Originally posted by kmbboots:
[QUOTE]I saw this too. I think that the conspiracy theory gains credibility because the logo is so ugly. I mean...there has to be some reason for it to be that bad.
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quote:
@Henry_Kissinger
Dr Henry Kissinger
Given Facebook's role in undermining US allies, should we charge Mark Zuckerberg with treason? Something to think about.
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quote:Gosh, I hope not... That would impact the development of Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 in a most unacceptable manner!!!
Originally posted by Samprimary:
Oh, they shut off Wisconsin's internet already?
quote:collective bargaining != freedom of association.
Originally posted by Paul Goldner:
Just threatening the freedom of association.
quote:I think, if we're being consistent, that it's just as crucial an aspect of freedom of association as money is to the freedom of speech, see Citizen's United, and prior rulings.
Originally posted by capaxinfiniti:
quote:collective bargaining != freedom of association.
Originally posted by Paul Goldner:
Just threatening the freedom of association.
quote:Actually, 80,000 people assembled.
I am more surprised that 40,000 people in Wisconson assembled at all, thats almost all of them!
Of course, some had to come from out of state.
quote:Football season's over. It's not like they have anything else to do anymore.
Originally posted by AchillesHeel:
I am more surprised that 40,000 people in Wisconson assembled at all, thats almost all of them!
quote:No, but prohibiting collective bargaining is a restriction on freedom of association. I think its reasonable to say that collective bargaining is a necessary element of freedom of association.
collective bargaining != freedom of association.
quote:http://www.thestar.com/news/world/article/942417--demonstrations-like-a-flu-yemeni-president-says?bn=1
A defiant President Ali Abdullah Saleh said the street demonstrations and calls for his removal were “like a flu,” which had spread from Tunisia to Egypt and was contaminating the Arab world.
“Why do you turn to violence? Why do you turn to the destruction of things? This is an infection, it’s not in our culture, it’s not in our tradition,” he told journalists invited to the presidential compound for a rare news conference Monday morning.
Saleh refused to step down, warning that the country would descend into anarchy as the government collapsed. He has vowed to not run again in the 2013 elections, but since he has twice before made the same promise few believe him.
quote:http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/23/world/middleeast/23bahrain.html
More than a hundred thousand protesters poured into the central Pearl Square here on Tuesday in an unbroken stream stretching back for miles along a central highway in the biggest antigovernment demonstration yet seen in this tiny Persian Gulf kingdom. ... In a nation of only a half a million citizens, the sheer size of the gathering was astonishing. The protest, organized by the Shiite opposition parties, began in the central Bahrain Mall, two miles from the central square and seemed to fill the entire length of the highway between the two points.
quote:As the awkward-sounding translator informed me during Gaddafi's press conference this morning, he will die a martyr rather than hand the country over. His body bag may well happen.
Originally posted by Samprimary:
If Gaddafi hasn't already fled, he stands a severe likelihood of ending in a body bag before this is all over.
quote:http://freakonomics.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/02/22/middle-east-despot-watch/
Libya — Gadaffi: 83%
Bahrain — Al Khalifa: 62%
Yemen — Ali Abdullah Saleh: 48%
Iran — Ahmadinejad: 16%
Iran — Ayatollah Ali Khamenei: 15%
quote:Obama certainly has some tough decisions to make. . . .
But many refused to run, initially at least, determined to defy the violence being visited upon them. Some held their hands in the air and shouted "Peaceful! Peaceful!".
The shooting resumed. One man crumpled to the ground, blood pouring from his leg; nearby a second was also felled. A scream went up: "live ammunition!"
As security forces then began to fire anti-air craft guns over their heads and the air filled with tear gas, the protesters' will finally broke.
But even as they fled in headlong panic, a helicopter sprayed gunfire at them and more fell. Paramedics from ambulances that had rushed to the scene darted forward to help the wounded, but they too were shot at. Several were detained and at least one ambulance was impounded.
quote:Well I would take that as a given. This is more for, "regardless of whether we have or have not supported a dictatorship in the past, what do we have a responsibilty to do so as to help other people from other countries establish their own democracies."
Originally posted by kmbboots:
It might mean that we should stop propping up the dictators in the first place. Problem is that dictators are good for business.
quote:It almost never comes down to Civil War, and even when it does, countries like Sri Lanka or Sudan are actually the exception rather than the norm.
Originally posted by BlackBlade:
A civil war would truly be an awful affair. One need only look at Sri Lanka to realize just how terrible those can be.
quote:And you thought that was a joke.
Oh, they shut off Wisconsin's internet already?
quote:
There's been virtually no reliable information coming out of Tripoli, but a source close to the Gaddafi regime I did manage to get hold of told me the already terrible situation in Libya will get much worse. Among other things, Gaddafi has ordered security services to start sabotaging oil facilities. They will start by blowing up several oil pipelines, cutting off flow to Mediterranean ports. The sabotage, according to the insider, is meant to serve as a message to Libya's rebellious tribes: It's either me or chaos.
Two weeks ago this same man had told me the uprisings in Tunisia and Egypt would never touch Libya. Gaddafi, he said, had a tight lock on all of the major tribes, the same ones that have kept him in power for the past 41 years. The man of course turned out to be wrong, and everything he now has to say about Gaddafi's intentions needs to be taken in that context.
Read more: http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,2052961,00.html#ixzz1ElW3Yj1d
quote:Come on now. The linked article is certainly a very, very far cry from "shutting off the internet."
Originally posted by Glenn Arnold:
quote:And you thought that was a joke.
Oh, they shut off Wisconsin's internet already?
quote:Dan, I don't see how Glenn's post is comparing anything to Egypt.
Originally posted by Dan_Frank:
quote:Come on now. The linked article is certainly a very, very far cry from "shutting off the internet."
Originally posted by Glenn Arnold:
quote:And you thought that was a joke.
Oh, they shut off Wisconsin's internet already?
For those that didn't follow it, the linked article is about a single website being blocked from access within the Capital building, for about a half hour, after which time it was reported and access was granted. There is significant disagreement on both sides as to the cause of this (one side says it's standard policy to block sites till they've been approved, the other side says it's an attack of the first amendment) and nothing has been proven either way thus far.
You're certainly welcome to interpret the facts the way that makes sense to you, but comparing it to what happened in Egypt is pretty disingenuous.
quote:I don't know about Saudi Arabia. It's one of the more stable dictatorships in the region. You'd reply to that by saying "yeah but that's what we said about Egypt and Libya!" but I think they're a slightly different situation. Saudi Arabia's unemployment rate is something like 10%, which is high by western standards, but it's still the lowest in the region. Egypt's was like 40%. I don't think there's quite as much boiling up under the surface there, but I could be wrong about that, obviously.
Originally posted by Phanto:
It seems that in Libya, Qaddafi has lost control of almost everything beyond Tripoli. Rumor has it he was shot today, but that is unlikely, though it alone dropped oil prices like $2.
Either way, it seems possible, and maybe even likely, that the revolt/rebellion will launch an assault on the main city - and soon.
It seems to me his days in power are numbered.
People are very concerned about Saudi Arabia. If protests spread there, the damage to oil prices - and the global economy - could be catastrophic.
quote:I don't really see how.
Originally posted by Blayne Bradley:
I'm fairly sure that would be illegal.
quote:The Swiss bank has already done so with Mubarak. Who is he going to complain to?
Originally posted by Blayne Bradley:
I'm fairly sure that would be illegal.
quote:
As Reuters reports, Libyans were puzzled by Col. Muammar el-Qaddafi's bizarre tirade on state television on Thursday in which he claimed that young Libyans "fueled by milk and Nescafe spiked with hallucinogenic drugs," were fighting not for their freedom but for Al Qaeda's leaders, Osama bin Laden and Ayman al-Zawahri.
quote:I always knew Nescafe was EVIL!
Anti-government forces said they had gained control of the city as Gadhafi accused followers of Osama bin Laden of adding hallucinogenic drugs to residents' drinks to spark the unrest.
"They put it with milk or with other drinks, spiked drinks," he said. After taking the tablets, "they (the protesters) attack this police station or that one so they can steal from there the criminal records."
Gadhafi called for the al Qaeda leader to be prosecuted.
quote:An especially fun bit
Protesters killed in Iraqi 'day of rage'
At least nine people have been killed in anti-government protests in Iraq as thousands take to the streets in cities across the country for a "day of rage".
Baghdad has been virtually locked down, with the authorities banning traffic in the city centre and deploying several thousand soldiers on the streets.
Still, several hundred people gathered in Baghdad's own Tahrir Square, calling for reform, but not regime change.
quote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12576613
On Thursday, Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki urged people not to join the protests for security reasons, and accused the protest organisers of being al-Qaeda insurgents and Saddam Hussein loyalists.
quote:http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2011/02/26/AR2011022603345.html?hpid=topnews
After Iraq's Day of Rage, a Crackdown on Intellectuals
Iraqi security forces detained about 300 people, including prominent journalists, artists and lawyers who took part in nationwide demonstrations Friday, in what some of them described as an operation to intimidate Baghdad intellectuals who hold sway over popular opinion.
On Saturday, four journalists who had been released described being rounded up well after they had left a protest of thousands at Baghdad's Tahrir Square. They said they were handcuffed, blindfolded, beaten and threatened with execution by soldiers from an army intelligence unit.
"It was like they were dealing with a bunch of al-Qaeda operatives, not a group of journalists," said Hussan al-Ssairi, a journalist and poet who described seeing hundreds of protesters in black hoods at the detention facility. "Yesterday was like a test, like a picture of the new democracy in Iraq."
quote:Mission accomplished!
Iraqi security forces detained about 300 people, including prominent journalists, artists and lawyers who took part in nationwide demonstrations Friday, in what some of them described as an operation to intimidate Baghdad intellectuals who hold sway over popular opinion.
quote:
Iran has threatened to boycott the London Olympics unless the organisers replace the official logo, which Tehran claims spells out the word "Zion".
The logo, a jagged representation of the year 2012, has been said by its critics to resemble many things, from a swastika to a sexual act, but the Iranian government argues it represents a veiled pro-Israeli conspiracy.
In a formal complaint to the International Olympic Committee, Tehran has called for the graphic to be replaced and its designers "confronted", warning that Iranian athletes might otherwise be ordered to stay away from the London Games.
quote:Well the logo is terrible...
Originally posted by Nighthawk:
Iran needs something to complain about... I know! How about the 2012 London Olympics logo?
quote:
Iran has threatened to boycott the London Olympics unless the organisers replace the official logo, which Tehran claims spells out the word "Zion".
The logo, a jagged representation of the year 2012, has been said by its critics to resemble many things, from a swastika to a sexual act, but the Iranian government argues it represents a veiled pro-Israeli conspiracy.
In a formal complaint to the International Olympic Committee, Tehran has called for the graphic to be replaced and its designers "confronted", warning that Iranian athletes might otherwise be ordered to stay away from the London Games.
quote:Sounds like the duped Nescafe missed its target.
Originally posted by Nighthawk:
Iran needs something to complain about... I know! How about the 2012 London Olympics logo?
quote:
Iran has threatened to boycott the London Olympics unless the organisers replace the official logo, which Tehran claims spells out the word "Zion".
The logo, a jagged representation of the year 2012, has been said by its critics to resemble many things, from a swastika to a sexual act, but the Iranian government argues it represents a veiled pro-Israeli conspiracy.
In a formal complaint to the International Olympic Committee, Tehran has called for the graphic to be replaced and its designers "confronted", warning that Iranian athletes might otherwise be ordered to stay away from the London Games.
quote:That would indicate we have some kind of standard for that sort of thing.
Originally posted by Samprimary:
Can we boycott the logo for simply being a hideously bad logo because well
quote:I saw this too. I think that the conspiracy theory gains credibility because the logo is so ugly. I mean...there has to be some reason for it to be that bad.
Originally posted by Phanto:
I never thought I'd say this, but I actually do get why you might think that.
Z upper left, I bottom left, O upper right, N bottom right.
Likely a complete coincidence, but not provocative nonsense totally unbased in reality; just provocative nonsense loosely based on reality.
quote:Absent some personality in the olympic committee who had the personal power to push his or her individual logo concept through with minimal impediment and review, the logo looks like typical failure of Design by Committee.
Originally posted by kmbboots:
[QUOTE]I saw this too. I think that the conspiracy theory gains credibility because the logo is so ugly. I mean...there has to be some reason for it to be that bad.
quote:Shirt 1: I like where we're going with this, but it's not X-treme enough!
Originally posted by Samprimary:
quote:Absent some personality in the olympic committee who had the personal power to push his or her individual logo concept through with minimal impediment and review, the logo looks like typical failure of Design by Committee.
Originally posted by kmbboots:
[QUOTE]I saw this too. I think that the conspiracy theory gains credibility because the logo is so ugly. I mean...there has to be some reason for it to be that bad.
quote:http://www.economist.com/node/18395991?story_id=18395991&fsrc=rss
UNTIL the Arab awakening reached Libya, protesters seemed able to prevail armed with little more than self-belief. Not any more. In Bahrain the regime’s troops, reinforced by foreigners—mostly Saudis—have stormed the protesters’ tent-city at Pearl roundabout, shooting as they went. In Yemen the regime of President Ali Abdullah Saleh has taken to firing live rounds into the crowds. And in Libya itself, as Muammar Qaddafi seizes back the rebel towns strung along the Mediterranean coast, the people are reaping the whirlwind. Torture and death are rampaging through Brega and Zawiya. Terror and despair loom over Tobruk and Benghazi.
quote:http://english.aljazeera.net/news/africa/2011/03/201131720311168561.html
The United Nations Security Council (UNSC) has voted on a resolution authorising a no-fly zone over Libya and "all necessary measures" - code for military action - to protect civilians.
Ten of the council's 15 members voted in favour of the resolution, while Russia, China, Germany, India and Brazil abstained.
No votes were recorded against the resolution on Thursday, which was co-sponsored by France, Britain, Lebanon and the United States.
quote:
8.46pm ET: Canada, in a typical display of aggression, has already pledged six CF-18 fighter jets to help impose the no-fly zone in Libya.
quote:How would that be a "no-fly zone?"
If they use air power to hit Ghaddafi's armor and artillery on the ground, well, then we might have a ball game.
quote:
Updated 1337 GMT (2137 HKT)
quote:Coincidence? I think not!!!!
Originally posted by Mucus:
quote:
Updated 1337 GMT (2137 HKT)
quote:London riots: Violence spreads in the capital and beyond
Riots have spread to new areas of London while looting erupted in the city of Birmingham as Britain's worst violence in decades extended into the third night.
Looting by groups of hooded youths spread to Ealing in west London and Camden in the north of the British capital late on Monday.
Television pictures showed groups of men running through the streets and smashing shop windows. They also set fire to buildings in Croydon, a south London suburb, and Clapham, where they looted shops and cash machines and set fire to at least one shop.
The violence, which began in the northern Tottenham district on Saturday, also spread to Peckham and Lewisham. In Peckam, flames leapt into the air from a torched building, while rubble was strewn across the street. People walked in and out of shops looting.
Police with riot shields responded by charging them as they tried to seal off an area around Hackney Central station in the east of the city. Dozens of officers have now been deployed to the streets of Hackney.
But in a sign that the unrest had spilled outside of the capital, attackers smashed shops and looted property in the central England city of Birmingham.
quote:Israel Protests Press Netanyahu
Massive demonstrations across Israel against the high cost of living point to a revival in the fortunes of the country's long-dormant left-wing movement, forcing Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu to focus on economic policy at a time when he enjoys broad support for his handling of policy toward the Palestinians.
...
On Saturday night, more than 250,000 protesters across Israel demonstrated while waving red flags symbolizing old-time socialist political movements, and chanting for "social justice" and a "welfare state." Over the past three weeks, a small tent city in central Tel Aviv protesting runaway rents has snowballed into Israel's largest demonstrations in recent memory, despite Mr. Netanyahu's efforts to demonstrate attentiveness amid the criticism. Real-estate values have gone up more than a third nationwide over the past four years.
quote:Apparently, some Olympics test events are already under-way, raising concerns about safety.
Rioting spread to other cities in Britain for the first time, with unrest in Birmingham, Bristol, Liverpool and Nottingham. West Midlands police made 138 arrests. Chief Constable Chris Sims said of the looting in the city centre: "This was not an angry crowd, this was a greedy crowd."
quote:
There has been serious disorder in a number of towns and cities across England, including Manchester, Salford, Birmingham, and Gloucester. A police station in Nottingham was firebombed as violence also hit Liverpool, Leicester, Bristol, Wolverhampton and West Bromwich. Garry Shewan, assistant chief constable of Greater Manchester police, said: "This has been senseless on a scale I have never witnessed before in my career."
quote:
Martin Wainwright and Riazat Butt are in Birmingham, talking to people there about the killing of three men who were run over as they tried to protect property last night:
Feelings are running very high in Winson Green where residents of the largely British Asian area are out on the streets discussing the tragedy in shocked and angry groups.
...
One of the group of men said: "There will be race riots if the police don't sort this out quickly".
He accused largely African-Caribbean looting gangs of targeting Asian-owned businesses, partly because they were perceived as easier targets compared with the city centre which was full of police.
quote:http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/blog/2011/aug/10/manchester-riots-uk-disorder-day-four-live#block-1
Several cars then drove past the group which was guarding local stores, Shakiel said, and the occupants shouted abuse before one vehicle returned and mounted the pavement at "tremendous speed" and hit the men, throwing them into the air.
quote:
In Egypt, where burning buildings and running street battles between police and civilians have become a familiar sight this year, reaction to the violence in Britain has been sharply divided.
On social media sites Egyptians started intense debates over the underlying causes of events in London and asked whether any links could be drawn between the unrest in England and their own dramatic political upheaval.
...
Mosa'ab Elshamy, tweeted in frustration at those likening the British riots to the Arab Spring. "Egyptians and Tunisians took revenge for [police brutality victim] Khaled Said and [Tunisian street vendor Mohamed] Bouazizi by peacefully toppling their murdering regimes, not stealing DVD players."
But others hit back, arguing that police brutality and social depravation were universal and that looters should not be instantly condemned.
As happened during the uprising that toppled Hosni Mubarak in February, the role of state television came under scrutiny. One commentator, Mostafa Hussein, wrote: "[The] BBC is making it sound like young people have a single aim & that's to loot and vandalise. Nothing or very little on why they are doing so."
quote:http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2011/aug/09/uk-riots-egyptians-swap-views
Hanna agreed, adding that the actions of looters in London compared unfavourably to the way Egyptians behaved when police were beaten off the streets. "On 28 January [when Mubarak's security forces had to withdraw from the streets] there were no police anywhere and yet there was still less looting than we've seen now in Britain. If the police were completely withdrawn on any given day in the UK the country would probably implode. That raises tough questions … the issue isn't just economical, it's societal."
quote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=327J3ISiVOU
The young man who was the victim of an awful mugging in Barking last night has been named as Mohd Asyraf Raziq Rosli, a 20-year-old Malaysian student.
He was apparently out early to buy food to break his Ramadan fast when he was set upon. The Malaysian Star newspaper reports he was treated in hospital for a broken jaw and disjointed teeth.
quote:http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/story/2011/08/10/social-media-riots.html
When social media helped protesters organize and overthrow corrupt regimes in the Arab world earlier this year, while also providing citizen journalism when the mainstream media was shut out, it was lauded as a tool of democracy.
However, when the same methods are used in a scenario like Britain, they are seen as disturbing, says Megan Boler, a media studies professor in Toronto.
"Here it's not about a dictator. Here the issue is the corporation as a representative symbol. These things always spiral off into hitting the mom and pop stores, which is unfortunate," says Boler, who teaches at the University of Toronto's Ontario Institute for Studies in Education.
quote:I don't know who Kami is, but I wouldn't put money against the last bit given how fast Amazon/Visa/Mastercard/etc. folded during the WikiLeaks incident.
A writer named Kami makes the same point with this post on Facebook.
"Cuz [sic] people who protest in the western countries are rioters, looters, and violent enemies of the good state, so social media is the "catalyst." In Egypt and elsewhere, social media was the tool that made revolution against evil dictators possible. Look for facebook [sic] and others to either have a major overhaul, be a tool for arrests/disappearances, or be named an enemy of the state when massive uprisings happen in the US."