quote:

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Originally posted by TomDavidson:
Oh, no kidding. Authentic Chinese food is often revolting.

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Not a big fan of broiled chicken feet, huh
 

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Posted by Noemon (Member # 1115) on :
 
There's a Chinese restaurant in Dayton that I've taken a number of forum members to over the years that, in addition to a very good American Chinese menu has a menu of Chinese Chinese food. They don't generally mention its existence to their non-Chinese patrons, but they'll bring it to you if you ask for it, and will serve you items from it without argument*. It's a bit of a crap shoot, since most of the menu is in either Chinese or is simply a transliteration of the Chinese, but when I go there with a group we'll often get a couple of things off of the Chinese menu, and more often than not what I've been happy with what we've gotten.

*I've been to Vietnamese restaurants where I've had to argue with the server in order to get them to bring me something that I've ordered if it wasn't the standard fare that most white people who ate there ordered.
 

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Posted by Mucus (Member # 9735) on :
 
I may point out that most of the examples of Chinese Chinese food that have been brought up are actually just Cantonese food with the exception of shabu shabu, which is actually the Japanese type of hot pot.

There is just as much variation between Cantonese food and Heilongjiang food, and between those and Shanghai food or Sichuan food as there are between English food and French food or Polish food.
 

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Posted by scifibum (Member # 7625) on :
 
I've heard that what we experience as Indian food here in North America is mostly Americanized Punjabi cuisine, and doesn't reflect the many regional cuisines in India. It doesn't surprise me to hear that there are a lot of various cuisines within China as well.
 

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Posted by Tante Shvester (Member # 8202) on :
 
In the part of New Jersey where I live, there is a large Indian population, and the restaurants they patronize tend to be authentic (with emphasis on a particular regional cuisine). Or so they tell me; I've never actually been to India.
 

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Posted by Reshpeckobiggle (Member # 8947) on :
 
Best Chinese food I ever ate was in Guadalajara.
 

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Posted by Sterling (Member # 8096) on :
 
I like to imagine there's various levels of "authenticity" in American Chinese food, from unidentifiable fried meat in sweet pink sauce to jellyfish (tried at a wedding banquet, don't think much of.) My personal tastes run somewhere in the middle. Undoubtedly some of it is colored by the meats and vegetables available in different countries.
 

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Posted by Mucus (Member # 9735) on :
 
Alright, I have a bit of time to elaborate. It is actually kind of amazing, not only have Cantonese immigrants managed to convince many Americans that Chinese food done badly (American Chinese food) is Chinese food, but they have also convinced the few that penetrate this illusion that Cantonese food is the entirety of Chinese food.

This is due to the fact that the majority of older Chinese immigration to America is from Guangdong via Hong Kong. But this is merely one Chinese province in the grand scheme of things.

Cantonese food is typified by rice, dim sum, seafood, and a great variety of animals. Very little spice is used and freshness is emphasized. As for exotic food, some Cantonese also enjoy horrifying Westerners with the more exotic food, which may only add to the problem. I'm not mentioning names.
But it is true that the North American palate of food seems very limiting to us, Cantonese are known even within China as being proud of eating everything.

Hong Kong is a good example of Cantonese food and is the *international* melting pot of Chinese food, combining Cantonese food, Chinese Western food, and so forth.

Cantonese food is trending downward with the new wave of immigration. The new trend is towards Sichuan food. Sichuan food is largely incompatible with Cantonese food since it is very spicy. From central China, it has less seafood, and lots and lots of spice.

Moving quickly, another great melting pot of Chinese food is Beijing, but while Hong Kong is international, Beijing is the national melting pot bringing together many varied culinary traditions from across China. Food usually includes more wheat and beans versus rice which is more southern. More lamb due to the northern influences and Chinese Muslims and less seafood.

There are many other types of food I'm leaving out, but just to lend perspective, I recently watched a Hong Kong documentary on Hangzhou food which is merely a few provinces north of Hong Kong. They covered it like a North American documentary would cover Mexican food.

To end, let it be known I am far from a cook. And that this post contains many stereotypes, but I'll be satisfied if I can only bring the stereotypes down from a national stereotype of Chinese food to provincial stereotypes. Consider this an invitation for those that can correct or expand.
 

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Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by TomDavidson:
Oh, no kidding. Authentic Chinese food is often revolting.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Mucus:
There is just as much variation between Cantonese food and Heilongjiang food, and between those and Shanghai food or Sichuan food as there are between English food and French food or Polish food.

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Honestly, I couldn't tell you the difference between any of those food-styles *laugh*
 

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Posted by Mucus (Member # 9735) on :
 
Fusiachi: Be careful though, while American Chinese food exists in America, it also exists in China. I had the distinct non-privilege of being served the stuff a couple years ago in Shanghai.

That said, I'm mostly providing the information in the thread simply to inform people about the differences between each variety of food, not to change people's taste. As the presentation notes American Chinese food IS uniquely adapted to North American tastes and that is a critical part of its success.

On a related note, I've tasted some much more modest attempts in the opposite direction by American food to Asianify itself in China/Hong Kong and I must say I rather enjoyed some of it.

MyrddinFyre: Seriously? All of them? I must say you are in for some major culinary delight when you do (if you do?) start finding out

[ December 31, 2008, 06:20 PM: Message edited by: Mucus ]
 

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Posted by scholarette (Member # 11540) on :
 
I was very annoyed by my tour in China- every meal they included sweet and sour something. My husband and I were like, um, this is NOT Chinese food. The tour guide replied "We get a lot less complaints this way." Our tour group rather disgusted us though. They even balked at dumplings.

Of course once we met up with family, we got lots of authentic food. The big problem then was the amount of food, not style. I swear, they must have not eaten for a week to eat as much as they did. They apologized for not providing a meal we liked, since after all we only ate 2 large plates full.
 

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Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
 
I've often seen Chinese families serve fairly large feasts as regular meals.

I love authentic asian food, but in Montreal I often either have to eat it at friends house or in have to travel a maze of buildings to find that "out of the way alley restuarant" to eat it.

Spicey Hmmmmmm
 

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Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
 
Who balks at dumplings???
 

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Posted by scholarette (Member # 11540) on :
 
Crazy American tourists.
 

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Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
 
Dang.

More for you, I guess.
 

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Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by ketchupqueen:
Who balks at dumplings???

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quote:

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Originally posted by scholarette:
I was very annoyed by my tour in China- every meal they included sweet and sour something. My husband and I were like, um, this is NOT Chinese food.

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quote:

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They apologized for not providing a meal we liked, since after all we only ate 2 large plates full.

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quote:

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Beginning with cold dishes, followed by at least 10 to 15 hot dishes, and concluding with fruit, a typical banquet lasts roughly two hours. In contrast to the West, where children are taught to "clean their plates" and leftovers could signal to the host that the meal was unpalatable, in China, an empty plate signals unsatisfied hunger and indicates that the host did not prepare enough food. Moreover, Chinese hosts will keep filling guests' empty plates until the guest leaves some food on the plate.

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http://www.chinabusinessreview.com/public/0807/fox.html

In real life, I can't say I ever really noticed either way, but I can be quite oblivious to these things.
 

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Posted by MyrddinFyre (Member # 2576) on :
 
Mucus - nope, and that statements includes the English/Polish/etc foods. I guess I just love food in general, and don't usually pay too much attention to its cultural significance
 

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Posted by Jhai (Member # 5633) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Tante Shvester:
In the part of New Jersey where I live, there is a large Indian population, and the restaurants they patronize tend to be authentic (with emphasis on a particular regional cuisine). Or so they tell me; I've never actually been to India.

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If you're in an area of the US with a large (say 20%+) population of Indians you can easily find authentic Indian food from various parts of the country, but it might be a bit less spicy than you'd get in India. A good rule of thumb is that if it's a vegetarian place then it's "South Indian" (very broad, I know). South Indian is typically spicier, and rice-based (you might get breads there, but they're made of rice). If the restaurant isn't vegetarian it's almost certainly a North Indian or mixed-regions place - where North Indian means the area of India that is geographically in the north-west, including Punjab and Jaipur. Food from other parts of India can be difficult to find - I can't even think of a Bengali restaurant in Silicon Valley.

However, almost all the Indian food served in restaurants in the US, if authentic, is the stuff you'd also get in restaurants in India, not the stuff you'd get in an Indian home. For home cooking, you need to import an Indian mother-in-law (highly recommended ! ).
 

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Posted by PSI Teleport (Member # 5545) on :
 
Mucus: do you know which region dan bing come from? My experience is Taiwan, but I'm not sure if they're originally from that area.
 

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Posted by kmbboots (Member # 8576) on :
 
I love fake American Chinese food. Especially when I have a cold. Garlic chicken and chicken chow mein from the take out place by my apartment, mixed together is often the only thing I want to eat when I feel lousy.
 

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Posted by Kwea (Member # 2199) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by ketchupqueen:
Who balks at dumplings???

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I do. I hate them. Sorry.
 

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Posted by GinaG (Member # 11862) on :
 
No offense to Chinese people, but I lived with a Chinese roommate and "real Chinese," while interesting, is yucky compared to American Chinese.

So is "real Mexican." I went into a little restaurant once determined to get authentic Mexican food- I was served a "pork taco" which was a tasteless stiff tortilla filled with chunks of fat. Bleccchhh. Give me Tex Mex any day.

I'm happy they brought us their food, but happier that they adapted it.
 

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Posted by Tatiana (Member # 6776) on :
 
Now I'm hungry.

That was fun and informative. I absolutely adore American Chinese food. I could eat it for every single meal.
 

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Posted by Mucus (Member # 9735) on :
 
Hmmm, I'd appreciate it if people stayed away from direct adjectives like "revolting" or "yucky." There's no technical reason you have to, but I'd note that there are those of us (loved ones too) that literally cook Chinese food at home on pretty much a daily basis. Hearing that food/effort described as such can be a bit hurtful and this is really meant to be a light-hearted thread.

You don't have to go to the extreme of "if you can't say anything good ..." but I'd appreciate some effort to at least put it more diplomatically or more ambiguously.
 

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Posted by ketchupqueen (Member # 6877) on :
 
There are good and bad "real Mexican" and "real Chinese" places just as much as there are good and bad Americanized Mexican and Chinese places.

We have a few "real Mexican" places around here that would blow your mind, and would never serve dry tortillas or greasy pork.
 

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Posted by Mucus (Member # 9735) on :
 
MyrddinFyre: Cool. That works too.

PSI Teleport: I don't know. I'm not personally familiar with that specific dish, but pictures of it seem to show something which is not entirely unlike a couple of southern or northern Chinese dishes that I have tried.
 

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Posted by Jhai (Member # 5633) on :
 
The idea of real Chinese food being "revolting" or "yucky" reminds me of the best dining advice I've ever read. (Side note: based on the home-cooked meals of my Chinese & Taiwanese friends and certain restaurants in the States that I am assured are authentic, I think real Chinese food can be amazing, as can American-Chinese food.) The writer, Tyler Cowen, is an economist who specializes in the economics of culture, especially art and food. He said that if you know you're in a top-notch restaurant then you should always order the thing that sounds least appetizing or most odd from the menu. I've found the most amazing dishes following that rule.
 

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Posted by dkw (Member # 3264) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by GinaG:
No offense to Chinese people, but I lived with a Chinese roommate and "real Chinese," while interesting, is yucky compared to American Chinese.

So is "real Mexican." I went into a little restaurant once determined to get authentic Mexican food- I was served a "pork taco" which was a tasteless stiff tortilla filled with chunks of fat. Bleccchhh. Give me Tex Mex any day.

I'm happy they brought us their food, but happier that they adapted it.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Jhai:

quote:

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Originally posted by Tante Shvester:
In the part of New Jersey where I live, there is a large Indian population, and the restaurants they patronize tend to be authentic (with emphasis on a particular regional cuisine). Or so they tell me; I've never actually been to India.

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If you're in an area of the US with a large (say 20%+) population of Indians you can easily find authentic Indian food from various parts of the country, but it might be a bit less spicy than you'd get in India. A good rule of thumb is that if it's a vegetarian place then it's "South Indian" (very broad, I know). South Indian is typically spicier, and rice-based (you might get breads there, but they're made of rice). If the restaurant isn't vegetarian it's almost certainly a North Indian or mixed-regions place - where North Indian means the area of India that is geographically in the north-west, including Punjab and Jaipur. Food from other parts of India can be difficult to find - I can't even think of a Bengali restaurant in Silicon Valley.

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quote:

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Originally posted by dkw:
I'd hate to see American cooking judged by some of the slop I've seen cooked in student apartments.

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QFT
 

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Posted by scifibum (Member # 7625) on :
 
Every culture and style is subject to different tastes and a wide variety of individual dishes. Trying a few authentic dishes probably isn't enough exposure to dismiss an entire cuisine. If going by my grandmother's idea of every day American cooking, few would be converted. But she's quirky, thrifty to a fault, and seems to have lost most of her sense of taste and smell, so it wouldn't really be fair. She also does a few things very well, you just might not catch her on a day when she does pot roast. If you get there the day she's experimenting with garlic bologna slathered in gravy...you might get a bad impression.

Anyway, if you think authentic Mexican food is gross, you need to rent and watch "Tortilla Soup." Nothing that looks that gorgeous can be yucky.
 

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Posted by rivka (Member # 4859) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by scifibum:
Anyway, if you think authentic Mexican food is gross, you need to rent and watch "Tortilla Soup." Nothing that looks that gorgeous can be yucky.

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quote:

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Originally posted by rivka:

quote:

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Originally posted by scifibum:
Anyway, if you think authentic Mexican food is gross, you need to rent and watch "Tortilla Soup." Nothing that looks that gorgeous can be yucky.

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My mom and I went to a pre-screening of that movie, with most of the actors present. They served food from it afterwards. One of the times that keeping kosher was a real test -- the food looked and smelled amazing. And all I could eat was the raw veggies!

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This is a good story, because you save yourself from the bitter envy of others by not getting to enjoy it yourself.
 

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Posted by Tatiana (Member # 6776) on :
 
I tried Indian food for the first time not that long ago, and I loved it. I read reviews on google to pick the restaurant and that turned out to be a good idea because of the 7 tables that were filled when I was there, 4 of them were filled with Indians. It wasn't very busy overall that night, which makes me worry that it won't last. Still, the food was perfectly scrumptious. I usually take a while to get used to new spices and things but this had lots of strong flavors all mouth-wateringly delicious.

They started me with these crispy crepes with three toppings, a chutney, some pickled carrots, and something else I forget. Then for my main dish I got tamboori chicken tikka with basmati rice. On the side came some lentil dish, and a dish called raita with yogurt, tomatoes, and cucumbers. To go with it all was this bread called nan that was similar to a soft light pizza dough. For dessert was gulab jamun, a fried cheese ball thing that was sitting in liquid sugar. It reminded me of a doughnut, sort of. It was all so good! I can't wait to eat there again.
 

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Posted by Jeorge (Member # 11524) on :
 
My favorite part of that video was when she flipped us the bird just as she was talking about the Chinese being excluded.
 

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Posted by Mike (Member # 55) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by JennaDean:
I don't really like dumplings. I'll eat them, but they're not my favorite. But then I don't like any kind of dumplings - especially those southern things they put in Chicken & dumplings. So it's not an Asian-food thing.

Yeah, more for you.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Kwea:

quote:

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Originally posted by ketchupqueen:
Who balks at dumplings???

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I do. I hate them. Sorry.

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Oy, kreplach!
 

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Posted by Artemisia Tridentata (Member # 8746) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Reshpeckobiggle:
Best Chinese food I ever ate was in Guadalajara.

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