That pretty much every gun encounter there is done within 1 foot of each other I think is plausible, your still risking your life possibly too much so. But it looks like its plausible, the knife encounters while still a chance of grave injury strikes me as less likely to kill you if things go wrong.
Looking it at objectively, even if 95% of the time you could, in full confidence pull this off, there's still a potential 5% of the time in which things go wrong, with a large spectrum of possibly grievous injuries to show for it.
On the other hand, it does look cool to watch.
At 1:10 is pretty much the only point I'm truly skeptical of, where one guy is crouched on the ground and is restrained by the person behind him flipping him over.
Any martial arts experts wanna provide commentary? Posted by AchillesHeel (Member # 11736) on :
Any time you see one of them getting flipped, that is the training method in which you practice breaking whatever limb you are holding onto without having to stress the joints, so instead you allow the receiver of the technique to completely move out of the dangerous position. Or it would be a technique in which the receiver is thrown directly on his head with his full weight causing lethal damage. Either way the training of such will look composed because it really is.
We spend years perfecting the minute details of our schools techniques and then when someone raises both hands as if to push you, all of a sudden you are crouching over your enemy (keeping knees off the ground, for mobility) holding each of his wrists and forcing his own hands into his throat thus choking him. My training made me familiar with situations in which people are trying to kill me: swords, knives, staffs, halberds, ropes, guns, empty handed, massively outnumbered. And in my school the point was that we really were trying, if you are supposed to learn how to block my punch it won't be good enough if never feel like you will get hit.
No amount of training will make you less likely to get hurt, if there is a knife expect to be stabbed and if there is a gun expect to be shot. The point of extensive training is that you are familiar with violent situations, you don't freeze up and you don't give up. When someone is prepared to hurt you talking to them is unlikely to save you, and waiting to see whether or not they will hurt you is undesirable in my experience.
I think that everyone should have at least some hand to hand training, but it doesn't save you from being killed and if anything it should help you understand just how much you cannot defend from.
Posted by neo-dragon (Member # 7168) on :
your still risking your life possibly too much so. But it looks like its plausible, the knife encounters while still a chance of grave injury strikes me as less likely to kill you if things go wrong.
It goes without saying that any action you take when threatened by an armed attacker is risky. No one can claim than any self-defense technique is 100% effective and risk free. The safest course of action when someone points a gun or a knife at you is usually to just give them what they want, unless of course hurting you is what they want.
Posted by JanitorBlade (Member # 12343) on :
Virtually every single gun disarm maneuver he pulls requires the holder to be standing almost against him. Unless this is the movies, he won't have that chance.
Posted by Aros (Member # 4873) on :
Depends on where you are. I've had guns pulled on me three times. In the two instances where there were handguns, the perp got in really close. From their perspective, it makes you easier to shoot and them less likely to be seen. At least in public places like parking lots.
Posted by Stone_Wolf_ (Member # 8299) on :
quote:Originally posted by neo-dragon: The safest course of action when someone points a gun or a knife at you is usually to just give them what they want, unless of course hurting you is what they want.
This is exactly, 100% right on the money. No matter the training or weapons you have on you, your possessions are not worth the risk.
quote:Originally posted by BlackBlade: Virtually every single gun disarm maneuver he pulls requires the holder to be standing almost against him. Unless this is the movies, he won't have that chance.
This is assuming that the person holding you at gun point is well trained and disciplined, and I don't think that is a fair assumption. In fact I think the fair assumption is that movies are -more- likely to influence the kind of person who decides to make mugging their life's work.
When teaching gun safety/tactics, I instruct that if you have a gun on someone, you can not allow them to get within arm's reach of you, and that if someone is advancing on you to let them know they will be shot if they do not stop...and then if they don't stop, to shoot them...twice in center body mass...and then once in the head.
The video looks like a mixed martial arts style, as there is a lot of Aikido, but strikes as well. When I was working security for a hospital they had us take a seminar on pain compliance taught by the local Aikido master. After that I always wanted to take Aikido, but never had the chance. Most of my training is in Shotokan, which is less about grappling and controlling and more about strong strikes, which means I am more likely to end up hurting someone, which is bad.
Posted by AchillesHeel (Member # 11736) on :
I'm tall and pretty big without being morbidly obese, also young and I am never inebriated. On top of that I do not look like a nice person. Aside from my car there is nothing about me that would make someone think I am worth robbing, I am not a desirable mark. If someone were to approach me with a weapon I don't think they would be the type who just want my wallet.
The average scumbag might feel powerful compared to the average woman, but when someone is willing to threaten a big guy with a constant scowl who is visibly paranoid he may be looking for bloodshed whether or not I do as I'm told.
Posted by Stone_Wolf_ (Member # 8299) on :
Tis true, at times the only choice you get to make is to die bravely, fighting back, or die on someone else's terms. At least with the former you have a -chance- no matter how small, to survive.
Posted by Kwea (Member # 2199) on :
two in center mass I get. But if you follow that up with a shot to the head, while they are down from the 2 in center mass, you are going to jail. Even here in FL.
Probably for 1st degree murder, if you have training.
Posted by Rakeesh (Member # 2001) on :
Such a third shot would pretty clearly be crossing the line from self-defense into judge, jury, and executioner.
Posted by Stone_Wolf_ (Member # 8299) on :
The one to the head is if they are still up and advancing...heck, the second one to the chest is too...if they stop, at anytime, you stop shooting. Hopefully they stop before you have to shoot.
If they are still advancing on you, you keep firing. Legally, you will be fine. If you go over to their crumpled body and shoot them again, you might be going to jail.
Remember, you don't shoot to wound, don't shoot to kill, you shoot to -stop-. Stop someone from doing the thing that they were doing that put someone's life in danger.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
Yeah the shot in the head without the clarification of "If they are still up, about and still homing in on you" is asking to go to jail.
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
quote:Originally posted by Aros: Depends on where you are. I've had guns pulled on me three times. In the two instances where there were handguns, the perp got in really close. From their perspective, it makes you easier to shoot and them less likely to be seen. At least in public places like parking lots.
If he wanted to refine his technique, he'd practice with an airsoft pistol and have the partner fire in surprise as he grabs, so as to see where if anywhere he gets shot.
Posted by Blayne Bradley (Member # 8565) on :
With the realistic ones he would have accurate weight and feel as well.
Posted by BlackBlade (Member # 8376) on :
quote:Originally posted by Blayne Bradley: With the realistic ones he would have accurate weight and feel as well.
Yes, that's what I had in mind.
Posted by Aros (Member # 4873) on :
Yes, that's probably the biggest danger. I'd wager it's likely that the shooter will get up close. But a lot of people who wouldn't be willing / able to pull the trigger just might fire in surprise when you went for them.
Posted by AchillesHeel (Member # 11736) on :
While training in what to do when someone puts a weapon on your back, the teacher specifically said to not act like you are in a fight. Telling us to act like nothing is wrong and say something polite and innocuous while you point the weapon away from yourself and break the arm before dropping the enemy on their head.
Posted by Kwea (Member # 2199) on :
In a real situation you move a lot faster, and do the move with more authority because you aren't holding back or letting someone flip to avoid injury as well. No training using those types of moves is really realistic.
I've seen an expert go to town once, and it was downright frightening how much damage he did in less than 2 seconds. He had the knife out of the guys hand and his arm shattered in less time than it takes to sneeze.
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