...I think being a child of divorce or strife makes Mormon teenagers more likely to marry as quickly as possible.
In order for this to happen, I think it needs two elements:
1. Unstable but not abusive home life 2. Great importance placed on the value of a happy family, and self-worth being derived from it.
The unstable but not abusive home life is important because a family is then something that is painful only by its absense. It isn't that it hurts to be home, but that home is a wreck and it's better to be together. If a family is actually abusive, then being closer and together wouldn't solve anything.
Posted by Posable_Man (Member # 5105) on :
Two thoughts on this:
1) lots of people marry to escape a less-than-perfect home life or out of some unfilled need. So, sure, this could happen to Mormons too.
and,
2) It'd be pretty awful to claim this out loud in front of people who had married young. Lots of people marry young out of love and spend the rest of their lives nurturing that.
[ March 18, 2005, 01:23 PM: Message edited by: Posable_Man ]
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
Well, I fit the mold. My sister-in-law doesn't, though.
Oh, wait. Her dad died and her mom re-married when she was a kid. That might be it.
Or she might just have needed to get away from the 20 other kids in the blended family!
But yeah, I can see that.
That, and there's such an emphasis on chastity until marriage. I mean, honestly, that's why I think young marriages have always happened; if you're expected to be chaste until you're married, many people get married. It's certainly easier that way, in some ways. It's all priorities.
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
Just to add: I'm not offended, Katie!
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
And I do love my husband very much. And we want at least 6 or 7 kids, so we did need to get started...
Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
What do you mean by "very young," Kat? Because marrying young used to be the norm.
Posted by TheHumanTarget (Member # 7129) on :
I came from a very stable, supportive family, and married my wife at 22.
Your theory isn't accurate. It would be like me saying that "Some flowers that bloom are yellow. Therefore all blooming flowers are yellow".
Posted by jeniwren (Member # 2002) on :
I think part of it, too, is that teenagers who have a lot of turmoil at home may be too distracted by that instability to develop interests that will carry them into adulthood. I've seen that kids who get involved with school, are excited about going to college or a mission, and have some general but firm ideas about what they want to be when they grow up tend not to *need* a romantic relationship. Lacking focus, involvement, or any passion for their own personal development, I think many teens pick relationships as the focus, and with a Mormon family oriented ethic, may choose to marry very early.
Posted by Lady Jane (Member # 7249) on :
I do NOT think this is the only reason they marry young, of course. In other words, I'm not condeming or saying they are not doing it out of love.
I do think that people get married for multiple reasons, though, and love is just part of it. Another part is if/when you are ready for it, and what might contribute to making some people ready more quickly than others.
In other words, I'm not being offensive, and this seems like the perfect place to talk about it. I'm hurt you would think I was trying to be.
Added: For this theory, I don't think 22 counts as young. I do think 18-19 does.
[ March 18, 2005, 01:28 PM: Message edited by: Lady Jane ]
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
jeniwren, I have interests. My biggest priority has just always been being a wife and mother.
Posted by Amka (Member # 690) on :
How young is young? Young by LDS culture standards or young by general standards? I have a sister and a couple of cousins who got married when they were 18. All from intact, happy families, and all of the parents were at least a little upset at the time.
Posted by Lady Jane (Member # 7249) on :
Well, that's why it's a theory. I'm not saying there aren't exceptions.
Posted by KarlEd (Member # 571) on :
I think there isn't a lot of usefulness in trying to generate blanket formulas when it comes to this sort of thing because people respond to stress in so many different ways.
Of the seven of us who have seven different views of the broken and/or abusive nature of our family growing up, one has jumped blindly into a series of failed weddings. One waited and was very careful to pick a good stable companion. And one avoided marriage until it became basically mandatory in his point of view.
You also have to define "very young". When I was active in the LDS church, most young women were encouraged to marry as soon as a worthy man asked, and most worthy men were encouraged to ask as soon as they got back from their missions. (I'm talking about social encouragement, not official doctrinal encouragement.) Basically, I think the whole culture encourages marriage at a young age. I'm incline to think too young, but YMMV.
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
This is true; I hear conversations like, "She's 26 and still not married, so, you know..." all the time. It strikes me as absurd, because in most other cultures, that's pretty normal. Mormon women, however, are "supposed" to get married younger.
I was married exactly 1 month after I turned 20. My family thought I was way young. My husband's (LDS, all of them) didn't think it was that unusual. I think his parents were a little upset that he was giving up on a mission (he tried three times, and was basically told it is not going to happen, not because of worthiness but another reason, but it was hard for his parents to get over that), but their other son had married a 19-year-old very soon after his mission, so it wasn't unprecedented in the family.
Posted by KarlEd (Member # 571) on :
Dang this thread moved quickly. I thought I had a decent chance of being first to respond. Damn me and my slow post-craft.
Posted by jeniwren (Member # 2002) on :
kq, you don't count because you *knew* what you wanted to be. I don't mean young men and women like you. I know a great gal at church who married at 19, has 3 small children now, and is happy as can be.
I mean the ones like me, who married at 20 to get out my parent's house, having no idea what I wanted to be when I grew up, not really interested in having children.
I watch the kids at church as they are growing up. The ones that seem to do the best are the ones who have a pretty good idea what their interests are and what they want out of life.
Posted by AntiCool (Member # 7386) on :
How young do you consider young for the purposes of this discussion, kat?
Posted by Lady Jane (Member # 7249) on :
Notice the lack of "always" and "never". This is NOT a blanket theory, but it might be a trend.
For "young" for this purpose, I consider 17, 18, maybe 19 for the girls, and 20 or younger for guys. Teenagers, basically.
[ March 18, 2005, 01:35 PM: Message edited by: Lady Jane ]
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
I can get behind that, jw. I don't think anyone should marry without knowing what it really means and understanding why they're doing it. At the very least.
Posted by Jon Boy (Member # 4284) on :
She said in one of her above posts (as an edit) that she was talking about the 18–19 range.
Posted by vwiggin (Member # 926) on :
It could be that Mormons in general marry young because they are less interested in vapid and promiscuous relationships. While many people today have several long term sexual relationship before getting married, I'd imagine that is not the case for Mormons.
[ March 18, 2005, 01:37 PM: Message edited by: vwiggin ]
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
I'm interested to know what triggered this, Katie.
Posted by Lady Jane (Member # 7249) on :
My brilliant sister-in-law (perfect grades in high school, full four-year scholarship to college, lots of interests) met my brother her first week of her freshman year and was married by spring break, having thought about it carefully.
Part of it was indeed that she wanted a family, and hers was not abusive, but also not together. Stability was appealling, and freedom comes with insecurity. That was not appealling.
What triggered it? An article in The Atlantic Monthly that reported a study that found a correlation in women and marriage rates: For every 15 points higher in an IQ test, they were 60% less like to be married.
This does not fit with my sister-in-law. So I was trying to come up with other reasons.
[ March 18, 2005, 01:39 PM: Message edited by: Lady Jane ]
Posted by Amka (Member # 690) on :
Amen, Karl, on how fast it moved.
I, personally, think there should really be no cultural stigma on how old someone is when they get married, young or old. People just mature at such different rates. There are some 16 year olds out there more ready to be married than some 30 year olds, I'm sure.
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
She sounds an awful lot like me. Posted by BannaOj (Member # 3206) on :
quote: they are less interested in vapid and promiscuous relationships. While many people today have several long term sexual relationship before getting married
I realize you put qualifiers in there, but its things like this that tick me off. Do you realize how arrogant and condescending you are being to non-LDS? Not being married does not necessarily make a relationship vapid or promiscuous. I realize you guys have a moral code, but if someone doesn't follow that particular moral code you can't judge them by it, and have it mean anything.
AJ
(ok, I over reacted a little bit. I went back and reread and the way vwiggin worded the post, is such that they may not be LDS themselves. In which case, portraying LDS as being that judgemental is also a stereotype, but more understandable.)
[ March 18, 2005, 01:48 PM: Message edited by: BannaOj ]
Posted by Scott R (Member # 567) on :
I wouldn't hold it as a belief until I saw some data.
Posted by TMedina (Member # 6649) on :
Your sister-in-law knew a good thing when she saw it?
Or she believed in having a family?
One could also argue that she was bright enough to know herself and know what she wanted from life which included a husband and children.
-Trevor
Posted by Amka (Member # 690) on :
Jon Boy, that had been posted when I had asked, so I missed it.
I knew I wasn't going to wait to get married if I found the right person, but I also wasn't particularly afraid of not being married.
Part of my point was that I wanted a family, and I wanted my career later, because I figured it would be easier that way.
Posted by Lady Jane (Member # 7249) on :
This is not an article of faith with me - it's a theory. That's why I'm discussing it. If it was something I believed absolutely, I wouldn't discuss it.
TM, I don't like equating brightness with knowing yourself as a teenager. They aren't equivelent, it's an insulting correlation, and it doesn't account for many things, which includes knowing you'll change and arranging priorities so things you like that can't be done with a partner are done before you aquire a partner.
I think it does make sense in some cases, though. If you have stability, then you don't need to search for it or find it. If you don't have a place to rest your wings, then you'll look for one. If you do, then finding one is less urgent.
[ March 18, 2005, 01:51 PM: Message edited by: Lady Jane ]
Posted by Amka (Member # 690) on :
AJ,
I think we can agree that It isn't necessarily the lack of marriage that makes a relationship vapid and promiscuous. It is the lack of commitment. For us, it is the willingness to jump into bed together without any real meaning other than satiating a hunger.
Even the terms vapid and promiscuous in this context doesn't automatically have a moral code attached to it.
Posted by Lady Jane (Member # 7249) on :
There are stages between having sex on your wedding night and jumping into bed for no reason other than empty lust.
[ March 18, 2005, 02:25 PM: Message edited by: Lady Jane ]
Posted by BannaOj (Member # 3206) on :
I don't know that I do agree Amka. Even though I am personally monogamous, I'm finding myself philisophically more and more in line with the ideaology of polyamorists. However I suspect most polyamorist people have actually thought more seriously about sex and it's role in their lives than most people in your average college freshman dorm, where people are humping like rabbits.
AJ (sorry kat, didn't mean to derail... on topic with non-LDS people, I'd say that people with turmoil in their homes probably tend to go to the extremes. Either the extreme you are discussing, or the exact opposite end of the spectrum and delaying marriage indefinitely, with or without sex involved.)
[ March 18, 2005, 02:07 PM: Message edited by: BannaOj ]
Posted by TMedina (Member # 6649) on :
Bright as in being self-aware enough to ask the questions?
Whether or not the answer changes is another matter entirely.
-Trevor
Posted by Lady Jane (Member # 7249) on :
I don't think bright is the word you are looking for.
*considers* The theory of the safe but unstable family comes from the idea that you don't need to look for what you already have. If you're in a stable place, you don't need to get married to have a family.
Posted by TMedina (Member # 6649) on :
However, if you grew up with the expectation of finding and marrying Mr. Right and starting a family, it's not a matter of needing something to fill a void in your life, but rather completing your own expectations of what a complete life is.
Which sounds depressingly circular...sorry, the meds are kicking in.
-Trevor
Posted by Lady Jane (Member # 7249) on :
I think any time people get married, there are layers and layers of motivations involved. I think this could very well be one of them.
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
I agree that it could be one of the reasons for marrying young, Katie. But there are plenty of other ones out there -- especially in Mormon culture, where marriage is almost a pathological need.
Posted by BannaOj (Member # 3206) on :
Is it a pathological "need" or "expectation"?
AJ
Posted by Lady Jane (Member # 7249) on :
There's a huge controversey right now consisting of people demanding to get married. It's highly inflammatory to characterize wanting to get married as a Mormon thing.
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
Definitely an expectation. Some people may have a pathological need, sure. But you can't generalize that to everyone.
Posted by BannaOj (Member # 3206) on :
is the Alantic Journal link subscribers only? AJ
Posted by Lady Jane (Member # 7249) on :
I didn't see it online - it was in my print version I got a couple of days ago. I'll update this thread with the info when I get a hold of it again.
Sadly, the Atlantic Online has gone to subscribers only. This is very annoying, as I can't link to that fabulous Bobby Fischer bio anymore.
Posted by vwiggin (Member # 926) on :
quote:I went back and reread and the way vwiggin worded the post, is such that they may not be LDS themselves.
Thanks for spotting that. I'm not LDS nor am I a religious person.
quote:In which case, portraying LDS as being that judgemental is also a stereotype, but more understandable.
I'm not saying the LDS considers all non-LDS or non-marital relationships as being vapid. I don't think I'm portraying the LDS as being judgmental. At best, you can say that I'm judgmental, and I'm can't really deny that.
All I know is that all of my LDS friends are very serious about their relationships. When they date someone, they are always thinking "can I marry this person?" My non-LDS friends, on the other hand, are more willing to date for, um, purposes unrelated to marriage.
quote:Not being married does not necessarily make a relationship vapid or promiscuous.
AJ, I agree completely. I believe married couples are more likely to be committed to each other on a deeper level as compared to non-married couples. But marriage is definitely not a requirement for making a relationship meaningful. Posted by Hobbes (Member # 433) on :
Sometimes you just fall in Love too.
Hobbes Posted by Puffy Treat (Member # 7210) on :
Hi, I'm a Mormon who had his entire life turn upside down when his parent's marriage fell apart back when I was 14. (I'm now 28.)
It really, really hurt...especially since there had been no outward warning signs.
As a result, even though I long to have a family...I'm terrified of marriage. Terrified of getting close to someone. Scared that any kid I have would end up going through the hellish feelings I went through during those "years of the divorce".
Gloria Steinem once had an essay in the book "Free to Be You and Me" that her parents divorcing lead to her having a happier childhood. That she believed kids only felt bad about their folks splitting up because movies and TV shows programmed them to feel sad.
I know from personal experience that's a load of crud.
It hurt. It hurt worse than almost anything I've ever felt before or since.
I barely dated during the later years of High School. Didn't date at all in college.
Have mostly avoided dating after returning from my mission, though I do attend the Single's Branch.
My younger brother is married to his childhood sweetheart. They got married within a month of his returning from his mission. They have a son. They seem very happy.
I envy them. Even though I know it's wrong, and that my brother (who's a GREAT guy) deserves every bit of happiness he has and that it's my own darn fault for being so reclusive and withdrawn...I envy them a lot.
When I think about finding someone, I feel sick, sad, scared. Drawn, yet repulsed.
All messed up inside, basically.
So no, at least in my case going through a youth affected by family strife and divorce didn't lead to an early marriage.
[ March 18, 2005, 08:12 PM: Message edited by: Puffy Treat ]
Posted by aspectre (Member # 2222) on :
"Because marrying young used to be the norm."
So was dying young. Don't see alotta folks opting for that nowadays.
[ March 18, 2005, 09:39 PM: Message edited by: aspectre ]
Posted by Elizabeth (Member # 5218) on :
"So was dying young. Don't see alotta folks pushing for that option nowadays."
Actually, aspectre, the prediction is that if the rate of obesity continues to increase as it is right now, the average age of death will be younger again.
Posted by Occasional (Member # 5860) on :
You know, I don't have a problem with dying young. I really don't. think about it, how many happy old people do you know past the age of, say, seventy?
quote:So was dying young. Don't see alotta folks opting for that nowadays.
I know people who wish this all the time. At least, who say they hope they die before such and such an age.
[ March 19, 2005, 12:21 AM: Message edited by: Occasional ]
Posted by dkw (Member # 3264) on :
I can think of a couple dozen happy people over the age of 70 right off the top of my head. Including three in their nineties. And my neighbor enjoyed her life right up to 103. Even though people kept trying to talk her out of doing things like fixing her own roof at age 95.
[ March 19, 2005, 12:22 AM: Message edited by: dkw ]
Posted by Teshi (Member # 5024) on :
quote: I know people who wish this all the time. At least, who say they hope they die before such and such an age.
This is true.
Posted by Occasional (Member # 5860) on :
quote:I can think of a couple dozen happy people over the age of 70 right off the top of my head.
I guess I have been in too many "old folks homes" and hospitals that take care of the elderly. Half of them look like they want to escape life, and the other half look like they don't remember what life is.
It makes me very depressed and even sick to my stomach. Not to mention, watching my grandparents die the slow death of age was very, very sad.
I will accept your experience as true for your observations. From mine, however, it has been the complete opposite. You can see it in their eyes the question of what is going to go wrong next and who is going to die/leave me/forget me next?
[ March 19, 2005, 12:54 AM: Message edited by: Occasional ]
Posted by Occasional (Member # 5860) on :
As for the real topic of getting married young, I think it is both theological and cultural reasons. First, Mormon theology states that unless you are married in the Temple, no one (Man OR woman) can be eligable for the Highest Salvation of Heaven. Unless, through no fault of your own it just never happens.
Culturally, this tranlates into getting married as soon as you can to complete your Earthly Ceremonial (or the Catholic term, Sacramental)requirements. You then become, for lack of a better description, completely adult. The sooner you are married, the sooner you are considered a fully spritual and social member of the community.
The problem is a question of maturity. At the younger age they may be seen as adults, but mentally and experientially they might not be ready for the responsabilities required by that role. The official statements made by the leadership of the LDS Church has backed off a little on the subject of early marriages. Still, not a lot and not enough for a huge change in the social remifications of a theological ideal.
Posted by Bob the Lawyer (Member # 3278) on :
Occasional, I've found that Nursing Homes were terribly depressing places until I stopped picturing myself in them. Because I was healthy and completely self-sufficient, I would go insane being there. Which is why, of course, there are so few healthy and self-sufficient people there.
I expect you won't agree with me, but that doesn't make me any less right Posted by Shan (Member # 4550) on :
I was also taught, Occasional, that having children was a requirement. It wasn't enough to just get married. Has that changed?
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
Puffy Treat, while your experience is certainly valid, may I point out that it's not always "a load of crap"? I have a few memories from before my parents were divorced. My earliest memory with sound attatched is one of my parents arguing, me running in my room, slamming the door and putting the pillow over my head-- and still hearing the yelling.
I always thought there was something "wrong" with me because people kept telling me that it's normal to fantasize about your parents getting back together, and I never did that. Wished they'd stop fighting, sure. Wished I wasn't related to either of them and lived in a different time and place, yeah. Wished sometimes that I was an orphan and didn't have to deal with all the stuff they dumped on me, yes. But never that.
So I think the experience of divorce is very different, depending on the situation.
I honestly think that Anne of Green Gables is the reason I'm able to have a healthy relationship. That, and my husband is the most loving, forgiving, patient, supportive guy I've ever known.
Posted by Shan (Member # 4550) on :
Anne of Green Gables is wonderful. Such civility. A lost art these days . . . *sigh*
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
I read the whole series-- and the Emily books, and The Story Girl and The Golden Road, and everything else by her I could get my hands on, not to mention lots of Alcott-- whenever I got stressed and needed to escape from my life. (Which was a lot.) I think I picked up much more about how the world should work from those books than from my parents.
Posted by estavares (Member # 7170) on :
Allow me to pipe in by saying I was raised in a single parent home and I found that I wanted to wait a while rather than get into a hasty marriage. I had seen the harm of divorce, and wanted to make sure it would never happen to me.
True, I was still young (24) and my wife was only 19, but that was an unexpected relationship that proved to be better than I anticipated. And she came from a two-parent, very active LDS home.
Clearly the quality of home life does have an influence. Social pressures, sexual behaviors, and other factors all play into it. The social part, expecially, must be taken in stride--regardless of the pressures, we are free agents to choose our companion when and how we wish. For me, it came down to that I found the right person.
Thirteen years, two kids and counting...
Posted by Lupus (Member # 6516) on :
quote: I guess I have been in too many "old folks homes" and hospitals that take care of the elderly. Half of them look like they want to escape life, and the other half look like they don't remember what life is.
If you go into locations where older people with health problems go...it makes sense that the older people you see will be in bad shape. People who are healthy don't generally live in nursing homes.
As for the marriage thing, I think many times people escape a family situation by going into a marriage...regardless of religion.
I don't think it is a sex issue...because in general Christianity is against premarital sex and it doesn't always lead to early marriage. I know most of the core members of my Methodist church hold those beliefs...and none in our group were married young.
I don't know much about Mormon culture...but others have mentioned the push for Mormons to get married soon after their mission. I would think that this pressure would account for the early age of marriage since it is something that non Mormons are not exposed to (unlike the desire to escape from the home).
[ March 19, 2005, 06:49 PM: Message edited by: Lupus ]
Posted by Ela (Member # 1365) on :
quote:
quote: they are less interested in vapid and promiscuous relationships. While many people today have several long term sexual relationship before getting married
I realize you put qualifiers in there, but its things like this that tick me off. Do you realize how arrogant and condescending you are being to non-LDS? Not being married does not necessarily make a relationship vapid or promiscuous. I realize you guys have a moral code, but if someone doesn't follow that particular moral code you can't judge them by it, and have it mean anything.
AJ
(ok, I over reacted a little bit. I went back and reread and the way vwiggin worded the post, is such that they may not be LDS themselves. In which case, portraying LDS as being that judgemental is also a stereotype, but more understandable.)
AJ, I want to say that my initial reaction to that post was the same as yours.
Posted by rav (Member # 7595) on :
I find your theory accurate in some if not most cases. There are and always will be exceptions to any rule.
My mom was 18, my dad was 20 when they got married which lasted almost 40 years until my dad died. They had more than a handful of children, I being the last dealt with my fathers death harshly, if not dealing with it at all. Sometimes I think that if they had divorced I would be better off, because I would have had someone I still completely-trusted that simply understood how things worked, and could help others understand.
That being said, I'm almost 22, and I'm not married nor plan on being married any time in the near future. Nor have I had long lasting relationships with anyone other than friends. (Especially that of a sexual nature)
I would think that I have placed great importance on family, but since I don't have one of my own, I am my family.
I was brought up LDS, and still consider myself LDS although I have been less active recently. In my family several of my siblings got married young, and they are all very happy families, I do also have a brother that just recently got married. (He just recently turned 38)
Kat: You've got a good start on this theory, people tend to be carnal in all senses of the word, that could very well lead to LDS kids who want to experience sex to get married. (I am not stating that they get married only to have sex, but when they find someone that they are compatible with they would probably want to settle down.) This theory is going to be really hard to pin down because people do things not only because of thier surroundings, but because of thier personalities as well. So to determine which, you will need more data than you would in a case if the environment was the sole catalyst.
Posted by Lady Jane (Member # 7249) on :
rav, you're right. It's not really a theory I can test without a great deal of legwork and the kind of guessing that makes people wrinkle their noses at the thought of sociology as a science.
Part of the fascination is figuring out why people do the things that they do, especially the major things. There is so rarely a single explanation, but the stories and songs usually deal with only one or two discrete explanations. I'm trying to figure out the other kinds, and also wondering what kind of effects a broken up family has on people.
*hugs rav* You're very good at being a friend.
Posted by Megan (Member # 5290) on :
quote:I don't think it is a sex issue...because in general Christianity is against premarital sex and it doesn't always lead to early marriage. I know most of the core members of my Methodist church hold those beliefs...and none in our group were married young.
Christianity may be against premarital sex, but it sure didn't stop any of the Christian kids I knew growing up in the bible belt. I knew so many kids in high school who loudly proclaimed their faith and condemned those who disagreed, and then proceeded to ...well, party hearty when mom and dad weren't looking. I saw a similar situation in college at the Baptist student union, where everyone made a big deal about being chaste at functions, but socially it was an entirely different ball of wax.
It may not be a sex issue for some LDS kids who marry early, but I certainly wouldn't assume that spiritual matters are the guide for everyone who marries early, either. I think we have to accept that people in their late teens are going to be very, very curious about sex, and unless they have explicit and helpful parental guidance, are going to find some way to satisfy that curiosity.
Posted by AntiCool (Member # 7386) on :
quote:Christianity may be against premarital sex, but it sure didn't stop any of the Christian kids I knew growing up in the bible belt. I knew so many kids in high school who loudly proclaimed their faith and condemned those who disagreed, and then proceeded to ...well, party hearty when mom and dad weren't looking. I saw a similar situation in college at the Baptist student union, where everyone made a big deal about being chaste at functions, but socially it was an entirely different ball of wax.
I grew up in the Bible Belt as well. While I certainly saw some behavior like what you describe, I also know many people who curtailed their sexual activities (sometimes completely, sometimes not) because of their beliefs.
Posted by Megan (Member # 5290) on :
Sorry, mph...I misspoke when I said it didn't stop any of the Christian kids I knew. It just didn't stop most of them. Now, this may have something to do with where I was growing up (affluent suburbia), but I knew ...just tons of people who made a big deal about their purity, only to find out that they didn't curtail pretty much any sexual activity--or if they did, it was along the lines of "everything but penetration is ok."
Posted by Scott R (Member # 567) on :
I think I must have been especially lucky to grow up around kids who were not gifted in hypocrisy.
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
My aunt and I were talking about this; we both decided that "if it looks like a duck, sounds like a duck, and walks like a duck, it's a duck". We don't understand why so many kids think that way...
Posted by Megan (Member # 5290) on :
Scott R: Yes, you were quite lucky!
KQ: Yeah, well...According to the kids I knew in high school and college, it's only a duck if you look at it from a very particular angle.
Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
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