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» Hatrack River Writers Workshop » Forums » Grist for the Mill » hmm...thought there'd be more hoopla... (Page 2)

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Author Topic: hmm...thought there'd be more hoopla...
redux
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quote:
Originally posted by Robert Nowall:
To cite another example...in the books, Tarzan was articulate and literate, an Oxford man if my memory serves, a man who taught himself to read English before he could speak it...but even before the sound era and Johnny Weismuller, once Edgar Rice Burroughs let the movies have Tarzan, his creation was down to "me Tarzan, you Jane." The damage was done.

You sir are correct! [Smile] I had forgotten about this bit of trivia! In fact, Tarzan spoke English with a French accent.

On a side note, many of these wonderful heroes - Sherlock Holmes, Tarzan, Conan - can be found on http://www.manybooks.net/

The stories have entered the public domain and are free. So we can read the originals then nitpick the movie adaptations ....

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Kathleen Dalton Woodbury
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Hey, I'm a Sherlockian (and a Baker Street Irregular, of sorts) from way back, and I love the new movies. But then, I tend to love movies that are violent and funny. <shrug>

The movies show Holmes to be brilliant and eccentric, and Watson to be much smarter than he is portrayed in the books, but it works for me.

As an additional data point, however, I also enjoyed WITHOUT A CLUE. Go figure. [Smile]

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Crystal Stevens
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Tarzan learned English from school books left by his parents in the cabin they built in the African jungle. But the first language he learned was French when he rescued a Frenchman connected with the expedition headed, I believe, by Jane's father. Tarzan took the Frenchman into the jungle and helped him recooperate from his wounds. The Frenchman didn't speak very good English but could read it. This allowed him and Tarzan to communicate so he could teach Tarzan how to speak French.

I've read the complete Tarzan series at least three times. I hope my memory didn't fail me when it came to what I just wrote [Big Grin] .

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Robert Nowall
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I don't think Watson was a complete dummy in the books, it's just that Holmes saw his way to the solution much faster than anyone else...see? That's a classic change made for the movies---Holmes remains super brilliant, but Watson becomes a bumbler.

Something along these lines could befall Ender's Game easily...

(Footnote: one of Burroughs's [many] lapses comes when Tarzan posts a sign with his name spelled out---before he could have known how his name would have been spelled.)

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LDWriter2
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As to the Downey Jr. Holmes. I watched the trailer and I didn't recall any boxing matches nor romance in the books. Of course it's been a long while so I could be forgetting a small scene or two.

But two people at work have seen and loved the second movie. One guy thought the ending was great... no hints of what it was.


Hmm if that was a fan trailer where did they get the space station scenes? Or were the space shots all made up and none will be in the movie?

And I would love for them to do a trailer for my first book published no matte what the case. :_

I have seen trailers for paper books.

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redux
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quote:
Originally posted by LDWriter2:

Hmm if that was a fan trailer where did they get the space station scenes? Or were the space shots all made up and none will be in the movie?

The space shots look like a mix of Halo and Star Trek (it looked like the reboot) - maybe some Starship Troopers. The scenes with the kid are a mix from Soldier (the Kurt Russell movie), Star Wars (the Boba Fett clones) and the end Haley Joel Osment in A.I. (the Spielberg movie).
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LDWriter2
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I've seen only a couple of those so wouldn't have been able to recognize scenes from the others... Oh well.
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Pyre Dynasty
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quote:
Originally posted by LDWriter2:
As to the Downey Jr. Holmes. I watched the trailer and I didn't recall any boxing matches nor romance in the books. Of course it's been a long while so I could be forgetting a small scene or two.

I have read some of them recently and yes Holmes was a boxer, they didn't have any scenes where he was boxing but every once in a while when they run across a tough who recognizes Holmes from the ring and expresses his admiration. As for romance, Watson is quite the ladies man. Holmes's only true love is Irene Adler who only appeared in "A Scandal in Bohemia" and it was more of a mutual respect for the woman who beat him at his own game.

On another note after reading Card's article on Andy Serkis it made me wonder if it wouldn't be an absolutely terrible idea to have Serkis play a CG Ender.

Oh and adding to the list of characters messed up by film: Frankenstein's Creature, and Dracula.

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Robert Nowall
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All this talk of Burroughs makes me wonder about how this upcoming John Carter of Mars movie will play. The Burroughs Mars books, after all, feature what might best be described as "a mindboggling amount of nudity," and you know how anything below an "R" rating would handle that...

On animation and Andy Serkis...I haven't sat through the Spielberg movie but I've seen pictures and clips, and, (1) I wondered why they just didn't do it in live action, and (2) they might have strived for realism, but some element of humanity seems lacking in their eyes, so much so that the characters seem less human than, say, the rats in Rattatouille or the cars in Cars, who were essentially caricatures rather than characters. And I think the Andy Serkis thing worked better when he was CGI-mixed in with live actors...I don't know if you'd want to go that way with Ender...

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MattLeo
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Why worry about any cinematic adaption of a favorite story? It's bound to be *different*, because cinema is a different kind of medium.

I was for the most part delighted with Peter Jackson's treatment of LotR, and wasn't in the least put out by minor, or even some *major* changes in the plot. The only change I really objected to was in the character of Faramir, because it undermined Tolkien's themes about human nature.

At best a movie adaptation sheds new light on a character; Sean Bean's performance as Boromir prompted me to go back and read the Boromir scenes with new appreciation.

So what can you expect from an adaptation of Sherlock Holmes that hasn't been done? We've had the very loose (Basil Rathbone) to the highly accurate (Jeremy Brett). Well, one thing that hasn't been depicted accurately is Holmes *youth*. When he takes up residence with Dr. Watson in 1881 he is (depending on which textual evidence you cite) between 20 and 27 years old. Watson, having been granted his Bachelor of Medicine in 1878, would be 26 or 27. Inevitably Holmes is played by an actor in his forties or later.

Robert Downey is one of the few actors who has both the assertive presence and physical vigor to play the young Sherlock, and the movies have some interesting takes on the character, depicting him as having something like autism spectrum disorder. His martial arts and weaponry skills are *entirely* canonical.

Of course in any adaption it's the supporting players that really make or break the show, and in Sherlock Holmes stories that means Watson. Nigel Bruce's Watson was dim -- a cheap screenwriter's trick to make Rathbone's Holmes seem all the more intelligent. Edward Hardwicke's Watson is probably the most consistent with the stories. Jude Law, especially in the more recent of the the Downey movies, has a very interesting take on Watson, showing him as a sporting man with an poorly hidden taste for excitement. That's not so much canonical as an interesting extrapolation. Watson's sporting habits might well explain how while he is manifestly an excellent doctor, his medical practice never seems to be demanding and he apparently pays only sporadic attention to building it up. That's the best you can hope for in an adaptation -- to have an interesting take on the characters.

At first I thought Law's Watson was a little *too* bright, but on reflection this is pretty much the level of competence we see in *Hound of the Baskervilles*. Sherlock's reliance upon him to defeat Moriarty is both a nice bit of character development and a clever bit of plotting that's worth examination. It allows Moriarty to be a more formidable adversary, yet still be credibly defeated. He can be Holmes equal or superior mentally and physically, but being on the side of good, Holmes can delegate more responsibility.

As for Enders' game -- don't hold your breath until they start shooting.

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LDWriter2
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Speaking of Holmes B&N has the Complete Holmes for the Nook for 2.99

Neat and cool [Smile]


And for the Dune loves evidently there's a new Dune book. Or at least they are pushing it right now.

The Sisterhood of Dune.

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Robert Nowall
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Seemed like a great idea, but I couldn't decide on which Nook edition to get...I seriously considered buying a trade paper edition when I saw it in B & N yesterday, but I think somewhere in my piles of books I already have one. (Saw the new Dune book, too, but lost interest in those even before Herbert's death.)
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redux
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Why pay when it's already in the public domain? For older works I check gutenberg.org and manybooks.net first.
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JenniferHicks
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quote:
So what can you expect from an adaptation of Sherlock Holmes that hasn't been done? We've had the very loose (Basil Rathbone) to the highly accurate (Jeremy Brett). Well, one thing that hasn't been depicted accurately is Holmes *youth*. When he takes up residence with Dr. Watson in 1881 he is (depending on which textual evidence you cite) between 20 and 27 years old. Watson, having been granted his Bachelor of Medicine in 1878, would be 26 or 27. Inevitably Holmes is played by an actor in his forties or later.
If you haven't yet, you should check out Steven Moffat's three-part series "Sherlock," which sets the stories in modern day London. There will be three more installments shown this month on PBS in the U.S.; the older ones are on Netflix instant streaming. Benedict Cumberbatch and Martin Freeman play a young, active Holmes and Watson. As a bonus, the show is very well-done.
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axeminister
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Wait... Steven Mofatt did those?

I am so there.
That guy is freekin awesome.

I've told him as much on Twitter, too. =)

Axe

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Kathleen Dalton Woodbury
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I'm with you, MattLeo, about Faramir (whom I loved in the books), but I have a theory about why they did it that way.

They wanted to show Aragorn struggling with his role as the Returning King, and so they chose to have him have doubts about himself (which he only sort-of did in the books), and his attraction to The One Ring was part of that.

So they couldn't have anyone else who was able to completely and automatically resist The One Ring (as Faramir did in the books) in the movie or it might detract from Aragorn.

I just wish they'd made up for it by putting more of Faramir and Eowyn in the extended version.

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redux
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I looked up some more info on the Ender's Game movie and it is being produced by Alex Kurtzman and Roberto Orci. If these names are not familiar to you look up the Transformers movie and the Star Trek reboot.

While those two movies were successful at the box office I wouldn't necessarily call them particularly good movies, or movies that were true to the source, let alone movies that will withstand the test of time.

Seeing how the guy who directed X-Men Origins: Wolverine will also be directing Ender's Game I am starting to have very low expectations for this movie. Then again, maybe it will pleasantly surprise me. I suppose I should reserve judgement until I see it [Smile]

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MartinV
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I find that going to the movies with low expectations is the best thing to do. That way you're always pleased with the result. I've gone to watch Master and Commander with very high expectations and I was disappointed in the end. Then I rethought the whole things, watched it again and was remarkably happy with it. I use that as often as possible now.
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Robert Nowall
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quote:
Why pay when it's already in the public domain?
Some of the public domain stuff, or even the cheap Nook editions, just doesn't "run" right on my Nook...longer pages, a table of contents index thing that just doesn't work, and difficulty in just loading it up. Besides, one might want annotations or a good introduction or illustrations...

*****

I've only been sorely disappointed by one movie I went to the theater to see---"Pearl Harbor." The battle scene was fine, but, on the whole, it was three hours of my life I'll never get back. Every other movie I've ever been to has pleased me, sometimes substantially.

I've been surprised by some things, too. I watched a shoot-em-blow-em-up thing called The Marine one day over at my brother's house---it wasn't something I'd've turned on here on my own TV---and I was kinda surprised at how entertaining it all was, for all its limited acting and plotting.

Maybe with movies I'm easy to please---but I don't go to a lot of 'em.

(I have a theory about film critics...that they have to go see so many movies that they become so jaded and hard to please that they can't appreciate the good qualities of anything but the top-of-the-line stuff---and top-of-the-line is defined by their own peculiar interests and expectations. Or that the movie the critic raked over the coals may have been and may yet be a moving and life-changing experience for someone else seeing it---who might not because of what they've written.)

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billawaboy
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Just got goosebumps. I went to www.hatrack.com. This is what I saw:

Want to Be in Battle School?
Open Casting Call for Extras in New Orleans This Weekend

Ender's Game open casting call being held at the Hilton Garden Inn located in the Warehouse District of New Orleans on Saturday, January 14th from 11am to 3pm.

Alexis Allen, along with Batherson Casting, are seeking bright and talented kids and teens ages 10-17 of varying ethnic background for the feature film production of Orson Scott Card's "Ender's Game"; based on one of the most famous science fiction novels of the last 40 years.

The film stars Harrison Ford, Asa Butterfield, Hailee Steinfeld and Abigail Breslin. Oscar-winning Director Gavin Hood will be filming Ender's Game in New Orleans from February until June 2012, providing those selected with up to 8 weeks of work.

To be considered, please come to the open call this weekend, located at the address below between 10am and 2pm

Hilton Garden Inn
1001 South Peters St
New Orleans 70130

Please also bring a recent snapshot of yourself. Homeschooled students are especially encouraged, because of the work during school hours.
----

Holy cow...they're really doing it. It's really happening.

BTW, I found Ender's Game thru the unabridged audiobook - I've never read the book! I was literally *told* the story. I've tried finding other audiobooks that good to no avail. I must have listened to it 20 times atleast.

I'm hoping Ender's Game the movie will reflect the images and scenes evoked by the audiobook. The opening of the audiobook is simply the best. I hope in the movie script they have something like:

FADE IN:

INT - MONITOR SPACE - OVERHEAD SHOT
From far above, in a sea of PITCH BLACK, a thin pale BOY lay on his side on a bright cold sterile metal table. He is still and quiet, staring off into the distance, waiting, unsure of what is to come. As we move towards him slowly, we hear the grim deep voice of COLONEL GRAFF in the darkness.

COLONEL GRAFF (V.O.)
I've watched through his eyes,
I've listened through his ears,
and I tell you...he's the one -
or at least as close as we're
going to get.

Whenever I hear those opening lines in the audiobook...goosebumps. My hairs stand on end. I really hope they do justice to the opening and mood of the book.

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KayTi
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My friend's 16 yr old son tried out for the movie today! He's waiting to hear if he got a part, terribly exciting. I wish I could have taken my own 10 yr old boy down there for auditions but the 14+ hr drive gave me pause. That would be a LOOOONG commute. [Wink]
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billawaboy
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@KayTi - Do it! 14+hrs? Roadtrip! If two adults go along, that's just 3-4 hours driving over two days - with a brief hotel stop at night.

It'd be a fun experience - the bonus would be getting the part!

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LeetahWest
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quote:
Homeschooled students are especially encouraged, because of the work during school hours
Too bad Utah is way too far away and I would have no place to stay. Oh and I guess the fact that my oldest is only 7 doesn't help either. But hey! I have nieces and nephews in that age range . . . Wish I could have done that. It would be something worth telling the grandkids about.
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MartinV
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If they really wanted to make the movie authentic, they should cast each character from the exact country they come from. I don't mean to be a b**h but Americans do have a very distinct way of behaviour. If everyone in Battle School behaves that way, it's not going to be what the book intended.
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redux
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quote:
Originally posted by MartinV:
If they really wanted to make the movie authentic, they should cast each character from the exact country they come from. I don't mean to be a b**h but Americans do have a very distinct way of behaviour. If everyone in Battle School behaves that way, it's not going to be what the book intended.

This reminded me of a Cheerios commercial that aired here in Canada. Everyone had a British accent. Then I was watching a US station and the exact same commercial was aired but this time their voices were dubbed with an American accent.
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Crystal Stevens
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quote:
Originally posted by MartinV:
If they really wanted to make the movie authentic, they should cast each character from the exact country they come from. I don't mean to be a b**h but Americans do have a very distinct way of behaviour. If everyone in Battle School behaves that way, it's not going to be what the book intended.

I understand where you're coming from, Martin, but I've seen people from one country play people from another country quite frequently and do it well. No reason why it can't be done again. Lucy Lawless has a very pronounced Aussie accent (since she is Australian) but not one bit of it came through in Xena. I'm not positive, but I believe David Odgen Steirs (sp.) is from Texas but played a brilliant Bostonian in the TV series "Mash". I see no reason why any nationality cannot be played by someone not of that nationality if coached to do it and do it well. It's been done time and again.
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aspirit
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I found this link on i09.

http://endersgameblog.tumblr.com/

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