY!!! She did it! She took American off!
Now we are GLOBAL!
Farmgirl
Posted by Jay (Member # 5786) on :
Booooo
Should rename the board to “Liberal Mecca of OSC readers”
Posted by Farmgirl (Member # 5567) on :
quote: I guess come to think of it, "Books, Films, Food and Culture" isn't really all that much more accurate... But I don't know if adding "Politics" in there would help any more
Are politics not part of our culture, Nato?
Farmgirl
Posted by Farmgirl (Member # 5567) on :
Jay -- don't you see? This (name change) has nothing to do with Liberal/Conservative at all.
It has to do with how far-reaching OSC's works have become..... And how many people globally this site touches.
Farmgirl
Posted by ElJay (Member # 6358) on :
Neato. Posted by Nato (Member # 1448) on :
quote:Are politics not part of our culture, Nato?
Yeah. I was just being snarky toward Ornery.
Three cheers for the Kama cabal!
Why exactly do you have a problem with this, Jay? Do you really see this as anti-Americanism? I bet you that very few people on this board are anti-American in any degree at all, unless being globally-sensitive counts as anti-American.
Posted by Brian_Berlin (Member # 6900) on :
>>>Should rename the board to “Liberal Mecca of OSC readers”
*snicker*
Not all of us, mate. Posted by Dagonee (Member # 5818) on :
quote:Should rename the board to “Liberal Mecca of OSC readers”
How exactly is a cultural discussion not limited to one country a "liberal" thing?
Posted by Hobbes (Member # 433) on :
Kristine is great.
Hobbes Posted by Jay (Member # 5786) on :
I just saw it as unnecessary.
Posted by fugu13 (Member # 2859) on :
In a large and nebulous sense, many things are unnecessary Jay, such as your existence (or mine).
However, as this forum clearly grapples closely with issues of non-American culture (see the thread on the science fiction convention in Europe, for instance), being arbitrarily exclusionary in the forum topic seems a trifle silly.
Posted by Lady Jane (Member # 7249) on :
Awesome!!!
Kristine and the mods
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
It does seem silly to have the exclusionary "American" in the title, but I'm still a tad sad to see it gone now.
Posted by Nato (Member # 1448) on :
That "American" was here before I was. I remember this forum as the scary fast-moving one that I took a long time to get used to. I mostly hung out in the safer (for a 15-year-old) Discussions about OSC one.
Posted by Carrie (Member # 394) on :
It's the end of an era. Life here will never look the same.
[/melodrama]
Posted by Puppy (Member # 6721) on :
The original title did have a rhythm to it that the new one lacks But I think my mom rocks.
Jay, you're being silly. If the forum title had never included the word "American" you wouldn't have missed it. And note that this change wasn't initiated by some anti-American liberal. It was initiated by a European who wanted it to be clear that Europeans are just as welcome as Americans. Not a huge request, and doesn't hurt the forum one bit.
Posted by Lady Jane (Member # 7249) on :
I do feel like someone should put this on the grand Hatrack calendar.
Posted by Boris (Member # 6935) on :
I think we should just change it to "All the Jatraqueros arguing, making fun of each other, or just plain rambling"
Posted by Dagonee (Member # 5818) on :
quote:Ramble on, And now’s the time, the time is now To sing my song.
Posted by sarcasticmuppet (Member # 5035) on :
Maybe it should be Books, Films, Food, and Global Culture. With "American" in it, it had a nice cadence that we don't have to lose completely. Posted by Farmgirl (Member # 5567) on :
Hmm.. .which would sound better -- "World" or "Global"?
Actually, they are both just implied by not specifying any one culture. I like it just fine as it is now.
Farmgirl
Posted by IdemosthenesI (Member # 862) on :
I know this change really isn't all that important in the grand scheme of things, but that didn't keep a big goofy grin from making an appearance when I saw it.
And Jay! Be nice! Else we shall have to exchange fisticuffs! Posted by Lady Jane (Member # 7249) on :
Considering the amount of introspection we do, it should be "Hatrack culture."
Posted by Jay (Member # 5786) on :
quote: If the forum title had never included the word "American" you wouldn't have missed it
I agree. I just think that changing something that has been so established might cause others to wonder about the reason. Posters that only visit once in a while or something. People that just read and don’t post. And any chance of them being critical in a negative way might not be wanted. Anyway, it’s done. I’m just highly patriotic and always want to see more of America showed off, not less.
Posted by Belle (Member # 2314) on :
No offense, our global members, but it just doesn't feel the same.
The rhythm is off, the acronym just isn't nearly as cool.
I hate change.
But Kristine still rocks.
Edit: And I was so upset, I couldn't speel.
My feelings have nothing to do with anything negative towards those not American or anything, it's just a resistance to change in general.
[ February 01, 2005, 12:50 PM: Message edited by: Belle ]
Posted by Kama (Member # 3022) on :
Posted by Kama (Member # 3022) on :
Jay, feel free to not look me up if you were to ever visit Poland for an inexplicable and mysterious reason.
Posted by Dagonee (Member # 5818) on :
I like the rhythm now. You have to give it a rising intonation, like a carnival barker, with hard stresses on each now, and brief pauses for the commas to act as unstressed syllables:
"We got Books, Films, Food, and Culture!"
Think of it as trochaic meter with two abbreviated initial trochees.
[ February 01, 2005, 01:29 PM: Message edited by: Dagonee ]
Posted by Anna (Member # 2582) on :
Super-cool ! Kristine, you are my hero.
[ February 01, 2005, 01:42 PM: Message edited by: Anna ]
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
I liked it better before your edit, Anna. Posted by BannaOj (Member # 3206) on :
*cheers the mods*
AJ
Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
Awesome.
And you know the best part? There is finally a Hatrack landmark that I was around for! Posted by Ryuko (Member # 5125) on :
YAYYYY!!!! It feels so nice to be in such a community. Posted by Teshi (Member # 5024) on :
Hooray!
Yay for globalism! *feels included*
[ February 01, 2005, 04:54 PM: Message edited by: Teshi ]
Posted by Megan (Member # 5290) on :
Geoff, your mom does indeed rock.
Inclusive = good.
Posted by Eaquae Legit (Member # 3063) on :
quote:American culture is supposed to be multi cultural.
Given the context, that is one of the more ironic statements I have seen lately.
Posted by MyrddinFyre (Member # 2576) on :
Wow, very cool! Good going Mods and Kama Posted by urbanX (Member # 1450) on :
Am I the only one didn't even notice the change?
Posted by Ryuko (Member # 5125) on :
I didn't until I saw this thread.
Posted by Ela (Member # 1365) on :
Hmm, BFFC works for me. Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
Yay! No more Americans!!!!!!! Yay!!!!
Oh, uh, well, what I meant was . . . Oh never mind!
Posted by mackillian (Member # 586) on :
Awesome. Posted by Avadaru (Member # 3026) on :
Heh, I didn't notice the change either 'til I saw this thread. Nice job on inititiating the change, Kama! And thanks to the mod for recognizing it. Posted by JaneX (Member # 2026) on :
I'm with Belle on being sad that the "American" is gone...just because it's been here for longer than I have, and I liked the nice rhythm and the cool acronym it had before.
But I do understand the rationale behind the change, and I completely agree with the sentiment. So...I'll get used to it.
And yes, Kristine still rocks.
~Jane~
Posted by Risuena (Member # 2924) on :
quote: In this day of so much anti-Americanism why should we participate?
I just want to point that perhaps there would not be quite so much anti-american sentiment if we, as Americans, did a better job of recognizing that we are not the only people in the world. And I think that removing American from the forum name is a way, albeit small, of recognizing that there's a larger world outside of the U.S.
Any yay! Mrs. Card - it can never be said enough that you are awesome.
Posted by Shan (Member # 4550) on :
Wow! The things that happen while one is at work on the west coast . . . mercy!
Trochaic . . . *LOL*
Posted by Telperion the Silver (Member # 6074) on :
Kama, you sneaky girl you...
YAY culture!
Posted by SteveRogers (Member # 7130) on :
Jumps for joy!!! We are now not considered American....stupid Americans.....I shouldn't say that though seeing as I am one......darn Posted by Lost Ashes (Member # 6745) on :
quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Jay, feel free to not look me up if you were to ever visit Poland for an inexplicable and mysterious reason.
Wow, Jay, you've just been dissed by one of the prettiest gals on either side of the Atlantic...
Crushing and your loss for sure.
And I'm in favor of the forum title better reflecting the global gathering hosted by the very generous Cards.
Posted by mothertree (Member # 4999) on :
quote: Isn't "American Culture" a bit oxymoronic already?
*cough* Native American? *cough* *keeps coughing* *has to leave thread beet-faced*
Posted by Jay (Member # 5786) on :
quote: Jay, feel free to not look me up if you were to ever visit Poland for an inexplicable and mysterious reason.
Gee Kama, that’s real nice. Well, if you or anyone is ever in WV feel free to look me up and stop by for dinner, a place to stay, or anything else you might need. I did not intend to offend. I just didn’t want it to change. I wouldn’t expect some other nations web board to change their name if I started visiting it. My only point was that it was already established. I apologize for offending you.
Posted by Judas (Member # 7355) on :
Yeah.. I'm totally with Jay.. Just like I was totally with the south during the Civil War.. I mean, African Americans were established as being the white man's property. It was Es-TaB-Liiishhe-D-hkfkjsdf! - Why change it? I mean really?
Oh well.. As the world turns I guess we'll have to deal with people making all the aspects of life more welcoming to everyone.. Sigh..
--------
I know.. harsh. No worries Jay, no one will hold it against you. No more than they'll hold what I just said to you against me. -
No, the title change doesn't do much at all, but knowing that the Mods even cared to consider it, and that people were so willing to change something to better the overall unity of our community, it's just a good feeling to know that people care.
Judas
edit: I think it should be renamed to "OSC's Jeesh" - or the other side should be.. ::shrugs::
[ February 02, 2005, 10:26 PM: Message edited by: Judas ]
Posted by narrativium (Member # 3230) on :
I think it should be renamed, simply, "Stuff."
Posted by urbanX (Member # 1450) on :
How about we rename the forum Life, The Universe, and Everything.
Posted by Judas (Member # 7355) on :
Oooo.. or just '42' in that case.
Judas
Posted by Jay (Member # 5786) on :
Just shows your ignorance if you think slavery was the major reason for the civil war. Sates rights was the biggest reason. (oops, do I need to use “one of” or “the single” oh gosh, here we go again). Slavery was going away on both sides, yes, more quickly on the northern side. But they didn’t have the cotton fields that had come to depend on the labor. That doesn’t justify it in the least. But your comparison holds less water then a spaghetti sieve.
Posted by urbanX (Member # 1450) on :
I'm sorry Jay but I had to post a resonse your comments. This is taken word for word from the Declaration of Why Missippi Suceeded from the Union. This is the first few paragraphs. "Mississippi [Copied by Justin Sanders from "Journal of the State Convention", (Jackson, MS: E. Barksdale, State Printer, 1861), pp. 86-88] A Declaration of the Immediate Causes which Induce and Justify the Secession of the State of Mississippi from the Federal Union. In the momentous step which our State has taken of dissolving its connection with the government of which we so long formed a part, it is but just that we should declare the prominent reasons which have induced our course.
Our position is thoroughly identified with the institution of slavery-- the greatest material interest of the world. Its labor supplies the product which constitutes by far the largest and most important portions of commerce of the earth. These products are peculiar to the climate verging on the tropical regions, and by an imperious law of nature, none but the black race can bear exposure to the tropical sun. These products have become necessities of the world, and a blow at slavery is a blow at commerce and civilization. That blow has been long aimed at the institution, and was at the point of reaching its consummation. There was no choice left us but submission to the mandates of abolition, or a dissolution of the Union, whose principles had been subverted to work out our ruin.
Right, but it was still more about States Rights then anything else. More info at home. Found this real quick. http://civilwar.bluegrass.net/ Not the best site. But has the general point of it.
Posted by Dagonee (Member # 5818) on :
State Rights to have slavery.
Posted by Teshi (Member # 5024) on :
Umm... that site is only a leetle biased...
Posted by Desdemona (Member # 7100) on :
We still have an instance of the 'American' still being in there...
But, I agree that Mrs. Card is cool, and it was a great thing to do!
Posted by Eduardo_Sauron (Member # 5827) on :
Culture Kama
Posted by TheHumanTarget (Member # 7129) on :
I feel almost ill, in that I'm about to partially agree with Jay...
Yes, slavery was a major issue in the secession of states from the Union, however there were many proposals and compromises being profferred by both sides to alleviate the issue (the last being an impromptu session in mid February by delegates from all of the states in an attempt to pass an amendment saying that Congress could never interfere with slavery in the existing states).
What essentially pushed southern states over the edge was the increasingly "Federalist" attitude of the northern states that favored giving the National government all powers not explicitly designated as state powers. The addition of a tarrif on southern goods to protect northern farms from cheaper produce(slave labor was cheap labor) also helped to force the issue forward.
[ February 07, 2005, 02:54 PM: Message edited by: TheHumanTarget ]
Posted by Intelligence3 (Member # 6944) on :
Succession is following, being subsequent to. Secession is to secede, to withdraw from.
No judegementalism implied, folks just might want to know the correct spelling. Homophones are tough, especially when not used often. Posted by TheHumanTarget (Member # 7129) on :
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Tom. American babies with my genes in them.
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Booooo ![[Wall Bash]](graemlins/wallbash.gif)
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Kristine and the mods
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