I need a latin translation verified. I'm suspicious of online translators, but it's all I've got.
The phrase I need an accurate translation for is: "Be the flame, not the moth."
This is what I got back from a free internet translation site: "Exsisto flamma, non matris."
If you can point me toward a good reference, I'd appreciate it, or if someone knows Latin and can verify/correct, I'd be ecstatic. Thanks.
It's tough researching languages. It's one thing to translate vocabulary; it's quite another to translate nuance of meaning.
Posted by pantros (Member # 3237) on :
The verb you are getting out of the translater is not the imperitive "Be"
The problem here is you are translating Exist as the flame not the moth.
when you should be translating
Act as the flame, not the moth.
Posted by pooka (Member # 1738) on :
Esse flamma, non [moth] would be my best guess. But esse is probably the infinitive, not the imperative.
I would read existo as "I exist". I don't know if I would be right.
Hey, I found a pretty decent grammar site by searching for "Latin Conjugations". It says "es" is the singular present of "to be" and Este is the plural.
[This message has been edited by pooka (edited June 19, 2006).]
Posted by Elan (Member # 2442) on :
Hmm... I ran both of those phrases through the translator to see what the difference is between them. Interesting. Although I have to say that "Exist as the flame, not the moth" may be closer to the nuance I need.
Retranslated: Exist as the flame, not the moth Futurus ut flamma , non matris
Act as the flame, not the moth Factum ut flamma , non matris
Anyone able to tell me if there is a nuance that makes the phrase "Exsisto flamma, non matris" flat-out wrong?
The character is making a statement of "being." He's tired of bending toward the will of others, and is saying this from a decision to step into his own personal power. Hope the circumstance helps identify the nuance I should use.
Crap. I took Spanish in high school, not Latin.
Posted by pantros (Member # 3237) on :
You are still thinking in English, when, Latin verbs conjugate in a manner similar to Spansish.
Your Exsisto is the first person present form of "Exist"
He is saying, "I am flame, not the moth" which might be what you are looking for. The lack of articles in Latin give room for slack.
Posted by pooka (Member # 1738) on :
I don't know why the translator gave you participles- it probably couldn't tell you wanted an imperative. That is why computers will probably never replace human translators. An imperative is a command that implies second person. When you say "Eat my cookies!" it means [you must] eat my cookies.
In Latin, an imperative generally ends with -e. These forms that end in -us are participles. Something ending in -o is a first person active verb. Of course, you could just pull a J.K. Rowling and do what sounds interesting without regard for sound grammar.
Posted by pantros (Member # 3237) on :
So
Exsiste Flamma, non matris!
Posted by pooka (Member # 1738) on :
Does it really have two Ss? I really prefere Es or Este, though if you go with Este, your nouns have to be plural.
Posted by pantros (Member # 3237) on :
I should say that due to the tradition of liberally translating Latin, there are about a thousand different ways to say "Be"
Posted by autumnmuse (Member # 2136) on :
I'm afraid I can't help with the Latin part, but I find it interesting that as of 24 hours ago I can't recall ever hearing that particular phrase (though it's possible I have and don't remember) and I just heard it twice; once on this thread and once in the movie "Casanova" which my husband finally talked me into watching with him. Interesting coincidence.
Posted by Elan (Member # 2442) on :
the English came out as: "To emerge Flame, not mother." From what I can tell, the word for "moth" is the same as the word for "mother." Which doesn't make a lot of sense to me.
Now I can see WHY I never wanted to take Latin... too confusing!
[This message has been edited by Elan (edited June 19, 2006).]
Posted by pantros (Member # 3237) on :
Matris is indeed "Mother" and NOT "Moth"
Maybe use the word "musca" meaning fly or "Papilio" meaning butterfly
Posted by pooka (Member # 1738) on :
I don't agree that there are many ways to translate "to be". Verbs of being are curious things. They don't even have them in some languages. P.S. I wasn't sure about your word for moth, which is why I didn't actually include it in my initial attempt.
[This message has been edited by pooka (edited June 19, 2006).]
Posted by Verdant (Member # 3498) on :
The phrase "be the flame" will use the infinitive form of the verb 'to be'. In such a case, this is not a command, necessitating the imparative form, but rather a statement that in latin-based languages (Italian, Spanish, Portugese, French, Romanian) requires the infintive. This will translate "be a/the flame" or "being a/the flame" Additionally, there are two different verbs that can mean 'to be'. I don't have my Latin Dictionary handy but this is going to be the same verb that conjugates 'ergo, esi, ese...
Good writing
Posted by pooka (Member # 1738) on :
I thought ergo meant "therefore".
To Be in the Active indicative:
Sum ----- Sumus Es ----- Estis Est -----Sunt
The infinitive would be (and I haven't heard of that rule, but my four years of latin ended 19 years back) esse.
Well, that chart didn't come out in a very clear way. It correlates to: I ----- we you ----- you pl. he/she/it-- they
[This message has been edited by pooka (edited June 20, 2006).]