posted
I brought up in the introductions section that I write roleplaying games, and a few folks expressed interest in the field. Rather than have that thread go completely off-topic, I thought I'd start it up in here. So...now what?
Posts: 38 | Registered: Sep 2004
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posted
People get paid to do that? Hmm. It has always seemed to me that the storylines in RPG's were the last thing done. A lot of games I've played have had really horrid storylines. Right now I'm playing Dungeon Lords and, while its graphics are great, the storyline leaves something to be desired.
Which games have you written stories for? I'd love to write the storylines for RPGs, because I love to play them and I'd like to see better storylines.
Before I read Tolkien or any other fantasy I was playing RPG games on my dad's old 386 and 486's. I was five years old and I beat Ultima 6 in about a week. :>
The fantasy novels I've found since then have contributed to my interest in the fantasy field.
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Gee. You were FIVE when you were playing games on a 486? Egad, does that make ME feel old. I remember seeing my first computer when I was 18 years old and a guy at college allowed me to come into the computer lab. It was a behemoth monster that stretched all the way across one wall, with a teensy monitor about 9" across. He programmed it to say, "Hello" and use my name. I was stunned with the possibilities as I could see sci-fi and reality begin to merge.
As for playing RPG, I don't have the patience for computer games (they waste time when I could be writing), and I've lost interest in table-top games. I get tired of having 15 seconds of fun with my turn and then sitting and waiting for another thirty minutes while the DM argues a point of the game with the other players. I sit there thinking "I could be writing instead!"
I turned my efforts to Play By Email Role-Playing Games instead, which integrates the best parts of role-playing and writing. I've been an avid PBeM fan for over 5 years now.
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I was reading Labs post and thought, "what does he mean? It's the PCs that make most of the storyline. The writers just do the background and the rulebooks." Then I realized when he said RPGs, he meant computer games. Someone hand me my cane. Where did I leave my teeth? Getting older FREAKIN' SUCKS!!
To clarify, I write for tabletop roleplaying games, but I've been looking into computer RPG's (CRPG's) a little bit more.
Lab, I can see what you mean about the old CRPG's, but they have improved drastically the past few years--check out whatwhat do you think of the bioware games with the NWN engine? They won an award for best 100 jobs in Canada, and I've been thinking of joining them. Have a friend who did QA for Jade Empires.
As for tabletop games, the massive proliferation of games in the wake of the d20 movement has caused a downturn in the market, but there are still plenty of opportunities for a talented writer.
posted
The term RPG stands for Role-Playing Game. I am assuming for purposes of this discussion that the term RPG can be applied to either table-top or computer games. Correct me if I've missed a transition in our lexicon, sort of like when the word "thong" quit meaning beach footwear....
Posts: 2026 | Registered: Mar 2005
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posted
Hmm, NWN, Icewind Dale and Baldur's Gate 2 seem to be exceptions to the rule. Those games had pretty decent storylines, but, then again, I think all three of the franchises are based off novels already. Unless you were talking about new games with the NWN engine; I only really pay attention to PC games, so I'm not too knowledgable about console games that may use that engine.
How would I go about writing for a computer RPG? I've no degree yet or professional writing experience. Much like everything else in my life, I don't really have a clue as to how to achieve my goals.
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Hmm Elan. I always considered an RPG to be just a computer game, but I guess there's a more specific term for that now (CRPG). I assumed that since he was writing RPGs it meant he was writing them for the computer.
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When fans want to distinguish, they add the "C" for computer, but it's far from common. Normally, the term RPG can be used to refer to tabletop, computer, or even other forms, but from a writer's perspective these have vastly different styles and approaches, thus the need to distinguish.
Lab, I'd recommend checking out the writer's qualifications at www.bioware.com. Matter of fact, I'd recommend it to anyone here; anyone who's had a novel published nationwide can apply to be a Senior Writer.
posted
Frankly, I think that it would be good if computer RPGs were more like table-top RPGs in the way that Josh described. The writer would create the background milieu and the basic rules, but the player made all the storyline decisions.
A few older computer games have done this well. But the open-ended world where the player is free to explore seems to be dominated by MMORPGs these days. The problem is that MMORPGs in general have a very basic flaw...that first 'M' standing for "massively". I think that there is room in this world for MORPGs and ordinary RPGs where the player gets to control a central character with an individual impact on the flow of the "story" without having to spend hundreds of hours leveling up and joining a "clan" of some kind. I don't know how anyone can find that sort of thing fun. If you want to chat with people online...well, then do that.
RPGs just don't work well when you've got more than about 10 players in a game. Computers can't change this fundamental fact.
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Survivor, there are still a few good open-ended CRPGS out there. Morrowind is a great example; I still play the game probably 20-30 hours a year, and the game's three years old. A sequel to Morrowind is slated to be released later this year.
I agree with you about MMORPGs. It's horrendously boring to spend 100 hours leveling a character, doing the same thing repetetively. Ultima Online was just about the best MMORPG to date, becuase there never was a leveling factor in the game. Everquest is the game that changed all of that, for the worse I believe. UO felt like you were playing with maybe 5-10 people at the most. The game was so much like Ultima 7 it was hard to tell the difference. Just four or five years better graphics, but it still used the isometric viewpoint, which was great.
And I don't have a novel published, so should I not even bother applying to be a writer at bioware, Shadow? Most people who frequent this site are unpublished, I believe.
posted
Just to throw in my two cents on clarity. Role playing games are where people get together, assume roles, and play a game. Now, I know they haven't come up with a better term, but how does anyone play a true role in a computer game? Yes, your role is to beat the computer...but it lacks any real interaction between people. Everything is predefined and your dialog is what is programmed.
Now someone could talk about the online versions...but too many people only care about levels and items. So a true rpg on the computer....not anytime soon.
Now for the original topic, writing a books for a rpg. I have to say that my favorite were Weis and Hickman's dragonlance sourcebooks. They managed to make it interesting to read as well as define the information. So if you want something better than a list of rules, write with a bit of passion about it.
Almost nothing in the good computer roleplaying games is predefined, except the dialogue. But even then, different character classes, with different faction levels, will get different responses and will have different things to say to NPCs.
In CRPGs, you can be a thief, a mage, a warrior, or some hybrid. Maybe in singleplayer mode it can be simplified into having to just beat the computer. But, in my opinion, there's much more to it than that. You have to find clues, levers to open doors, specific items, etc.
Most CRPGs also have multiplayer modes, where you can play with and against others to achieve various goals, and not have the game be polluted by levels and items. There are also Dungeon Masters who can make up the dialogue, maps, and whatever else for the electronic version, essentially making the game a polished version of a tabletop rpg like Dungeons and Dragons. Neverwinter Nights is a good example of this.
I never played Dungeons and Dragons. After 15 years of playing CRPGS, my imagination is either not there, or D&D is simply lacking. I think it's the former. But in CRPGS you do assume a role; evil or good, fighter or mage, savior or destroyer.
Oh well, this rant is over.
I've seen D&D stores with all the rules books and all that, but I never knew there were storylines in those as well. That's probably one of the reasons I assumed he was talking about writing for the computer RPGS. Oh well.
I've never written for RPGs (table top or computer), but I've always been interested in the subject. My favorite was GURPS, due to the seemingly infinite potential of the system. What games have you written for? I've a lot of respect for RPG writers because not only do you have to create a world, you have to create a world so cohesive that strangers can actually take active part in it. What would you say is the hardest part of writing for RPGs? How do you query a company to publish your game? Is it the same process as with a book?
posted
I think that a lot of computer RPGs really don't give you much freedom to affect the storyline once you've made the initial choice of character class and all that (even at that, often the initial choice of character class affects little or nothing about the storyline). There may be a few sidequests that are optional, but too often these have no real affect on the larger game either, you just end up getting a couple of special items or something like that.
I don't hate that...the computer RPG is really a narrative art, sort of like an interactive novel. Just as I love novels, I love many games that revolve around a linear narrative.
And I don't deny that it's possible to play many computer RPGs more the way you would play a real RPG, with a DM and about 3-9 players. But I think that the industry as a whole really does neglect that aspect. Also, most games don't support a "character history" more advanced than a signed interger value indicating how "good" or "evil" you are. That's really pretty dumb, how hard would it be to at least have a real character history and even to integrate that into the game in some way? Or to let online users have smaller worlds DMed by players?
I just think that there's a market there which is being ignored and marginalized right now because the "established" models of computer RPGs are what they've become.
Anyway, this is a bit off the topic of actually writing for a RPG game. Basically, for that you just need to get some chops as a writer and then hang out at gaming conferences (getting chops as a modder also works if you're getting into the computer game development side of things).
posted
Don't worry, Lab, there are still plenty of jobs at bioware for writers like us. I was referring specifically to the qualifications for "Senior Writer."
As far as the basics of writing for RPGs, it requires mostly the same approach as being published in any other field. I'll look around for some good advice for those staring out, but here are a few pointers:
1) Adventures are easier than worlds. Most of the publishing companies for RPGs got into the business to promote their own setting, so it's doubtful they will push yours, too. It's much easier to start out writing adventures that are adaptable to many settings, perhaps as articles for a gaming magazine.
2) You'd better know your technical stuff. Most starting writers--even those familiar with the game--are heavy on the fiction writing end and light on the rules. Get to know the rules. Find a fan-site online and create some monsters for everyone to critique, then sit back and take the criticisms: "Which edition is this for again?" "You didn't list THAT in its special qualities!" "Flight is a movement type, not a special quality." "Undead aren't be affected by mind-affecting spells."
That's all for now, I'll be back with more. In the mean time, perhaps we should start CRPG's as a separate topic? They really are different venues.
[This message has been edited by DeepShadow (edited May 23, 2005).]
quote:Or to let online users have smaller worlds DMed by players?
I thought NWN was supposed to be a step toward that?
I happen to be a bit disappointed with the game, btw. I don't play many CRPGs but the ones I liked best allowed me to be many different people at once in the single-player game. NWN gives you henchmen, but you're only allowed to have one at a time and you can't control a single thing that henchman does. I know it adds realism to the game and makes it closer to what it would be if you were in a multi-player setting. I don't care. I liked being different people all at once, dang it!
Just had to rant a bit. I'm finished now.
[This message has been edited by Keeley (edited May 25, 2005).]
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