If I am level adjustment/ecl + 1, what exp do i need to get from 1 to 2, 2-3 etc.
Posted by TheGrimace (Member # 9178) on :
your lvl 1-2 transition would be the 2-3 transition on the exp tables (sorry, I don't have the books in front of me)
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
so 2-3 is like 3-4?
Posted by scholar (Member # 9232) on :
basically (so 3000 for 1-2, 6000 for level 2-3). It's kinda like you took a level in race (which gives you no benefit except being the race).
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
k, where do I find info on ithilids?
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
nvm found it, our misfit party of lvl 1's took out a ithilid Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
That is actually very surprising. Of course, if some of you have level adjustments, you're not actually a first-level party.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
we had a dromite psion, a dromite fighter, a Half dragon sorceror, a human psion or wizard im not sure, and a human rogue.
Sufice it to say that the psion/wizard and the half dragon were both sent unconscience as a result of the battle.
The half dragon was lvl 1 (ecl+1) and I think everyone else was level 2.
Lemme think, Christine, Joe, Alex, Dave, and myself. everyone but me (the half dragon) were level 2. I kamikaze'd to do shocking grasp, Alex as pummeled by the tenticles, but we managedto take it down.
I can't wait till next week as I'm level three now, so I can use a breath weapon.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
Characters: We are all chaotic good/chaotic neutral party members.
2 Dromites, kind alike Pinky and the Brain here, Dave's Dromite is... Insane, while Joe's is diplomatic and rational, (and a psion).
A rogue human. A wizard human.
And me, a half dragon (Blue) Sorceror.
Were traveling through the cave engaging hobgoblins as we go, but then we make it to a bridge, and start going across it with the insane one leading. Suddenly we encounter the Ithilid (I only realizing its an Ithilid when its descrbed as having 4 tenticles) it compels Dave's insane Dromite to jump off a cliff into the waters below but he makes it out and rejoins the fight.
We take turns fighting it I acid splash it dealing 1 damage, it turns on alex's wizard, Alex goes down. dealing 4 attacks with the tenticle thingies, I don't remember what Dave's and Joe's Dromite's did or what the rogue did, but I boldly stepped in and did shocking grasp, Dave attacks, Christine's rogue attacks and it dies.
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
Dromites also have a +1 level adjustment. That said, if you were playing with the psionics rules, the mind flayer should still have been able to take out the whole party with mind blast -- and can, remember, plane shift at will. So you got lucky. Posted by Primal Curve (Member # 3587) on :
Or had a sloppy DM.
My group almost got TPK'ed by some kind of flaming skeletal hydra thing. Tom will probably know what it is called. The DM I play with is really into picking the most obscure monsters from the Monster manuals that fits our CR.
Nothing like 7d6+7d4 of damage on a full attack (7 heads).
Posted by Scott R (Member # 567) on :
quote: some kind of flaming skeletal hydra thing.
That's Todd.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
Question how does the DM determine who NPC's attack does he determine it himself or is there dice rolls?
Posted by Scott R (Member # 567) on :
He determines it himself.
Posted by Primal Curve (Member # 3587) on :
The DM can even determine that. If the creature is a mindless killing machine, the DM can roll to see who gets attacked first. This is usually the most fair way of playing and the DMs I've played with usually expose the roll so that players know what he's up to and don't feel like the DM has a grude.
However, this isn't required and the DM can use as much strategy as he/she wants. The DM I'm currently playing with is really into nearly killing us all. He's actually pretty good at it. Our Paladin is pretty sick of being unconscious through most of combat, though.
Posted by Selran (Member # 9918) on :
Random rolling is fine for things like zombies, but most NPCs, even animals, will have some ability to evaluate the the relative threat level of the characters and should act accordingly. There is nothing unfair about a bunch of orcs gang banging the wizard to take him out in the first round. It's what the players are going to do.
Posted by The Pixiest (Member # 1863) on :
I've always been of the opinion that if you get a TPK, the DM has failed along with everyone else.
It's easy to make an encounter that will kill everyone. It's much harder to make an encounter where everyone will feel challenged yet no one will die (except out of their own stupidity)
Posted by Noemon (Member # 1115) on :
quote:Originally posted by Scott R:
quote: some kind of flaming skeletal hydra thing.
That's Todd.
Scott wins the thread.
Posted by Primal Curve (Member # 3587) on :
quote:Originally posted by Selran: Random rolling is fine for things like zombies, but most NPCs, even animals, will have some ability to evaluate the the relative threat level of the characters and should act accordingly. There is nothing unfair about a bunch of orcs gang banging the wizard to take him out in the first round. It's what the players are going to do.
quote:Originally posted by My Awesome Self: If the creature is a mindless killing machine, the DM can roll to see who gets attacked first.
Read: Flaming Skeletal Hydra Thing = Mindless Killing Machine = CR for four 10th level characters.
Hardly a shambling horde of zombies.
See also:
quote:Originally posted by My Awesome Self: However, this isn't required and the DM can use as much strategy as he/she wants.
Posted by Primal Curve (Member # 3587) on :
quote:Originally posted by The Pixiest: I've always been of the opinion that if you get a TPK, the DM has failed along with everyone else.
It's easy to make an encounter that will kill everyone. It's much harder to make an encounter where everyone will feel challenged yet no one will die (except out of their own stupidity)
I agree completely. My DM is really good at this. Almost every encounter has been a close fight. It just gets a little tiring when all you ever do is nearly die every time you fight. This especially sucks since I'm the meat shield.
Which reminds me, when and if we ever get into a town, I really need to boost my DEX. My poor Monk is really hurting in the AC department.
Posted by Selran (Member # 9918) on :
quote:Originally posted by Primal Curve:
quote:Originally posted by Selran: Random rolling is fine for things like zombies, but most NPCs, even animals, will have some ability to evaluate the the relative threat level of the characters and should act accordingly. There is nothing unfair about a bunch of orcs gang banging the wizard to take him out in the first round. It's what the players are going to do.
quote:Originally posted by My Awesome Self: If the creature is a mindless killing machine, the DM can roll to see who gets attacked first.
Read: Flaming Skeletal Hydra Thing = Mindless Killing Machine = CR for four 10th level characters.
Hardly a shambling horde of zombies.
See also:
quote:Originally posted by My Awesome Self: However, this isn't required and the DM can use as much strategy as he/she wants.
My point was not only can a DM use tactics to decide who to attack, but that is what he should do. I don't recognize the skeletal hydra thing, but I would assume any CR10 undead to be intelligent.
Posted by The Pixiest (Member # 1863) on :
PC: Ya, once in a while you need a fight where you just completely roll over your opponents and no one gets scratched.
Last capaign run by my hubby and DM (before the one we just started) every fight ended with one person at 2hp and the rest bleeding to death. That was great and challenging but very tiring.
Posted by msquared (Member # 4484) on :
In the real life game I run, near the end of the session the characters (all level 7 or 8) were fighting a level 13 cleric. The cleric used unholy word and paralysed everyone but the sorcerer. The party cleric was only paralyzed for 1 minute. However, the evil cleric was being held by the black tentacle spell so the sorcerer blasted away with spells. Just as the sorcerer ran out of spells the good clerics' paralyzed time runs out and she casts remove paralysis on the dwarf fighter right next to her.
By this time the evil cleric is free of the tentacles and moving after the sorcerer. The evil cleric blasts the sorcerer to -2HP but is close enough to the dwarf fighter that he 5 foot steps and full attacks the cleric, killing her.
The rest of the party was going to be paralyzed for at least two more minutes.
Everyone let out a sigh of relief.
msquared
Posted by Primal Curve (Member # 3587) on :
After getting a serious pummeling (I was down to -5hp, and our Cleric was down too, our Rogue and our Paladin (Hide from Undead) went invisible. This caused the Hydra to retreat into the pool he emerged from. While the Paladin went around and dished out a little Lay on Hands action, the rogue setup a little trap.
He had a rod of ropes and he was able to lay out a trip wire on the cavern leading to the pool. After I got up, the beast charged us. The DM intended to roll a Strength check to have the Hydra blast through the rope and beat us to death, but he critical fumbled!
At that point, the Hydra was nearly dead anyways, but it was a great triumph for our little Rogue, who really couldn't do much else in the fight.
Posted by MEC (Member # 2968) on :
I have a question that I could never figure out:
When you get bitten by a natural lycanthrope and fail the save you turn into an afflicted lycanthrope. An afflicted lycanthrope gains an ecl of +2. What happens to the player's experience? Does the player gain experience to put them between their ecl and the next one, or does they remain at the same experience and have to earn a ton more just to level up?
Posted by Selran (Member # 9918) on :
If a template is gained at some point after character creation, the character's experience and level progression are not affected. The ECL only matters for comparing the PC's power level to the challenge rating for purposes of calculating experience.
Posted by Puffy Treat (Member # 7210) on :
So...when is D&D 4E coming out?
Posted by Dan_Frank (Member # 8488) on :
Heh, you can tell it's been a little while since the last D&D-related thread. The question was answered with the first post, so then everyone just hangs out sharing D&D stories.
Ahem. I agree with Pixiest. Making the players fear for their lives is a lot more fun than making the players lose their lives. Honestly, as a DM, I feel like such a jerk when one of my players dies.
Posted by MEC (Member # 2968) on :
So the raised ecl wouldn't make the experience necessary to level up greater?
Oh, and I forgot my other question.
The game manual states that a wizard has a 100 page spell book, and that every spell he needs to prepare must be in the spell book, and that spells take up pages directly proportional to their level. Wouldn't this mean that the wizard is even more limited in spells to cast than a sorcerer? Or is it possible for the wizard to have more than one spell book, or a larger spell book?
[ January 10, 2008, 03:14 PM: Message edited by: MEC ]
Posted by Selran (Member # 9918) on :
quote:Originally posted by MEC: So the raised ecl wouldn't make the experience necessary to level up greater?
No, but they would end up earning less XP. As an example, in a party of four fifth level characters, with one of them ECL 6, up against a CR5 creature the three regular level five guys would have there XP calculated as lvl. 5 vs. CR5 and the ECL6 guy would have it calculated as lvl. 6 vs. CR5. Over time this will rebalance the power level of the party.
quote:The game manual states that a wizard has a 100 page spell book, and that every spell he needs to prepare must be in the spell book, and that spells take up pages directly proportional to their level. Wouldn't this mean that the wizard is even more limited in spells to cast than a sorcerer? Or is it possible for the wizard to have more than one spell book, or a larger spell book? [/QB]
A wizard can have more than one spell book, or a bigger than normal one, or a smaller on. 100 pages is just the standard one they all start with.
quote:Originally posted by Puffy Treat: So...when is D&D 4E coming out?
June 6, 2008
Posted by Selran (Member # 9918) on :
On a somewhat related note, does anybody play any roleplaying games other than D&D? Over the past year I've really gotten into the small press, or "indie" games like Dogs in the Vineyard, Spirit of the Century and Primetime Adventures.
Posted by scholar (Member # 9232) on :
I love Amber but the GM (my hubby) finds it difficult. I haven't heard of either of those, but my husband loves non-D20 systems. He bought Elric and Traveler as Christmas presents for himself. We have old version BESM, Sengoku (I think that's its name), Marvel system, and there are more but I don't remember them right now. Dreampark maybe. We also play other worlds from DnD (Rokugan, Raveloft, Eberron).
Posted by Dan_raven (Member # 3383) on :
On the Death vs Good Fight theme, back in the day I created an NPC who's sole occupation was to bring folks up to the point of death, with the understanding that they could escape such disaster by surrendering their soul.
This was a Devil (yes, back in the day when the Monster Manual had Devils and Demons in them) named Mendax (who later wound up being used by DM's around the world, thanks to one of my players who borrowed him while in the Army, and let other copy him on bases from El Paso to Germany and Kosovo)
He was a master of illusion and timeless strategy who was harvesting souls for his master's legion of the dead. He created whole dungeons just to threaten the lives out of players, or create elaborate plots of intrigue, or by disguising himself as a potential ally, willing to save the group, for a price.
I only had one character ever give him the price. My first thought was "Great, now what am I going to do?" I chose to have the DM control that character at given times, taking free will away from the player, and creating havoc amongst the group.
I miss Mendax
Posted by Selran (Member # 9918) on :
quote:Originally posted by scholar: I haven't heard of either of those,
Other systems I've played: Deadlands, Shadowrun, Call of Cthulhu, Rifts, TMNT, Paranoia... I get the feeling there's one or two others but I can't think of them right now. Systems I've made characters for but the game never actually started: Legends of the Five Rings, Mage, Gamma World
--Enigmatic
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
I hate to say this, Dan, but Mendax may in fact be best known from another source.
Posted by Nighthawk (Member # 4176) on :
quote:Originally posted by The Pixiest: PC: Ya, once in a while you need a fight where you just completely roll over your opponents and no one gets scratched.
Last capaign run by my hubby and DM (before the one we just started) every fight ended with one person at 2hp and the rest bleeding to death. That was great and challenging but very tiring.
On a semi-related note, I just finished Final Fantasy on the PSP. My group pretty much steamrolls over everything, regardless of what it may be, except for the occasional boss. Every encounter is now a nuisance more than a challenge. Heck, my black wizard is "one shotting" creatures with his knife...
Yes, eventually there should be something challenging for even the non-stupid players, but for the most part the goal is not to vaporize the group at every step.
And, to be totally honest, as DM I don't remember if I ever killed any players through combat. Sure, I might have dropped them in to lava or skewered them with a ballista, but never through combat. Those that died did so through their own stupidity and bad choices, not because of the dice.
Posted by scholar (Member # 9232) on :
Deadlands, shadowrun and Rifts I have played or atleast made characters for. Legends of the the Five Rings is same source material as Rokugan. We looked at the non D20 version but decided it would be easier to get people to play if we did the dnd version.
Posted by Scott R (Member # 567) on :
About the only game that I've played that hasn't been a d20 variant was Top Secret.
Loads of fun, with a hit and damage system that was intuitive, easy and precise. It was based on d10; you rolled one pair of d10 to hit a target, and if the target was human, one d10 to see where you hit them.
Posted by Noemon (Member # 1115) on :
quote:Originally posted by Enigmatic: Systems I've made characters for but the game never actually started:...Gamma World
I have a huge soft spot for Gamma World. Back when I used to play pen and paper RPGs in person I'd say that the split was 60% AD&D 40% Gamma World.
Posted by Enigmatic (Member # 7785) on :
That soft spot comes from the radiation. It's weakening your bones.
--Enigmatic
Posted by Selran (Member # 9918) on :
I loved the chart you used in Gamma World to figure out the purpose of an artifact.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
Another question, are half dragons just 'Half Dragon' or are they half-pickrace/half-dragon? And do racial bonuses apply for both halves?
Example: At character creation I can choose to have either a wing feat or a tail feat if I am a sorceror but if I am half human & half dragon then I get a bonus feat? Thus letting me have both a tail and wings?
Posted by MEC (Member # 2968) on :
I'm not sure what you mean by the feats, that's probably specific to your DM. Anyway from my experience for half somethings (celestial, devil, dragon, etc...) you usually choose a compatible starting race and add the half-whatever template to it.
Am I right in understanding that 4E will include a large online play system?
[ January 13, 2008, 09:39 PM: Message edited by: MEC ]
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
Yes. It will also include dragonoids right out of the box, suggesting that it's been designed for people like Blayne.
Posted by MEC (Member # 2968) on :
In that case, maybe I'll start playing again with 4E, most of my friends who play have scattered, and this would probably make it easier to play together. Is anyone else planning on using 4E?
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
I will once the pdf's are out. MEC, interested in playing online sometime? Like even 3rd ed, I have this idea of playing via teamspeak/msn webcam conference.
Posted by MEC (Member # 2968) on :
Can't play 3.5, I've sold all the stuff I did have for it (I actually made a profit on it, as I bought the stuff second hand and then auctioned the stuff off), I would be willing to play 4E with anyone once I get it.
Posted by Mr.Funny (Member # 4467) on :
Blayne, your DM is almost certainly using some sort of non-standard half-dragon. Half-dragon is, in standard rules, a template that you can apply to any living creature. So, you could have a half-orc half-dragon (which I suppose would be a half-dragon, quarter-orc, quarter-human).
The normal half-dragon template says that the level adjustment is +3, and mentions nothing about wing or tail feats, which is why I'm guessing that your DM made the half-dragon or picked it up from a non-core source. You'd have to ask him about the wing/tail thing - though, my guess is that, given that they are feats, rather than special abilities, there shouldn't be any reason that you couldn't take both using your bonus feat (or even your standard 1st level feat available to all characters).
As to racial bonuses, assuming that this half-dragon is set up like a normal template, you should apply both the half-dragon bonuses from the template and racial bonuses to stats and whatnot. However, if your DM is treating half-dragon as a race, rather than template applied to a living creature, most of the stuff I've just said goes flying out the window.
In any case, take anything people say here with a grain of salt - it appears that your DM isn't sticking solely with core rules, so the final say is always up to him in this case.
Oh, and perhaps you meant Illithid , rather than ithilid?
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
The "Races of the Dragon" 3.5 edition book describes all the draconic races, classes, and whatnot. It has a full list of draconic feats, like 'Draconic heritage' then then next feat 'draconic breath' giving me a breath weapon of my dragon subtype every 1d4 hours. I can now deal 2d6 damage per spell level used to accomodate the breath weapon Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
in tht book it described half dragon as being ecl +1
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
Then it's almost certainly a race and not a template. In that case, you probably don't get a human's bonus feats or skills.
Posted by MrSquicky (Member # 1802) on :
I've been toying around with introducing a rule variant to skill checks to make them less up to random chance. I was thinking of having alternate checks using the other d's, with a starting point that reflects the d# chosen.
So, let's say a d12 would be (4 + d12), d10 (5 + d10), etc.
I think it should be limited by what skills you use it with and likely only available in non-stressful situations. I also think you'd have to have a certain amount of ranks in a skill before you could use the various steps.
What do people think?
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
What's the problem with simply taking 10 in those situations?
Posted by MrSquicky (Member # 1802) on :
Doesn't taking 10 only work for repeatable checks?
Also, I like the idea of rolling for skill checks, I just think that, in many cases, the d20 range is too large.
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
That's taking 20.
Posted by MrSquicky (Member # 1802) on :
Ahh...I'll have to look at the rules for taking 10 again. It's been some time since I've played.
Posted by Primal Curve (Member # 3587) on :
I've only played RL D&D with Tom once, but he seemed to have an encyclopedic knowledge of the d20 system. It was nice to be able to just ask someone something and they'd know the rule without looking it up.
Posted by MightyCow (Member # 9253) on :
One of my friends was telling me about a Feat that allows a character to take a 10 on any skill check. I can't find it in my books, so I imagine it's in one of the specialty books.
Posted by Primal Curve (Member # 3587) on :
Since it's skill-related, I'd guess it's probably in Complete Scoundrel or Complete Adventurer. Otherwise, I think I saw something similar in the Dragon Compendium.
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
quote:One of my friends was telling me about a Feat that allows a character to take a 10 on any skill check.
He's probably thinking of Cool Under Pressure.
Posted by TheGrimace (Member # 9178) on :
Blayne, my guess about your half-dragon question (not having seen the book you're referring to): you shouldn't get any human bonuses. As it is your starting race you just get the stats/bonuses layed out for your race. It's just like Half-Orcs don't get orc+human stats... that being said, obviously the other half of you has to be something, so presumably it would be human or elven or whatnot. And depending on your DM's say you might be able to swing minor things (i.e. your half-dragon/half-elf might have very dim low-light vision, assuming the dragon side of things didn't give that to you).
On the general discussion earlier about DM's killing their players off, I definately agree that it's generally a sign of a bad DM. Though sometimes I'll give more leeway: 1) Current 2.5 campaign involves: Me - Half-elf thief/wizard (effectively an illusion/enchanting specialist who has 0 damaging spells) Will - Wierd custom class, mostly druid with a little thief and no healing spells Dan - Gnome illusionist Ty - fighter who flakes out alot so ends up generally "detained by authorities for questioning"
unfortunately it's a highly pre-planned campaign and the first part is all about the undead, which means I play the tank with no armor, 15 hp (at lvl 3/2) and a rapier, and as a result have been dropped below 0 3 times so far (twice in one day).
2) previously was playing a campaign with only 2 PCs (not reccomended) and had a couple encounters pitting them against large parties of bandits. The intent being either to kill the leader and cause the rest to flee, or just to run and be funneled in the direction I wanted them to go. Unfortunately both characters went into every encounter with the assumption that they would be able to kill all the enemies... so that time I blame the characters (though officially I never killed them).
Obviously things can always work out according to the die such that the DM would officially kill people, but it's his job to fudge the rolls and be creative in order to not ruin the campaign. That being said, a DM pitting an Illithid against the party you describe (in any context where the Illithid would be trying to fight you) is not doing a good job...
MrSquicky, your alternate die idea reminds me most of shadowrun, where you had various "pools" of dice that you could use on certain rolls to boost your chances. i.e. if you REALLY had to make that attack roll you could blow all your combat pool to effectively be twice as effective that round (but then have no more for the rest of the day/combat)
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