I'm teaching myself piano and working on a piece fro m the movie "Spirited Away" called "One Summer's Day".
Anyway, near the end there are these measures in the left hand that have two whole notes seperated by a symbol that looks like this /// or this \\\ (if the 2nd whole note is lower than the first).
My primary instrument is violin and I've never seen these symbols before, which suggests to me that I'm trying to perform a feat that only a piano can perform.
What do these symbols mean? What is their name? Google fails w/o a name and it can't search by "looks". Posted by Shigosei (Member # 3831) on :
Tremolo, maybe? Does it look like the notation in this article?
I would have to see the score to be sure, but it sounds like it might be a tremello. You strike the keys, alternating rapidly between the two. Imagine a double roll with two timpani.
Posted by Evie3217 (Member # 5426) on :
It's called a gliss (I think) and it means that you slur down (or up) to the next note instead of hitting each one as an individual note. Hope that helps.
Edit: Does it look anything like this? Scroll down to find the gliss.
Posted by ludosti (Member # 1772) on :
I've only really heard of using glissando on a harp or in singing, while tremelo is somewhat common on piano.
Posted by Evie3217 (Member # 5426) on :
You know what? You guys are probably right. I'll just be quiet now. *goes and sits in the corner*
Posted by Earendil18 (Member # 3180) on :
Ohhhhh, I'm so used to seeing them on the notes it never occurred to me it was tremolo! LOL Thanks guys!
Evie that's still a good page to bookmark, come out of the corner! Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
UUUUHHHH hang on.
A trill is actually marked by a squigly horizontal line resenbling an (~). Often with a little "tr." written in above the note.
This is definetly NOT a "tremolo," which is what the people here have used to describe what is actually known as a "trill", as the notation for that would be much clearer.
Earendil- What those slashes probably have to do with is articulation. For instance the composer may be indicating the use of a damper and a significant seperation between the two notes, similar to a breath in singing. As I'm not a pianist, this notation isn't entirely familiar to me. It may also signify a slight retard, or a diminuendo between notes. Look in the index of your score for a note from the publisher, and there was be a glossary of symbols there as well. Failing that listen to a recording and see what the pianist does.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
quote:Originally posted by ludosti: I've only really heard of using glissando on a harp or in singing, while tremelo is somewhat common on piano.
Glissandos and tremelos are quite impossible in traditional piano technique because they involve manipulation of the string which cannot be accomplished by use of the keys.
The only definition of tremelo that works for a piano is the "trill," which is quite different from the common usage of the word, which has to do with moving the fretting fingers on string instruments.
Posted by BandoCommando (Member # 7746) on :
It's a tremolo. Tremolos and trills are very similar. In fact, they are identical, except in how they are notated.
A trill is marked with a tr ~~~~~~~~ kind of idea. This idicates that one should start on the written note and alternate between that and the next diatonic note up (diatonic means "within the key signature"). Of course, an accidental (sharp, flat, or natural) could indicate that you are to trill to a note OUTside of the key signature.
The limitation with the trill marking is that it can only indicate a alternation of notes within the range of an Augmented 2nd (3 keys away). A tremolo can indicate that you should alternate between ANY two notes.
Earlier, I misspoke. Trills do not always start on the first note written. It is common practice to perform Baroque and Classical style music with the trill starting on the upper note.
Orincoro: tremolo on a stringed instrument like violin is often accompanied with the technique of playing over the bridge of the instrument, resulting in a ghostly sound. It also might indicate simply repeating the same note rapidly, as opposed to alternating notes.
I suppose Artemisia had it most correct when likening a tremolo to a drum roll. In fact, a drum roll could be considered a form of tremolo.
And if my word isn't enough, check the ultimate source of online information, Wikipedia:
Orincoro: tremolo on a stringed instrument like violin is often accompanied with the technique of playing over the bridge of the instrument, resulting in a ghostly sound. It also might indicate simply repeating the same note rapidly, as opposed to alternating notes.
Whatever, I'm a guitarist, so bow technique isn't my forte- Although my ensemble is working on Electric Counterpoint by Steve Reich, which we are going to perform LIVE! The 8th/16th note repetitions are fast enough that they require some interesting picking techniques, should be fun.
Posted by Baron Samedi (Member # 9175) on :
Dude, I'd love to hear Electric Counterpoint live. That'd be enough to fry your brain. If you record it, can you post a sound clip or something?
How many people are in your ensemble?
Posted by raventh1 (Member # 3750) on :
I have a piano question: When do you guys find time to practice? And how to you remember to practice daily?
I'll never finish learning these peices if I don't practice daily.
Posted by Artemisia Tridentata (Member # 8746) on :
Rav Arturo Rubensten (a great pianist from another era) is reported to have said; "Behind every great pianist is a mother with a big stick". I'm afraid that, absent the aformentioned mother, most of us don't find time to practice.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
quote:Originally posted by Baron Samedi: Dude, I'd love to hear Electric Counterpoint live. That'd be enough to fry your brain. If you record it, can you post a sound clip or something?
How many people are in your ensemble?
Yes, I was looking for a way to post another concert peice I composed a few months back, but couldn't find a host for my mp3. If you can tell me how to do that, I can obtain a copy of our recording when we do it on may 31st and I will post it.
We have a core group of seven guitarists. On top of that we can get a few local ringers and play in two quartets, an octet, or just our normal sextet with a conductor. We do anything from Purcell Viole consort stuff, to Bach's Art of Fugue, to Brower's "Cuban Lanscape, with rain." This quarter its all Reich all the time, and we're doing the performance with 9 electric guitars, 2 electric bass guitars, and two vibraphones. Its going to be intense.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
Rav- 90% of practice is mental preparation, according to Glenn Gould anyway.
Posted by Baron Samedi (Member # 9175) on :
Let me do some looking around. I'll post here when I find you a host.
I love Steve Reich. I've got most of his stuff, and it's mind-blowing. I have a friend who's a percussionist and a professor of music, and a few years back he got to perform Clapping Music in an ensemble conducted by Reich himself. I still haven't overcome the jealousy.
Posted by Earendil18 (Member # 3180) on :
Very good online book. Now if only it were in an offline format (read: book) I'd be set.
As it stands however, there's very good points, and I'm trying to incorporate better "practicing method".
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
quote:Originally posted by Baron Samedi: I love Steve Reich. I've got most of his stuff, and it's mind-blowing. I have a friend who's a percussionist and a professor of music, and a few years back he got to perform Clapping Music in an ensemble conducted by Reich himself. I still haven't overcome the jealousy.
Don't be too jealous, Reich has never been much of a musician. He's a great minimalist composer to be sure, but he was never a extraordinary performer of his own work, that's why his best stuff is better handled by pro performers; like pat mahoney and Kronos Quartet. We were working on movement 3 last night of EC, and its mindblowing to hear when it really works. AS a peice of music, it is boring to play, because every player has a very small uninteresting part. However, as an ensemble, there are many beautiful and meaninful little moments.
Posted by raventh1 (Member # 3750) on :
If it were really just that much mental prep I'd be really good.
There is something about learning by rote and doing all the different scales, and learning fingering by rote. (muscle memory)
Other than that I agree.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
meh, 90% mental. You play something correctly three times, and you have it in memory, rote learning doesn't *really* work. It feels like it works, but its just a vehicle for mentation. This is why experienced musicians can play at sight what I take hours of practice to learn, they don't need all that extra mulling time because they are more efficient.
Posted by MightyCow (Member # 9253) on :
Maybe you get something in memory after three times, but it takes a lot longer for me. One of the most frustrating things to me about playing instruments is trying to memorize the pieces. I play pretty well from music, but it takes me forever to memorize a piece on any of my instruments.
Posted by Orincoro (Member # 8854) on :
That's what I'm talking about, the key to memorization is not the physical act. Really good musicians can memorize peices VERY quickly, and hear what they sound like in their heads just by looking at the sheet. Its training your memory to absord the details you need to remember the right things; I think its a skill, not a talent though, it can be learned.
Posted by Earendil18 (Member # 3180) on :
The problem I've having right now is I memorize a piece too soon, so I never actually look at the music for very long before it starts to "get in the way" and I'm looking at the keyboard again.
Being a violinist, I only have to read one clef at a time, but playing the piano I need to read two clefs at a time and do it QUICKLY.
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