But 9 miles is a little short of the mark, for me. I'd like it to get at least 14 miles so I can get to work and back. Then I'd rarely need to use the engine. Still 94 mpg is nothing to sneeze at.
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
How long does it take to charge from dead to fully charged?
Its not enough for me to get to work and back, but I could still drive around town instead of using gas, and I would love to support the technology.
Posted by Glenn Arnold (Member # 3192) on :
quote:How long does it take to charge from dead to fully charged?
It doesn't. In a hybrid, the battery only discharges a small amount of its total capacity before the engine comes back on to recharge it. The battery could probably drive the car (guessing) 50-100 miles, but that would discharge it completely, which would shorten the life of the battery, making it an expensive item to replace.
When the prius came out, the big argument was that the battery would be too expensive to replace, but toyota engineers calculated that since it never discharges more than about 1/10 of full charge, the battery should be able to hold up for over 100,000 miles. In practice the data seems to indicate that the current batteries will probably outlast the car, although performance may degrade somewhat, even if the car lasts 250,000 miles.
Toyota previously claimed that they weren't willing to consider a plug in hybrid because they didn't think they could guarantee the battery. My guess is that the 9 mile range in fully electric mode is the compromise they came up with to ensure that the battery doesn't take too much punishment.
Posted by Zeugma (Member # 6636) on :
A 9 mile range would fit right in with our driving habits at this point... we probably wouldn't touch the gas more than once a week. Neat!
What I'm wondering is how much more our electricity bill would be. Would it be that much of an improvement over buying gas? And, what, do you just run an extension cord out to the car? Posted by Tante Shvester (Member # 8202) on :
I could probably increase the range by getting a 10 mile long extension cord.
I wonder if running the windshield wipers and defroster would cut into the range so that you might get stuck without juice on a rainy day.
Posted by Icarus (Member # 3162) on :
quote:Originally posted by Zeugma: A 9 mile range would fit right in with our driving habits at this point... we probably wouldn't touch the gas more than once a week. Neat!
What I'm wondering is how much more our electricity bill would be. Would it be that much of an improvement over buying gas? And, what, do you just run an extension cord out to the car?
If it's anything like my electric car, charging it will cost far less per mile than gasoline.
quote:Originally posted by Tante Shvester: I could probably increase the range by getting a 10 mile long extension cord.
I wonder if running the windshield wipers and defroster would cut into the range so that you might get stuck without juice on a rainy day.
If your range is more than four miles, you could bring an extension cord with you and plug in at work, if work would let you.
In my car, running electric stuff does diminish my range, but since I don't drive anywhere near the extreme edge of it, it's no big deal. Now, with this car being a hybrid, I don't think either would diminish your range, since that range is for electric only.
Posted by MyrddinFyre (Member # 2576) on :
Very cool.
Posted by OSTY (Member # 1480) on :
Yes, but I would have to ask...How green is a plug in car really? The power still has to be made so unless your house is solar powered, you are still not driving a green vehicle!
Posted by Tante Shvester (Member # 8202) on :
You could always paint it.
Posted by Dagonee (Member # 5818) on :
quote:Yes, but I would have to ask...How green is a plug in car really? The power still has to be made so unless your house is solar powered, you are still not driving a green vehicle!
Electric motors make more efficient use of energy than ICEs, taking into account generation and transmission, and most electrical power plants have better pollution controls than ICEs.
Posted by HollowEarth (Member # 2586) on :
quote:Originally posted by OSTY: Yes, but I would have to ask...How green is a plug in car really? The power still has to be made so unless your house is solar powered, you are still not driving a green vehicle!
Please. Do you think everything that goes into a truly "green vehicle" is non-petroluem based? And its much much easier to make a power plant cleaner than it is to make a car cleaner. Power plants are generally more efficient as well.
This sort of FUD wastes everyone's time.
Posted by OSTY (Member # 1480) on :
Actually in many cases as pointed out here. I would be greener to drive a combustion vehicle then to drive a electric car if you are receiving your power from a coal powered plant. Which here in the midwest most of use are. I don't know about power on the coasts. Imagine if a large number of people decided to get electirc plug in cars. Plants would need to produce more electricity, which right now is a problem in some areas with out that.
Posted by Glenn Arnold (Member # 3192) on :
Some of the other numbers are completely favorable for EV's, but it looks like CO2 and NOx are even for ICE and EV at 49% coal.
The SO2 numbers don't surprise me at all for coal. Coal is a dirty fuel, but then I wonder if they have accounted for whether the sulfer goes into the atmosphere or whether it comes out in scrubbers.
There's also lots of room for improvment in NOx emissions, which is probably what Bush means when he keeps talking about "clean coal" technology.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
I can't say I blame him for wanting to find a way to make clean coal work. Personally I haven't seen enough data to think it's going to be ready before cost effective renewable energy would be, but the US could live off coal for a long, long, long time with what we have here, which is why they are trying to turn it into gasoline (which they've done, or rather something close to gas, it just costs too much to mass produce), and make the energy of the past into the energy of the future.
But there's still a lot of work to go on that front.
Posted by Bob_Scopatz (Member # 1227) on :
Other issues are distribution of the emissions and overall efficiency of power generated/particular emission output.
Distribution MOST urban areas in the US have problems with EPA compliance. Power generation usually takes place remotely -- at the very least the power station is not right in the central business district where pollution from cars is typically worst.
efficiency Power stations have well known characteristics for emissions per kw of power generated. This changes with how close the plant is to running at capacity. Anything that can shift power production to times of the day when the plant is below peak efficiency is a good thing. Anything that increases the usage during peak hours is generally bad. Charging EVs at night is going to be a good thing. Charging them while you're at work might not be so good. It all depends on power generation profiles in your area.
One other note: the economics of EVs makes it important to include the eventual replacement cost of batteries into the per-mile cost. It's a legitimate per-mile expenditure for comparison between EVs and other modes of transportation because it IS a cost that someone will bear, eventually. In addition, the cost of battery recycling (or, horrors, disposal) is worth considering.
![[Smile]](smile.gif)