Since 9/11, and especially since the beginning of the Iraq War, we in America have been hearing more and more from people in other countries about our quirks, flaws and annoying differences. I can't tell you how many times I've heard, or read on an internet message board, lists of the things that make Americans weird. Some of the things on these lists are just stupid, but some are quite thought-provoking, and some hit entirely too close to home.
One of the things that is often mentioned is our rampant patriotism. Many people from other countries say they find our zeal strange. They are taken aback when Americans say that America is #1, or that America is the greatest. They think it odd when we recite the Pledge of Allegiance, or fly the flag and sing the national anthem at the drop of a hat, or wear lots of flag or U.S.A.-themed clothing.
I have been thinking about this. Early on, I recognized that it was true. Americans do tend to be much more publicly patriotic than many other nations, including most European nations. Sometimes we can get pretty obnoxious about it.
So I wondered why this is the case. I might be fooling myself, but I think I have arrived at the answer.
The United States of America, more than any other nation I can think of, is the product of immigration. Now, I know that a lot of other countries, especially in the Americas, owe their present existence to the influx of immigrants from someplace else. But I'm not aware of any other nation that has seen so many waves of mass immigration from so many other places since its earliest days as a nation. Over and over again, people have come to the U.S. specifically to escape their living conditions in their home countries, and to seek a better life. In many cases, these people were fleeing countries in which they felt oppressed, abused, and downtrodden.
They found, in the U.S., a vast improvement over their old lives. They had opportunities that they had never seen before. Perhaps they were finally given freedom of religion, or they had the chance to actually own land, or to move freely from one place to another, or to receive an education, or any number of other things. They were joyful, and very thankful, and naturally enough they taught their children that they were lucky to live in the U.S., and that other countries (e.g., wherever the parents came from) were much worse.
These people probably could have improved their lives in any number of other places, particularly in the past century. The U.S. certainly does not have a monopoly on freedom, or equality, or opportunity. Today, you could probably live in any of several dozen nations and not see any appreciable reduction in your rights, opportunities, or access to wealth. But, because of circumstances, we got those immigrants, and in their minds, the contrast between their former lives and the U.S. was unmistakable. As a result, their children grew up believing that they really did live in the best nation in the world. They had heard the stories repeated so many times that they were convinced that, if they did not live in the U.S., their lives would be miserable.
We are the product of millions of people, over several generations, who vastly improved their lot by coming to this country. After hearing their stories so often, how could we be other than patriotic?
Posted by jebus202 (Member # 2524) on :
Yea well... it's still gay.
Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
I can see that. I figure it is because we are county that was, in a sense, made, out of ideals, instead of a country that happened.
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
quote:Yea well... it's still gay.
I can't tell if that is supposed to be an insult or a compliment. Posted by Bokonon (Member # 480) on :
I think World Wars One and Two have a lot to do with dampening European patriotism... At least in the way Americans show it.
A lack of any historical entrenched, acknowledged aristocracy also plays a large factor, IMO.
-Bok
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
Good point, Bok.
*re-reads*
I read it first as "A lack of historical entrenched, acknowledged atrocities also plays a large factor".
Which I think also fits.
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
"After hearing their stories so often, how could we be other than patriotic?"
That may be part of it. I think our relatively short and uncomplicated history coupled with enormous economic success has more to do with it, though.
Posted by Dr. Evil (Member # 8095) on :
Ironically, I work with a number of people who were born in other countries and while they live now in the USA and take advantage of all she has to offer, they will point out how much better their respective nations are. A form of patriotism but I always found it to be such hypocrisy to live and work and function here yet to say how much better it is in other places.
Of course, when one asks them why they don't live where it is better, the flaws come to the surface.
Posted by Annie (Member # 295) on :
I find it a little weird to base feelings of love and admiration for one's homeland on the fact that said homeland makes a lot of money. I think I could be more patriotic if I felt a connection to a people who were laregly good or moral or happy or at least cooked well. As it is, I'm pretty much a 4th of July humbug.
Posted by Parsimony (Member # 8140) on :
I think that the American people are largely good, moral, and happy, Annie. Most people are not bad, insensitive, greedy bums.
I was driving through Charlotte at the time fireworks were being set off. Due to timing issues, I wasn't able to attend fireworks with my family or friends. When the show started, I pulled onto the shoulder of the highway and got out of my car to watch. Within 2 minutes, the shoulder was full of people standing outside their cars and watching the fireworks in silence together. There is something about that sight that will stay with me forever, as proof when I need it that we really are all the same, and the division we sometimes encounter is just a fleeting abnormality.
--ApostleRadio
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
I think the average American is a lot more isolationist than most other nations. It's not that they don't really care what is going on in the world, they just want the world to leave them alone so they can go about their business.
Obviously Americans, aren't unfeeling, just look at the response from Americans over the tsunami disaster, and the outpouring of emotion when Princess Diana died. I remember going to stand in line for an hour to sign one of those books to extend sympathies to the royal family.
I think World War two did the most to kick the average American into the "America is the best!" mind set, only furthered that much by the collapse of the Soviet Union. We're a nation used to getting our way, and not losing, and that does a lot to further a national sense of pride, and also arrogance.
Posted by advice for robots (Member # 2544) on :
I'm not ashamed to be openly patriotic. I will sing the national anthem facing the flag with my hand over my heart. I will participate in patriotic activities (although I won't wear a tie with a flag on it, no way).
I wonder why some people get so embarrassed or outraged when, say, an American flag is flown on a fire truck in an American city. I realize that there are people in America with many nationalities. I don't believe in rubbing my patriotism in their face, but I'm not going to take down my flag because a foreigner might feel offended by the gesture. I can't understand why someone from another country who is in America would be hurt or offended to witness normal American patriotism.
Posted by jebus202 (Member # 2524) on :
It's not offensive, why would anyone be offended? It's just annoying.
Posted by WheatPuppet (Member # 5142) on :
quote:Since 9/11, and especially since the beginning of the Iraq War, we in America have been hearing more and more from people in other countries about our quirks, flaws and annoying differences.
I think that's primarily because Americans are open to scrutiny by the world at large, while most other nations aren't. The United States is on top at the moment, which leads people to take more interest in her people. Americans are certainly no more quirky or flawed than any other folk on Earth, we're just under a more powerful microscope.
How often do the quirks of Botswanans come up in conversation? Not at all, but they have their quirks and flaws, I imagine, just like everybody else.
[edit] Being back on the rack is good. Better than a wrack, I guess.
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
quote: I remember going to stand in line for an hour to sign one of those books to extend sympathies to the royal family.
Why did you do this?
Posted by Lupus (Member # 6516) on :
I think anytime you have an empire, you will have a lot of patriotism by its core citizens. People in Rome often wrote about doing things for the "Glory of Rome", I'm sure their was a lot of patriotism during the height of the British empire...and so on. Right now the USA is clearly an "empire" with military bases, and cultural influence all over the world. I think this sort of thing leads to a national pride, or patriotism.
Posted by Zemra (Member # 5706) on :
Dr. Evil, totally agree with you. It upsets me when I hear people from another countries coming to US to work and make money and badmouth the country that is feeding them and their families. I am not from USA. I come from very poor country in Europe where government steals from the poor and there are no promises to life. I came to US when I was only 19 and I have been able to accomplish things that I had never even dreamed of. The only thing that might be a little bit of a problem is that you have to work for it if you want to become someone. America is the land of opportunity and a great country. I love America and I am very proud to be an American. USA has helped many countries in the world with their problems. I remember the war in Kosovo. Hundreds and thousands of Kosovars died but if it weren’t for America and other troops in Europe Kosovo would not exist today. One thing to add is that US didn't have any interest in Kosovo (like oil or anything). When I hear The Star-Spangeled Banner I sing it with pride.
Posted by Jim-Me (Member # 6426) on :
Lupus,
It is not an Empire. America has global influence, but we leave that influence at precisely that level. We do not control Western Europe, South Korea, or Saudi Arabia, though we definitely make our presence and wishes felt in those areas. Those governents are not our puppets, they are our allies.
I think the reason people get highly patriotic over America is that, more than any other nation before it, it was founded on ideas and ideals and so represents those to its citizens, regardless of its failings, in practice, to live up to those ideals on every occasion.
Posted by sndrake (Member # 4941) on :
I don't know about our other expressions of patriotism, but our relationship with our flag is, well, peculiar. In some cases, the rhetoric surrounding it comes very close to that of revering a sacred object.
I recognize the reality of these attitudes about the flag, although I've never understood them myself. (It's the major reason, as an activist, I'd never participate in burning one. I believe one should have a better objective than just outraging people.)
Posted by Primal Curve (Member # 3587) on :
quote:here is something about that sight that will stay with me forever, as proof when I need it that we really are all the same, and the division we sometimes encounter is just a fleeting abnormality.
That, or people really just like watching stuff blow up.
Posted by Annie (Member # 295) on :
Maybe I just haven't encountered enough true patriotism. Most of it that I'm surrounded with always has an undercurrent of "yeah, we'll show those Muslim bastards that the Christians are right" or "take that, you lame Mexicans who come crawling to us for money. What? Your country not good enough for you?" or "Thank God that I live in a place where I can own my own hummer and a boat and go blow lots of money on weekend trips without having be surrounded by people looking at me with malnourished eyes making me all guilty."
I just haven't met enough "patriotic" people who were sincere and not hypocritical. I know a lot of them have innocent intentions, but I can't take their attitudes seriously. Maybe the fault is in me for being the cynic.
Posted by MrSquicky (Member # 1802) on :
As real community ties break down, it's common for people to latch onto largely symbolic affiliations that don't ask much of them. To me, this seems to be the extent of patriotism for many Americans. For others, it serves as an extention of their own ego, where being "American" means thinking and acting the way I do and is seen as being superior to all other ways. For other people, there is a pride in the history, land, people, and current position of the country. Often combined with this, there is a respect for the ideal that America is supposed to stand for. And then there's the patriotism that politicians and advertisers try to whip up to control the populace.
Patriotism is a convenient label for all these things are difficult to separate out from each other.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
quote: I remember going to stand in line for an hour to sign one of those books to extend sympathies to the royal family. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Why did you do this?
"To extend sympathies to the royal family"
I thought that was fairly self explanatory.
They had books like that at certain locations all throughout the country. And all of them I believe were sent to Charles, or the royal family in general, or maybe it was the British people, I don't remember where exactly they were sent.
Posted by Annie (Member # 295) on :
To: The British People Postal Box 2 Great Britain
Posted by Black Fox (Member # 1986) on :
The thing is so many people are patriotic in America because in a sense this nation was started by people who wanted something. Americans volunteered to be free, we did not have to conscript hundreds of british colonists to fight, they came. Yes they were paid etc., but they were not mercenaries etc. The people who came to America lived here because obviously they saw something here that they liked. They loved it enough that not only did they move here, but they stayed and kept their children in this land.
The fact is that we don't inherit patriotism, we aren't taught it, we aren't even forced it. The fact is people in America choose to love their nation. People in America choose to hate their nation etc. That is what makes America "great." So many times before America has been rediculed by the rest of the world as being weak, not as good, etc. The fact is America has never had to be one thing or another, we are not constrained by nearly as many petty rivalries and long standing traditions as so many othe rnations. We are a nation of people. Look at us, we fight a massive war 60 years ago and are best friends with both the nations we fought, and in turn we became the "enemies" of two of the nations that fought with us( China and the USSR).
Posted by WheatPuppet (Member # 5142) on :
During the Revolutionary War, there were just as many Tories as there were Yankees. Both were patriots--both loved the land they lived in--but thought different things were best for it. One side just happened to coincide with one of the best military forces on earth at the time. The other just so happened to win. Posted by Sweet William (Member # 5212) on :
A form of patriotism but I always found it to be such hypocrisy to live and work and function here yet to say how much better it is in other places.
On my LDS mission, I had a companion from Mexico who was particularly obnoxious in this regard.
His family lived in Texas on some kind of visa that allowed them to run a daycare center. He would trash the U.S. all the day long ("my little brother and sister are starting to act like little American brats" was a phrase which will forever live in my mind).
I can't believe I didn't punch this guy, looking back on it.
Then, he got a letter from mommy saying their visas had expired, and they would soon be deported to Monterrey. He was beside himself.
I, of course, delighted in repeating all the "America is sooo horrible" crap he'd been pontificating about for the past two months.
Man, that was a fun afternoon; laughed my ass off. Posted by MrSquicky (Member # 1802) on :
Not big on the whole What Would Jesus Do thing, are you Will?
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