Here’s my question. It concerns copyright. Not copyright of my work. Company trademark copyright. So much is being bandied about over using Kleenex or Xerox etc. You shouldn’t use them and should use tissue and copy instead.
So here is the question—please do not take offence—In my story, an African American is annoyed because his friends call him an Oreo Cookie. For those of you who do not know the meaning(my husband didn’t) it means being black on the outside, but white on the inside. If you are Native American you get called an apple. So back to the question—is that a copyright infringement? Somehow saying–“They call me a chocolate sandwich cookie.” doesn’t have quite the same ring to it.
Any opinions or answers?
Shawn
Posted by Kathleen Dalton Woodbury (Member # 59) on :
What the trademark watchdogs are concerned about, as I understand it, is that the trademark may turn into the generic term for the object.
What you're talking about is slang, not genericism per se.
So go ahead and use Oreo (without the (TM) preferred by trademark people--that would be as "too much" as "chocolate sandwich cookie" in the circumstances).
Or, you could go with "Uncle Tom" (and have an allusion that lots of people nowadays may not get....)
[This message has been edited by Kathleen Dalton Woodbury (edited April 05, 2001).]
Posted by SiliGurl (Member # 922) on :
I agree with Kathleen... It's okay to use.
Posted by srhowen (Member # 462) on :
My husabnd sugested zebra--not the same thing though.
Shawn
Posted by Rina (Member # 825) on :
Indeed... this is a tough one. You could, if needed, use something like Ice cream sandwich, or coconut truffel...
Posted by srhowen (Member # 462) on :
I like th eice cream sandwich one--LOL
Shawn
Posted by Lizzie (Member # 957) on :
I generally have an issue with "modernisms." Will someone twenty years from now know what an Oreo cookie is? Probably(I certainly knew 20 years ago) Same with Kleenex(but not Puffs)I think Kleenex and Oreo have become standard, understood references, and it would be OK to use them. What I can't stand is when authors make reference to specific "this time only" items just for a laugh that only someone Right then will get. (Example: JK Rowling refers to "Plystation "n Harry Potter #4) I really hate that.
(OK,can someone, once and for all, tell me what I do that makes me erase the words ahead of what I am writing? It drives me to insanity) Sorry, because it happened above and I don't know what to do.
Posted by writerPTL (Member # 895) on :
This is just a guess, because that Harry Potter reference stuck out at me as something J. K. wouldn't use. I almost wonder if she put Nintendo (more generic), a British equivalent, or even just video games, and Scholastic (in its editing of the British to American versions) changed it. I don't know though, just an UN-educated guess.
Posted by Writer_Actress (Member # 848) on :
hmmm.... neat theory.
Posted by FlyingCow (Member # 1198) on :
Lizzie, you hit the Insert button on your keyboard... it switches you from Insert mode to Typeover.
OSC talked a bit about this at literary boot camp in Greensboro. His take on the matter was to go ahead and use whatever product name you want, because they really can't stop you.
Whatever they may say to the contrary, words like kleenex, xerox, oreo, band aid, levi's, etc. have become part of our language, and not merely as specific product names.
He said that if your character would say "hand me a kleenex," then write that. They certainly wouldn't say "hand me a facial tissue" He told us not even to capitalize Kleenex, and certainly not to use the (tm) afterward.
I think using oreo in the context you did (though it's not exactly something that would endear me to that character ) is perfectly fine.
Posted by IonFish (Member # 1192) on :
On the same subject, I'm currently writing a science fiction story set some four hundred years in the future.
Would it be alright to have a travel journalist of the time writing a Lonely Planet guide, or would I have to obtain permission from the publishers?
Thanks for your help.
Posted by srhowen (Member # 462) on :
I tried to respond to this earlier today but my ISP flipped out and I couldn’t get back on. The word resulted out of this conversation: “Hell, my old friends call me an Oreo cookie. It just doesn’t pay to climb out of the sludge anymore. No one wants a role model.” The speaker is an African American trauma surgeon speaking to a Native American one who is the main character in the book. The conversation takes place after the NA’s brother calls him an apple. (And those of us who live off reservations hear that one a lot when we go back for a visit) Translation: red on the outside and white on the inside.
Posted by FlyingCow (Member # 1198) on :
I don't think I'd put the cookie. All the times I've ever heard the expression it's been just plain "oreo"... as a derisive slang word, I don't know if it would need to be capitalized either.
As far as Lonely Planet, that's tough. Could you alter the title a bit? How many companies from 400 years ago are still around that you know? Doug Adams made The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, playing with the Hitchhiker's Guide to Europe idea - I wonder if he needed permission?
Posted by IonFish (Member # 1192) on :
It's a kind of tongue-in-cheek thing, as this story is being set on another world, so keeping the title would be preferable if possible; however, I don't know how legal it would be.
