Just another quick question. This time its about (Americans, quickly, run away! ) THE METRIC SYSTEM.
As a Canadian, I only know the metric system. I know that I am 167 cm tall, and weigh about 90 kilo's (settle down now, I know I'm heavy ). I don't know what a mile, inch, yard, foot, or a pound is.
When I write, I always use metric units. ie:
The beats that bore down on Alex was 3 meters tall and well over 150 kilos.
Will this make my writing automatically rejected? Do I need to convert everything?
Thanks, Ronnie
Posted by Christine (Member # 1646) on :
Nah. I've read books/stories with the metric system. I don't think it matters. Besides, Americans should learn that system anyway. If you're writing science fiction, in particular, the metric system can be an even better choice.
Posted by Miriel (Member # 2719) on :
I agree with Christine: setting is a factor. Science Fiction and books set somewhere other than the US do just fine in metric. If the story's set in the US with US characters, I'd probably change it, though. As for fantasy...I'd be hesitant to use metric if you're selling to US markets. Metric measurments tend to conjure up scientific images to us -- I mean, the only time we use them are in science class. It might detract from the more rustic and old feel desired in fantasy.
Posted by Survivor (Member # 213) on :
All Americans know the rough equivalents for most common metric units. A meter is a little over a yard, a quart is just less than a liter, and so on and so forth.
SF fans tend to prefer metric (because the dimension translations are so easy), while fantasy fans are just as likely to want cubits or some such thing. So there isn't any real preference for the common English units.
I got's to say, 3 meters and over 150 kilos...that sounds rather scary. Is it anything like a lictor?
Posted by Spaceman (Member # 9240) on :
No, Survivor, he's being chased by a diving board.
Posted by rcorporon (Member # 2879) on :
Spaceman, that was too funny!
I think I'll just go the corny fantasy route and use crap like "hands, spans, stones, etc." and skip imperial / metric all together.
Ronnie
Posted by Leaf II (Member # 2924) on :
On a related note, is it acceptable, do you think, in fantasy to use feet, mile, ect.. for measurements in the story. Because, that's what I like to use, and its also what I like to read, because I don't know what the hell a cubit, wheel, blocks... or whatever else they come up with in some stories. It doesn't paint me an accurate picture in my mind. (And please don't write me explaining the measurement of cubit or something, if I wanted to know, I could just google it) So what do you think?
Posted by Corky (Member # 2714) on :
I'd recommend using the kinds of measurements the characters in your story would use.
Unless, of course, you are writing something that you can pretend you have "translated" into American English for the readers.
Intersestingly enough, many older systems of mesurement used body parts as a basis. So, avoiding the more obvious humorous possibilies inherent in such a system, it seems that both scifi and fantasy authors could use measurements based on non-human body parts to spice up the writing. At the very least, it seems that a war could be started by two cultures feuding over trade difficulties based upon seasonal changes in body part sizes.
Posted by wbriggs (Member # 2267) on :
I'm an American, and if somebody's measuring things on Mars in miles, I think, wtf? Not plausible.
But if you set your story in the contemporary or past USA, you'd want to use English.
Posted by pantros (Member # 3237) on :
Use whatever you are comfortable with.
If measurement is Vital to be accurate as part of the story. make sure the reader gets a frame of reference. If A length in Meters is important, describe the height of man in Meters or the length of stride, if millimeters are important describe the size of a pen tip. If its inches, the size of a common coin. I'm sure there are better comparisons out there. But you get the idea.
If its not important, don't specify height in a unit of measurements, Slightly taller than average, Head and shoulders above his friends, etc...
Posted by EricJamesStone (Member # 1681) on :
In writing science fiction, I almost always use the metric system.
In writing fantasy, I tend to use units that will be easily understood even though they are inexact: five paces away, three day's journey on foot, etc.
Posted by abby (Member # 2681) on :
I have to say, if I imagine a kilo, I imagine one kilo as an average sized elephant. (No idea why).
Of course 25 years ago, I understood the metric system, and can still recognize that a meter is similiar to a yard, but that is about it. However, lack of use, has led to loss of the other measurement meanings.
In scfi-fantasy, most I have read, have their own unique measurement names that are in relation to something the main character would recognize, so the new term will have some meaning (such as clothing, pens, houses)
Posted by Survivor (Member # 213) on :
I just want to say, while a three meter diving board isn't as scary as a lictor...um...okay, it isn't scary at all. Even if it was bearing down on Alex.
Posted by Kathleen Dalton Woodbury (Member # 59) on :
Abby, maybe you think of an elephant because kilo means thousand?
A kilo(gram) is just a little over 2 pounds, so a chicken might be a closer match.
Posted by pantros (Member # 3237) on :
As long as when someone says "Kilo" you don't think "$25,000" I think its all fine.
Posted by Survivor (Member # 213) on :
No, man, you call that a "Kee".
Okay, really, when I hear "Kilo" I think "Lima". At my age, that's just weird.
Posted by abby (Member # 2681) on :
Kathleen may be tight about why I view kilo as an elephant. I'll try to remember the more correct version as a chicken,
Hubby mentioned another reason to avoid kilo - law enforcement people, tend to view it as a word used to describe drug captures, so it can have a certain negative aura around the word. Just a thing he mentioned.
Posted by Domasai (Member # 2939) on :
Do you have to change it if you want to sell it in the States? No. Would it make things easier for most readers here? Yes. 'Cause you don't want someone wondering how far a kilometer is when they're supposed to be paying attention to where the car is driving and how anxious the people in the car are about getting there.
Posted by Robert Nowall (Member # 2764) on :
Metricism gives me trouble. I know that anything I set in the near or far future must use "kilometers"or "kilograms." "Liters" works for me...you can talk about a "gram" or a "kilo"...a "meter" is good...but what can you do with "kilometers?" I've tried "clicks," I've tried "kays," but nothing seems quite right...
Posted by keldon02 (Member # 2398) on :
Three completely different associations:
Funny, to many postindustrial age Americans metric means foreign technology, alienation and job loss. I don't know how many times I've seen farmers, housewives and laid off workers make comments to this effect. But then I live in the south, and southerners have been actively fighting against metric usage since President Grant first declared it our national system of measurement during the days of radical reconstruction.
To us aging baby boomer sci fi fans, especially those of us who were trained in the sciences, metric has surprisingly retro associations. This probably because a good minority of the writing fifty years ago used metric.
I disagree about the future being neccessarily metric. With modern CAD/CAM technology one could just as easily design a fleet of space ships using ancient Sumerian measurements. They could individually design each ship, right down to the bolts, using a base 64 version of the left thumb width of its prospective captain as its measurement key.
[This message has been edited by keldon02 to wonder if there is a story in that last idea. (edited October 22, 2005).]
[This message has been edited by keldon02 (edited October 22, 2005).]
Posted by Spaceman (Member # 9240) on :
Metric only gives trouble to those unwilling to learn the system.
I was the last class in my high school to do physics problems in the English system, and the first class to do them in metric. We had two textbooks. It had teh effect of teaching me the physics instead of the measurement system.
[This message has been edited by Spaceman (edited October 22, 2005).]
Posted by Survivor (Member # 213) on :
I think that standard production templates are definitely with us in any future that involves mass industrialization, particularly for military use (where you need to have replacement parts on hand that can fit into any vessel).
Like I said, the metric system has faults, but the fact that you can easily use any of the units to derive the other units is a real bonus.
Posted by apeiron (Member # 2565) on :
"I was the last class in my high school to do physics problems in the English system, and the first class to do them in metric. We had two textbooks. It had teh effect of teaching me the physics instead of the measurement system."
I learned E & M first in SI, then in CGS. Both are metric, but since many quantities are defined in different units, the equations fall out differently. Having the constants change around on you certainly teaches you to appreciate the real meanings of and relationships between quantities, no matter how they are defined.
"With modern CAD/CAM technology one could just as easily design a fleet of space ships using ancient Sumerian measurements. They could individually design each ship, right down to the bolts, using a base 64 version of the left thumb width of its prospective captain as its measurement key."
Why do I see this ending in a NASA-esque disaster in which the ships navigation system is programmed in one captain's thumb width, and quantities are entered in another's...?
Posted by AstroStewart (Member # 2597) on :
As a physics grad, I agree that having to use SI and cgs units can be quite a pain sometimes, but you should try taking it a step further. I've gotten to the point where most of my classes use fun bizarre units that "make things easier." In this system c=hbar=k=1. (with c=speed of light, hbar = plank's constant, which pops up all the time in quantum mechanics, k=boltzmann's constant, pops up all the time in statistical mechanics)
While this makes the equations much prettier, it makes you work harder once you finally get a numerical answer, converting that back to a number that makes sense.
How's that for fun with units?
Posted by Robert Nowall (Member # 2764) on :
As for eccentric metric units, I remember the "milli-helen"---how much face it takes to launch just one ship...
Posted by keldon02 (Member # 2398) on :
quote:Why do I see this ending in a NASA-esque disaster in which the ships navigation system is programmed in one captain's thumb width, and quantities are entered in another's...?
I was thinking more about the possibilities in case of mutiny or piracy, or if the captain hit his thumb with a hammer.
Posted by Robyn_Hood (Member # 2083) on :
When measuring the heighth of a horse, how big is a hand? Is it a set measure or is it just whose hand happens to be handy?
Posted by Survivor (Member # 213) on :
It's usually set to four inches these days, though I'm sure that there are enough people with hands (actually just the palm) of the right size that the measuring is occasionally done using a hand. Otherwise you have to use one of them fancy measuring rigs.
Posted by apeiron (Member # 2565) on :
"Otherwise you have to use one of them fancy measuring rigs."
...A ruler?
Milli-Helen! I love it!
Posted by Robert Nowall (Member # 2764) on :
I attribute the "millihelen" to the late Isaac Asimov, in whose work I ran across it. (Though he was annoyed that Time Magazine once mentioned it without attributing it to him.)
). I don't know what a mile, inch, yard, foot, or a pound is.
