So I was watching this Penn & Teller skit about illegal immigration {warning nudity at the end, and lots of swearing for those unfamiliar with Penn & Teller} and in this third part they finished building a fence that took 8 hours to build, and then with the same illegals that built it asked them to demonstrat how they would get across the fence.
The fence only really added 3 minutes of travel time.
3 minutes.
And the US government is going to spend 60 billion$ to build 700 miles of fence that doesnt fully cover the 2000 mile border.
Think on that for a moment.
[ March 25, 2008, 08:52 AM: Message edited by: Blayne Bradley ]
Posted by MightyCow (Member # 9253) on :
I've been reading a book called "The Undercover Economist", and he claims that any arbitrary, government barriers to free trade end up causing excessive waste, and harm everyone involved. I realize that there are many complex issues involved with immigration, but it seems to hold especially true in this instance.
That $60 billion could be used in SO many better ways to deal with the issues involved.
Posted by Launchywiggin (Member # 9116) on :
The video contains massive amounts of swearing and even nudity at the end. Well done, Blayne.
Posted by Dan_raven (Member # 3383) on :
The following needs work, but for 10 minutes thought, not bad. It has my worries about the immigration debate buried in there somewhere.
Tis for the best:
In 83 they came to me And said "Tis for the best. You'll see The job you do, with sweat and toil Labor costs and foreign oil We exchange for something rare Executive-lite, you sit and stare Computer Tech, Its here to stay." And so we sent manufacturing jobs away. The 150K job my Union helped insure Just took my pension and walked out the door.
In 95 they came to me And said "Tis for the best. You'll see." I'd studied hard and leaned to code The tech bubble that others rode Rode me down with viscous force As my tech job they did out source. "Ah, poor man, don't be nervous The economy is one of service." My 80K job that I earned with my brain Is being done by someone else in Bahrain.
In 08 they came to me And said, "Tis for the best. You'll see. We can't out-source you service job We can import some cheaper Bob To mop and cook and wait on those Who own the stock that rose-sweet rose. With each illegal, cheap, meek immigrant We limit your pay and your choices servant." This Service Economy is a growing disaster For Service means Servant and that means a Master Who I must bow to or hear it be said all around That--to do my job, no true Man could be found Unless he comes from abroad, legal or not We need to pay him less to fill this spot. So my 40K job I must grasp with a might Serve hours unpaid and to Masters delight Watch as the yawning gap does expand Tween the rich and the poor--lives ruled by supply and demand.
Posted by MightyCow (Member # 9253) on :
I wonder if there's a Spanish version of that poem bemoaning the loss of a 1K job, instead and wishing for a 20K one.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
The border fence to me is a lot like corn subsidies, it's election pandering, especially this year. Building the border fence makes you look like you are tough on illegal immigration to people who don't necessarily understand the situation to its fullest extent. I don't necessarily understand it to that extent either, but I know it well enough to know that unless the fence has underground sonar, snipers every 500 feet, and is electrified, it isn't going to do a whole lot of good, and will likley just slow down or hurt people.
But it's a good way to get some people on record as being weak on immigration. It's all in how you frame the argument, and in this case, it's Republicans, and they are very, very good at it. Plus there are too many Democrats in border states, that's what pushed it over the top.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
quote:Originally posted by Launchywiggin: The video contains massive amounts of swearing and even nudity at the end. Well done, Blayne.
In all fairness I did say it was Penn & Teller, it takes a encredibly dense person to not realize that there's going to be alot of swaering.
The nuddity at the end also in fairness I didn't notice, as I was tabbed out from it after I saw the illegals hop over the fence in 50 seconds flat.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
quote:In all fairness I did say it was Penn & Teller, it takes a encredibly dense person to not realize that there's going to be alot of swaering.
I didn't click the link but, this is a pretty interesting statement.
I've never seen Penn & Teller outside of other shows, like their guest appearance on the West Wing, Babylon 5, or a couple others. I think I might have seen them on a Comedy Central show once and it might have had a little swearing, but, not much.
In other words, it takes an incredible leap of assumption to assume that everyone is familiar enough with P&T to know what to expect when they click on the link. Regardless of that fact, it's still generally good form to put a language/nudity warning in front of the link, wouldn't you agree?
Posted by Constipatron (Member # 8831) on :
I wonder if there IS a solution to the illegal immigrant issue. If the government builds the wall, if not done as thoroughly as the Israelis are doing it (if THAT ever works), then I don't see it working. If we become lenient on immigration laws, then we face an even greater influx of people coming north and straining our over-wrought economy. I think the solution may be in the attitudes in BOTH sides. Unless that changes, then nothing's going to work. I've come across Americans who are very militant about keeping illegal immigrants out, even though they wouldn't be here if it weren't for immigration, not to mention, probable ILLEGAL immigration from lands east. And I've run into Mexican immigrants who assume that this country is theirs alone with the attitude that they're 'taking it back'. Now, those are two extreme points of view, which I think is rather startling because those views DO exist.
Posted by AvidReader (Member # 6007) on :
I think if we really wanted to stop illegal immigration we'd help our neighbors improve their economies so they have decent paying jobs where they don't have to give up their language, culture, holidays, and extended families. People don't set out where they know they're not welcome and will be constantly looked down on because it sounded like a good idea that morning. Haiti has to import something like 80% of its food, and most of it's rotting in the port because they're trying to stop drug trafficers - like we asked them to.
I also think if we paid an American to go out and pick tomatoes in the sun all day we couldn't afford to eat them, but I know I'm an extreme minority in thinking we should have an open border with Mexico and immigration only limited by the job market.
Posted by Scott R (Member # 567) on :
I think the current political hysteria about illegal immigrants damaging the economy is about as silly as barbed-wire underpants.
Posted by quidscribis (Member # 5124) on :
quote:Originally posted by Blayne Bradley:
quote:Originally posted by Launchywiggin: The video contains massive amounts of swearing and even nudity at the end. Well done, Blayne.
In all fairness I did say it was Penn & Teller, it takes a encredibly dense person to not realize that there's going to be alot of swaering.
I've never seen Penn & Teller and have only barely heard of them.
I guess this makes me encredibly dense.
Posted by Primal Curve (Member # 3587) on :
quote:Originally posted by Scott R: barbed-wire underpants.
I think you've just, single-handedly, solved the illegal immigration problem.
Posted by Scott R (Member # 567) on :
Did I?
Excellent. Now, what happened to my other hand?
Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
It's in use.
You didn't say anything about elastic . . .
Posted by Scott R (Member # 567) on :
Well, whoever's using it should have been polite enough to ask first. It's hard to type with a hand missing. And when I went to wash my hands this morning-- disastrous!
Posted by Dan_raven (Member # 3383) on :
ooops. posted in the wrong thread. um
ummm
Go Immigrants! Yea!
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
quote:Originally posted by AvidReader: I think if we really wanted to stop illegal immigration we'd help our neighbors improve their economies so they have decent paying jobs where they don't have to give up their language, culture, holidays, and extended families. People don't set out where they know they're not welcome and will be constantly looked down on because it sounded like a good idea that morning. Haiti has to import something like 80% of its food, and most of it's rotting in the port because they're trying to stop drug trafficers - like we asked them to.
I also think if we paid an American to go out and pick tomatoes in the sun all day we couldn't afford to eat them, but I know I'm an extreme minority in thinking we should have an open border with Mexico and immigration only limited by the job market.
In the future I'd be okay with a border similar to what we have with Canada, but not until a lot of problems are solved. But you're right, we need to help Mexico and Central America fix their economies and get up to nearer to first world standards so they don't leave their countries seeking a better standard of living elsewhere. And in the meantime, I'm all for work visas and a steady stream of legal immigration, but open borders? Not yet, but someday of course.
Posted by scholarette (Member # 11540) on :
Right now, if you want to pick fruit and have no family members with US citizenship, you can not come to the US legally. Even if you have a relative, the waiting list is over 20 years (for unskilled labor). I think that is a fact that everyone needs to know before they make decisions of the immigration system.