Well, I'm in a school right now. I'm the "old man" in the class; most of my students are 18 to 20 yrs old. I have never before been around a lot of people who are five to ten years younger than I am. It is starting to freak me out. They have no frame of reference on things that happened in recent American history or pop culture. It is amazing how little they know about the Vietnam war, 80s and 90s pop culture, the Lewinsky scandal, etetera.
Some examples of stuff I've mentioned or joked about, and gotten blank stares in return:
-Stockholm Syndrome (none of them got my Patty Hearst joke) -REAL gangsta rap (none of them know who Eazy E, Ice T, Ice Cube, KRS-One, etc. are...and to them, Snoop Dogg is an old man) -Jimmy Stewart (amazingly, ONE of them knew who this was since I reminded him of the movie he was in with John Wayne [The Shootist]; but it was doubly disappointing because then I found out that several of them literally do not know who John Wayne is) -Ross Perot (especially surprising since I'd bet $50 that some of their parents voted for the guy) -Reebok Pumps (?) -Nirvana (not kidding...there was one kid who knew who Kurt Cobain was and swore that he was still upset about his death, but didn't know he was in a band called Nirvana) -Yo! MTV Raps (there were actually a lot of MTV shows these kids didn't remember...I think we ALL miss the days when MTV showed actual music videos)
There are plenty more examples, but it just depresses me to think of them. I remember talking with one of the kids and realizing that he was only 14 when the WTC attacks happened. That was especially depressing to me, for some reason.
Posted by Elmer's Glue (Member # 9313) on :
It sounds to me that it isn't that you are old, it's that these kids are stupid.
Posted by Reshpeckobiggle (Member # 8947) on :
Not mutually exclusive things. Same goes for me. I'm old (26) and college kids are stupid.
Posted by Samprimary (Member # 8561) on :
I cannot say I experience the same general obliviousness with my own college peers.
Posted by calaban (Member # 2516) on :
One of the youngsters in the office came in one day when I was listening to Riders on the Storm. He told me I needed to listen to some 'real' music. I'm 30 so I grant that the Doors are old music by the definition of my generation, but to be ingorant of them? It's like my buddies younger brother who asked what we were listening to half way through the white album. Signs of impending apocalyptic doom.
Posted by Redskullvw (Member # 1549) on :
It's like being told by some ignorant person that "Beatles" should be typed beetles.
Posted by Goody Scrivener (Member # 6742) on :
I am successfully indoctrinating the 14 year old Goodletin the music of the 60s, 70s and 80s, and the 11 year old is starting to recognize a few songs enough to sing along as well. It's gotten to the point where the teenager is able to identify Queen songs on shuffle faster than me. Not by much - one or two notes, maybe - but faster all the same.
And now I'm happily whistling the intro to Riders Posted by Redskullvw (Member # 1549) on :
I already started on my 2 years old. Currently he is getting a dose of ELO, The Beatles, Queen, Van Morrison, and Zepplin.
I hope it works.
Knowing my luck he will gravitate owards gansta rap and country music.
Posted by Evie3217 (Member # 5426) on :
I mean, I do know a lot of people who don't know any/all of your references. I, for one, do not know about Reebok Pumps. Wait...maybe I do. Were they those shoes where you actually pump air into them? Those things were awesome. And I'm 21. I think partly people are just ignorant of the generations before them, and feel that everyone should know everything about their generation while ignoring the former or the latter.
Posted by Threads (Member # 10863) on :
I've never heard of Stockholm syndrome or MTV Raps. I know of Ross Perot and all but KRS-One on your rapper list. I recognize everything else by name but couldn't tell you much of anything about them. I'm seventeen.
Posted by 0Megabyte (Member # 8624) on :
Beware, everyone. Musical ignorance brings forth the metalocalypse.
Posted by Fyfe (Member # 937) on :
Jimmy Stewart -- my brain is exploding. I've known about Jimmy Stewart since I was about four.
Posted by ClaudiaTherese (Member # 923) on :
Beloit College performs a wonderful service yearly.
Posted by scholar (Member # 9232) on :
Watching the Simpsons- "Wow even the army has hummers now!" Which was one of the things on the Beloit list.
Posted by SoaPiNuReYe (Member # 9144) on :
Wow, I used to watch Yo! MTV Raps when I was a little kid. I find it very surprising that nobody knew anything about Nirvana since everywhere I go I seem to find somebody wearing a Nirvana shirt.
Posted by BlueWizard (Member # 9389) on :
Reebok Pumps???? How about PF Flyers? If you can remember those, then oh my stars, are you ever old.
I was dying for white PF Flyers when I was a kid, but I alway had to settle for black cheapos. Broke my heart, but you know what...I got over it.
Wait a minute, let me put on the Doors-LA Woman album,...yes, album. Ahhh...that's better.
Steve/Bluewizard
Posted by Tante Shvester (Member # 8202) on :
quote:Originally posted by BlueWizard: Reebok Pumps???? How about PF Flyers?
Converse All-Stars.
Posted by breyerchic04 (Member # 6423) on :
Tante, those are popular again.
Posted by sylvrdragon (Member # 3332) on :
Olson Twins before they were millionaires, Hulk Hogan without the Hollywood, the names that preceded Operation Desert Storm, Rewinding things, Oregon Trail, Car phones, Goosebumps, Trick-or-treating all night long, Micheal Jackson as anything other than a joke (or Britney Spears for that matter...), Nike Air Jordans, Bugle Boy clothes. I could keep going...
I'm only 25, and it's already a completely different world from when I was a kid. Wonder how many transitions MY kids are going to go through.
Posted by Tante Shvester (Member # 8202) on :
quote:Originally posted by breyerchic04: Tante, those are popular again.
Oh dear! Are skin-tight designer jeans coming back too? Hairstyles with "wings"? Peasant dresses? Walt Frasier Pumas? Mork and Mindy? Sonny and Cher? Donny and Marie? Captain and Tennile? The Jackson Five?
Weird Al?
Posted by sylvrdragon (Member # 3332) on :
Another big one occurred to me. The next generation is going to view 9/11 the same way my generation views the JFK assassination. The Iraq War will be to them what the Vietnam War is to me. Past historic events that have no relevance to me.
Another thing; Does it seem like Pop culture is a lot shorter-lived than it used to be? I can't think of very many actors or musicians that are as universally famous as the ones you hear about from our parent's/grandparent's generation. Who would be our John Wayne? Our Elvis? Our Marilyn Monroe? Our Doors, or Beatles? Is this stuff only seen in hindsight or what? What is my collective generation going to reminisce about that most everyone can agree on?
Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
You view the JFK assassination and the Vietnam War as "past historic events that have no relevance to [you]"?
How unfortunate. Although it is consistent with your degree of detachment from everyone not in your immediate surroundings.
Posted by pooka (Member # 5003) on :
I'm too old to have heard of MTV Raps in the first place.
I know the White Album is a pop culture reference, but I don't know much about it besides that.
Posted by Artemisia Tridentata (Member # 8746) on :
30 years ago, I had a Human Resources Clerk ask me why we were still tracking Viet-Nam era Veterans. "Are there any who are still alive?" One of my employees, a young newly wed, came in a couple of months ago and announced to the office that "her rabbit had died" She was not at all prepaired for my reaction and was quite amused by it. Last week, the other rabbit died. She is still not expecting. EDIT: Oh, and when I referred her to the appropriate MASH episode for a reference, she hadn't ever seen a MASH.
Posted by pooka (Member # 5003) on :
quote:Who would be our John Wayne? Our Elvis? Our Marilyn Monroe? Our Doors, or Beatles?
We may not have these. Some eras are more conducive to pop culture than others.
Also, I don't see anything wrong with seeing JFK and Vietnam as historical events. I wouldn't go so far as "not connected to me". I mean, I feel connected to the Gettysburg address. When I was really little, it was just something everyone talked about, and then I got old enough to appreciate why they talked about it.
Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
quote:Originally posted by Artemisia Tridentata: Oh, and when I referred her to the appropriate MASH episode for a reference, she hadn't ever seen a MASH.
Well, THAT is just criminal!
Posted by Tara (Member # 10030) on :
Well this is what happens when, like, time goes by.
But I'm 17 and I love classic rock. My 10-year-old niece and nephew know all the words to tons of Beatles songs. Posted by Tante Shvester (Member # 8202) on :
My 16 year old son impressed the heck out of me by singing "American Pie". All the lyrics, and correctly, too, as far as I can tell.
I asked him how he knew that song. He said he just learned the lyrics from listening to it a lot, because it's a good song. That's a lot of lyrics to learn.
Posted by Tara (Member # 10030) on :
quote:Originally posted by Tante Shvester: My 16 year old son impressed the heck out of me by singing "American Pie". All the lyrics, and correctly, too, as far as I can tell.
I can do that!
Posted by Tante Shvester (Member # 8202) on :
Good golly, the kids today, and their crazy music!
Posted by pooka (Member # 5003) on :
But does he know what any of it means? My father in law doesn't. I knew it had to do with headlines in the 60's but most of it was gobbledy gook to me.
Posted by FlyingCow (Member # 2150) on :
quote:Who would be our John Wayne? Our Elvis? Our Marilyn Monroe? Our Doors, or Beatles?
I was just thinking about this the other day. I think the era of the "super-icon" is gone.
There won't be another Elvis, for instance. The number of media outlets for musicians at the time Elvis was a hit made it far easier for one person to "dominate" if you will. The way music was distributed and how the music industry functioned made it easier for an artist to become huge.
Now, there are so many outlets and venues, with such wildly cusomizable music presentation choices (satellite radio, mp3s, YouTube video, etc), I don't think any one artist can get nearly the share of public consciousness that Elvis (or the Beatles) did.
Even looking back to compare the 80s to today, I don't think any artist will enjoy the "superpop" stardom of Madonna or Michael Jackson again, either.
As for the next John Wayne or Marilyn Monroe, I don't think we'll see those either. That was a time when studios "owned" actors and put them in film after film after film. They were flagships for a studio (like Shirley Temple, too) and were actually part of a studio's brand.
Now, with every film casting independently of every other, there are more "big" stars - and therefore less chance of one star becoming that much bigger than the rest.
Posted by paigereader (Member # 2274) on :
Kids all over the country grew up watching the same things (ie seseame street, sat morning cartoons) because that is all we had. With mass media and entire television channels devoted to underwater basket weaving... we have less and less to tie us together.
Posted by SoaPiNuReYe (Member # 9144) on :
quote:Originally posted by sylvrdragon: Who would be our John Wayne? Our Elvis? Our Marilyn Monroe? Our Doors, or Beatles?
OutKast probably will take the place of one of those in the near future, at least from most critics' point of view.
Posted by Marek (Member # 5404) on :
You think this stuff is bad, try working with high school students, and some college students, who have never heard of Nixon, think Georg W. Bush's father was George W. Bush senior, but had no idea he was president, think Hillary may have been married to some president but aren't sure, and have never heard the word Chernobyl. I know one 18 year old on the stock crew who has a confederate flag phone cover, and didn't realize it was the confederate flag, nor had he heard the term "the stars and bars". Several of them have never heard of Anne Rice (I was reading one of her books on break), and one girl didn't realize Lord of the Rings had been books before it was movies.
The scariest part is as my old economics teacher used to say, these people can vote, and breed.
Posted by Tara (Member # 10030) on :
Not being aware of certain historical facts is bad. Not being aware of strictly cultural things such as various types of music is just natural. Time goes on, music changes. What else can you expect?
Posted by James Tiberius Kirk (Member # 2832) on :
quote:Originally posted by FlyingCow:
quote:Who would be our John Wayne? Our Elvis? Our Marilyn Monroe? Our Doors, or Beatles?
I was just thinking about this the other day. I think the era of the "super-icon" is gone.
quote:Originally posted by Tante Shvester: My 16 year old son impressed the heck out of me by singing "American Pie". All the lyrics, and correctly, too, as far as I can tell.
I asked him how he knew that song. He said he just learned the lyrics from listening to it a lot, because it's a good song. That's a lot of lyrics to learn.
But the question is, does he know that it wasn't originally performed by Madonna? Posted by cassv746 (Member # 11173) on :
I'm a freshman in college (18) and I know for sure 3 of the things on the original list. As for the Vietnam War I don't really know much about that aside from a couple of my uncles fought in it. I was barely born in the 80's so I think its understandable that I don't know some of that stuff. I do love older music though.
However, I still understand the point. I'm dumbfounded half the time that people my age don't have the slightest idea of what's going on in the world.
Edit: I'm not saying it's understandable I don't know my country's history when it comes to the Vietnam War. I meant about the 80's icons.
Posted by TomDavidson (Member # 124) on :
None of the items in the OP's list are '80s icons,
Posted by cassv746 (Member # 11173) on :
quote:Originally posted by TomDavidson: None of the items in the OP's list are '80s icons,
Hmmm... I seem to have miscommunicated what I was trying to say again. Sorry for that. Now I'm not real sure what I saw in this thread that made me think that.
Posted by FlyingCow (Member # 2150) on :
Kirk, see, I'd compare Paris Hilton more as a 21st century counterpart to, say, the Hindenburg before I'd say she was a counterpart to Marilyn Monroe.
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