If you're in third person deep penetration, and the MC thinks about something he believes to be generally true, is it "is", or "was"?
As in:
He'd always known the basic rules of the universe. Klingons love Shakespeare. 2 plus 2 is 4. And even-numbered Star Trek movies don't suck.
or:
He'd always known the basic rules of the universe. Klingons loved Shakespeare. 2 plus 2 was 4. And even-numbered Star Trek movies didn't suck.
Posted by HSO (Member # 2056) on :
What is the tense of the whole narrative? 3rd person can be present or past tense, or future tense, I suppose.
Anyway, since the first sentence is past tense ('He had'), I assume the rest of the story is as well. In that case, the bottom example feels right to me.
Posted by autumnmuse (Member # 2136) on :
Hmm, I wonder if a style manual has the answer? I actually prefer the first example, and have seen that done in print. But it may be okay both ways.
Posted by Silver3 (Member # 2174) on :
I've seen both used in print. I prefer the second, but it's a personal thing.
Posted by mikemunsil (Member # 2109) on :
I prefer the 1st. Not to be contrary, but because you've set up that the character is going to opine onthe basic truths, and then the character does so and the presetn lends immediacy. It seems more correct to me that way.
Posted by Lazer (Member # 3098) on :
I prefer the first way.
I you say 2 and 2 was four, you imply that it is something from the past, when 2 and 2 STILL is four nowadays. At least, that's the way I read it...
Posted by Crotalus@work (Member # 2959) on :
I also vote for the first way. For the reason Mike stated.
Posted by pantros (Member # 3237) on :
First way.
You can likely use either way and be correct but make sure you are consistant.
However the first would be my pick for most of the reasons already said.
Posted by Minister (Member # 2213) on :
It's my Greek training coming through again, but I like the first -- not because it's deep penetration, but because it states general truths. Good question, though; I often struggle with exactly how to word thoughts in 3rd person deep penetration.
Posted by Corky (Member # 2714) on :
When you think those rules (or ones like them) in your own head, do you use present or past?
I use present, so I'd vote for the first one.
[This message has been edited by Corky (edited January 05, 2006).]
Posted by Survivor (Member # 213) on :
Well, the question is what you mean to say, not which is "correct". By using the past as you do in the second example, you strongly imply that these rules of the universe (or perhaps just one of them) are no longer valid. The implied statement is very clear, and it is not present in the present tense usage.
Posted by Calligrapher (Member # 2985) on :
The story is part of a timeline. Even though the story is told in past tense, there are events that happended prior to the story, at the same time as the story and events that will happen in the future.
He'd always known the basic rules of the universe. The Klingons had loved Plato at one time. Now they love Shakespeare. They would have loved OSC if the series had not ended.
Posted by wbriggs (Member # 2267) on :
Sounds good to me!
Posted by yanos (Member # 1831) on :
Rules and truths (or things believed to be true) can always be written in present tense, doesn't matter what the situation.
Roger Bannister is the first man to run a mile in under 4 minutes.
Posted by benskia (Member # 2422) on :
I vote for the first one. Because of what Lazer said.
Posted by krazykiter (Member # 3108) on :
I'm with Survivor on this one. I would use the first, for example, in a situation where you want your character to be confused about the present reality of his situation:
"He'd always known the basic rules of the universe. Klingons love Shakespeare. 2 plus 2 is 4. And even-numbered Star Trek movies don't suck. So why wasn't the Illudium 238 Space Demodulator working?"
As Survivor points out, the second seems more appropriate to a situation where things are different, and the character is aware of the change.
