This is topic Photon Sail name? in forum Open Discussions About Writing at Hatrack River Writers Workshop.


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Posted by EP Kaplan (Member # 5688) on :
 
My current story features a photon sail that is used for time dilating voyages. I wanted a name evocative of the light-based aspect of travel, and the first thing that popped into my head was the LAMP Drive, which stands for LAser to Motion Photon Drive. What do you guys/gals think?
 
Posted by snapper (Member # 7299) on :
 
sounds good to me.
 
Posted by rstegman (Member # 3233) on :
 
Another tactic is to give it a brand name, or the name of the inventor.

It could be the kaplan drive, or the Bill Gates Drive,

or it could be the Gladwrap Clinglight drive or Alcoa Aluminum company's starcatcher sail systems.
Of course, one has to make sure a real company is shown in a good light and there might be permission issues involved.
For some fun, one might have a name for each sail type, as they did in the old sailing ships.

One could also have fun by taking companies that would never have anything to do with such a systme and figure out how changes in their business plans, caused by their expansions into other fields, could get them there, such as the BurgerKing light sail company.
 


Posted by TaleSpinner (Member # 5638) on :
 
LAMP drive is nice, but if the photons come from the nearest sun, there isn't a laser, is there?

Unhelpfully,
Pat
 


Posted by InarticulateBabbler (Member # 4849) on :
 
So it's actually a solar converter?

[This message has been edited by InarticulateBabbler (edited April 30, 2008).]
 


Posted by AstroStewart (Member # 2597) on :
 
Speaking as a scientist, the inclusion of both "light" and "photon" in an acronym is redundant. Light is made up of photons. Also, assuming your drive is getting light from stars, it would not be laser light (incidentally, laser is already an acronym: Light Amplification by Stimulated Emission Radiation).

If you're using a solar sail to somehow achieve relativistic speeds (moving fast enough for time dilation to have a noticeable effect) I would suggest something along the lines of:

Light Absorption for Relativistic Motion -- LARM

or if you really want to keep "LAMP" as the acronym, I'd suggest something like "Light Absorption for Momentum Projection" of course "projection" would have to have a somewhat tweaked/new usage with your new fancy near-light speed drive for that to work.

If you really like including "photon" it would make the most sense to replace "light" with it. ie. Photon Absorption for Relativistic Motion -- PARM, or ... Relativistic Travel -- PART.

Just trying to add a helping hand. If this is a near-light travel device with an acronym based on the science behind it, and it's essentially some kind of solar drive, using the energy of light from stars to propel it, I would definitely suggest having "relativistic" in there, and some kind of... "light absorption" or "photon absorption" or maybe "light conversion" ie. converting the energy of a photon into kinetic energy (movement)

At the same time, scientists sure do like playing around with words until the acronym is pretty, funny, and/or memorable.

case in point: the proposed Cherenkov radiation detector upgrade in Japan to replace the current one (called Super Kamiokande) is in all seriousness named GADZOOKS! (Gadolinium Antineutrino Detector Zealously Outperforming Old Kamikande, Super!) =P

(edited for typos)

[This message has been edited by AstroStewart (edited April 30, 2008).]
 


Posted by debhoag (Member # 5493) on :
 
Am I the only one who read the previous post and immediately thought "phart?"
 
Posted by EP Kaplan (Member # 5688) on :
 
Thanks, all. I would prefer to use a laser, primarily b/c the biggest issue with current photon sail tech is what one does as the ship gets far from any sun. Also the issue of steering.

I read PARM drive and got hungry for eggplant.

Light Absorption Module (or Momentum) Propulsion?

[This message has been edited by EP Kaplan (edited May 01, 2008).]
 


Posted by MartinV (Member # 5512) on :
 
This last one sounds good to me, Kaplan.

What is the radar called in Battlestar Galactica? Draides or something?
 


Posted by EP Kaplan (Member # 5688) on :
 
DRADIS

Direction, RAnge, DIStance.
 


Posted by MartinV (Member # 5512) on :
 
I thought range and distance is the same thing.
 
Posted by Wolfe_boy (Member # 5456) on :
 
Excuse my lack of physics knowledge, but wouldn't putting a laser on board a ship to shoot at a sail mounted in front of the ship be the same thing as mounting a huge fan on a sailing ship and pointing it at the sails? Basically, that there is zero net propulsion, since the reverse momentum expended to put out the wind/light would be equal to the force captured by the sails? Even though we're only talking about photons here, there should be a negative force implied with putting out the numbers required to achieve any kind of relavistic speed.

Plus, aren't we talking about some kind of ridiculously large laser here? Solar-sail propulsion is slow enough as it is, even with the sun itself providing locomotion. The sheer mass of the laser required to create any kind of significant photon flow would be several orders of magnitude larger than anything we currently have.

*Whew! Too much science!*

Also, once you reach any significant speed and pass beyond the edges of the solar system, you would basically keep going at that same speed - or even increase speed even more slowly due to residual but faint photon reaching your ship from our own sun - until you begin to approach another star and encounter resistance from the photons being emit by it. There shouldn't be any significant barriers to movement in deep space, and you should be able to retain enough inertia that you don't become hopelessly stranded in the wild expanses between stars.

And, finally.... sailors seem to have managed to steer ships in the sea for a few years now without a huge fan onboard to steer the ship. A simple thruster in the role of a rudder, when used in consort with a change in sail geometry and position, would be enough to effect a change in direction. Once you're in deep space, though, you're kind of stuck with the inertia you've got. trying to change it too much would likely require significant amounts of thrust requiring large onboard fuel reserves, or you might risk losing some of the momentum you currently hanve and could end up extending the length of your journey significantly (and when we're talking interstellar distances, a 1% decrease in speed could add up to a considerably longer transit time).

Everyone still with me? Sorry for the digression - it's your technology, so it does what you say it will.

Jayson Merryfield
 


Posted by rstegman (Member # 3233) on :
 
Wolfe_boy,

What you say is true, but, there is something to add.
There is photons coming from all over, from the earliest universe to nearby stars. If the light sale was transparent in the direction the ship was moving, then all the thrust from billions of suns would be thrusting the ship along. One simply would have to change sale orientation to change direction.

Remember, the only reason the sky is black, rather than starlight white, is that the universe is expanding. The light of billions of stars that would light the sky like our sun, are cooled by expansion of the universe, sending the energy to heat, rather than light.
That energy is still there, so one just has to have a way to have more force on the backs of the sails than on the front. The use of diffraction and coatings could cause light from the front to avoid the fabrics of the sails and avoid thrust from the light. while in the back, the diffractions and coatings direct the light to the fabric of the sails and cause the push. The difference in light pressure will add up over time. A pound of thrust will eventually add up to near light speed.

I read that if we kept up the thrust of the Apollo launch vehicles, we would achieve light speed in a year.

Light sails are like balloons. You get it big enough compared to your cargo mass. it will get you moving.

You can ignore this or use it if you want, but there is a theory that the space between the stars are as filled with debris as the the area outside the orbit of Pluto. There are a lot of objects out there and this theory says that deep space is just as junky. consider a fast moving ship through that stuff, especially something with as poor control as a fast moving light sail might have....
 


Posted by EP Kaplan (Member # 5688) on :
 
As far as I know, the difference between the fan and the laser is that the fan is essentially propelling air in two different directions, while the laser is propelling photons in one direction. The classic issue of space flotsam, one I've thought about for a while, that I'll solve with the old SF standby, electromagnetic shields or some such device. It sounds better than a RAM drive type deal, or some super-metal coating.

Yes, adjustments to the sail would do the job, and would probably aid in retrothrusting, since you could reverse the "polarity", so to speak, as you neared your destination. I'm looking at putting a dedicated fusion reactor on the ship (if the can put a fusion reactor in a ship to power the sucker, they can build a BIG laser and a high efficiency photon sail, just give them a couple thousand years to sort out the details. I'm intrigued by two way mirror style coatings to catch repelled photons before they ever bounce off the sail).

Oh, and the DRADIS. The range is used for x and y, and distance for z, thus enabling 3D radar. The enemy's gate is down.
 




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