I want Nightcrawler! There's so much to his character, and they didn't elaborate on it at all! Also, I want Gambit!
But they have Frasier playing Beast, yes? That much should be good.
Other than that, I shall beat the X-men movie folks with a sharp stick.
What do you hope to see/wish you had seen/think is an abominable mistake?
-pH
Posted by pfresh85 (Member # 8085) on :
It was sad that they left out Nightcrawler. He's one of the best characters. And I agree the Kelsey Grammer playing Beast was a good choice. I don't think X-Men 3 will be good though. So far it sounds kind of lame. *sigh* Had such hopes for it too.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
lol.
No Gambit for this movie, maybe for X-4. And yes, Kelsey Grammar is playing the voice of Beast, which I think is a fantastic casting choice.
I despise most of the changes. Storm's role is far too reduced, she's supposed to be the second in command to Cyclops. Further, her powers should be much stronger.
Rogue should not be a child, she should be an adult. All the childhood mutant powers acceptance crap they are forcing on her is supposed to be the storyline of Jubilee, who while also a child, has yet to have any sort of importance in the movie at all other than just a brief flash on screen, not even using her powers.
Making Iceman a child as well is annoying, now they can't introduce him as a full fledged mutant with the ability to fully use his powers.
Making Colossus a child pisses me off because he was my favorite character, and now he can't battle Juggernaut or be involved with the fight against Omega Red, who will probably end up just being a bad guy for Wolverine.
Speaking of which, why are these movies basically Wolverine-fest? Two of his major villains they made not even know him. Sabertooth, who he is constantly feuding with is just a stranger to him. And Lady Deathstrike, who was supposed to be his long lost love from Japan didn't know him either. They totally erased her background and just tossed her in there as a throwaway bad guy.
I refuse to believe that the writers are just lazy, but come on. They don't need to make the characters younger to give it broader appeal, it's one of the most popular comic book series, and that crowd includes millions of kids who don't care that they are slightly older. I grew up on the newer X-men, which means Gambit flirting with Rogue all the time, not Gambit's lack of existing and Rogue being a child who flirts with Iceman who is also a child.
Also, Magneto's character. He isn't supposed to be quite that heartless. It's true he doesn't so much care about humans, but he isn't supposed to be a heedless murderer. How are they going to do Asteroid M if he is like that? I'm already dreading what they might do with Cable, Bisop or Genosha, let along Apocalypse, who is in my top 5 of all time bad guys. If he is emotionally void, as they appear to make him, how are they going to turn that around and give him feelings if they ever try and do the Quicksilver/Scarlet Witch story angle?
I think part of the problem is that there are so many characters and storylines, they feel they have to do it all in 3 episodes, rather than fully fleshing out each individually line accurately.
The thing I understand the least is making all the adults into kids. It makes zero sense to me.
Posted by Rakeesh (Member # 2001) on :
My beef with X-men movies is that there are so many X-Men I don't give a damn about at all. Angel, Jubilee, Dazzler, Cyclops, Jean Grey (except insofar as she relates to Wolverine), Bishop, Banshee...couldn't care less. Not remotely interested.
Nightcrawler, Gambit, Colossus, Professor X, and of course Wolverine are quite different. To me, they're compelling characters. Of course it's different with Ultimate X-Men. There, they were able to make interesting even the least interesting (to me) X-Men, Angel.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
I think Archangel has a pretty good storyline, especially when you throw Apocalyse into the mix.
Cyclops tends to annoy me, he's so one dimensional. He serves two purposes: 1. Jean Grey's champion. 2. Professor X's stooge. That's all he ever does. Protect the Professor and whine about Jean.
I like the fact that they cover all the different angles though. It shows that in the X-Men universe everyone is affected by the mutation, average people, adults, teens, rich people, poor people, etc.
Maybe it's also realistic in the sense that not every character is going to be compelling, sometimes you're going to have boring people just like in real life, but that doesn't mean I have to like them.
The movies annoy me with their Wolverine focus. Sure, he is a very important, complex and interesting character. But the same could be said of Storm as well, her main role consists of looking worried, and tilting her head to the side as her eyes glass over, which means someone is about to be struck by lightning. Her character should have a lot more depth than that, and I don't blame Halle Berry, I blame the writers for reducing the role of a title character.
Posted by pH (Member # 1350) on :
I heard the White Witch is going to be in the next one.
Why aren't they just going in the Phoenix direction? Why this strange jumble of various stories?
Also, comic book Rogue is much cooler than movie Rogue.
The characters I really liked from the movie were Professor X, Wolverine, and Nightcrawler.
-pH
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
White Witch? I don't recall who that is?
Jadis?
I think the plan is to totally screw with the Phoenix storyline. The Shiar, the Emcron Crystal, Llandra, all of that is most likely gone.
Instead the Phoenix will probably just me some crazy demon inhabiting her and causing mayhem everywhere until Scott can plead his undying love for her and she can summon the will to beat back the evil Phoenix with the help of the Professor and Cerebro. I also forecast that while she is under the influence of the Phoenix she will get with Wolverine.
Posted by Carrie (Member # 394) on :
White Queen, I think pH meant. Emma Frost.
I'm confused with the apparently story line of keeping the entire Phoenix saga at the background of the movie. How is that even possible? And what the heck is going to be at the forefront?
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
The real storyline of the Phoenix Saga will be raped for the sake of visual effects and making the movie shorter and less complicated.
I'm guessing that will be at the forefront, and Juggernaut, Beast, Siryn, and Angel will all be side stories.
Moira McTaggart is a character too, so there enters yet another storyline to be mixed in.
I think it'll just be a giant free for all. They don't care about story anymore, they just know we want to see SFX.
Posted by pH (Member # 1350) on :
quote:Originally posted by Carrie: White Queen, I think pH meant. Emma Frost.
I'm confused with the apparently story line of keeping the entire Phoenix saga at the background of the movie. How is that even possible? And what the heck is going to be at the forefront?
Yes, that's what I meant. Witch, Queen...same thing. The White Queen is the one who uses magic, right?
-pH
Posted by Altáriël of Dorthonion (Member # 6473) on :
I hope the movie goes well, the director changed so we can expect a different feel from the other movies.
Posted by SteveRogers (Member # 7130) on :
I was angered that Colossus was made into a child, as well. He has been my favorite X-Man since I was eight. And now, he will not be doing any of the cool stuff his character was allowed to do in the comics.
Posted by Lord Solar Macharius (Member # 7775) on :
BIG BIG SPOILERS
Ye be warned. Seriously. BIG.
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quote: Instead the Phoenix will probably just me some crazy demon inhabiting her and causing mayhem everywhere until Scott can plead his undying love for her and she can summon the will to beat back the evil Phoenix with the help of the Professor and Cerebro. I also forecast that while she is under the influence of the Phoenix she will get with Wolverine.
The early script review at AICN (not the best source, mind you) said that X3 will see the deaths of Xavier and Cyclops at the hands of Phoenix.
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Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
quote: The White Queen is the one who uses magic, right?
No. Emma Frost is a telepath. The Red Queen, formerly her partner, is a sorceress.
You may also be thinking of the Scarlet Witch, who's kind of a magician but more of a McGuffin.
Posted by Scott R (Member # 567) on :
Uh-- I think you're thinking of the Black Queen, Selene. There is no Red Queen in the Hellfire club.
Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
MMmmm. Hugh Jackman.
Edit: Sorry! No complaints. Posted by Megan (Member # 5290) on :
I agree with CT. Anything that puts copious amounts of Hugh Jackman on the screen is a goooooooood thing.
Posted by Storm Saxon (Member # 3101) on :
I thought the Hellfire Club was muties only?
Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
[ November 21, 2005, 08:59 PM: Message edited by: ClaudiaTherese ]
Posted by Scott R (Member # 567) on :
Storm-- Nah. Donald Pierce wasn't a mutant.
Selene, it turns out, WAS a mutant with some very vampire/witch like powers.
The Hellfire club was more about money than genetics, in my understanding
Posted by LadyDove (Member # 3000) on :
quote:Speaking of which, why are these movies basically Wolverine-fest?
quote:MMmmm. Hugh Jackman.
quote:I agree with CT. Anything that puts copious amounts of Hugh Jackman on the screen is a goooooooood thing.
Yep! Yep! Yep!
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
quote: There is no Red Queen in the Hellfire club.
Wrong! We learn -- in Excalibur, I believe -- that the British version of the Hellfire Club has Red and White pieces, not Black and White ones. Posted by Scott R (Member # 567) on :
:applauds:
You're right. I'd forgotten that there were two branches, and I didn't know they had different color leaders.
Of course, the FIRST Red Queen we meet in Excalibur is the dumpy-but-violent Red Queen of the Crazy Gang.
Good times.
Posted by Rakeesh (Member # 2001) on :
I don't know what you people are doing caring so much about the largely boring X-Men Posted by Scott R (Member # 567) on :
Mostly, I'm waiting for people to submit character writeups to the Malloy campaign over @ sakeriver.
Posted by smitty (Member # 8855) on :
Unless we get to X-Men 25, there's not going to be enough time to tell every story and develop every character. I do think they were too quick to throw away the backstory of several characters, though. Making them children, changing the romances, aren't that bad - it allows the story to be retold and made new, and with several years between movies, it doesn't take long for these "kids" to become adults, and use their powers effectively. After all, Colossus looked pretty old, and was fairly adept at kicking ass. But, unfortunatly, you can't focus on 30 characters in one 2 hour movie, so a lot of characters get rolled into one, a lot of plot lines are removed. It's just part of the price to see these characters on the big screen.
Posted by Storm Saxon (Member # 3101) on :
If I modify my question to the inner circle of the Hellfire Club, would it then be true that it was muties only?
By the way, if anyone, like me, didn't know, there existed, and exists, real world analogues to the Hellfire Club. Neat. Posted by Storm Saxon (Member # 3101) on :
Screw it. Freaking board.
Been trying to post the link off of wikipedia which corroborates that both you and I are correct. Inner Circle used to have normals, but has been taken over by mutants.
Posted by Scott R (Member # 567) on :
Posted by Rakeesh (Member # 2001) on :
Hey, I was all gung-ho but I decided to wait since thread posting and whatnot seemed to drop off and it appears it won't be starting for awhile. Felt like I was the only one gabbing about it, but that could be due to PMing and not posting.
Posted by Walker (Member # 8866) on :
I would have liked to have seen more Sabertooth vs Wolverine myself these two have great fights in the comics, but only a few minutes in the first X-Man. Would be nice if they also explain a little more into his history this time around...
Will the Dark Phoenix saga be tided in with this movie also???
Posted by EricJamesStone (Member # 5938) on :
If I were in charge of the X-Men movies, I'd bring Jean Grey back as Phoenix in X3, but push the Dark Phoenix storyline (other than a few hints) into X4.
Posted by Dan_raven (Member # 3383) on :
Of course, the whole "Hellfire" Club thing was stolen from The Avengers
Ms. Peel...Rrrrrrr.
Posted by littlemissattitude (Member # 4514) on :
quote:Originally posted by LadyDove:
quote:Speaking of which, why are these movies basically Wolverine-fest?
quote:MMmmm. Hugh Jackman.
quote:I agree with CT. Anything that puts copious amounts of Hugh Jackman on the screen is a goooooooood thing.
Yep! Yep! Yep!
May I just add my name to this growing list of Hugh Jackman/Wolverine admirers. Posted by Megan (Member # 5290) on :
I watched Kate and Leopold for him. It had the dumbest premise, it really did...but he looked sooo nice in it.
Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
Yeah.
I, um, picked up a copy of it on clearance.
Posted by MrSquicky (Member # 1802) on :
quote:I would have liked to have seen more Sabertooth vs Wolverine myself these two have great fights in the comics, but only a few minutes in the first X-Man.
Random bit. Apparently during a deleted bit in one of the fights in X1, Sabertooth grabs Wolverine's wrists, holding his claws off to the side and says, "Without these, you've got nothing." at which point Wolverine smashes his adamantium coated skull into his face. I would have liked to have seen that.
I would have liked to have seen more Nightcrawler, but his powers cause some major story-telling problems. Instaneous teleportation is a whole big can of worms. Witness Harry Potter, for example, where most of the books no longer make sense if you accept that people can teleport pretty much anywhere without much effort. It's one of the dreaded powers for plots.
Posted by Storm Saxon (Member # 3101) on :
The problem was solved in the comic books by limiting the range to one mile and having the act of teleportation severely drain/damage Nightcrawler. There were some other limitations, too, now that I think of it. I think line of sight, or it had to have been a place he'd been to.
Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
quote:Random bit. Apparently during a deleted bit in one of the fights in X1, Sabertooth grabs Wolverine's wrists, holding his claws off to the side and says, "Without these, you've got nothing." at which point Wolverine smashes his adamantium coated skull into his face. I would have liked to have seen that.
Awesome.
And HJ could have totally pulled off the timing, too.
Posted by Rakeesh (Member # 2001) on :
quote:Witness Harry Potter, for example, where most of the books no longer make sense if you accept that people can teleport pretty much anywhere without much effort. It's one of the dreaded powers for plots.
[tangent]Oh, I dunno, she's done an OK job of handling the inherent problems, I think. You cannot teleport into or out of Hogwarts, period, and supposedly such travel can be monitored or even intercepted.[/tangent]
I didn't know about that deleted fight scene. That woulda been a very, very good scene.
Posted by Synesthesia (Member # 4774) on :
quote:Originally posted by Megan:
I watched Kate and Leopold for him. It had the dumbest premise, it really did...but he looked sooo nice in it.
He did look nice in a Victorian suit, but talk about DIPPY!!!
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The White Queen is the one who uses magic, right?![[Smile]](smile.gif)
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