Uh. Well, Rachel is even more horrible than she was last year. I guess that counts as a kind of character growth. And... I guess having a girl with Down Syndrome being mean and obnoxious like Sue is kind of a strike for equality (of meanness), I thought it was kind of distateful.
And Brittany is as clueless as ever. <sigh>
Posted by Stephan (Member # 7549) on :
I was more upset that no one was added. I assume the football player will join eventually.
Posted by Synesthesia (Member # 4774) on :
Sue had the best funniest lines.
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
I think I'm going to start a new category, called Second Worst Person of the Week (Sue has Worst Person of the Week sewn up as a regular thing).
This week's Second Worst Person of the Week award goes to Rachel Barry.
Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
I have figured out Glee and why it is so crappy at times.
It is a Saturday morning cartoon. Every single episode resets back to zero, and the characters all go back to their one characteristic. The lessons they learn are the same lessons every single time, because they all have amnesia. There are no character arcs - it's a Saturday Morning Cartoon. There is no logical flow to the story - cheap Sat. cartoon. You can drop in at any episode and not only are the characters in the same place, but they are learning the same lessons they learned in every other episode. It's just a cartoon.
I'm glad it didn't win the Emmy. It doesn't deserve.
It is a Sat. morning cartoon with fun singing and dancing, so I'll keep watching it. I have started muting the non-singing parts. I've seen that episode before. All of them.
Posted by Stephan (Member # 7549) on :
quote:Originally posted by Lisa: (Sue has Worst Person of the Week sewn up as a regular thing).
Not in season one's finale though. I give that to the other two celebrity judges.
Posted by Raymond Arnold (Member # 11712) on :
I actually kinda liked the down syndrome girl being mean. Maybe that makes me a bad person, dunno. I thought it was more... perhaps not more tasteful, but at least more interesting than the Family Guy episode. In this case, the girl was literally being coached by Sue who was the one person who's given her respect so far, so it made perfect sense, and I suspect there will be at least a LITTLE more interesting development there. (Though in general I agree with kath's Satuday Morning Cartoon analysis).
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
quote:Originally posted by Lisa: I think I'm going to start a new category, called Second Worst Person of the Week (Sue has Worst Person of the Week sewn up as a regular thing).
This week's Second Worst Person of the Week award goes to Rachel Barry.
I'd say it should go to that stupid kid in a wheelchair who made his friend go into the locker room with him and ask his coach if he could play on the team.
Then of course since he didn't get on the team which even a five year old could predict was going to happen, his friend loses his hard earned seat on the team for embarrassing the coach in front of the players. Then to top it all off, it appears wheelchair boy didn't even feel the need to apologize for screwing up his friends life. Oh wellz!
Leaving that aside, that was possibly the most ridiculous way to get the character off the football team and into glee club full time.
Posted by msquared (Member # 4484) on :
I am not sure what it is, but I find Brittany hot.
I have no idea why she is not pregnant yet.
msquared
Posted by MattP (Member # 10495) on :
It can't hurt to keep trying!
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
Add to that the fact that Artie lost his girlfriend because he was being a total jerk to her, and that was the pretext for using Finn to get on the team, and thus Finn losing his position.
In other words, Artie was a pretty big douche in the first episode.
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
quote:Originally posted by msquared: I am not sure what it is, but I find Brittany hot.
I have no idea why she is not pregnant yet.
Um... 'cause she likes girls. Duh.
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
My favorite lines were all from the beginning. Jacob had some awesome one liners, but the best one was Brittany.
"People thought that I went on vacation this summer, but really I was just lost in the sewers."
Oh yeah, I hate Rachel too. I wish Cherise would have stuck around, I think her voice is amazing.
I REALLY felt bad for Coach Biest, especially when she was crying in the locker room. I thought she went overboard with Finn, but I could actually see someone reacting that way in the real world. I feel bad that Finn once again got dumped on, but hopefully Coach Biest will let him back on the team now that her and Schuster have made nice.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
I'll say this, Britney was amazing at doing Britney. I'm not surprised they gave her the dance heavy numbers since she was a dance instructor for the show originally, but I thought she nailed them.
Yeah, but other than that? The episode sucked. Maybe the worst ever.
Next week looks heavy.
Posted by Shanna (Member # 7900) on :
I vote for a Brittany spin-off. She can dance and then made cute one-liners into the camera.
Seriously, that's the only reason I'm still watching. Oh, and I'd like to hear Santana sing more.
Otherwise, even characters I loved before are becoming annoying. It used to be that I couldn't stand Rachel, Finn, or Schuester and whenever they weren't on camera things were mostly enjoyable. But now I find myself hating Artie and Kurt, while wondering what happened to Mercedes (if she's getting any lines I must be missing them.)
And the producers in the recording studio need to step away from all the pretty buttons and sliders. It'd be nice if the show choir sounded even alittle bit like a real choir, with harmonies and all that good stuff.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
It looks like next week will have an honest to goodness ensemble piece.
Posted by Synesthesia (Member # 4774) on :
Brittany is so funny. She says weird things in a dead pan voice. It cracks me up. Also it's funny what Sue said "it's a Britney Sex riot"
Posted by Carrie (Member # 394) on :
I actually watched the two numbers where Britney was being Britney - I've not watched a musical number since "Somebody to Love," which was a long, long time ago. Holy crap, she can dance! I am still impressed with her. Now if only she did more on the show...
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
Well, Heather Morris' original attachment to the show was as a dance instructor to teach Kurt and the others how to do the Beyonce dance for "Single Ladies." She has a background heavy in dance. She lucked into a background role as the third cheerleader and earned her way up to being a series regular. It's nice to see her get a chance to really shine. You should see a lot more of her, relative to last season (so many character, only so many minutes and songs), now that she is a regular.
I was very impressed with her this episode, but I felt that everything but her fell very, very flat.
Posted by msquared (Member # 4484) on :
I heard that she almost made the top 20 in season 6 of SYTYCD. Missed it by just that much.
msquared
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
I agree. Brittany was great this episode, and to a lesser extent Finn. Kurt, Rachel, Will, and Artie are annoying me to no end though.
How immature is it that Will is trying to copy the dentist because he thinks it will somehow help him get Emma back? This isn't the same guy from the first season. The first episode he treats Coach Biest like garbage, then the second episode he acts like one of his students. It is getting pretty lame.
I am really happy Coach Biest is giving Finn and Artie a chance on the football team. She is probably my favorite character so far this season. She is the only character this season that comes across as someone that could actually exist in the real world. I think the reason may be because she actually has a heart.
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
This week's Third Worst Person of the Week award goes to Rachel Barry (any time Terri is on the show, the award gets bumped down to Third, since Sue and Terri always tie for first place). Trying to manipulate Finn into quitting the team that she knows means so much to him, having Quinn test him, particularly when she knows that Quinn isn't over him... she is just a screaming bitca.
Kurt was as annoying as usual. Was he wearing a skirt? And Will was just as pathetic as always.
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
I feel bad for Quinn, but I'm worried she is going to return to being mean to the other kids in Glee. I think she has grown too much to do that, but it just seems like the past two episodes she is consistently on the verge of tears.
When Quinn asked Finn to get back with her I knew Rachel had put her up to it almost right away. That didn't stop me from hoping that Quinn was serious and that Finn would actually get back with her. Rachel treats Finn badly and I think Quinn has grown and realizes that she missed out on a guy that would have done anything for her.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
Quinn cheated him on him and then tried to lie to him about a baby that wasn't his. Rachel is being a controlling jerk, but nothing approaches that level of betrayal. On the other side, having Quinn be the one to tempt Finn was a double-douche moving knowing that Quinn still has feelings for him and probably regrets the way she treated him.
I keep waiting for Coach Biest to actually be a huge jerk, because it always seems like she has an evil smile on her face whenever she does something nice. I keep waiting for the other shoe to drop. But assuming she really is a good person, man, they really treated her bad, and only Will has the conscience necessary to really feel bad for what he did, but I'm glad that he's atoning to a degree.
Also the short little Glee clip about Britney Spears on Hulu is funny. They ask John Stamos if he feels his premiere was upstaged by Britney and he says something like 'no, it was okay. I mean, they named the episode Britney/Britney and not John Stamos/John Stamos, but it's fine.'
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
I know Quinn cheated on Finn. She was a different person then. She has grown as a person and has matured over the past year. I guess I just want more interaction between the two of them. I would really like them to sit down and talk about what happened.
That is one of my complaints with the show though. One scene Santana and Quinn are fighting each other, then in the next scene they are singing together and smiling and acting like everything is good in the world. They either work things out off camera or they all have short term memory loss.
Posted by rollainm (Member # 8318) on :
Or good work ethic?
Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
Cartoon. The whole show makes so much more sense when you realize that after every scene, they hit the reset button.
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
quote:Originally posted by katharina: Cartoon. The whole show makes so much more sense when you realize that after every scene, they hit the reset button.
Sadly I think you are right. I guess after watching Ryan Murphey's last show I was expecting grudges to hold and bad feelings to stick around longer than one scene.
Nip/Tuck was not the best show, but one thing you could count on was grudges, bad feelings, and resolution.
Posted by AvidReader (Member # 6007) on :
I was pleasantly surprised that they handled spiritual beliefs as well as they did. Not terribly interestingly, but these are pretty stupid characters. Anything more would have been out of place.
Mostly, I think I was grateful for a return to the old song mix. Brittney's catalog without the production trickery was pretty weak, and the week before when they proved how hip they were, I was pretty bored with the songs. This week was a nice mix, both of songs and singers, actually.
Posted by Amanecer (Member # 4068) on :
I agree. I enjoyed the music greatly and was at least interested in their exploration of the topic. I can't think of another broadcast show that has even quasi-fairly explored an atheist's beliefs. While this wasn't deep, it was sympathetic.
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
I really liked the episode as well, but I am not liking Kurt much. The first two episodes he was annoying, and this latest episode he was a complete jerk. I'm glad he shaped up at the end though. I really hope his dad is ok, he is one of the most "real" characters of the show, aside from the Finn/Kurt/Burt fiasco in the Gaga episode.
I enjoyed the interaction between Sue and her sister as well. You got to see the human side of Sue when talking about her sister, though I have no idea why she would have shown her human side to Emma. It just didn't fit. It would have been more believable if she had opened up to Will, as she has in the past.
Finn and "Grilled Cheesus" really cracked me up. He did a great job with "Losing my Religion" as well.
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
quote:Originally posted by Amanecer: I agree. I enjoyed the music greatly and was at least interested in their exploration of the topic. I can't think of another broadcast show that has even quasi-fairly explored an atheist's beliefs. While this wasn't deep, it was sympathetic.
I'm glad they had the atheist commentary that they did in that episode. But it would have been nice if the religious exploration had been deeper than my toes.
Instead per usual the religious fall back on just being total jerks, then by the end come up with, "It doesn't matter what you believe in, just believe in something!"
The best thing to come out of that episode was that cover of the Beatles, "I want to hold your hand."
Posted by Amanecer (Member # 4068) on :
quote:Instead per usual the religious fall back on just being total jerks
I didn't see the religious people as being total jerks. Finn's story was ridiculous, but all of the others, while not given much exposure, didn't come across negatively to me at all. What negativity did you see?
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
The whole back and forth where they asked Chris Colfer why he didn't believe in God, and the gems the religious side were throwing out is, "But you're going to hell then!" and "You can't disprove God!"
Finn's story was an aside to me, it bugged me too, but I was trying to stay focused.
edit: oh and Jane Lynch's back and forth with that student was another example of, religion having no answers and just sitting there in awe as an intelligent atheist gets a TKO in the first round.
Posted by Amanecer (Member # 4068) on :
I guess I saw the Colfer thing as normal shock and not as negative, but I could see how they could come across as empty to you. I thought that the way his classmates accepted him and supported him throughout the episode without seeming to care too much about his lack of faith was more relevant.
I thought that Jane Lynch coming around to appearing open to faith at the end was the message that they were going for.
I do not believe that Ryan Murphy is an atheist. But that is based largely on his prior work. Things could have changed for him. Wikipedia says he sometimes goes to church. My suspicion is that he is religious but in a very liberal way and that is the viewpoint that was most espoused by his characters.
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
Kurt remains an ass.
But it's really the writers who are the asses.
Someone suggests dedicating the week to Jesus and neither of the two prominent Jews in the class have any issue with it.
God, this show is pissing me off.
[ October 06, 2010, 06:05 PM: Message edited by: Lisa ]
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
I really liked Sue in this episode. Even when she was being evil she wasn't really being evil, not like she normally is. She was being a regular person with a regular person's doubts.
I like that Finn was trivializing religion only to learn that God isn't a wishing well. I also liked that one of his wishes came through monkey paw style to teach him a lesson.
I'm glad that Kurt learned his lesson by the end of the episode, but really, what an annoying selfish little prick. I hate characters that spurn the grief of others.
And Lisa, as far as the Jews go, the week wasn't dedicated to Jesus per se. Sure Finn was all about Cheesus, but Shue made it clear that it was a non-denominational spirituality that they were celebrating, and none of the songs specifically listed Jesus did they? Furthermore, she made her concerns extremely clear to Finn when she told them that their kids needed to have the freedom to do exactly what she told them to do, which was amusing, but made her look, yet again, like a bit of a bitch. Also, Puck expressed his displeasure, but backed off when Shue said it was about spirituality.
As far as the music went, it was okay. I thought it was interesting that What if God Was One of Us was done to almost the exact same style as when they did Keep Holding On. Apparently whenever a classmate has a serious problem, they all dress up in white, go to the auditorium and do a group number. Finn did a decent job with the REM song. Puck had a nice one. Mercedes had two, one of which was fun. My room mate and I made a note that black churches always look like a BLAST on television. It's one of those fun, positive stereotypes.
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
Funny you say that, during the church scene my wife turned to me and said "That's how church should be!"
BB, I didn't see the same thing you did. Will made it clear that it was supposed to be spirituality in general, I think Kurt's song played into that. He sang about the bond between father and son.
I think Kurt looked like a complete jerk this episode. His friends were trying to help by praying for his father, and Kurt acted like a child. We don't know if Burt is religious at all or what his beliefs are. It wasn't up to Kurt to make that decision for his father, and I think he realized this at the end.
I think most people that do not believe in God would still appreciate if a friend prayed for a sick family member. I am sure there are those that wouldn't, but I do not believe they would act like Kurt did.
One thing that really bugged me about this episode though... For a while Finn believed that Grilled Cheesus was answering his prayers and giving him what he asked for. There is the scene where Finn is angry at Kurt for not telling him about Burt and says that Burt is the closest thing to a father he may ever have. Afterwards he doesn't pray that Burt gets better, but instead asks to touch Rachel's breasticles. I don't know if the writers are just idiots or if they purposely wrote it that way. It just really bugged me.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
Everyone had a lesson to learn or impart in this episode. Finn had to learn that God wasn't there for his own selfish reasons, but that he needed to think of others too, and that religion was bigger than him personally.
I was actually okay with that one. It was a little silly, but it all counts as character growth.
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
Geraine: The end of the episode at church was OK, but it was too little too late for me.
I didn't look down on Kurt for the way he was acting, he was dealing with grief. If I was trying to cope with my own father dying and a Buddhist said to me, "Don't worry he will be reincarnated, perhaps as your own child!" I would be seething.
If I was an atheist and my religious friends wanted to pray for a dying a relative I might be frustrated as I would want them to help me through it in a way that was meaningful to me, prayer wouldn't be one of those ways. They could pray during their own time if they wanted, but I wouldn't want to go to a church meeting where my father was being prayed for unless I thought it *might* do something.
Posted by Shanna (Member # 7900) on :
I don't understand why people thought Kurt was being a jerk.
I felt horrible for him and the way his classmates were treating him. Here he was gong through something very difficult and really needed the support of his friends, but they couldn't support in the way HE needed to be supported. I thought it was selfish to keep pushing the faith and religion issue when I think he really just needed someone to sit with him and listen to stories about his dad. I even cried during "I Wanna Hold Your Hand" because it really just sunk home the idea that Kurt probably feels very alone without his dad, the one person who has always supported him no matter what.
It felt really forced to have Kurt attend church with Mercedes (especially when she then implies that atheists have to believe in "something" as if Kurt hadn't already come to the realization of how important and "sacred" time with his father is.) And I still don't understand why all the kids got together to sing "What if God was One of Us."
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
Eh. It didn't look to me like all they wanted to do was push religion on him, though, that was an aspect for sure. When all the kids were with Burt singing to him and be barged in to kick them out, I thought that was really rude. It wasn't about Kurt in that moment, it was about the other people's connection with Burt, especially Finn and his mom. They have a right to be there and deal with things their own way. My problem with Kurt wasn't that he wasn't religion or rejected religion, it was that he was trying to create an anti-religion bubble around his dad that no other character could pierce, regardless of whose sake it was for.
And at the end, I think Kurt learned at the church that it wasn't necessarily about praying or believing in God, but that being with a bunch of people who genuinely care and want to help, regardless of their motivations, CAN have a healing power. I don't think he understood that at all until he went to church with Mercedes.
Posted by Shanna (Member # 7900) on :
Making allowances for Finn and his mother makes sense, but obviously Finn isn't really that religious or he would have put better use to his Cheesus.
But what relationship did Rachel or Mercedes have to Burt?
If I were invited to a religious funeral, I wouldn't go around talking about reincarnation or how the body is becoming wormfood. And I certainly wouldn't pretend to be shocked when religious mourners closest to the grief become upset with me. When we provide comfort, it is meant to help the person who is suffering not to make ourselves feel better. To say "I'm praying for you" to an atheist, can be a very selfish thing to say because it shows a lack of respect and understanding.
I think it is important to surround oneself with caring friends during times of crisis, but I wouldn't say that the Glee kids were particularly caring. Maybe they had good intentions, but I think how they conducted themselves was very disrespectful.
Posted by Raymond Arnold (Member # 11712) on :
This is my favorite episode of Glee, and my favorite "Religious" episode. To those bothered by the Shallowness of the religious types.... well, first of all, I was moved by the spiritual songs in the episode. Second of all, in every single other "Religious" episode I've seen of any given TV show, it's the atheist viewpoint that's given shallow lip service. So imagine being that annoyed at least once per TV-show-you-like-that-attempts-to-deal-with-serious-issues."
I liked that Sue was an atheist, and that it was among the most reasonable things about her.
I liked that Kurt acted pretty realistically throughout the episode. The moments when he was upset and lashing out at people, he had every reason to be mad - partly because his friends were being insensitive, but mostly because his Dad was in a coma and he felt alone and angry. And when he had time to process his grief he forgave and apologized to his friends and they forgave and apologized to him and I can't imagine changing any of it without ruining the story.
I especially liked that, like most Religious episodes, it ended with with "you gotta believe in something," but unlike most Religious episodes, it gave you a very concrete of what atheists can and should believe in.
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
quote:Second of all, in every single other "Religious" episode I've seen of any given TV show, it's the atheist viewpoint that's given shallow lip service.
But that's like complaining that you are sick to death of movies where the woman is a pair of breasts for the hero to fall in love with, and then a movie comes along where a really hot, intelligent, driven girl is the main character while some dunce dude with a hot body tags along providing make out opportunities along the way.
Either way it's poor writing.
Posted by Raymond Arnold (Member # 11712) on :
I didn't feel that believers in the show were portrayed as shallow. I thought they showcased the power that faith in something can bring, regardless of what form it takes, and I do believe that power is real. I actually think it did a much BETTER job of showcasing the pro-religious side than most versions of this episode do even when the authors are clearly trying to favor it. It's not that the writing's bad. It's that the subject matter is HARD.
I thought every aspect of this episode was a step up from the normal writing quality of Glee. I realize that's not saying much, but the writers were clearly trying. Did the characters have complex well thought out philosophies about why they were religious? No. They're high school kids. I know exactly one person in real life who might have responded more intelligently than the kids did to Kurt when he came "out." Every believer I've revealed myself as an atheist to's first words were similar to theirs. And every theist who has responded to Sue Sylvester's argument (in real life OR on intellectual message boards) has sounded exactly as compelling to me as Emma did.
Could they have trotted out carefully thought out theist arguments for the characters to present? Sure. It would have made the theist characters even more obnoxious and insensitive though. Not to mention they also could have trotted out more atheist counterarguments. The best things about religion I've ever seen or experienced were about feeling something powerful and sharing in that feeling with your community, and I think the show captured that very well. Are there plenty of other aspects of religion they could have dealt with instead? Sure, but that was the one that was actually relevant.
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
quote:It would have made the theist characters even more obnoxious and insensitive though. Not to mention they also could have trotted out more atheist counterarguments.
Writing smarter theists does not mean the theists become more argumentative. I don't want theists who are more capable of pushing their religion on people at the wrong time.
And sure they are high school kids, that's a good point they are more likely to be shallow in their faith, I got told I was going to hell for being a Mormon in my high school. But high schoolers can also be quite intelligent, considerate, and understanding, especially in the face of tragedy.
Yes the power of believing in community is probably the best angle they could approach from, I don't want them to write a God into the episode who starts granting prayers and manifesting himself within the school. I don't even mind that there was prejudiced feelings from the religious side. What bugs me, and this has bugged me from the very first episode where the cheerleader is being a jerk about abstinence, and ends up pregnant, is I don't feel like there is a single positive religious role model in the show, but there is plenty of religious, (both apt and retarded) criticism.
Posted by Shanna (Member # 7900) on :
It was recently confirmed that Glee's creators have plans to introduce a "Christian character" sometime this season. According to Murphy, "We’ve taken a couple jabs at the right wing this year, so what I want to do with this character is have someone who Christian kids and parents can recognize and say, ‘Oh, look—I’m represented there, too!’ If we’re trying to form a world of inclusiveness, we’ve got to include that point of view as well."
But nobody should be getting their hopes up considering how most of the characters on the show are varying degrees of unlikable. It seems this character will be an evangelical teen (I guess along the lines of pre-pregnancy Quinn) who will take issue with Kurt's homosexuality and the suggestive dance choreography and song selections.
On a whole other level, why are they adding a new character?! That will make three new Glee members this season (Sam, Kurt's future love interest, and this Christian character.) As it is, Quinn has had almost no lines this season, Santana is yet to get a solo, and we still know next to nothing about Mike (except that he has great abs.)
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
How sure are we that Sam ISN'T Kurt's future love interest?
Posted by Shanna (Member # 7900) on :
Depends on if you think Ryan Murphy would lie about Sam NOT being Kurt's love interest. Though this article also says he'll be a member of a rival Glee club instead of a student at McKinley.
quote:Originally posted by Synesthesia: Brittany is so funny. She says weird things in a dead pan voice. It cracks me up. Also it's funny what Sue said "it's a Britney Sex riot"
The growing panic on her face in that scene was priceless.
Posted by aeolusdallas (Member # 11455) on :
quote:Originally posted by Lisa:
Kurt was as annoying as usual. Was he wearing a skirt?
No a sweater and trousers.
Posted by aeolusdallas (Member # 11455) on :
quote:Originally posted by Geraine: Funny you say that, during the church scene my wife turned to me and said "That's how church should be!"
BB, I didn't see the same thing you did. Will made it clear that it was supposed to be spirituality in general, I think Kurt's song played into that. He sang about the bond between father and son.
I think Kurt looked like a complete jerk this episode. His friends were trying to help by praying for his father, and Kurt acted like a child. We don't know if Burt is religious at all or what his beliefs are. It wasn't up to Kurt to make that decision for his father, and I think he realized this at the end.
I think most people that do not believe in God would still appreciate if a friend prayed for a sick family member. I am sure there are those that wouldn't, but I do not believe they would act like Kurt did.
One thing that really bugged me about this episode though... For a while Finn believed that Grilled Cheesus was answering his prayers and giving him what he asked for. There is the scene where Finn is angry at Kurt for not telling him about Burt and says that Burt is the closest thing to a father he may ever have. Afterwards he doesn't pray that Burt gets better, but instead asks to touch Rachel's breasticles. I don't know if the writers are just idiots or if they purposely wrote it that way. It just really bugged me.
Finn's selfishness was the whole point. It was also nicely contrasted by Puck's selflessness.
Posted by AvidReader (Member # 6007) on :
It was a little odd to see Puck get the "Best Guy in the Episode" award. And his line about J-Money being his favorite Heb cracked me up. All in all, it was a good week for Puck.
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
"The J man". Not "J-Money".
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
I went back and watched the episode again. After my second viewing, I think Kurt was a jerk on in the hospital scene. The scene where he said he was an atheist was actually very well done. He didn't come across as a jerk to me this time around.
I think the funniest line goes to Britney though... "God is an evil dwarf?"
Quinn is probably my favorite character, partly because she has had the most believable character development in the series. I feel her pregnancy made her more understanding of others and helped her mature. The other characters haven't really matured, with the exception of perhaps Puck. I'm just afraid that since she is head cheerleader again she will revert to her old ways.
I would also like more numbers with Santana and Quinn. Mike will be getting a duet with Tina next episode, so we finally get to hear his voice.
Posted by Goody Scrivener (Member # 6742) on :
I was a little disappointed last week that John Stamos didn't get a chance to sing. I was really looking forward to a Beach Boys number. And it seems unfair that when each of NPH and Idina Menzel guest star, they got to show off. Maybe he'll be back, though.
I can't put together my thoughts on this week's episode just yet.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
Stamos is supposed to be an ongoing guest star. I imagine we'll have to hear him sing at some point.
Posted by Anthro (Member # 6087) on :
Please tell me I'm not the only one who really just wants Rachel to die offscreen and never ever come back.
Honestly, she's the more obnoxious character on this show.
Posted by Phanto (Member # 5897) on :
I don't get why they can't make balanced characters.
There is a lot of melodrama and the writing is not always great. This episode was heart-wrenching and deeply moving, but it was fundamentally based off a dramatic trick.
If they can't make the characters have meaningful and relatable life experiences without pulling out the stops - say having a fake baby, myocardial infarction, and so on - the show will likely descend into melodrama.
In my opinion, the first episode of this show was the best, and they haven't lived up to that potential since.
Posted by Raymond Arnold (Member # 11712) on :
quote:If they can't make the characters have meaningful and relatable life experiences without pulling out the stops - say having a fake baby, myocardial infarction, and so on - the show will likely descend into melodrama.
This implies that melodrama is a status the show must descend towards to achieve, as oppose to a permanent state that has been part of the show from the beginning.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
Jane Lynch was on SNL last night.
Couple of funny skits. Lots of unfunny ones. That show has really gone downhill.
Posted by Shanna (Member # 7900) on :
Did anyone watch tonight's episode yet?
It felt like they completely replaced the writing staff. They corrected so many problems I've had with the show that I actually enjoyed the episode rather than viewing it like a car wreck.
I never thought Finn and Rachel could ever be adorable but with Rachel deciding to be selfless (in her own roundabout way) I felt like we finally saw what they'd be like as a real-life couple. There was something just so right and genuine about how they interacted with each other. She was respectful of him and he just seemed so puppy-dog in love with her...it was nice.
AND THEY DEALT WITH THE KURT AND FINN DEBACLE FROM LAST SEASON. Sorry for the caps but I hear little show choir angels singing "Hallelujah" right now. It was great to see Burt talk to Kurt about how he was treating Finn, and Kurt actually listened. Kurt and Finn also had a surprisingly calm and mature conversation about what happened.
I'm interested to see if this whole Brittany and Artie thing continues past this episode. I don't have alot of faith that it will, but it'd be really cool to see some more character development for Brittany. She's kinda the last person I'd expect the writers to really utilize beyond her great one-liners.
We also got some early budding romance for Quinn and Sam. Mike and Tina not only got a song but a funny scene that shows their rocky relationship. And Santana and Mercedes did the BEST performance of the night. I've been begging for a Santana solo since the Gaga episode and I'm so glad to finally hear more of her voice.
I actually did not like Kurt's duet performance. As if he could really get the Cheerios to help him out for that. Was Sue out with the flu? But I did enjoy his performance with Rachel at the end.
Overall, I'm quite pleased with the amount of character growth in an episode with so many musical numbers. In two weeks we get another themed episode with the Rocky Horror Picture Show, but I'm hoping after that we'll get more episodes like this one.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
While I'm thrilled that they finally addressed this, I still don't think that Kurt really gets it. He continues to conflate homophobia with being creeped out by unwanted and inappropriate advances. I'm glad that Finn discussed it with such calm directness. I'm still not sure he got it.
Santana/Mercedes' number was amazing. I thought Tina and Mike, while not the most powerful song, was maybe the most impressive performance because it must have been so hard to learn.
Posted by AvidReader (Member # 6007) on :
I agree completely that this was a cut above everything else that has ever come before it on this show. The level of growth from the writers was equally impressive to anything the characters did.
There was a lot to love, but I think my favorite was Britney pushing the meatball with her nose. I think it opened up a lot of vulnerablity in her character. If these writers stick around, it could even turn into a character arc or something.
As for Kurt not getting it, I think I see where he's coming from. I don't think it's that he doesn't see the inappropriateness, per se. I think it's that he's so lonely, that he's denied something so basic that he feels entitled to go out and get it. It's his way of being Britney. They're both looking for something special and getting sidetracked with what's more readily available.
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
I really loved the episode last night as well. I thought most of the musical numbers were pretty good, with the exception of Kurt's solo. My wife actually asked me to fast forward the song because she thought it was boring.
I'm so happy Quinn is giving Sam a chance. I first thought Sam was going to be a tough guy, but it turns out he is just a nerd. I cringed when he spoke the Na'vi language to Quinn, and the look on her face was priceless. I'm glad she is going to give him a chance though. The poor guy probably has no idea how to socialize with women since he went to the all boys boarding school.
Rachel was less annoying this episode. I still hate her.
Britney actually looked hurt when Artie broke up with her. I think she truly likes him. One thing about Britney is that she doesn't really judge people. The way she was looking at Artie kind of made me feel sorry for her.
I am also pleased that Kurt is starting to see that maybe he was being pushy and inappropriate. Burt admitting he may have overreacted with Finn was great. I want Kurt to just get a boyfriend so he can stop being so annoying. I know the dialog about Kurt being lonely is setting us up for this to happen, but I want it done and over with.
Posted by aeolusdallas (Member # 11455) on :
How can anyone not love Kurt's performance last night? It was absolutely amazing. Not quite as good as Julie Andrews in Victor Victoria but damn close.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
Kurt's was okay, but it was maybe only my third or fourth favorite song. I liked Mike/Tina's number as a performance, but not so much as a singing performance. For that, Mercedes and Santana absolutely won. I didn't care for Quinn and Sam's because it wasn't a riff, it was like karaoke, but it wasn't nearly as good as Mraz and Callait. And I liked the mashup at the end.
Posted by Raymond Arnold (Member # 11712) on :
Wow, that was pretty good. This season seems to moving in... dare I say... New Directions...
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
It's still early. Remember that we all loved the first half of last season too.
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
I didn't recognize the song Sam and Quinn did. It sounded like something by the Ditty Bops.
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
I usually enjoy the show tunes the most, but I just hated Kurt's. He did a great job of singing the song, I just found myself wishing it would end because it was boring.
I did enjoy the duet with Rachel and Kurt though.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
quote:Originally posted by Lisa: I didn't recognize the song Sam and Quinn did. It sounded like something by the Ditty Bops.
It was "Lucky" by Jason Mraz and Colbie Callait.
I actually really like that song. Usually I like the Glee songs that take songs and do their own thing with it, but this was a dead-on performance of what the cd track sounds like. I don't mean that as a compliment either. They matched it stylistically, but the original is better by far.
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
I just listened to it. And the original doesn't sound so much like the Ditty Bops. Maybe it's Sam and Quinn's voices.
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
Link. A really smart analysis of why Rocky Horror is the phenomenon that it is, and why having them do it on Glee is really kind of dumb.
Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
I have to close my ears during the non-singing parts. The "drama" is PAINFUL.
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
I hated the changed lyrics. So "transvestite" is okay for a show in the first hour of prime time, but "transsexual" isn't? And "petting" is problematic? Sheesh.
On the other hand, who knew that Emma could sing so well? And Kurt is a perfect Riff-Raff.
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
quote:Originally posted by katharina: I have to close my ears during the non-singing parts. The "drama" is PAINFUL.
But that's how every episode is, just about.
Oh, and Will actually wins "Worst Person of the Week" this week. He even outdid Sue. What a slime.
Posted by Raymond Arnold (Member # 11712) on :
While Will was definitely an idiot this episode... oddly enough I didn't find the drama eye gouging. It was so over the top that I found myself just not caring.
I thought the "male body image" subplot was worthwile, and I think they did a decent job of interesting meta discussion of Rocky Horror itself (although I am not remotely familiar with the show in its original form, the concerns of that guy Lisa linked to didn't bother me, considering how they handled it).
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
I thought it was a "ho-hum" episode. I was glad Emma sang and I was pleased that Quinn got a mini solo in one of the songs. Other than that, the only positive thing was that Rachel didn't have many lines.
Oh, and I want Puck back already.
Posted by AvidReader (Member # 6007) on :
I loved Mercedes's number. She was amazing.
Anyone know who it was that got the opening solo? I wanted to match her by the teeth, but no one got enough of a close-up for me to tell.
Posted by Shanna (Member # 7900) on :
Those were Santana's lips in the opening.
Posted by AvidReader (Member # 6007) on :
Yes! Now how to tell hubby without actually saying "I told you so"... Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
quote:Originally posted by Lisa:
quote:Originally posted by katharina: I have to close my ears during the non-singing parts. The "drama" is PAINFUL.
But that's how every episode is, just about.
Oh, and Will actually wins "Worst Person of the Week" this week. He even outdid Sue. What a slime.
Yep, every episode is downright painful during the talking parts. There's hasn't been an enjoyable-during-the-talking-parts episode of Glee since...the first half of the first season, I think. There was one or two with Quinn that were okay. Maybe the one where we first met Jesse St. James.
What I really want is for Fox to admit that the show's story sucks and give us a "musical acts" version on their website. Seriously - give a few title cards to describe the set up, and just let us see the singing.
Posted by Raymond Arnold (Member # 11712) on :
On Hulu they usually have isolated music clips, although they don't have all of them.
I thought the Religion and Not-Particularly-Themed episode that came after it were both pretty good. Britney episode was funny except for when it was terrible. Overall this season's been more watchable than the last episodes of last season for me.
Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
"Duets" was okay, and it was notable because it was basically the characters apologizing for their horrible behavior in the rest of the episodes. It's Rachel being self aware about being a raging witch, and Kurt getting called out for being an entitled, whiney predator.
Oddly enough, once again, the only really tolerable storyline that wasn't a mea culpa was Quinn's. She isn't my favorite character, but she's the only one that's getting written consistently like a human being instead of a charictature or a plot device.
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
quote:Originally posted by Shanna: Those were Santana's lips in the opening.
It took me about 5 seconds to figure that out by the way she moved her mouth. I admit I am kind of obsessed with Naya Rivera. Even more so with Diana Agron. Not in a stalker type of way, but.... ok fine, I'd stalk them if I weren't married.
Posted by Armoth (Member # 4752) on :
This show bothered me so much. Bothered me because Will was an absolute jerk, and his character is the worst. This was so in character for him (lately) which totally removes him from the lovable morally upright teacher who helps his kids mature, and makes him more the high school kid who has never grown up.
And GOSH. I HATE the hypocrisy in Glee. Their whole diatribe about how it is inappropriate for kids to push the boundaries like that, and yet this show makes SUCH an impression on millions of high school teenagers. They got away with riding the raunchiness and pretended that they weren't doing the play for an audience, so it was ok. Except that they were REALLY doing it for an audience of millions of viewers at home, and that they had pretty much done all the envelope pushing scenes by that point anyways. Ugh.
Posted by Raymond Arnold (Member # 11712) on :
Wait, are you talking about last night's episode or the show in general? Or about the Rocky Horror one from a few weeks back? I thought last night's episode was pretty good.
I definitely agree that the show tries to have its cake and eat it too with the raunchiness, and it's kinda despicable.
I think the "Will is a High School student who hasn't grown up" is an accurate comment that was actually explored (slightly) in yesterday's episode, and I think if they made it a more official theme instead of something they occasionally just touch on it might be more workable.
Posted by Armoth (Member # 4752) on :
I was talking about Rocky Horror. I'm a bit behind.
Posted by Armoth (Member # 4752) on :
Okay, that episode was pretty good.
I though the Beist storyline was a little silly, but still pulled on my heartstrings. And yes, they keep resurrecting Kurt's storyline, but I think this time I actually respected Kurt and his method of dealing. I thought making the bully gay was stupid, but whatever, I enjoyed Kurt's growth.
And I'm a HUGE fan of the new dude who will play Kurt's boyfriend from a very potter musical.
Also loved teenage dream. My acapella group actually uses the guy who arranged and produced teenage dream to mix our songs. He did an amazing job with the song.
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
Are you so sure that Blaine will be Kurts new boyfriend?
I mean, Kurt has been attracted to football boys in the past. Finn and Sam are both jocks, so it Kurovski...I don't know! I read somewhere that Kurt would have a boyfriend at his own school, so if Blaine doesn't tranfer, that leaves Kurovski.
Posted by Armoth (Member # 4752) on :
I guess I'm not sure. I don't see Kurt as a real person so I'm not sure I'd factor in his past attractions. But if his leering at Blaine while he was singing Teenage Dream is an indication of attraction, I'd say Kurt is set.
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
I thought that too. He did have a very telling look on his face at the time. Kurt has never been good at hiding his emotions though, and the rest of the episode it was like Kurt saw Blaine as more of a brother or mentor than someone he is romantically interested in.
Then again that could just be due to bad writing.
Posted by Goody Scrivener (Member # 6742) on :
Gah. I so should have seen that locker-room scene coming, but I didn't. It's so bloody cliche. Boys pick on the girls they like cause they don't know how to say it.
I wonder if we have the makings of a new triangle here, actually. I also saw Kurt as being very attracted to Blaine during Teenage Dream. I don't think that cooled, just changed as Kurt realized that Blaine was more than just a pretty face. I have a hard time imagining that Kurt could be in any way attracted to Kurovsky, largely because of the bullying. But clearly Kurovsky is either attracted to Kurt specifically or using the fact that Kurt is out of the closet as a way of exploring his own confusion. No matter which way it rolls, I would definitely like to see Kurt not feel alone anymore.
As for Shue's comments about Kurt becoming surly and belligerent? Hello??! Did everyone forget that he danged near lost his father just a few weeks ago?
Posted by Raymond Arnold (Member # 11712) on :
The bully-kiss was cliche, but it's exactly the sort of cliche Glee uses all the time and was done in a way worth exploring.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
I think Kurt sees Blaine absolutely as a love interest, as and a mentor. Isn't that sort of a cliche too? Blaine is Kurt's gay ombudsman that Kurt is going to fall in love with. I'm guessing it won't be requited, because we know that Blaine has a major arc in the series, the creator has already said that, and because introducing yet another new character would be odd, and Blaine seemed to genuinely have a thing for Kurt too. Either that or he just has that personality. And good. Kurt NEEDS a real relationship so he can finally work out some of his crap rather than constantly repressing it and blaming everyone else for his problems.
The rest of of it was all fine.
Except damn, the music was ten times better than usual for two reasons. 1. The music finally returned to playing more of a background role rather than carrying the show. 2. I mean geez, the songs and arrangements were just awesome! The mash-ups were crazy good. "Teenage Dream" with the High School Whiffenpoofs was fantastic, I really hope we see more numbers from those guys. Whoever plays Blaine has a natural charisma to him that I don't think any of the other characters on the show have. Plus he went to U of M.
I feel like they're starting to focus more on character development and less on music, FINALLY. Let's hope it stays.
Also, did anyone notice that Rachel barely said two words and the episode was one of the best of the season? Don't get me wrong, I like Rachel, and obviously her voice is amazing, but, you know, a little dab will do ya.
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
It was only because she was trying to be the opposite of how she usually is.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
I was rewatching bits and pieces earlier today (mostly for the great songs) and it hit me that they've started using leitmotifs, at least, for Kurt they are. Seemed like was a cue from "Defying Gravity" too.
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
Did anyone watch the episode last night? I enjoyed it quite a bit.
I'm happy Mr. Schu didn't act like a complete moron when he learned Emma married "The finest dentist alive." (Santana's words)
I'm also kind of proud of Puck for telling Rachel that he didn't want to betray Finn again. I REALLY hated Rachel this episode. She went from being selfish to being the worst person on that show. First it was Kurt, then Mr. Schu, I guess it was Rachel's turn.
I loved the interaction between Brittany and Artie. I think they actually have pretty good chemistry. My favorite line was actually from Artie, when he told Brittany that while the comb wasn't magic, she was.
One thing though.. Was it just me or did Puck look more than a little impressed by the wrestler girl? After this episode it seems like she is the female version of Puck, and I think he is starting to dig her. I really hope the writers decide to go with it, it would be good for some character development.
The only thing this episode was missing was Sue. I'm really surprised she wasn't trying to sabotage the Glee club.
Posted by aeolusdallas (Member # 11455) on :
I was glad that Rachel got dressed down for her behavior. I also loved that it pointed out that many of kurt's issues are internal and that Dalton Academy was safe but also a gilded cage.
The music was all absolutely amazing.
The whole Puck/Wrestler girl 7 minutes in heaven exchange and Santana's reaction shot was great.
And boy oh boy can Mike and Brittany dance!!
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
I think I said "Whoa" about 5 times while they were dancing. Not only were they great, but Brittany did that entire dance in heels. I can't imagine what her feet felt like after that scene was finished.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
I absolutely loved the dance number between Mike and Brittany. Reminded me of all the great dance numbers from the 30s, 40s, and 50s before that genre really died out. And all the women back then danced with heels. It's insanely impressive.
I liked that Puck took a stand for his and Finn's friendship by pushing Rachel away. But man, what an insanely awful, awful person. Rachel just floors me. I loved the interplay between her and Kurt, and I loved that Kurt got a chance to realize that maybe New Directions wasn't so bad after all, and that he's had to make the choice between a contest of individualities and the safety of anonymity. The choice isn't nearly as clear-cut as he thought it was.
Rachel though, geez, the fact that she thinks she was justified, or gets some kind of mulligan...I serious think that this episode takes us into a place where Rachel isn't just a selfish brat...there's actually something seriously wrong with her. Her petulant selfishness when she was denied a solo was just he tip of the iceberg. I dislike how the episode made me like and hate her at once. But I like that it actually made me like Kurt for once, who I usually can't stand.
Posted by dabbler (Member # 6443) on :
Florence and the Machine (the original of the final song) has been really on the radar these last few months. Heard her a bunch on the radio, on SYTYCD over the summer, now Glee. Very captivating voice.
Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
None of these characters are any kind of real. I am resigned that Glee is one long SNL sketch with fun music.
The sanctification of Martyr Kurt is horrendously boring.
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
Kurt is the creator's Mary Sue. You can't expect more.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
quote:Originally posted by katharina: None of these characters are any kind of real. I am resigned that Glee is one long SNL sketch with fun music.
The sanctification of Martyr Kurt is horrendously boring.
It's not even that. It utterly fails because Kurt is such a jerk so often. If he were only the victim, I could see it. But he's often either a bully, albeit not a violent one, or just a completely unlikable self-involved jerk.
That scene with him and Rachel this week was the first time I've liked either of them in awhile. And I liked them throughout the episode until the end, when I hated Rachel. But Kurt seems to have actually learned something, so I liked that too.
I don't get why they can't make every episode like that for at least one of the characters, while still holding onto a shred of continuity.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
And another thing.
I thought "Don't Cry for me Argentina" was a great song for Rachel (Kurt did a nice job, but doesn't really have the punch that the song needs).
But they wasted it. It would have been a great song for Rachel to sing at the end of an episode where she realized she was being a total jerk to the club, and sang it as an apology to them. Instead she sings it to no one while pouting about why she can't get her way, and then proceeds to do even WORSE things in the aftermath.
This just goes to show that the best episodes, so far as the music goes, are when the music either perfectly matches what's happening on stage, or is used as a background piece just for fun while letting the story tell itself.
Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
They seem to have confused "downtrodden" with "sociopath". It's really frustrating.
I can just imagine if the pitch matched the show actually is: "Every character is either a horrible person or flat as a pancake, while the character that gets showered with praise on a weekly basis is based on me! How I wish my life was! Only hotter!"
Posted by AvidReader (Member # 6007) on :
quote:Originally posted by Lyrhawn: I serious think that this episode takes us into a place where Rachel isn't just a selfish brat...there's actually something seriously wrong with her.
She did once announce that she's like Tinkerbell; she needs applause to live.
I don't know. I'm not sure I see a teenager fooling around with another guy as quite as big a deal. This is not a mature woman who did this to her husband. This is a dumb kid in her first real relationship trying to "get even" because she got her feelings hurt. Discovering that there are consequences to making yourself feel better is an important life lesson that will serve her well down the road.
The part I'm confused about is why a girl with two doting parents has such intense abandonment issues. That exchange with Finn? "You said you'd never leave me!" That's an abandonment issue talking. (Yeah, been there, done that.) Maybe the writer's got that problem and doesn't realize people with both parents tend not to do that. It's just weird.
Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
I understand the abandonment issue - her mother just dropped her cold because she wasn't a cute little baby anymore last year. That would give anyone a complex.
I'm still shocked that happened. A mother searches a daughter that looks exactly like her, sings like an angel, longs for any kind of relationship, and she walks on her for not being 7 lb.? That part was bad plotting. But Rachel being damaged by it is completely understandable.
I mean, it isn't like Rachel hunted her down. The mother hunted down Rachel, and then was so disappointed with who she found she disappeared and adopted the child of the blonde, perfect cheerleader instead. That is COLD.
Posted by Raymond Arnold (Member # 11712) on :
quote:I understand the abandonment issue - her mother just dropped her cold because she wasn't a cute little baby anymore last year. That would give anyone a complex.
Wait what? I missed some episodes last year, I totally missed that.
Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
At the end of last season, her mother orchestrted events to find her daughter, they sang a few inappropriate songs together, and then the mother didn't want a relationship with Rachel because what she really wanted was Rachel as a baby. As a teenager, she was no fun at all. So she has no contact with Rachel and adopted Quinn's baby.
As horrible as everyone else is, she definitely wins forever as Worst Person On the Show. I can't even imagine the magnitude of Rachel's abandonment issues, all justified.
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
I just realized that Quinn's baby is technically Rachel's adopted sister...
I hope the writers will start writing Rachel as being a little more mature. I actually think she is less mature this season than she was the second half of the first season.
As far as character development goes I think the only real winners on the show have been Quinn and (to a lesser extent) Kurt.
Posted by Raymond Arnold (Member # 11712) on :
I thought Rachel was supposed to have two gay dads. Was it too gay moms, or did I totally get that wrong?
Was Rachel actually likeable in that episode?
Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
...creating a child requires a mother as well as a father.
Rachel was likable there - I liked Rachel most of last season. The duet of "Poker Face" was a little bizarre, but mostly it made sense and Rachel was very relatable. Even when she had faults, they were human ones. This year is nothing sociopaths, cartoons, and Mary Sues.
Posted by aeolusdallas (Member # 11455) on :
quote:Originally posted by katharina: None of these characters are any kind of real. I am resigned that Glee is one long SNL sketch with fun music.
The sanctification of Martyr Kurt is horrendously boring.
Nothing in that episode sanctified Kurt.
Posted by aeolusdallas (Member # 11455) on :
Katharina you need to learn the actual meaning of sociopath so you quit misusing it.
Posted by Hank (Member # 8916) on :
quote:Originally posted by Raymond Arnold: I thought Rachel was supposed to have two gay dads. Was it too gay moms, or did I totally get that wrong?
Was Rachel actually likeable in that episode?
She was raised by her two gay dads. The mother was her the surrogate they used--her birth mother, played by Idina Menzel.
Posted by msquared (Member # 4484) on :
Coach is now my second favorite character.
msquared
Posted by Raymond Arnold (Member # 11712) on :
Christmas episode was excellent. Funny and touching in all the right ways.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
I hated the fact that Rachel was singing "Last Christmas" to Finn. It would have made perfect sense for HIM to sing it, but zero sense for her.
And what the heck is wrong with the kids at that school? I would have loved for carolers as good as them to swing by my class in high school.
Posted by AvidReader (Member # 6007) on :
The rest of the school is pathalogical in their need to hate the Glee club. It's like a mountain range or a lake - just part of the setting.
But seriously, how adorable was Brittany? Her with the braids coming in while Sue was destroying the room. And the line straight out of the book. It was just so cute!
As for the Finn/Rachel stuff, I was screaming at him to stay away from the narcissist. He can do better. Posted by Shanna (Member # 7900) on :
My choir used to carol during the holidays as a fundraiser (we also did singing-grams for Valentines.) I haven't met a high schooler who wouldn't welcome a break from class, any kind of break. But the writers dictate that students at McKinley would loudly insult cheerleaders and football players at the top of the popularity pyramid just for being in show choir. And teachers can throw shoes without reprimand.
I adored the whole Brittany/Santa storyline. I really watch the show just for her most weeks. And the ending, while ridiculous, was super sweet!
Sue as the Grinch was also quite fun. But everything else, especially the music, felt forced. The song while decorating the tree, Rachel's boring solo, Rachel singing that horrible choice with Finn, and Kurt and Blaine's duet while cute also felt like it was dropped in as a necessity.
Posted by Amanecer (Member # 4068) on :
quote:But seriously, how adorable was Brittany? Her with the braids coming in while Sue was destroying the room. And the line straight out of the book. It was just so cute!
Hear Hear! I loved the Grinch story.
Posted by Raymond Arnold (Member # 11712) on :
I loved the decorating the tree song - I was totally not expecting them to sing "Isle of Misfit Toys" and it made my day. Apart from the Rachel songs I really liked their choices.
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
I liked the episode as well. I've decided that Coach Beist is probably the only truly good hearted character on that show. I liked how she opened up to Brittany, and I admit I teared up when Beist was outside the choir room looking at Artie when he tried his new legs she got him.
I still hate Rachel. I hope Finn doesn't get back with her. At the end when they were near the tree he had that half smile on his face when he looked at her. I hope it doesn't grow into something more.
I actually liked Kurt and Blaine's duet. I thought it was very well done.
Posted by aeolusdallas (Member # 11455) on :
quote:Originally posted by Amanecer:
quote:But seriously, how adorable was Brittany? Her with the braids coming in while Sue was destroying the room. And the line straight out of the book. It was just so cute!
Hear Hear! I loved the Grinch story.
I loved this episode and I was practically doubled over with laughter during the Grinch scenes. Plus Bieste made me tear up at the end.
Plus that rendition of "Baby it's Cold Outside" was absolutely beautiful.
Posted by Phanto (Member # 5897) on :
This episode touched my heart. The football coach is a very relatable person.
That said, the writers have pretty much decided Rachel is just going to be an unlikeable character.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
Really liked last week's episode.
And I think the Warbler number are the best thing, musically, going for the show right now.
Posted by Raymond Arnold (Member # 11712) on :
I just saw that today as well, and thought it was pretty good.
Posted by aeolusdallas (Member # 11455) on :
I like that Rachael is growing up. I also like that Quinn pointed out Finn's hypocrisy in going after her. Even Finn seems to have finally started to wise up about his motives. Another great thing was Blaine's hilarious mishandling of his crush. It makes him less perfect and humanizes him. Kurt had some really great double takes, quips and expressions during that debacle.
Santana's dressing down by the group was a long time coming and wow that fight with Zizes was the most fun I have had watching TV in some time.
I am loving Zizes a lot. I am glad they are showing us a girl who has some self respect. Particularly a big girl who people also assume will be "grateful" if any boy tries and gets some from them.
Clearly Puck is liking it as well. It's good that he meets a girl who wont fall for his bad boy act.
Plus the Music was pretty good.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
I agree with everything you just said.
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
I'm pretty happy about Zizes being in the group as well. Seeing Puck go after her was my favorite part of the episode. I thought it was great that Puck got stood up, especially since he is usually the one doing it.
I'm probably one of the only people that think Finn and Quinn are a cuter couple than any of the others. I think they have great chemistry. I never understood the whole Finn / Rachel thing. At the end of the episode Santana looked back at Sam and smiled and gave him a look, I'm wondering if she is going to try to hook up with him.
I am pretty happy about Kurt finally telling Blaine about his feelings for him. I had to go back and watch "When Harry met Sally" again to understand what they were talking about though.
Posted by aeolusdallas (Member # 11455) on :
Wow they knocked Sing!(My chemical Romance) out of the park!
That scene at the Batmitzvah was hilarious. They made great fun of the whole Bieber Fever phenomenon and still did good versions of the songs. I really thought the Diva-off was a great number as well. Plus Zizes number was fun. Really we had a whole lot of music in this episode. All of it pretty well done.
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
I don't know how I feel about the whole Quinn / Sam situation. I kind of feel bad for both of them.
I really liked the scene at the hospital as well when Will took Sue to see the kids.
The whole Puck and Lauren thing just makes me smile. She is in control and Puck is digging it.
Posted by aeolusdallas (Member # 11455) on :
I loved Brittany's statement to Rachael. "They look at you and they see a cat getting its temperature taken. And then they hear it screaming."
Posted by Phanto (Member # 5897) on :
Yes, I liked the Brittany trend setting thing as well. Cute subplot.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
I think Lauren's number is troubling if we're to believe she's actually a good singer. That song was pretty flat, and while I thought it was very entertaining, it seems proof that she doesn't have a great voice. Otherwise it was a bit of a silly number to start with.
Posted by aeolusdallas (Member # 11455) on :
The original version of the song is kind of flat too
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
Precisely. I meant they specifically chose a song that requires no singing ability.
Posted by aeolusdallas (Member # 11455) on :
Well the actress claims she can sing and had to audition so I will reserve judgement till I hear her again.
Posted by Raymond Arnold (Member # 11712) on :
I'm interested in them doing an original song for their anthem. But I also just saw the video for Pink's Raise your Glass for the first time and think that would make an absolutely amazing anthem for Glee.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
Well we've known for awhile that they were going to do an original music episode, and that some of the best current song writers were lining up to write for the show, including Dianne Warren, who got a shout-out last week via Santana.
It'll be interesting.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
Oh geez, annoying, pity-me-Kurt is back.
Posted by aeolusdallas (Member # 11455) on :
I loved Weepy Drunk Santana!
All of the songs were good but the Human League duet with Blaine and Rachael was particularly good.
Kurt was a stand in for the "There are no bisexuals" guy that will inevitably run into if you spend any real time In a gayborhood. As for his pity me mode, it's just part of his character. He is a drama queen. Just like Rachael.
I actually liked that his father put him in his place.
On a final note...or two. I am so glad we finally got Beiste singing and the long awaited Brittany Ke$ha number.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
I think my biggest problem with Kurt is that he's making a farce out of a genuine problem. you know, I was on his side when Karofsky at school was being a brutal nightmare to him. That was unacceptable, and it happens too often. It shined an important light on the subject.
But every other thing he's done has involved him blaming EVERYone around him for being homophobic because that don't do what he wants. Finn is homophobic because he's a straight guy who doesn't want to be leered at. His dad tells him it's inappropriate to have a sleepover with a potential sexual partner, and it's because he's being gay singled out when clearly that wasn't his dad's concern. And frankly, I think his dad was pretty cool about it. It's impossible to take any of his complaints seriously.
And by the way, Heather Morris is the hottest thing on that show. She absolutely nailed it. Surprisingly, she's one of the better singers in the group, and with the dance moves, I think she comes off as one of the top individual entertainers of the show.
Posted by aeolusdallas (Member # 11455) on :
Kurt's overly defensive. But considering that he is a very flamboyant gay teen in a smallish town in Ohio. The only out gay that he really ever knew till he met Blaine. I can't really fault him to much for it. Plus while his actions towards Finn were not appropriate in real life, had his character been straight no one would have said anything about it. Every teen in a romantic comedy goes to outlandish levels that would be stalking in real life.
As for "creepy". Falling for someone who will never love you back and making a play for them anyways is foolish and doomed from the start but not creepy.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
Well that's a silly hypothetical. If he wasn't gay, he wouldn't have been leering at Finn.
And I think he went beyond your description. It WAS creepy. Maybe even abusive. If Finn had been a girl, we'd be calling Kurt a sexual predator.
Posted by Raymond Arnold (Member # 11712) on :
I think aeolusdallas is somewhat correct that since this is a romantic comedy, it's a bit more accepted for people to do ridiculous things. I think Kurt's actions with Finn are still unacceptable, but I admit that I'd tolerate a wider range of unacceptable things on a silly TV show than I would in real life.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
Fair point I suppose, though, Glee has a habit of being silly one moment and then turning super-serious when it wants to make a real point and sort of demands to be taken seriously. It's not like Friends or Frasier where EVERYTHING is a farce. Sometimes they demand your attention. I'm somewhat less likely to give it these days.
Posted by Carrie (Member # 394) on :
Let's focus on the positive, shall we?
quote:Originally posted by Lyrhawn: And by the way, Heather Morris is the hottest thing on that show. She absolutely nailed it. Surprisingly, she's one of the better singers in the group, and with the dance moves, I think she comes off as one of the top individual entertainers of the show.
She's awesome, plain and simple.
Posted by Shanna (Member # 7900) on :
Slightly random, but if we're geeking over Brittany I just had to share this.
As for the episode, thank goodness for Brittany. I am so sick of victim-Kurt and ridiculously-immature-Schuester. And, of course, Rachel forgets all of her growth in recent episodes and continues to cling to Finn and hit on her friend's crush.
The show can't seem to find the right balance between comedy/drama. The writers should start taking a clue from the early seasons of Scrubs. Here's another show that utilizes absurdist humor but still makes me care about the characters. Its so hard to cheer for the Glee kids (and adults who act worse than kids.) Unless we're cheering for them to have their hearts destroyed and their dreams crushed. THAT'S something I could get behind.
Except for Brittany. I already fear for the day when Artie has his obligatory worst-character-of-the-week episode and breaks her heart.
Posted by aeolusdallas (Member # 11455) on :
quote:Originally posted by Lyrhawn: Well that's a silly hypothetical. If he wasn't gay, he wouldn't have been leering at Finn.
And I think he went beyond your description. It WAS creepy. Maybe even abusive. If Finn had been a girl, we'd be calling Kurt a sexual predator.
Then you would have to call the protagonist in most romantic comedies a sexual predators.
Posted by aeolusdallas (Member # 11455) on :
quote:Originally posted by Carrie: Let's focus on the positive, shall we?
quote:Originally posted by Lyrhawn: And by the way, Heather Morris is the hottest thing on that show. She absolutely nailed it. Surprisingly, she's one of the better singers in the group, and with the dance moves, I think she comes off as one of the top individual entertainers of the show.
She's awesome, plain and simple.
Yeah Heather Morris was just amazing!
Posted by boros1124 (Member # 12513) on :
quote:If Finn had been a girl, we'd be calling Kurt a sexual predator.
We have called Kurt a sexual predator. He's creepy as heck. He's such a poor human being I have to wonder if Ryan Murphy even knows what he's doing - if we are supposed to be rooting for Kurt, then making him a self-righteous stalker isn't the way to go.
quote:Then you would have to call the protagonist in most romantic comedies a sexual predators.
No, because of: 1. The bordello shared bedroom. 2. Manipulating the parents. 3. Finn uncomfortable even in the bathroom.
All towards a person who has stated, emphatically, that he is not only not interested in Kurt, but isn't interested in his entire gender. It's less While You Were Sleeping and more Misery. Definitely creepy.
But the biggest problem with Glee is that we are supposed to weep for Kurt after the lightest slightest sneer and laugh hysterically as other characters are subjected to experiences that should send them into a sobbing fetal position. All in the same episode.
Posted by Phanto (Member # 5897) on :
Yes, if you rephrase it as a guy hitting on a girl, it is fairly icky.
- A guy has a crush on a girl so he orchestrates their single parents marrying so that he can sleep in the same room as the girl.
Plus the other things.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
quote:Originally posted by Phanto: Yes, if you rephrase it as a guy hitting on a girl, it is fairly icky.
- A guy has a crush on a girl so he orchestrates their single parents marrying so that he can sleep in the same room as the girl.
Plus the other things.
I'd almost say that if you stop that part way through then it's fine. Guy likes girl so guy tries to get girl's parent to like his. But, the sleeping in the same room and sneaking peeks thing for a step-brother/step-sister relationship? That's off no matter what the gender is.
Posted by Phanto (Member # 5897) on :
I would also add that I'd bet Kurt's father would not be so happy with him having a girl sleep over either.
So it's just a weird dynamic where the rules/social norms are unclear or yet to be established.
Posted by msquared (Member # 4484) on :
Again, Kurt's dad shows himself to be the best character in the show. He and the coach.
msquared
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
I agree. Burt has redeemed himself in my eyes since the whole Burt/Finn fallout of the first season.
And I'm still in love with Diana Agron...
Posted by msquared (Member # 4484) on :
What I liked about his sex talk is that it is one any parent could have with any kid. It was that good. It was about respecting yourself.
I like Agron to but the lady who plays Britney does something for me.
msquared
Posted by Shanna (Member # 7900) on :
Did anyone else laugh when Blaine called Kurt the "most moral and compassionate" person he knew? The same guy who gave him grief last week for possibly being bisexual.
I like Diana Argon as well but I don't like what they're doing with Quinn this season. As for Brittany, her stork speech was epically hilarious.
Has anyone else noticed that the kindest characters all have names that start with the letter B? Bieste, Blaine, Burt, and Brittany (for the most part.)
I will say that I was very moved by Santana's storyline last night. But alot of credit goes to the actress for the delivery. Its interesting that she's not just the cliched "mean girl" but that she lashes out in order to keep people away and not have to investigate her feelings. It makes sense. However, I feel like we kinda already did this storyline with Kurt's bully.
I'm still interested to see where things go. I think Brittany may care for Santana more than Artie but she's obviously cares enough to not want to break his heart. However, I'm worried its going to turn into yet ANOTHER love triangle. I'd count them off but we've had so many that I can't keep track enough to care.
Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
None of these chracters have the slightest bit of veracity.
Blaine said that to Kurt because Kurt is a Mary Sue, and Ryan Murphy is a raging narcissistic who can't see the monster he's created because its him.
Kurt does a lot of whining and he's been the gamut from petty to predatory. Being a victim doesn't make someone virtuous, especialy when they deal with it, as Kurt does, by victimizing others (Finn, Rachel). Maybe he saves orphans off-screen, but from the evidence of the show, Blaine was hallucinating.
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
quote:Originally posted by katharina: None of these chracters have the slightest bit of veracity.
Did you see this ep? If you don't think Naya Rivera's character had veracity, you need to get out more.
Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
And when Ryan Murphy gets bored, she'll get another personality change.
Posted by Phanto (Member # 5897) on :
Kurt's dad is just a wonderful and believable character. You can tell homosexuality makes him uncomfortable, but that's because of his being a manly kind of guy from a previous, perhaps less tolerant generation and he doesn't let it influence his care for his son.
The whole lesbian twist strikes me as unrealistic, though. It was previously just something the two girls did because one is a somewhat clueless, sex fiend and the other is a moderately vicious, sexual woman. To elevate it to love seems melodramatic.
Posted by aeolusdallas (Member # 11455) on :
quote:Originally posted by Shanna: Did anyone else laugh when Blaine called Kurt the "most moral and compassionate" person he knew? The same guy who gave him grief last week for possibly being bisexual.
I like Diana Argon as well but I don't like what they're doing with Quinn this season. As for Brittany, her stork speech was epically hilarious.
Has anyone else noticed that the kindest characters all have names that start with the letter B? Bieste, Blaine, Burt, and Brittany (for the most part.)
I will say that I was very moved by Santana's storyline last night. But alot of credit goes to the actress for the delivery. Its interesting that she's not just the cliched "mean girl" but that she lashes out in order to keep people away and not have to investigate her feelings. It makes sense. However, I feel like we kinda already did this storyline with Kurt's bully.
I'm still interested to see where things go. I think Brittany may care for Santana more than Artie but she's obviously cares enough to not want to break his heart. However, I'm worried its going to turn into yet ANOTHER love triangle. I'd count them off but we've had so many that I can't keep track enough to care.
Santana is kind of the female version of Karofsky. Lashing out for the very same reasons he is. Only she acknowledges it. I was actually kind of surprised when she essential said she was lesbian. Particularly after her " I like everything speech" earlier in the episode.
Posted by Raymond Arnold (Member # 11712) on :
My favorite part of this episode was Blaine's look of utter confusion as Sue started talking. We're so used to her odd mannerisms that we just roll with it. I liked the lampshading of how WEIRD she actually is.
Posted by aeolusdallas (Member # 11455) on :
On a serious note Burt's sex talk was just about the most wonderful and honest sex talk I have ever heard,in media or real life. It was beautiful.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
Second. That was an amazing speech.
I kind of liked what happened with Santana and Britney. At the very least, I really was impressed by the acting. I've given up expecting fluidity to this show, so I kind of take each moment as it comes.
What I thought was painful was that Santana finally opened up in a real moment, and was sort of shut down, which was exactly the thing she feared. Harsh. But I like that Britney didn't just drop Artie. In general, it was a good, enjoyable episode.
Didn't really care for most of the music though.
Posted by aeolusdallas (Member # 11455) on :
I don't know Emma's tragic misunderstanding of Afternoon Delight had me in tears.
But last weeks music was overall better.
Posted by AvidReader (Member # 6007) on :
Out of curiosity, is Landslide even a love song? For some reason, I'd always interpreted it as being about a woman leaving her husband.
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
I really liked the Santana / Brittany storyline as well. I think Naya Rivera (Santana) is a better actress than I thought she was. In this episode she showed that she can act as something other than a mean girl.
I think this season Brittany and Santana are getting a lot more screen time because we essentially know about every other character. In the first season we got a lot of the regulars, but Naya and Heather were guest stars. Since they got made regulars I think the writers are trying to make up for the story and screen time they missed in the first season.
I also don't like what the writers are doing with Quinn this season. In the first season she was a mean girl that was humbled when she got pregnant. In this second season she starts off as nice but now it seems the writers don't know what to do with her. She's been nice, she's been shady, she's been mean. Judging from the preview from next week, she's going to be downright cruel.
Oh, and I still hate Rachel.
Posted by katharina (Member # 827) on :
I think Ryan Murphy has the same problem that Stephen Moffat has (although Moffat is tens times better at everything else): he doesn't know how to develop a character. Both writers do interesting intros to a character, and then they flail. There's no arcs, no consistency, no sense of layers. Moffat's characters generally don't grow beyond their introduction, but Murphy basically creates a new character and uses the same name and actor every time.
That's how you get Quinn careening all over the place, why Sue ping/pongs between evil and saintly, why Emma is making out with Hot Carl who erases her OCD one minute and then back to the ice princess when it suits the plot, and why the Britanny/Santana thing went from played for laughs between a ditz and a Captain Jack to Twoo Wuv. Rachel never learns anything, Kurt never learns anything, and Artie switches between a sweetheart to *&&(^% and back again. I could not BELIEVE the way he treated Tina. And that's why the show can't decide who the main characters and can't follow a storyline for more than 1.5 episodes.
Anyway, Murphy writes moments, not characters. He did this with Popular as well, his other teen show. I don't think it's a coincidence that Brittany is turning into the most consistent character, because she's such a cartoon she could be melted by kerosene. The actors are fine and doing their best with what they have, and some are better than others. But writing isn't good. I don't think he knows how to make it so.
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
That makes complete sense Katharina. I have noticed the same thing. I think right now the only real consistent characters we do have are Brittany, Biest, and Burt. I really hope the writers don't ruin them for us.
Posted by Raymond Arnold (Member # 11712) on :
I pretty much agree with Kath as well. But I also take Lyrhawn's approach ("I've given up expecting fluidity to this show, so I kind of take each moment as it comes.") I'm under no illusions that the show is going to move forward with good, well written character arcs. But periodically we get some decent acting, and it's more enjoyable if I pretend that that acting had the appropriate set up.
I actually liked the Santana/Britney thing quite a bit, and DO consider it a place where the previous writing actually WAS the right set up. (Even if it's more likely to be random chance than deliberate plotting). I never felt like the Britney/Santana relationship was just played for laughs. It always felt like deliberate foreshadowing to me.
As for Santana's proclamation of "love," I think the word "love" is probably overkill, but I also think that it's a perfectly accurate portrayal of inexperienced teenagers who have powerful feelings they don't fully understand yet.
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
1. Rhyming dictionaries? Seriously? 2. Trouty mouth was just plain mean. I can't believe Shue let it go on that long. 2. Big A$$ Heart totally rocked. 3. Mercedes is always spectacular. 4. The Jewish star at the end of that song was just gross. 5. Blaine's solo sounded like this Purim song I heard recently. 6. And how about that? Rachel didn't do a single thing to make me hate her this week. Neither did Kurt. Will wonders never cease?
Posted by msquared (Member # 4484) on :
As the show started and Blaine and the Warblers were singing, I was going to comment to my wife about I was wondering how Kurt was liking always being second or third fiddle to Blaine. It had seemed to me that the group was Blaine and the Warblers. Then Kurt brings it up.
Kurt's performance of Blackbird was one of the best I have seen this season.
Right now if I were a judge at a singing competition, I would be furious at the writer. For two years running the judges have been jokes. Who would want to win when you are being judged like that?
msquared
Posted by Shanna (Member # 7900) on :
At first, I was happy to see Kurt call out Blaine on all of his solos. But as the episode progressed, I really wish Kurt has kept his mouth shut.
Because then the bird dies and Kurt has a solo. And since you can't rule anything out with Glee, my brain jumped to "wow, Kurt faked the bird's death as an excuse to sing a solo and since Blaine is already feeling guilty, he'll plead Kurt's case to the council."
Blaine falling in love with Kurt at that moment could not have come more out of left-field. But that's cause I keep forgetting how in Glee, a gorgeous solo fixes everything.
And since that's the case, it suddenly makes sense why Quinn's character has done a complete 180. By having Quinn use Finn to win Homecoming Queen and then bullying Rachel, we can now view Rachel as the victim and the only one who could truly love Finn. I love how the writers manipulate the audience into forgetting that Rachel cheated on Finn and broke his heart. Oh and look, see how Finn stares at Rachel during her gorgeous solo. Its like music heals all wounds.
Seriously, someone make it stop!
Posted by aeolusdallas (Member # 11455) on :
quote:Originally posted by Shanna: At first, I was happy to see Kurt call out Blaine on all of his solos. But as the episode progressed, I really wish Kurt has kept his mouth shut.
Because then the bird dies and Kurt has a solo. And since you can't rule anything out with Glee, my brain jumped to "wow, Kurt faked the bird's death as an excuse to sing a solo and since Blaine is already feeling guilty, he'll plead Kurt's case to the council."
Blaine falling in love with Kurt at that moment could not have come more out of left-field. But that's cause I keep forgetting how in Glee, a gorgeous solo fixes everything.
And since that's the case, it suddenly makes sense why Quinn's character has done a complete 180. By having Quinn use Finn to win Homecoming Queen and then bullying Rachel, we can now view Rachel as the victim and the only one who could truly love Finn. I love how the writers manipulate the audience into forgetting that Rachel cheated on Finn and broke his heart. Oh and look, see how Finn stares at Rachel during her gorgeous solo. Its like music heals all wounds.
Seriously, someone make it stop!
Blaine's falling for love was not out of thin air. It happened when Kurt quit acting like a love sick puppy and started.(for the first time since he went to Dalton) like himself.
Did you completely miss what Quinn was actually saying in her conversation with Rachael?
Winning Finn is the only real victory she has to look forward too. Rachael is going places. Quinn is not. Quinn was all but begging Rachael to let her have Finn but Rachael couldn't see that. It was all about herself. Your "writers manipulate the audience into forgetting that Rachel cheated on Finn and broke his heart" line is way off. The writers are doing no such thing.
Posted by Shanna (Member # 7900) on :
Kurt is so dramatic about everything that its hard to tell when he's being genuine. Its easier to accept him as an overblown caricature. There's a throwaway line about him buying a fancy cover for the bird cage and so we're supposed to believe that Kurt has really been struck by the bird's death.
I did hear what Quinn was saying during her speech to Rachel but again, she doesn't love Finn since she's so sure he's going to be a "Lima Loser" just like her for the rest of his life. I hate Rachel, I really do, but Finn loves music and Rachel could inspire him to pursue his dream. Members of a nationally-ranked show choir can very easily get scholarship money for college.
I'm quite annoyed with all three of them. Finn's too easily manipulated, Rachel's loves being the victim, and Quinn, who has suffered more than any character on the show, has learned nothing. Sure, she was pregnant but she gave the baby up for adoption. The only thing holding her back is herself. She's not going to go anywhere if she's holding onto dreams of being homecoming queen. Its hard to feel for a character who not only has low self-esteem but seems determined to hold back others as well. In that way, she may be even meaner than Santana.
Posted by aeolusdallas (Member # 11455) on :
I disagree. Quinn more than any other character except Santana has shown the most growth this season. Unfortuantely she is very insecure and seems to be accepting her future limitations. She is settling instead of dreaming big.
Finn is kind (mostly) and not very bright but he does read people well but yes he is easily manipulated.
Kurt is over emotional and has been taking care of that bird for most of the season. Of course he was upset by it's death.
edit Kurt is always being genuine. Over the top and overly dramatic and sometimes very annoying but I can't think of a single thing he ever did that wasn't genuine .
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
I wondered how much of Kurt's grief was defensive. He'd been given the bird as a responsibility, and he must have been afraid that he'd be in trouble with his fellow Warblers. Displaying that degree of grief is good protection from that sort of thing.</cynicism>
Posted by aeolusdallas (Member # 11455) on :
quote:Originally posted by Lisa: I wondered how much of Kurt's grief was defensive. He'd been given the bird as a responsibility, and he must have been afraid that he'd be in trouble with his fellow Warblers. Displaying that degree of grief is good protection from that sort of thing.</cynicism>
You seem to always take whatever Kurt does and twist it to the worst possible motivation. Why is that?
Posted by Lisa (Member # 8384) on :
Because I make the mistake of reacting to him the way I'd react to someone in real life. Which doesn't really make sense, since he's just a fictional character, and they can roll the dice on personalities all they want. But if I knew a real person who had displayed the sort of selfishness/selfcenteredness that Kurt has, then yeah, that's probably where I'd go first.
Also, I'm generally cynical. Comes with age.
Posted by Lyrhawn (Member # 7039) on :
You know, the Star of David at the end of the Jesus song REALLY threw me. I looked over at my room mate and we both had a "huh?" face. This episode was remarkably predictable though. My room mate and I guess everything that would happen five minutes before it did, including my room mate guessing that Sue would deck the woman who presented the results, which was particularly hilarious.
As for the actual content: The songs were pretty hilarious, but really, I thought they really could have made fantastic songs out of them. "Hell No" worked more or less as is. "Trouty Mouth" would have been a sweet jazz song with better lyrics, and Naya certainly can do jazz. "Big Ass Heart" also had an awesome beat. The lyrics weren't even atrocious, but they could have been a lot better for what was musically a fun song.
I loved it when Kurt called Blayne out. It wasn't even malicious and catty like he normally is. He was even, and spot-on. I was fine with it because I particularly like his performances, but I thought that was nice.
The thing with Rachel and Quinn was interesting. I think Quinn is bitter because she realizes she's not getting out of that town, and thinks that marrying the quarterback prom king really is the best that she can do. It was a very resigned, cynical, bitter, angry speech that she gave Rachel, even while actually sort of being nice to Rachel by acknowledging, several times, that Rachel is the only one who will make it out because she is so talented. For Rachel's part, that song didn't at all brush under the rug the fact that she cheated on Finn. The song was all about the mistakes that she made, and acknowledging all the self-destructive things that she has done in the past. I thought she actually grew quite a bit. Too bad with this show that growth will never be allowed to last, but it was nice.
I was hoping we'd get another performance with Mike and Brittany dancing together, but this was fine. What I don't get is where Vocal Adrenaline is. I'm sure they have an explanation as to why they weren't there, but I don't see how two Ohio based groups can compete against each other at Nationals.
Posted by KissPista (Member # 12530) on :
The Glee also made a comic book. Very funny. Unable to think clearly.
Posted by Geraine (Member # 9913) on :
I thought that while Quinn could have been a little nicer about it, she basically asked Rachel to just let her have this one.
The speech about her becoming a realtor and Finn taking over Burt's Tire Shop helped me understand why Quinn was acting the way she was. In the first season she called Puck a Lima loser. She made it pretty clear she didn't want to be one. Now we have learned that she has resigned herself to that life and wants to make the best of it. I think she really does love Finn, but is afraid to let herself admit it because of their past.
Posted by Phanto (Member # 5897) on :
I think the Quinn speech was wonderfully done, and I thought Hell No had real potential. Rachel was less obnoxiously annoying than usual this episode, but still, the point that she is a naive person living in a fairy tale was not inaccurate.
Kurt was also better than normal. Not a bad episode.
Posted by leeyn (Member # 12531) on :
(Post Removed by Janitor Blade. Spam)
[ March 18, 2011, 01:11 AM: Message edited by: JanitorBlade ]
Posted by aeolusdallas (Member # 11455) on :
Wow Jesus Is My Friend is a preexisting song from the 70's
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
![[Frown]](frown.gif)