This is topic The force of Death in forum Fragments and Feedback for Short Works at Hatrack River Writers Workshop.


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Posted by Phanto (Member # 1619) on :
 
quote:

It was hunting for her, a ruthless force ready to annihilate her like it had Silvia. May screamed, abandoned her farming equipment, and started running desperately from it. But it was swift as the wind. It caught her. The pillar of blue light swallowed her. And then--

May awoke from the nightmare, screaming. Only a dream, she told herself, trying to control her hyperactive breathing. Only a dream. I'm safe. Unlike Silvia. No, she's gone. Terribly gone.

Outside the sun was rising, its light streaming into May's little house through a glass window. She sighed and started getting dressed. No point in mopping. Life had to go on, and all that.

Someone knocked on her door, shouting, "I have no time to waste; let me in at once!"

May paused. "But who are you?"

"The shaman, you fool."

Oh, yes. She had sent for a shaman, hoping that he would be somehow able to help save Silvia.


Please give me your opinion on this start to Sister of Deceit. Is it evocative enough, does it establish a link to the character, et cetra.

All help appreciated.

If anyone would be willing to put up with the whole first chapter, let me know at yos@gis.net.
 


Posted by Survivor (Member # 213) on :
 
I got kinda over busy before being able to do much with your original version...and right now I have a commitment....

There is still a problem with the setting being a bit general...you use terms like "farming equipment" and "little house" and so forth. I have absolutely no idea what the milieu is going from this description. It could be like medival France, pioneer America, or even a high tech future. The only clue is that a glass window is worth mentioning...which fits all three scenarios I just listed. Oh, and there's a shaman, which (with a different name and perhaps different dialogue) could also fit almost any milieu.

I should stop nitting about using the POV character's name as soon as possible in the text...but I also shouldn't. Because unless you have a brilliant reason for hiding the POV character's name (and I mean one that no human writer has ever thought of before), you should always intro a POV with the POV character's name as soon as possible. The only "exception" is amnesia stories, where the whole dramatic tension is that the POV character doesn't remember who he is. Even in that case (especially in that case), you need to figure out how to identify the POV character to the reader consistently and identifiably as soon as possible...which makes it more of a special case than an exception, I know (that's why I went back and put exception in quotes).

In this case, that doesn't touch the main issue, which is that we have no idea even after learning her name what sort of setting this is. I don't know whether this is taking place on a mountain, or plain, or in a forest, or what (I'm reasonably sure it isn't set in Waterworld, though).

As I said, I can't read the whole thing right now. But give us a setting, say what kind of farm equipment she's using (plow and ox? Solar powered grav-tractor?) and what kind of house (stone cottage? log cabin? pre-fab shelter dome?). And let us know something about the character other than "she fears death...like, a lot."
 


Posted by Phanto (Member # 1619) on :
 
You're right about the lack of accurate enviroment description; it's one of my major failings.

However, I'm not sure if this segement shows the character as being scared of death. Could any other readers give their view of May based on this?

Survivor: Feel free to take your time. I appreciate all the help you give me.
 


Posted by Kolona (Member # 1438) on :
 
I think you need to flesh out this beginning a bit. It seems written in shorthand and waiting for you to fill in all the blanks.

Rather than the amorphous ‘it,’ I’d be more drawn in if you named the evil at once: ‘The blue pillar of light was hunting May…’ ‘May screamed’ seems too bland, too ho hum, as if you’re trying to get us to care in too contrived a manner too soon. ‘Swift as the wind’ may be a little clichéd.

quote:
She sighed and started getting dressed. No point in mopping. Life had to go on, and all that.
Awfully abrupt change of mood after a terrifying nightmare. Either match how May views the outside world with her upset mindset, or contrast it. In any case, utilize the setting (which, yes, needs specifics), don’t simply throw it out there.

The exchange between May and the shaman needs some work. May seems a bit air-headed, and the shaman’s arrival too dry. I didn’t get that May was scared of death, necessarily, but of something, or was just greatly upset about Silvia – and I wasn’t sure yet if Silvia was dead or just gone somewhere.

 


Posted by TruHero (Member # 1766) on :
 
Fear of death? not so much.
But you almost had me thinking she was afraid of her "farm equipment". You need a better description of "IT". Although, killer farm implements might be kinda cool!

I like this beginning better than your original. But you should go into more detail in your description of May's dream. Let us see what "IT" is she is running from.

If you can wait about a week I will take a look at your chapter. Go ahead and email it to me in .rtf or .doc format. I will try to go over it this weekend.
 


Posted by Phanto (Member # 1619) on :
 
quote:

The pillar of blue light was rushing towards May, a ruthless force ready to annihilate her. Terror clutched her heart. She dropped her sack of seeds, and ran desperately from the advancing light. But it was swift as a hawk falling from the sky onto its prey. It caught her. The pillar of blue light swallowed her. And then--

May awoke from the nightmare, screaming. Only a dream, she told herself, trying to control her hyperactive breathing. It was only a dream. I'm still alive and well.

Outside the sun was rising, its cheerful orange light streaming into May's stone house. She sighed and started getting dressed. The shaman would be arriving soon enough. Hopefully he would be able to help.

Someone pounded on her door, shouting, "I have no time to waste; let me in at once!"

"You're the shaman?"

"Yes."

"Many thanks for coming," she said, opening the wooden door. "I appreciate it greatly."


I decided to leave the reader in suspense as to why she's having this nightmare and hired the shaman. The answer (that Silvia vanished) will come in the next couple of paragraphs.

Thanks again for all the help.

[This message has been edited by Phanto (edited February 19, 2004).]
 


Posted by RillSoji (Member # 1920) on :
 
I agree that you need more description. Although I read it all the way through it didn't hook me or catch my interest. You need to flesh it out a little bit. If she's scared in her dream then help us to feel what she's feeling. Get us to care about what happens to her.

I don't know about May but when I wake up from a nightmare I usually spend at least 10 minutes trying to calm down enough to go back to sleep. Moods rarely swing from scared to depressed/moping in a matter of minutes. It usually takes quite a bit of thought for someone to drop into a depressed state. I'm not seeing that thought process taking place.

I think the dialouge with the Shaman is okay if you set up for it a little bit better.

Overall though you have an interesting story but you really need to describe what's happening, where, and why in order to hook me.

Hope that helps

[This message has been edited by RillSoji (edited February 19, 2004).]
 


Posted by Phanto (Member # 1619) on :
 
Version 3

quote:

The pillar of blue light was rushing towards May, a ruthless force ready to annihilate her. Terror clutched her heart. She dropped her sack of seeds, and ran desperately from the light. If it caught her, she knew something horrible would happen.

Still running, she turned her head back. The light was far away from her. It had no chance of catching her. But then, as she watched, it sped up until it was swift as a hawk: a hawk diving from the sky onto its prey.

The space between them rapidly shrunk. It would be a matter of moments before the light captured May. She stopped running and looked right at it. There was no way she could escape. "Do your worst," she said. She would not die fleeing, that was the coward's way.

The light engulfed her. It swallowed her. And then--

May awoke from the nightmare, screaming. Only a dream, she told herself, trying to control her hyperactive breathing. It was only a dream. I'm still alive and well.


[This message has been edited by Phanto (edited February 19, 2004).]
 


Posted by Jules (Member # 1658) on :
 
I like that version. It works better than the ones above, and I think is a better way of opening than the scene we saw before where May was talking to the shaman.

I'm currently procrastinating on starting the next chapter of my novel and I'm nearly finished with the book I'm reading, so if you want to send me something I'll probably look at it. Best if you use my work e-mail at the moment (jules at acris dot co dot uk, with the obvious changes) because my personal address is getting hundreds of viruses every day. :-(
 


Posted by Kolona (Member # 1438) on :
 
This is better, but I still say fill in the blanks more. Instead of, or in addition to, <Terror clutched her heart>, show us. Help us feel May's terror.

And jettison the "And then--" It's very phony-sounding. Makes it seem like you tried to play a joke on the reader. Try taking the reader through that disorienting period between nightmares and wakefulness.

 


Posted by Phanto (Member # 1619) on :
 
Thank you all for being patient with me. I shall send out to those who were interested copies of chapter 1 today.

Version 4

quote:

The cloud of sparkling blue light was blasting at May, a magical force eager to kill her. Terrified, she froze, watching it come at her in a sort of slow motion. Then something inside of her clicked. If she didn't escape, she'd die horribly. Dropping her bag of crop seeds, May started running.

Still running, May turned her head back. The light was far away. It had no chance of catching up with her. She was safe. But then, as she watched, it somehow doubled its speed, becoming fast as a hawk diving down onto its prey.

The light was going much faster than May. She was already running her hardest—it would soon catch her. She stopped and glared directly at the cloud of light, refusing to flinch or move one step further. She would not die fleeing; that was the cowards' way.
The light engulfed her. It swallowed her. It--

May's eyes slammed open. She was lying in bed, her throat hoarse from screaming. Rubbing the sweat off her face, May blinked several times. Only a dream, she told herself.



 
Posted by TruHero (Member # 1766) on :
 
Phanto,
I tried to send your critique back but it would not go through on your current e-mail address. Let me know
 
Posted by Phanto (Member # 1619) on :
 
That's odd.

Try again, I guess. Then if it doesn't work, try ackackackack@go.com.

Thanks.
 


Posted by Kolona (Member # 1438) on :
 
<ackackackack@go.com>
LOL LOL
Phanto, that's hilarious! That SO reminded me of Mars Attacks!
 
Posted by Christine (Member # 1646) on :
 
I've been quite busy lately so only now got around to catching up on the F&F board...I hope you don't mind my somewhate late input, but since no one else brought up the main point I had when first reading I thought I'd pop in.

This is how the first version (and all subsequent versions) read to me, paraphrased: things happenings to someone i don't know, she's afraid of something (the later versions were better at describing what that something might be and increasing the fear) and then....A DREAM? What kind of cheap *@#$@#$ is that?

In my humble opinion, dreams need to be used carefully and sparingly in works of fictione. There are a few reasons for this. First of all, our understanding of how dreams work and how they relate to our real life circumstances is shaky at best. The truth is that almost all dreams come across as contrived for this very reason. I remember many of my dreams, and almost none of them make as much sense as the dreams I read in fiction.

Second, dreams read like a cheap trick to increase the action without actually putting anyone in danger. I'm not saying I haven't woken up sweating from a nightmare before (although half the time I don't remember what frightened me so badly), but there was no real danger, and the reader knows that. In fact, the only one who really doesn't know that is the person having the dream, but she's not the one whose emotion you are really interested in influencing. You want the reader to feel that emotion.

And finally, while dreams have their uses in stories, I would never START with one. The reason for this is that you have already shown me that you are deceitful as a writer, making me think something bad was happening when it wasn't, and I will trust you less as I continue to read. Gaining the reader's trust is important, or they will never believe and enjoy your story.

So that's my two cents, take them for what they're worth.
 


Posted by Survivor (Member # 213) on :
 
Christine has a good point there. While I'm not averse to dreams in fiction, I demand that they be dreamlike, immediately identifiable as dreams. That probably means you shouldn't try to start inside a dream sequence, since the way to make a dream sequence dreamlike is by contrast to the normal POV...and at the beginning of the story you can't have established that yet.

Have May wake up first, then have her remember the nightmare...it isn't like there's much of it to remember, after all.
 


Posted by Phanto (Member # 1619) on :
 
I need to keep the dream format, as that will have an important role in the story as she becomes mixed up with magic. Is this an effective lead up to the dream?

quote:

Two burly farmers tramped into May's house, carrying May herself in their hands. Making hardly any noise, they dumped her onto a bed. They stared at her, looking at the wild expressions playing across her face.

The taller one spoke eventually. "What'd you think's wrong with her? She sure is sleeping tight."

"Dunno. Could be anything, really."

"Hmm…." The farmer stroked his
beard. "Maybe it's the plague, or something of that sort?"

"You think so?"

He nodded slowly. "Could be."

Without a single word more, they both left.

May moaned loudly, almost rolling off the bed. Her eyes fluttered open, then closed back again. Pure terror radiated from her.

The cloud of sparkling red light was blasting at May, a magical force ready to kill her.
She froze, watching it come at her slowly.


[This message has been edited by Phanto (edited February 28, 2004).]

[This message has been edited by Phanto (edited February 28, 2004).]
 


Posted by Survivor (Member # 213) on :
 
No.

Look, why do you need the dream 'format'?

If you mean that later she is going to have a lot of dreams, that's fine. Just establish that she's started having a lot of dreams. If you mean something weird like every POV sequence is going to kick off with a dream, then forget it. Not a good idea. I sometimes have characters have dreams that reveal important information about their past or future...but I don't need to kick off the first POV segment inside a dream to do it.
 


Posted by Phanto (Member # 1619) on :
 
Fair enough. The bad formating must go.

*Swallows pride*
Thanks.
*Returns to work.*

[This message has been edited by Phanto (edited February 28, 2004).]
 


Posted by wetwilly (Member # 1818) on :
 
OH NO! There's got to be some way to do this without the "sike, it was all a dream" opener. That just screams "stop reading" to me.
 
Posted by rogozhin (Member # 1930) on :
 
I agree with the above. Begining with a dream is probably the most overused book/film opener. Cliche to the core.
 
Posted by Survivor (Member # 213) on :
 
quote:
John woke in the stygian black of a cool night, jarred by the lurching progress of the wagon train over the rocky trail. For a moment he thought that he was going home, his coffin making its way over the mountains of West Virginia, before he shook off the remnants of dream and oriented himself.

Maybe this isn't great, but this is the POV intro of my character. In several later passages, I mention that he sometimes dreams about home. And eventually I do one of his dreams. Unless the reader is completely asleep, it is clearly a dream, clearly dreamlike, and the reader should be expecting it because of this and some other references to this recurring dream.

Now it can be very simple to clue the reader into a dream. For instance, you can have the character lose consciousness or simply go to sleep at the end of a scene, then begin the next scene in an unlikely setting with strange events going on. Once the reader has been introduced to the character's POV and the milieu of the story, the dreamlike quality of a well written dream should be obvious.

But if you begin inside a dream, then the reader has no clue that the events aren't simply part of a fantasy setting, and if the POV is vague and surreal, it will seem to be a simple weakness in your writing. But when the character wakes up most readers won't react by saying, "Oh, I see, the weak POV and over the top strangeness were because this was a dream sequence...how clever, I look forward to reading the clear, realistic narrative that will now follow." Your readers will react much more the way Christine did..."things happenings to someone i don't know, she's afraid of something...and then....A DREAM? What kind of cheap *@#$@#$ is that?"

You have to start by building the readers' trust that you'll play fair...then, when you push their buttons a little, they'll stay with you.
 




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