The following shouldn't be disclosed to OSC! We don't want him to spend time away from writing books!
But there is an amazing new strategy game out called MAKING HISTORY: THE CALM AND THE STORM. It's made by a company called Muzzy Lane and aims to be a historically accurate strategy game of the WW2 era. Until now, it was mainly used in class rooms, but now they're gearing up to sell the game to the wider public as well.
I first learned about it in an article in NEW YORK where the famous historian Niall Ferguson praised it highly. http://newyorkmetro.com/news/features/22787/index.html Ferguson: "Based on a combination of system dynamics, a technology designed to generate simulated scenarios from real-world data, The Calm & the Storm has a completely different feel from any other war game I’ve played. To begin with, it is based on a quite astonishing quantity of factual information about the war."
The company has just released a free demo, I'v played a few games and I'm impressed. I recommend it. And no, I have "no financial interest" in Muzzy Lane
You confuse me.
Posted by Rakeesh (Member # 2001) on :
This reads like spam, making me doubt the truthfulness of the claim being made.
Posted by Icarus (Member # 3162) on :
Can you make a good living posting on bulletin boards?
'cause I'd quit my day job tomorrow . . .
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
But I don't like spam!
Posted by Megan (Member # 5290) on :
I'll have yours, then; I love spam!
Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
it reads like a total spam, possibly even a bot. yet i looked at his posting history and it seems legit.
Posted by Icarus (Member # 3162) on :
Wouldn't be the first time.
Posted by erosomniac (Member # 6834) on :
Where's Alcon? We need some plant accusations. Posted by Michiel (Member # 7649) on :
Guys, it's not spam! I am just very happily reporting on this excellent game, which may be of interest to others here.
I am sad to being accused of being a "bot". ..
Posted by Mr.Funny (Member # 4467) on :
Nobody said you were a bot. They just said that you were spamming.
[Edit: Never mind, I missed Strider's post.]
Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
Michiel, nobody is accusing you of being a "bot." [though Strider notes the possibility, as I see now] If I am reading this situation correctly, you are [primarily] being accused of being a "plant;" i.e., not an automated spamming program, but a real livin' & breathin' person who sets up a history and relationships at a site in order to insert product promotion for which he or she has some sort of vested interest.
Or, perhaps, decides later to shill at a site where he or she is already a member. See also "tool."
I'm sorry if you are not a shill. The reaction you are getting would be quite disheartening. But you sound, look, and smell like one. Really, you do. You give off ultraviolet waves of it.
Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
You know, you are welcome to get involved in other conversations here, should this all be a misunderstanding. Tell us more about yourself, what you are thinking about and doing in your life. Get to know people, let us really get to know you.
Posted by Puffy Treat (Member # 7210) on :
Does someone have the URL of the Penny Arcade strip about message board "plants"? I can't remember it. Posted by Euripides (Member # 9315) on :
...or just wait until your post count is a tad higher.
Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
quote:This marketing plan actually refers to "Hiring viral specialists to advocate NBA Live online via chat rooms targeting gaming fan sites" and "Placing offensive, defensive and PR shills into common gaming chat arenas."
quote:It's all very measurable and very effective. You should see the monthly reports you get from these guys: everything is detailed. Spooky.
quote:It's all very insidious and, I'm sure, widespread. So much so that I don't trust anything I read. Unless it's a board where I "know" the posters, I always assume everyone on the board is a shill.
Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
quote:Guys, it's not spam! I am just very happily reporting on this excellent game, which may be of interest to others here.
It's just that when a new name with a really low post count starts a thread basically advertising a product, warning signs go up. Plus, it seemed odd to bring up OSC in the thread title just to recommend a game completely unrelated to OSC. And not being familiar with your posting style, I can only assume you talk like an infomercial in real life too(sorry, couldn't help it).
If you're sincerely recommending a game you think other people here would like, then I am sorry. But you have to see how this thread looks to other people, and I question whether I'm giving too much credit by even saying this.
Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
CT, the *really* insidious thing about that tactic is that those links that they insert, unless the thread gets deleted, will boost traffic to their site even if people on the forum don't click on it.
Posted by Tante Shvester (Member # 8202) on :
Hey, when I started here, I was accused of being a bot.
I'm no bot.
Really.
But, have you guys heard about Chicken Soup (tm)? Actual Scientific Studies have shown it to be a useful remedy for common cold, flu, dandruff and "that special time of the month". Made only from wholesome natural ingredients, it tastes great and is great for you. Chicken Soup(tm) had been highly valued by indigenous cultures throughout history. That "mess of pottage" that Esau sold his birthright for? Chicken Soup(tm) with Matzah Balls. The "pot of gold" at the end of the leprechaun rainbow? Chicken Soup(tm) with noodles. The "hidden treasure of El Dorado"? Chicken Soup(tm).
Actual archaeological and anthropological discoveries prove this!
Personally, at one time, I was very sickly, and suffered from halitosis, post nasal drip and some kind of rash. After eating just one bowl of Chicken Soup(tm) a day, I found myself to be in radiant health after just FIVE DAYS! It is the secret to longevity of those really old people in those remote mountains in Georgia, too! They live to be well over 100 and maintained in full vigor without any complaints of dandruff or athlete's foot fungus! Really!
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
I eat my chicken soup raw with organ meats.
Posted by Dagonee (Member # 5818) on :
quote:Plus, it seemed odd to bring up OSC in the thread title just to recommend a game completely unrelated to OSC.
This part made sense to me, because it strikes me as the kind of game OSC might like, and there have been references to not doing anything to distract OSC from Master Alvin/Ender in Flight/Rasputin/etc. in the past.
Posted by Michiel (Member # 7649) on :
I'm very sorry if I have annoyed anyone with posting this.
And I realize that 'only the paranoid survive', but in this case this wasn't justified. I am real person, not a "bot", a "tool", a "shill", a "plant" and even emitting "smells" (as if the gas smell here in Manhattan this morning wasn't enough)...
Just for the record, I am a real person, a genuine fan of OSC, I have been reading his books for fifteen years. I discovered this board quite a while ago as well. Obviously I have been doing more reading than posting here, but I hope that isn't a problem.
All I wanted to do is share my genuine enthusiasm for what I think is a great game with other people who might share my interests.
I know I can't prove this to your skeptical satisfaction, but I have absolutely nothing to do with the game developers. My day job is keeping me plenty busy, thank you very much!
But I apologize if anyone disliked reading this.
Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
Tante, where can I find this marvelous Chicken Soup(tm) you speak of? Is it possible that it would be available for purchase somewhere?? Can you provide a link???
quote:and there have been references to not doing anything to distract OSC from Master Alvin/Ender in Flight/Rasputin/etc. in the past.
OSC is posting a lot on the other side of the forum. Kind of narcissistic right? Posted by Farmgirl (Member # 5567) on :
Michiel, I think the wording of the original post just kind of caught us off guard and all. That, and you don't post enough that we recognized your SN from being here over a year.
Don't let our initial reaction run you off.
I'll mention the game to my son. He always loves to try out new strategy games, and especially loves that era.
FG
Posted by Strider (Member # 1807) on :
Europa Universalis was a great game.
Sorry Michiel, I hope my words didn't hurt you in any way, and if they did I apologize.
btw, interesting spelling of your name. What's that from?
Posted by Michiel (Member # 7649) on :
It's the Dutch variant of Michael.
Posted by Jon Boy (Member # 4284) on :
For what it's worth, it wouldn't have even crossed my mind that you were possibly a plant if nobody had mentioned it.
Posted by I Am The War Chief (Member # 9266) on :
It still really sounds like you hired Bob Barker or his little announcer to tell me what ive won . . . and why its great Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
Crossed my mind. Then again for a WW2 strategy game, I don't even care if he's a plant so long as the game is good.
After reading some of the site, there's a good article on it about using video games as teaching tools. It'll be interesting if someday I can assign some RTS WW2 games as homework to kids.
[ January 08, 2007, 03:12 PM: Message edited by: Lyrhawn ]
Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
Michiel, I was unsettled by some of the wording and by the all-capital letters, as these are characteristic of products pitches via spam here in the States.
It'd be great to learn that this was all a misunderstanding exacerbated by English as a non-first-language. I think the longer you stay and get engaged in the community, the more people will relax about this incident.
So, you are Dutch and currently living in New York? That's fascinating. Could you tell us more about yourself and what brought you here?
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
i like Hearts of Iron II better. and eu2 is a good game.
Posted by Jon Boy (Member # 4284) on :
quote:Originally posted by Tante Shvester: Personally, at one time, I was very sickly, and suffered from halitosis, post nasal drip and some kind of rash. After eating just one bowl of Chicken Soup(tm) a day, I found myself to be in radiant health after just FIVE DAYS! It is the secret to longevity of those really old people in those remote mountains in Georgia, too! They live to be well over 100 and maintained in full vigor without any complaints of dandruff or athlete's foot fungus! Really!
But will it fix my crooked teeth and narrow rib cage?
Posted by Tante Shvester (Member # 8202) on :
You betcha!
Posted by Olivet (Member # 1104) on :
I must confess... I'm a plant. Hibiscus, actually. I've spent the last seven years earning your trust, only to seduce you with my succulent leaves and gaudy blossoms.
That long, wordy Landmark was just to win your sympathy.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
Fiend!
I think you'd better make like a tree and leaf.
Posted by FlyingCow (Member # 2150) on :
That's a pretty bold stamen, Olivet - I think you might be pollen our legs. Then again, you've always been quite the pistil...
Posted by Tante Shvester (Member # 8202) on :
Let the deflowering jokes ensue!
Posted by Noemon (Member # 1115) on :
Oh, surely we can stem the tide of those.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
hehehe.
Posted by Little_Doctor (Member # 6635) on :
I was accused of being a n00b once. Does that count? Either way, I showed them!
*shakes fist*
Posted by Kwea (Member # 2199) on :
We have also had an influx of bot spam lately. Most of it was caught by people who post here before the mods caught it.
I wasn't sure, but I got the "don't tell OSC" bit of it so I was withholding judgment.
Welcome, BTW.
Posted by Papa Moose (Member # 1992) on :
We've had an influx of spam accounts being registered, too -- I've tried to get rid of most of them before they have a chance to post, but since it's not only a manual process, but something I have to ask someone else to do, it's a bit much to keep up on. And I don't want to delete the new account of a real person, so I'm sure plenty of them get through. I'm also sure plenty of them register with the plan of waiting a long time before posting, and plenty register not realizing that a real actual e-mail account is needed, so probably a quarter of all registration e-mails bounce back to me.
Not that I'm complaining or anything.
--Pop
Posted by Noemon (Member # 1115) on :
quote:Originally posted by Little_Doctor: I was accused of being a n00b once. Does that count? Either way, I showed them!
*shakes fist*
Back in yer cage, newbie! ::cracks whip::
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
So I downloaded the demo of the game being touted here.
It's a lot of fun. It's a 20 turn demo, and everytime it hits 20 turns and shuts off I curse at the thing. Apparently it takes more than 20 turns to see if a surprise attack into Alscasce Lorraine by the French will work to put the Germans on a defensive footing, but it's nice to see the British jumped in to help me as soon as I did it.
Playing a smaller nation, like France is actually fairly easy, to manage the economics, military, diplomacy, etc. But playing the US us almost unwieldly there's so much to deal with. I left half of it alone, trusting that everything would just naturally work out.
It was a lot of fun, and I'll probably buy the full scale version if/when it's out, depending on how much it is. I think it'll be a blast to play on multiplayer, and if other Hatrackers get it, let me know immediately.
Posted by Euripides (Member # 9315) on :
quote:Originally posted by Lyrhawn:
It'll be interesting if someday I can assign some RTS WW2 games as homework to kids.
Lyrhawn, you want to be a teacher?
quote:Originally posted by Lyrhawn:
It was a lot of fun, and I'll probably buy the full scale version if/when it's out, depending on how much it is. I think it'll be a blast to play on multiplayer, and if other Hatrackers get it, let me know immediately.
I found out about this a while ago and intend to buy it. Time permitting, count me in.
But remember, we have that Greek gender roles project lined up.
One of these days I'll get off my butt, drive to the university library, and update the Sparta thread.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
Yes I want to be a teacher, or at least, that's what I'm going to school for, so I hope it works out. I'm planning to be a secondary education history teacher.
Is the full version of the game even out yet? How much is it?
I'm game for the Greek project, I'm going to have a few hours a week of spare time not taken up by reading for fun or Guitar Hero that I can devote to side projects. Just let me know when you're ready and where you want to start.
Posted by Euripides (Member # 9315) on :
Excellent. One the main role models in my life was a high school history teacher.
It should be coming out in February. You can pre-order a boxed version for $40. I will be downloading it when it comes out, for obvious reasons.
Sure thing. I'll get the list of cities to start our research.
Posted by Euripides (Member # 9315) on :
Sorry, I forgot the pre-order link.
Posted by Michiel (Member # 7649) on :
quote:Originally posted by Lyrhawn: So I downloaded the demo of the game being touted here.
It's a lot of fun. It's a 20 turn demo, and everytime it hits 20 turns and shuts off I curse at the thing. Apparently it takes more than 20 turns to see if a surprise attack into Alscasce Lorraine by the French will work to put the Germans on a defensive footing, but it's nice to see the British jumped in to help me as soon as I did it.
Playing a smaller nation, like France is actually fairly easy, to manage the economics, military, diplomacy, etc. But playing the US us almost unwieldly there's so much to deal with. I left half of it alone, trusting that everything would just naturally work out.
It was a lot of fun, and I'll probably buy the full scale version if/when it's out, depending on how much it is. I think it'll be a blast to play on multiplayer, and if other Hatrackers get it, let me know immediately.
Glad you liked it. I was experiencing similar feelings at every "20 turn"-moment. You do need a lot of RAM to play the game comfortably. I also just played a round as France. They're in a bind! But I thought the AI tends to be a little bit passive, so multiplayer is probably best. Then again, the game is supposed to be very realistic, so 20 turns isn't much, you're still in 1939 at the end...On the whole, I am quite impressed by this game.
Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
Michiel, not to hound you, but are you interested in getting involved in this community in more ways than just touting this game?
Just checking.
Posted by Euripides (Member # 9315) on :
Sudden Strike is the most realistic WWII RTS I've played, and RO addresses the deficiencies he sees in Medal of Honor. Teamwork is critical in RO; squad leaders actually lead squads, machine gunners need runners to supply them with ammunition, tank commanders tell tank drivers where to go and the gunner what to shoot, and so on. The level of realism is excellent for a first person shooter, or for a computer game of any kind.
Posted by Euripides (Member # 9315) on :
Michiel, I was going to give you the benefit of the doubt, but you are starting to make me suspicious as well.
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
I'm pretty sure that web marketers aren't actually allowed to deny financial interest; this is a violation of law. I'd be very surprised if that isn't mentioned at least once during their orientation. For this reason, I suspect Michiel's just a fanboy.
Heck, if we didn't know any better, we'd assume that Blayne and KoM were trying to get us all to buy Europa Universalis, and twinky was trying to talk us into buying a Wii.
And, y'know, even if he IS lying, at least he's more participatory than a Google Ad.
Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
I'm merely curious.
There isn't anything necessarily wrong with wanting to only discuss one commercial product, in great detail and with glowing words. I just wanted to know if that was where this was going.
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
Given that it's the point of this thread, I sort of hope so. *grin*
Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
Well, yeah, sure. But this may or may not be the only thread Michiel is interested in pursuing. I'd find that helpful information, myself, although of course he is welcome to ignore that request. It isn't his job to address my curiosity.
Life is harsh. One can only hope for occasional directions. Posted by Jon Boy (Member # 4284) on :
CT, I'll admit that I honestly don't understand why you're interrogating Michiel like this. One thing I've always liked about Hatrack is the willingness to accept new members and give them the benefit of the doubt.
Posted by MrSquicky (Member # 1802) on :
Michiel sounds very, very much like a paid plant. I think CT may be pushing him a bit in order to 1) allow him to demonstrate that this isn't true (assuming that it isn't) and 2) encourage him to explore other parts of the forum instead of just promoting a game.
Posted by Jon Boy (Member # 4284) on :
Thank you, but I have been following along. I simply feel that the scrutiny is unwarranted and not in the spirit of this community.
Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
What MrSquicky said. Although I'd like to explicitly acknowledge (again) that I'm not claiming Michiel owes me anything, be it additional participation in the forum or merely an answer to my question/invitation.
He's free to not respond. I invited twice, asked about it specifically once (since he speaks English as a second language -- I think -- I followed the general rule of being as explicit as possible at least once in such circumstances), and now I plan to drop it.
Had he directly indicated, however gently, a lack of interest sooner, I'd have dropped it then. As it is, I've satisfied both my curiosity and my desire to encourage him, as noted by MrSquicky above. That's it for me, although I'll apologize for any bad behavior this has exhibited on my part.
Posted by Rakeesh (Member # 2001) on :
I don't think any apology is necessary, although with CT's stellar personality even an unwarranted one isn't surprising
Basically, we have a situation where someone showed up walking like a duck, wearing feathers with a bill and quacking. Calling that person a duck, or asking, "Hey, are you a duck?" ain't out of line, even if the duckish appearance was just a coincidence.
Posted by Michiel (Member # 7649) on :
quote:Originally posted by Jon Boy: Thank you, but I have been following along. I simply feel that the scrutiny is unwarranted and not in the spirit of this community.
I agree. This is getting absolutely ridiculous. I totally understand you're initial skepticism (even though I think a simple look at my history here would have been sufficient to establish that I am "legit", but fine). But once I explained and re-explained myself I thought we had gotten beyond this nonsense.
If you're so interested in my participation in this forum, I invite you to read all the other threads in this forum going back to March 2005. I am just enthusiastic about this game, and had good reason to suspect others on the board might be as well.
I have read this forum for years before I joined (I only joined to participate in the famous "think of a new for the new Ender book), and this community always struck me as unusually friendly, non-aggressive, and welcoming to new members. Seems I was wrong.
Obviously I cannot prove to you that I don't have financial interests in the Company. I can't prove to you that I don't have financial interests in the SciFi channel either, and still I dared to -enthusiastically- discuss "Battlestar Galactica" in another thread!
You're making me feel awful about participating here.
Posted by Michiel (Member # 7649) on :
quote:Originally posted by ClaudiaTherese: I'm merely curious.
There isn't anything necessarily wrong with wanting to only discuss one commercial product, in great detail and with glowing words. I just wanted to know if that was where this was going.
Obviously you care immensely about this. So you must have read my other posts in other threads. You therefore must *know* that I am NOT here to "just discuss one commercial product".
But whatever, it's pretty clear to me that you that you have convicted me in your mind already, so there is nothing else I can say to persuade you that I am not what you slanderously accuse me of.
Unfortunately, now I must attend to my job. One that does *not* involve chatting on internet bulletin boards, alas.
[ January 09, 2007, 04:43 PM: Message edited by: Michiel ]
Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
quote:Originally posted by Michiel: If you're so interested in my participation in this forum, I invite you to read all the other threads in this forum going back to March 2005.
quote:Obviously you care immensely about this. So you must have read my other posts in other threads. You therefore must *know* that I do am NOT here to "just discuss one commercial product".
I did! When I did, I found that over half of the 25 posts you had were one- or two-liners.
And given that the industry apparently (see my link to Tycho on the prior page) makes a point of having people establish some sort of background on the site, that didn't seem out of the ordinary for this sort of enterprise. [Edited to add: Nor would it be out of the ordinary for someone who speaks English as a second language, mind you. And certainly there is no minimal requirement for a post! It's just that, in context, I wasn't finding something to be reassured about.]
Which is why I asked you more directly. I can see that it was offensive to ask it as a straight-forward question, and I do (and have) apologized for that. I don't have anything to offer you other than my apology and my promise not to intrude in your thread (or other threads you post in) about this any more.
quote:You're making me feel awful about participating here.
I am indeed sorry for this.
---
Edited to add: My job, also alas, is not that of communicating on various online fora. It has just been a day of waiting for returns to pages and emails, and so I have free time on my hands. Apparently, it was not used courteously. That's a shame, and it is my issue.
Posted by Michiel (Member # 7649) on :
quote:Originally posted by Michiel: [QUOTE]Originally posted by Michiel: [qb] [QUOTE]Originally posted by Jon Boy: [qb] Thank you, but I have been following along. I simply feel that the scrutiny is unwarranted and not in the spirit of this community.
I agree. This is getting absolutely ridiculous. I totally understand your initial skepticism (even though I think a simple look at my history here would have been sufficient to establish that I am "legit", but fine). But once I explained and re-explained myself I thought we had gotten beyond this.
If you're so interested in my participation in this forum, I invite you to read all the other threads in this forum going back to March 2005. I am just enthusiastic about this game, and had good reason to suspect others on the board might be as well.
I have read this forum for years before I joined (I only joined to participate in the famous "think of a new for the new Ender book), and this community always struck me as unusually friendly, non-aggressive, and welcoming to new members. Seems I was wrong.
Obviously I cannot prove to you that I don't have financial interests in the Company. I can't prove to you either that I don't have financial interests in the SciFi channel, and still I dared to -enthusiastically- discuss "Battlestar Galactica" in another thread!
You're making me feel awful about participating here.
Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
(Michiel, you might be hitting the "quote" button instead of the "edit" -- I do that all the time myself. Should you want to delete the redundant posts (not that you have to, mind), there is a "delete" option in the edit form.)
Posted by El JT de Spang (Member # 7742) on :
quote:But whatever, it's pretty clear to me that you that you have convicted me in your mind already, so there is nothing else I can say to persuade you that I am not what you slanderously accuse me of.
I'm not a lawyer, but I believe 'slander' only applies to oral statements (not sure where internet communication falls). Plus, I'm pretty sure they have to be false, which, as you've said, you haven't yet proved.
Plus, I think you're being overly defensive. It sucks to be mistaken for a plant, but the surest way to prove that you're not is not to get indignant; it's to show that you do have interests here beyond this game (in my opinion).
Posted by Michiel (Member # 7649) on :
quote:Originally posted by ClaudiaTherese: (Michiel, you might be hitting the "quote" button instead of the "edit" -- I do that all the time myself. Should you want to delete the redundant posts (not that you have to, mind), there is a "delete" option in the edit form.)
Thanks. You know, they don't train us very well in the spamming seminars, but I'm trying to learn on the job. Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
quote:Originally posted by Rakeesh: Basically, we have a situation where someone showed up walking like a duck, wearing feathers with a bill and quacking. Calling that person a duck, or asking, "Hey, are you a duck?" ain't out of line, even if the duckish appearance was just a coincidence.
But we didn't just have that. After saying "No, I am not a duck," he gets asked "So, are you going to do anything here than keep acting like a duck?"
I didn't see anything wrong at all with the initial question, but to keep bringing it up after it's been asked and answered is puzzling.
Posted by King of Men (Member # 6684) on :
quote:we'd assume that Blayne and KoM were trying to get us all to buy Europa Universalis
Well, Tom, actually you should buy Europa Universalis. The third game in the series is due out on the 19th; a perfect opportunity!
Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
quote:Originally posted by Michiel: Thanks. You know, they don't train us very well in the spamming seminars, but I'm trying to learn on the job.
Well, we are taught in the Anti-SPammers league to subtly insinuate ourselves into the good graces of those we are trying to out by offering treats and free prizes.
Given that I am a happily married woman, I am somewhat limited in my repertoire. "Details of UBB" is about as good as I can give.
(Psst -- it's also a well-known secret that the search engine for this site is, shall we say, problematic? Thus I might have missed several of your prior posts, regardless.)
Posted by El JT de Spang (Member # 7742) on :
quote:Thanks. You know, they don't train us very well in the spamming seminars, but I'm trying to learn on the job.
This post does far more to convince me that you're a real boy than any amount of righteous indignation, fwiw.
Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
quote:Originally posted by mr_porteiro_head:
quote:Originally posted by Rakeesh: Basically, we have a situation where someone showed up walking like a duck, wearing feathers with a bill and quacking. Calling that person a duck, or asking, "Hey, are you a duck?" ain't out of line, even if the duckish appearance was just a coincidence.
But we didn't just have that. After saying "No, I am not a duck," he gets asked "So, are you going to do anything here than keep acting like a duck?"
I didn't see anything wrong at all with the initial question, but to keep bringing it up after it's been asked and answered is puzzling.
And, as has been established, offensive.
I beg the indulgence of the Board and vow never to get involved in this sort of thing ever again here. Apparently I find the Gladys Kravitz role well-nigh irresistable.
Posted by Michiel (Member # 7649) on :
quote:Originally posted by ClaudiaTherese: I did! When I did, I found that over half of the 25 posts you had were one- or two-liners.
And given that the industry apparently (see my link to Tycho on the prior page) makes a point of having people establish some sort of background on the site, that didn't seem out of the ordinary for this sort of enterprise. [Edited to add: Nor would it be out of the ordinary for someone who speaks English as a second language, mind you. And certainly there is no minimal requirement for a post! It's just that, in context, I wasn't finding something to be reassured about.]
Which is why I asked you more directly. I can see that it was offensive to ask it as a straight-forward question, and I do (and have) apologized for that. I don't have anything to offer you other than my apology and my promise not to intrude in your thread (or other threads you post in) about this any more.
---
Edited to add: My job, also alas, is not that of communicating on various online fora. It has just been a day of waiting for returns to pages and emails, and so I have free time on my hands. Apparently, it was not used courteously. That's a shame, and it is my issue.
Alright, apologies accepted. I really don't want to abuse the kind hosts of this board and turn this thread into some kind of 'flame war'.
Since it's also obvious to me that it is going to be simply impossible to prove to people with active imaginations that I am not in some ways, if not a bot, then at least a plant (cf. El JT de Spang's recent post) so I won't bother with explicit further responses on this.
ClaudiaTherese: I do speak English as a second language, but I have been in this country for a while, and certainly my foreign background has nothing to do with my posts being short. I can wax verbosely with the best of them. My time being limited is the proximate cause for that.
Enough of this already!
Posted by mr_porteiro_head (Member # 4644) on :
quote:And, as has been established, offensive.
It has? Sorry, I must have missed that. I didn't mean to dogpile.
Posted by Rakeesh (Member # 2001) on :
quote:Enough of this already!
Dude. It's been dropped.
Posted by Euripides (Member # 9315) on :
Yes, let's talk about WWII games. Posted by Euripides (Member # 9315) on :
So Lyrhawn, how is the demo?
I first played as Japan, and felt 'mired' in China, which was historically accurate. Then I played as Germany and gobbled up Yugoslavia, Hungary, Poland, and Alsace-Lorraine before the demo cut out.
I personally find Civilization more entertaining, but this is still good fun.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
I felt a bit mired in China when I was Japan. They allied with the Commies and threw huge numbers at me and it was taking forever to get my industrial base in Japan to produce reinforcements. I think it did a great job of showing how truly limited their industrial base was, and how once the factories are maxed out, that's really all you get, and it comes down to playing your pieces as best as possible. And they really need more bombers. Carrier based fighters and the limited bombers they had weren't enough.
I didn't play Germany, but I tried France and Italy out (and the USA, but they were a bit much). With Italy I tried to smash into Albania, Greece and Yugoslavia, only to find my forces mired there, and not really getting anywhere until Germany rolled over them with armor. Italy was weak, and only really got crap territories for the effort.
France on the other hand was fun. I partnered up with Britain and declared a preemptive war on Germany after stacking my forces on the border. I snapped up Alsace-Lorraine and the British immediately poured over the border to back me up with air cover. Germany was stuck in the east, which left me plenty of time to reinforce myself and dig in. I got into trouble once Italy breached my southern defenses, but it was still fun, and I think if Britain had helped me WWI style with some armor and troops, I would've held them off.
What's Civ like?
Posted by Euripides (Member # 9315) on :
I would curious to find out if in the full game, one could play Japan and change its occupation policy. That's one thing the game doesn't seem to take into consideration; the mindset/morale/alignment of the people in each region (or am I just missing it?). In Civ, if Japan captures a Chinese city, the inhabitants of that city remain Chinese (the proportion of Japanese to Chinese grows over time). They will rebel, and Japanese troops would have to remain there to occupy it and quell the rebellion. Rebellion and civil disturbance is possible in any city, depending upon the supply of luxury goods and other needs, entertainment venues, etc. In the Chinese cities, the native inhabitants will be disgruntled if you continue a war against their mother country. And if you were particularly brutal when capturing their territory, they will remain alienated for much longer.
So, what I'd like to see in the final game is if I can correct Japan's mistakes in SEA (from a purely strategic standpoint, not a moral one). Japan's most glaring weakness in the war was it's inability to protect its merchant marine and supply routes, and to successfully draw resources from its colonies (since it alienated the local populations). Will I get to do more than just refrain from trashing the existing infrastructure?
Maybe we can have a Hatrack challenge; who can get closest to Nuber's Italy?
Germany was stuck in the East? So Russia was helping you?
Civ is more generalized, since it spans the entire history of human civilization, but it's based on the dynamics of history and society which are pretty constant, and is therefore fairly realistic (at least plausible). It also takes cultural influence into consideration, and so it isn't focused exclusively on the military industrial arena. It kind of offers a richer 'world leader' experience.
[ January 10, 2007, 08:49 PM: Message edited by: Euripides ]
Posted by ricree101 (Member # 7749) on :
quote:Originally posted by Michiel: Since it's also obvious to me that it is going to be simply impossible to prove to people with active imaginations that I am not in some ways, if not a bot, then at least a plant (cf. El JT de Spang's recent post) so I won't bother with explicit further responses on this.
If you want to be a part of the community here, then my advice is simply to go ahead and do so. Yeah, some people are going to be suspicious, but the more you stick around and talk the less suspicious even the "people with active imaginations" will be.
And if you don't want to be part of the community, then why even bother sticking around to defend yourself. So what if a bunch of jerks like us think that you're a plant .
Seriously, though, any way you look at it indignation won't be much help to you. Personally, I'm always in favor of new people coming in to contribute, so by all means, please do.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
Germany was stuck in their invasion of Romania and Poland. As soon as they crossed the border into Poland I went after them. The west was way underdefended. Fortress Germany my foot.
Yeah I too was curious about the garrison forces. I always left an extra infantry unit in captured territory. It seems very odd that you can leave conquered territories undefended.
Posted by Euripides (Member # 9315) on :
If you want to try out something like Civ, there is always Freeciv. It's open source and based on Civ II. All the game mechanics are there.
We could play that together sometime, while we're waiting for Making History.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
So this is out now. I saw it at Best Buy the other day when I was getting Medieval Total War II.
Once I max out on MediWar, I think I'm going to get this, unless Sean can talk me into one of the Civ games, but I want a grand strategy RISK like game that I can play over the net with someone, and I know for a fact that Making History is fun from the demo.
If only people still played Star Wars Rebellion and Star Trek Birth of the Federation.
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