On Friday! This is gonna be my first trip, and I can't wait. We're gonna stay at the Hilton, a block off the strip, which has 15 restaurants. Good golly that's a lot. There's a casino in the hotel too, but I don't know if we'll do most of our gambling there or not. Anyone have any suggestions on good casinos? Cheap casinos? High class casinos?
I'm trying to learn how to play certain games as fast as I can, but I can't access gambling websites, so I'm kinda stuck. Anyone play craps? Is it hard? What are the odds? How about TX Hold 'Em? I hear it's a losing bet at casinos, but I don't know how it works. I do well when playing friends, is it very different?
So, tell me about your trips to Vegas! How was it? Share a funny/horrifying story! What did you do? What did you see? Tell me where the best/cheapest buffet is! Any good shows that are a must see?
Posted by Luet13 (Member # 9274) on :
Ooh, Vegas. Vegas is fun.
My suggestion: Make use of the cheap bus that runs up and down the strip. My friends and I didn't realize how cheap it was until the last day, therefore we walked. FOREVER. Those hotels are huge, so you think, oh i'll just walk to the next one, well each one is like four to eight blocks long. Gah. So yeah, take the bus.
My favorite hotel/casino we visited was at the Belagio. That place was just pretty. Also that was where Cirque du Soleil was doing 'O'. So that's my next suggestion: see a Cirque du Soleil show. They're expensive, but they're worth it.
Random fact: you can drink on the street there, walk and drink, etc. I found this odd. Also you can smoke absolutely everywhere.
Have a great trip!
Edit: To remove curse word. - Luet
[ October 11, 2006, 04:14 PM: Message edited by: Luet13 ]
Posted by El JT de Spang (Member # 7742) on :
Dear lord, I love Vegas.
If you really want to learn craps, the best place is just south of Vegas. There's a giant casino in Henderson (~10 miles south on I-15) that has 25 cent craps tables. They also have a pretty good buffet (for the money).
The best buffet in town is at the Aladdin (especially the Saturday champagne brunch). Be early, and be advised -- it's pricey. Like 30 bucks or so. But it's incredible.
All casinos are the same -- if you want cheap table games go to a low rent one (Westward Ho has cheap tables and cheap food). Caesar's and the really nice ones are worth walking around in, but they're expensive to gamble in.
Each casino has at least one danceclub, and usually a few specialty bars as well. Look around.
Posted by vonk (Member # 9027) on :
quote:So yeah, take the bus
Will do. Thats a great tip, and we probably wouldn't have known about it otherwise. Thanks!
If the Cirque du Soleil is expensive, we'll probably skip it. I would love to see the show, but I want to focus my monetary attention on gambling and boozing. Boozing on the street, apparently. Excellent. (<--a la Mr. Burns)
Posted by vonk (Member # 9027) on :
quote:All casinos are the same -- if you want cheap table games go to a low rent one (Westward Ho has cheap tables and cheap food). Caesar's and the really nice ones are worth walking around in, but they're expensive to gamble in.
Awesome, that is exactly what I'm looking for. Cheap places to gamble, eat and drink and then walk around and look at the pretty expensive things.
And 25 cent craps? Can't win much that way, eh?
Posted by TheGrimace (Member # 9178) on :
As for what to gamble on, it largely depends on your motivation... when I was there last I spent something like 60 bucks on a couple hours of texas hold-em, I think it was at the Mirage. For me, I was spending the money on a few hours of entertainment with the potential to actually make some of it back (which happens to be the mindset I find best to keep you out of trouble when gambling) however, you're probably right that you're not going to come home with 30 times your starting cash unless you play there for many hours (but it depends on how much you enjoy just playing)
but that's my general suggestion if you're going for entertainment, I set aside about what it would cost to go to one of the shows and instead spent that playing cards.
if you're looking to have a chance at raking in the big bucks though, then yes I think craps is what I've heard has the best possibilities, but I for the life of me have no idea how to play the game.
Posted by vonk (Member # 9027) on :
Haha, me too. Something about snake eyes, I think.
I'm planning on setting aside a certain amount of money for gambling, cutting it in half and spending half on table games and half on nickel slots while I get schnockered for free.
I do want to play hold 'em, i'm just a little nervous. But 60 bucks for a couple of hours doesn't sound too bad. I do really enjoy playing, and it would probably be a great learning experience.
Posted by Bokonon (Member # 480) on :
Your best odds are at craps, and then either Black Jack or roullette, I always forget which. Slot machines are the worst bet in town.
Poker (the hold 'em and stud varieties, not the moer exotic "Carribbean" which is set up differently) works on a more "service" level. The casino doesn't have any interest in the results of the hand; they don't play a hand. Instead, they provide a service (they shuffle and deal, and adjudicate the game). As a result they usually take a 10-15% cut of every pot. As well, if you win a buig pot for the stakes of your poker level, it's considered proper etiquette to tip the dealer... Usually 5% or so of the pot you just won is acceptable.
Honestly though, stick to craps. It can be a bit overwhelming at first (the different bets), but I would recommend sticking to betting on the Pass line. It can be a great group game, since your winnings depend on the other people at the table.
Of course, if you want people to hate you, bet the "No Pass" line.
-Bok
Posted by Silent E (Member # 8840) on :
If you want to see cool stuff, stay on the Strip between Mandalay Bay and TI. The sights are enough to make your eyes bug out, either in the day or, especially, at night. Almost everything is very expensive in that area, unless you stick to sightseeing and people watching, which can be very entertaining.
If you want cheap gambling and food, go Downtown. They're all old casinos there, so you also get the flavor of "old Vegas", but that mostly just means that things are smaller, more rundown, less flashy (except the Fremont Street Experience, after dark), and the waitresses are older. The Golden Nugget is actually a very nice place, because it's the only casino in that area whose owners actually seem to care about it. Some of the buffets are really quite good, and less than $10. I like the one at the Fremont, which is where most of the Vegas scenes were shot in the movie Swingers.
Posted by Bokonon (Member # 480) on :
Basic Craps, from a web site:
Essentially there is a "shooter" (roller) who rolls the dice that everyone is betting on. There are essentially 2 chances to bet: before the first roll of a new game, and immediately following the first roll of the game. Below are the basic bets:
Pass Line Bet - You win if the first roll is a natural (7, 11) and lose if it is craps (2, 3, 12). If a point is rolled (4, 5, 6, 8, 9, 10) it must be repeated before a 7 is thrown in order to win. If 7 is rolled before the point you lose.
Don't Pass Line Bet - This is the reversed Pass Line bet. If the first roll of a dice is a natural (7, 11) you lose and if it is a 2 or a 3 you win. A dice roll of 12 means you have a tie or push with the casino. If the roll is a point (4, 5, 6, 8, 9, 10) a 7 must come out before that point is repeated to make you a winner. If the point is rolled again before the 7 you lose.
-Bok
Posted by Boothby171 (Member # 807) on :
You have to see the Rio Sky Parade (off strip, and the show is free), Blue Man Group at the Venetian, KA at the MGM Grand, and Zumanity at the NY NY Casino (be warned, though--it's quite risque!)
Why?
Because I designed a lot of them! Well, a lot of all of them!
Plus, if you're at the Hilton, you'll have to check out the Star Trek ride (worked on that, a little, too).
And even though i had absolutely nothing to do with it, the outside water show (fountains) at the Bellagio is amazing!
Posted by vonk (Member # 9027) on :
OK, so cheap stuff, go Downtown, the Golden Nugget especially. Good sightseeing and people watching between Mandalay Bay and TI (what is that?). "Pass line bet" if I don't want to get in a fight. In poker you play other people, not the casino, so if they're really good, or have a big stack, I'll lose. Great info!
Boothby - that's a lot to see, and sounds expensive, but the free show sounds great. And there are rides at the hotel? You mean like rollercoasters?
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
You have 50% odds if you play roulette. Play the black/red spaces.
My best friend lost $30 doing it but I earned $100 before stopping.
I agreed to lose up to $50 before stopping, and if I earned $100 on top of my money I would stop.
Put $10 down on red (or black if you want, ignore the number squares), if you win KEEP your $10 bet on that red/black square do not add or take away from it, you only increase $10 every time you win. If you lose put down $20. If you lose again put down $30. If you lose again walk away.
This way you only need to win once to earn back all the money you lose form a losing streak.
It was tense, it was fun, I came out of it a winner, then vowed never to gamble again. Without my best friend there to keep me on track I would definately get sucked into losing more money then I would gain.
Posted by vonk (Member # 9027) on :
Wow, 50% odds! That sounds like the way to go. But I don't think I'll be able to stop at $100. Or -$50 for that matter. Here's hoping! But my friends are more likely to be all "c'mon, lets bet more money, we might win!"
Posted by pH (Member # 1350) on :
Ooooh, a Vegas thread!
We're talking about going there in mid-December. AAA has some really nice deals on great hotels/airfare. The catch is that you have to pay for it all up-front.
-pH
Posted by El JT de Spang (Member # 7742) on :
You do not have a 50% chance of winning at roulette, and your system is a common one that doesn't work long term. Actually, it's most commonly stated that you just pick red or black and you double your bet everytime you lose.
But statistically speaking, it won't give you 50%. There are 38 slots, and two of them are neither red nor black (the 0 and 00, which are green). So your odds of winning betting either red or black all night (or to infinity) are 47%.
Not bad, for a casino, but still a losing proposition.
Posted by fugu13 (Member # 2859) on :
BlackBlade: on roulette wheels, there's one or two (depending on style) places that are neither black nor red. The odds are not 50%.
Posted by vonk (Member # 9027) on :
Well, 47% ain't a whole lote worse than 50%.
Posted by TheGrimace (Member # 9178) on :
vonk: TI = Treasure Island
Posted by El JT de Spang (Member # 7742) on :
It's a whole lot worse than sitting in your room and betting successively higher amounts on repeated coinflips.
Posted by fugu13 (Member # 2859) on :
It is in a casino.
Played properly (and well within what one can pick up in a few minutes practice given a list of dos and don'ts), blackjack only gives the house a 1% advantage, instead of the slightly over 5% advantage the house has at roulette (with two zeros, such as in US casinos) betting on a color.
Played really well, blackjack tilts in your favor, but its very hard and the casinos don't like it .
In fact, Blackjack, Craps, Baccarat, and several varieties of Poker vs. the house have better odds than roulette (to name some prominent games).
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
quote:Originally posted by fugu13: BlackBlade: on roulette wheels, there's one or two (depending on style) places that are neither black nor red. The odds are not 50%.
Your right I forgot about that. There are 2 spaces that are green and so you don't win if the ball lands there regardless of whether you played black or red. But 47% isnt much worse then 50%
Just enough to insure the house will eventually win.
I didn't come up with the strategy, I just used it and came out ahead. If I played infinitely I would of course run out of money in the end. But the odds are still good enough to give you a winning streak you can take advantage of.
edit:
Black Jack is still in the casinos favor even though the dealer has to stand on (I believe its 17, could be 18).
The fact you have to play before the house is what makes it worse then 50/50.
But there are the card counters (I personally think its unfair for card counters to be forbidden from play) and they play blackjack so that should tell you something.
Posted by El JT de Spang (Member # 7742) on :
Odds have nothing to do with it, in that case. You can keep raising your bet on any game in the casino and if you're lucky and patient enough to wait for a winning streak and smart enough to quit at the right point during it you can win money most times. But over the course of your lifetime you can bet you'll lose more money at the casino than you'll win.
As long as you're okay with that going in you'll have fun.
Posted by El JT de Spang (Member # 7742) on :
quote:But there are the card counters (I personally think its unfair for card counters to be forbidden from play) and they play blackjack so that should tell you something.
Card counting and using basic strategy yield a longterm advantage over the house of ~2%. Each percentage point when you're talking about this amount of money and games is enormous.
Posted by vonk (Member # 9027) on :
quote:Originally posted by El JT de Spang: It's a whole lot worse than sitting in your room and betting successively higher amounts on repeated coinflips.
Alright! My trip is planned now!
Posted by vonk (Member # 9027) on :
I figure the best way to approach casino gambling is to have an "I'm gonna spend x amount of cash for the great experience" rather than "I'm gonna gamble and try to make some money!" I am setting aside a set amount of money that I fully intend to loose gambling. If I don't lose, well that's awesome, but if I do, well, that's what I'm there for.
quote:and well within what one can pick up in a few minutes practice given a list of dos and don'ts
Would you happen to know where one can get this list?
quote:Baccarat
Burt?
Posted by El JT de Spang (Member # 7742) on :
You can even print this out and sit it in front of you on the table. But honestly, that's a boring way to play.
All you need to know about blackjack is that you always assume the next card out of the deck will be a ten (or facecard, obviously). And then you decide, based on what the dealer's showing, whether the ten will be better for you or for him. You also always assume the dealer has a ten down.
In other words, if you have a 13 and the dealer's showing a 6, you stay. But if he's showing a 7, you hit. Assuming that in the first case he has a 16, which he'll hit and bust on, and a 17 in the second case, which he'll stay on.
Other than that, always double down on 11 and always split aces. Have fun.
Posted by vonk (Member # 9027) on :
Wow, those are fantastic tips. I might just print out that post and put it in front of me. I can't open the link right now, but I will check it out later.
Posted by King of Men (Member # 6684) on :
If I did the calculation correctly, the odds of winning a 'pass' bet in craps are 49.3%. [/random]
Posted by fugu13 (Member # 2859) on :
There've been a few famous teams of blackjack players (you mainly need the team to prevent the casino from realizing what's going on), notably from MIT, who've taken casinos for quite a bit of money by careful application of probability theory.
Yeah, but it's the team that allows you to circumvent the 2% return. That number is based on a single player.
Of course, it's my understanding that team play will no longer fly in Vegas, no matter how subtle or skilled you are.
Posted by BaoQingTian (Member # 8775) on :
I live in Carson City (the state capitol), I wonder if teams for blackjack are watched as closely. It seems like it's mostly the retirees and locals that gamble here. If anyone comes to the area specifically to gamble, they'll most likely take the 20 minute drive to Reno or South Lake Tahoe where there's a lot flashier places to gamble. So it might be easier to get away with something like that here.
Posted by OSTY (Member # 1480) on :
If you are staying at the Hilton (we stayed there the first time we were in Vegas) ask about taking lessons on any games you want to learn to play. The casino is really good about teaching you the games and then when we were at the hilton we got some free chips to gamble with.
There are so many great things to see. Try to spend some time seeing everything. And if you need a little extra Cash there is a TV viewer panel place in the MGM that will pay you to watch a 30-60 minute show. My wife got paid $50 to do a focus group and I got paid $25 to play video games for 10 minutes and then tell them about the advertisements I saw within the game.
Posted by vonk (Member # 9027) on :
quote:And if you need a little extra Cash there is a TV viewer panel place in the MGM that will pay you to watch a 30-60 minute show.
Woah! That's awesome. I will have to check that out, as I assume I will be broke by the end.
Good golly I'm goin' to Vegas tomorrow! Squeeee!
Hmm, I wonder if I can put together a blackjack scamming team with absolutely no starting talent in less than 24 hours?
Posted by Bokonon (Member # 480) on :
Just remember that Casinos are private property, so they can kick you out and ban you and your no-talent team, regardless of any law-breaking. Happened to some of the founders of the company I worked for, who were members of one of the several MIT teams back in the day.
-Bok
Posted by vonk (Member # 9027) on :
So, you're saying that standing around talking about how much scamming we're about to do isn't a good idea?
Posted by fugu13 (Member # 2859) on :
Oh, the casino will let your amateur blackjack card-counting team keep on playing. You'll be messing up, and an incorrectly played system is worse than a correctly played set of simple heuristics .
Posted by vonk (Member # 9027) on :
Awesome! Me and my amateur, no-talent, invisible super hero blackjack scamming team are gonna be rich!
Posted by Bokonon (Member # 480) on :
Exactly.
(On both counts, vonk and fugu)
-Bok
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
quote:Originally posted by BaoQingTian: I live in Carson City (the state capitol), I wonder if teams for blackjack are watched as closely. It seems like it's mostly the retirees and locals that gamble here. If anyone comes to the area specifically to gamble, they'll most likely take the 20 minute drive to Reno or South Lake Tahoe where there's a lot flashier places to gamble. So it might be easier to get away with something like that here.
I know Carson City is the capital of Nevada, Looney Toons taught me this.
Theres an episode where a gangster asks Bugs Bunny "How much do you know?" Bugs replies with "oh! I know lots of things..." Among the list of random fact he spews out its that Carson city is the capital of Nevada. I've always retained that little tid bit.
Looney Toons did not just teach me how to properly setup TNT or that anything can be ordered from Acme and Ace.
Posted by El JT de Spang (Member # 7742) on :
quote:Originally posted by BaoQingTian: I live in Carson City (the state capitol), I wonder if teams for blackjack are watched as closely. It seems like it's mostly the retirees and locals that gamble here. If anyone comes to the area specifically to gamble, they'll most likely take the 20 minute drive to Reno or South Lake Tahoe where there's a lot flashier places to gamble. So it might be easier to get away with something like that here.
Easier in the sense that they're probably less vigilant about checking for things like that. Harder because the limits are lower, for one, and to really make a profit you need to play as many hands at as high a limit as you can for as long the cards are in your favor. Also harder because the consequences would likely be much harsher if you're caught in a place like Carson City or Reno than if you're caught in Vegas.
Vegas is now pretty corporate; they'd probably kick you out and ban you at worst. Indian Casinos and privately held casinos -- who knows what they'd do to cheaters.
Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
quote:And 25 cent craps? Can't win much that way, eh?
You can't lose that much either! The swings in craps can be absolutely outrageous. Even on a $5 table you can lose or win a matter of hundreds of dollars in minutes, or less. Assuming you're betting on more than just the pass line, which is where all the fun is. Craps is by far the most fun game at the casino, but extremely dangerous! be careful. Though, i must say, my first time ever playing craps i was down to my last $30 at a casino and decided I'd throw it away to learn how to play craps which i had never played before. An hour later I had recouped all my losses, actually ended $60 in the positive for the night, and learned craps sufficiently well.
quote:But 60 bucks for a couple of hours doesn't sound too bad. I do really enjoy playing, and it would probably be a great learning experience.
I don't know where you're going to play Texas Holdem where you can actually buy in for this low amount of money and even more so make it last that long. I think the cheapest tables are 2-4 limit tables. You can conceivably sit down at that table with $60, but I wouldn't recommend it.
quote:You have 50% odds if you play roulette. Play the black/red spaces.
Put $10 down on red (or black if you want, ignore the number squares), if you win KEEP your $10 bet on that red/black square do not add or take away from it, you only increase $10 every time you win. If you lose put down $20. If you lose again put down $30. If you lose again walk away.
This way you only need to win once to earn back all the money you lose form a losing streak.
This has been covered, but it's important to stress how much of a bad idea this is. Not only is a 3% disadvantage a lot more significant than you think, but the system he lays out is wrong. You have to double your bet every time to recoup all your losses on one win. But if you hit a really bad streak(which happens a lot more than you think) you might end up doubling your bet so much to the point where you're laying down $1000 to win your initial $10 bet back. It's not worth the risk. Let alone the fact that you'll most likely run out of money before you get a chance to recoup that loss if you hit a streak of the wrong color for more than 6-10 goes. Just think about it.
I would also suggest going to the bar on the 52nd floor of the Rio. Can't remember the name, but it has this outdoor area where you can see all of the Vegas strip from a few blocks away and 52 floors up. It's beautiful at night.
Posted by vonk (Member # 9027) on :
quote:I would also suggest going to the bar on the 52nd floor of the Rio. Can't remember the name, but it has this outdoor area where you can see all of the Vegas strip from a few blocks away and 52 floors up. It's beautiful at night.
Do you know if it is incredibly expensive or hard to get into? Cause that sounds really cool.
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
Strider I said in my post to have a predetermined amount you are willing to lose. Mine was $50. That means if you lose the first 3 spins you leave. If you rack up some winnings you can afford longer losing streaks. But not by much.
Posted by vonk (Member # 9027) on :
I was considering putting all of the money I intend to gamle away down on one hand of TX Hold 'Em and calling blind all in. That would be fun. For a minute anyway.
Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
quote:Do you know if it is incredibly expensive or hard to get into? Cause that sounds really cool.
no to both those questions. though i can't remember what night or what time we went. there may have been a cover of $10-$20, but i also may be making that up. but there was no wait at all.
And if you're going to put all of your money down on one hand, I'd say go for blackjack.
BlackBlade, yeah, I see what you're saying, but it still sucks to lose. And I think more often than not you'll be on the losing end of that one, so from my perspective, it doesn't even make sense to try. This is also coming from someone who does play roulette every once in a while. But it's only if i've had a really good night and feel like "gambling".
Posted by MyrddinFyre (Member # 2576) on :
Ohh, I love Vegas. Been there five (wait.. six?) times... if booze is part of your plan I'd suggest taking full advantage of the seedier hotels on the strip which try to draw you into their casino with $1 beers and such. The trick is, you're totally allowed to just walk right out with your beers after buying them. You can make your way down the strip this way sometimes.
If you're as huge a geek as me, the Star Trek portion of the LV Hilton is worth checking out >_>
If you're into rides, I've heard the NYNY rollercoaster is quite a trip, as is the Stratosphere. The Atlantis ride at the end of the Forum Shops at Cesaer's Palace is fun, it's a 3d Imax motion ride.
And don't stray off the strip except to see the Rio or Downtown (speaking of downtown, don't miss the Freemont Street Experience, or light show, or whatever they call it).
The Luxor has margaritas to die for.
Posted by pH (Member # 1350) on :
quote:Originally posted by MyrddinFyre: The trick is, you're totally allowed to just walk right out with your beers after buying them. You can make your way down the strip this way sometimes
I assume this means drinking in the street is okay? That's good...I still am not used to not being able to get a to-go cup and stroll around when I'm out of town.
-pH
Posted by vonk (Member # 9027) on :
Awesome! (Man, I must love that word) Thanks for the tips Myr! Sounds like dollar beers is the way to go. But isn't drinking usually free in most casinos? Speaking of, are top shelf drinks free, or just well?
Posted by BaoQingTian (Member # 8775) on :
I actually had a middle aged black homeless man who drew a terrible sketch of me because he didn't take the $20 as charity warn me not to stray off the strip as well. He specifically warned be about the north end of the strip, past the Stratosphere. He said there was quite a bit of drugs and gang activity up there that was best to steer clear of.
Just passing it along.
Posted by El JT de Spang (Member # 7742) on :
Yeah, off the strip can get pretty ghetto. If you have time (most people don't) there are two good outlet malls, one on each end of town. Every major tennis shoe retailer is represented (which is a big deal for me).
Top shelf liquor is free, as are well drinks, but only while gambling. And if you're not playing with pretty big money or get in good with a waitress don't expect to get enough drinks to do you any good. In my experience, the 'free drinks!' aspect of gambling is one of the most misleading. Yeah, they're free. But you have a tough time getting more than one small, watered down drink every 30 minutes.
Posted by vonk (Member # 9027) on :
Good info. I'm not looking to get mugged or worse.
Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
quote:But you have a tough time getting more than one small, watered down drink every 30 minutes.
Hey, when you're sitting down for an 8 hour poker session, a drink every 30 minutes is MORE than enough.
And like in any business, you take care of your waitress and she'll take care of you.
Posted by vonk (Member # 9027) on :
quote:Yeah, they're free. But you have a tough time getting more than one small, watered down drink every 30 minutes.
Well that sucks. But I guess its better to get rid of my disillusions before I get there.
Is a dollar a drink adequate for casino cocktail tipping?
Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
i usually tip $1 a drink. Sometimes I might start off with a few bucks or tip extra if i have special requests, but yeah $1 average. Also, if the drinks are watered down, ask for a double shot. I always ask for extra kahlua in my white russians.
Posted by vonk (Member # 9027) on :
*sigh*
Well, that was an incredibly expensive trip. I've never seen a paycheck disappear so quickly, and so completely. I didn't stick to my betting limit at all, and lost just about everything.
For the most part we played roulette, and did ok, until I got greedy/drunk and lost it all stupidly. Then we played slots for a while, and man did that hurt. I figured nickel slots would be a breeze, but I didn't take into account that I was betting on nine lines at a time with double credits. That's almost a dollar a bet. Ouch.
Towards the end a friend convinced me to play some poker and that's what I should have been doing all along. I lost the buy-in for that particular game, due to exessive amounts of bourbon and 7 I'm sure, but did pretty well throughout the game. I think that had I been playing cards the whole time, I would have come up at least even in the end. Oh well.
But man did we see some awesome things. We didn't get all the way down to the MGM or Bilogio(sp?) but we did see the Wynn and the Venitian. Both were incredibly amazing in the sheer waste of money spent on absolutely everything visible. The Venitian impressed me especially much. The carport and lobby were frankly amazing and I was gaping like a fool for quite some time. TI was pretty cool too, and we saw the Sirens of TI show, which was nice, but way too crowded. The Golden Nugget was a dump and gave almost everyone in our group an asthma attack. It was packed and took almost a half an hour to get a seat at any of the tables.
But we had a blast, over all. The money was spent and we all had a good time, so I guess it was worth it. Next time, I'm not going to take my entire paycheck though.
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
![[Wink]](wink.gif)
.![[Frown]](frown.gif)
Well that sucks. But I guess its better to get rid of my disillusions before I get there.