Hatrack River Writers Workshop: Asimov's September 2010

This is topic Asimov's September 2010 in forum Open Discussions About Writing at Hatrack River Writers Workshop.

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Posted by Osiris (Member # 9196) on :

I just picked up the latest issue, and decided to do a little experiment inspired from these forums. I decided to read the first 13 lines of each story to see what hooked me and what didn't.

I was surprised to find that only one story really hooked me in the first 13. In fact it did it in the first 3. Its a story called Wheat Rust (I think, don't have it in front of me).

Otherwise, none of the other pieces did that. It might just be me, maybe I'm a bit jaded as a reader, but it makes me wonder a bit if others have had the same experience. Anyone else read this or prior issues and experience the same thing?

Posted by philocinemas (Member # 8108) on :

Yes, we have discussed this several times in the past. Here are some recent discussions that I could find fairly easily:

http://www.hatrack.com/forums/writers/forum/Forum1/HTML/005640.html
http://www.hatrack.com/forums/writers/forum/Forum1/HTML/005644.html
http://www.hatrack.com/forums/writers/forum/Forum1/HTML/005647.html
http://www.hatrack.com/forums/writers/forum/Forum1/HTML/005662.html

In my opinion, editors, especially from the "Big Three", look at different criteria for a hook than we often do as writers/readers - that and familiarity with certain writers.

Posted by Osiris (Member # 9196) on :

Thank you sir, reading your links, threads are interesting.

Posted by Merlion-Emrys (Member # 7912) on :

For me, its more proof that trying to craft a perfect "hook" is futile, since everyone is "hooked" by different things. Hence, write your story and then find its best audience.

Posted by tchernabyelo (Member # 2651) on :

"that and familiarity with certain writers"

I think this point is worth emphasising.

Once you have sold to a big name market, you are MUCH more likely to sell there again. You no longer have the same need for a "hook" in your story.

Posted by walexander (Member # 9151) on :

I just recently went through a ton of my old books reading first thirteen, and was sad to find that most really didn't hook anything. Sometimes now it makes me wonder if becoming a writer is going to ruin me a little to the experience of reading, because it happens for enjoying movies when you become an actor, it's hard for me not to notice the things you would never notice by having this skill set, you lose some of the illusion. Like seeing how many stage lights and how they are placed in a film actors eyes.

Little things like that bite at it's sub-reality.

I'm starting to wonder if I'll always be critiquing the stuff I'm reading now, and wondering if it was good writing as well as good story.

One of the other things that was disappointing was I started to read first 3 pages, just to see if it was more than just first thirteen. That was in a way more disappointing because I noticed some authors putting a lot of effort into the first page, and then the writing style dropped after the initial thrust.

I mean most of the books I have, and I have a lot, are decent readable books. It's funny to really look at them now with a writers eye.

Posted by Brad R Torgersen (Member # 8211) on :

Trying to become a pro writer has semi-ruined much of my for-fun fiction reading. It's kind of like loving magic shows as a kid, then growing up and realizing stage magicians just use tricks and illusion. Oz is revealed behind the curtain, as it were. The fun has largely gone out it.

Which is not to say I don't get joy from reading something that really knocks my socks off. Last story I remember reading that really, really did this, was "Arkfall" by Carolyn Ives Gillman. It wasn't a perfect story, but it really swept me up and I found myself -- as I so seldom do these days -- transported totally into the world the author had created, such that I didn't want the story to end, even when it did. The characters were true to life, their emotions and predicaments genuinely moved me, the adventure was genuinely adventurous, and I was reminded of why I work so hard to be a writer myself, and why I love it when an author 'transports' me in that way.

In essence, "Arkfall" is the kind of story I wanted to learn to WRITE, and I think I at least partially succeeded with my novelette that comes out in the November issue of Analog SF.

Sadly, too little fiction -- even by the big Name pros -- transports me these days. Sometimes it amuses or entertains, but just as often I find myself kicking over into critique mode, and becoming frustrated because of what I perceive to be flaws or problems. I remind myself that probably nothing is wrong with the story, it's just not the kind of story that suits my tastes, but the problem remains: I enjoy fiction far less, as a reader, than I otherwise would have had I never wanted to become a writer myself.

Posted by johnbrown (Member # 1467) on :

I don't think becoming a writer has affected my enjoyment too much. I've always been an impatient reader. If the story didn't hook me, I never got to page 2. But I haven't become MORE impatient. I still enjoy stories and novels all the time. However, it is true that if the story is working well or belches, I will loop out of the reader's trance and try to figure out what's working so well or not.

BTW, my experience with any magazine or anthology is the same. Usually only a few stories grab me. It's always been that way.

Posted by InarticulateBabbler (Member # 4849) on :

quote:

Trying to become a pro writer has semi-ruined much of my for-fun fiction reading. It's kind of like loving magic shows as a kid, then growing up and realizing stage magicians just use tricks and illusion. Oz is revealed behind the curtain, as it were. The fun has largely gone out it.
Sadly, too little fiction -- even by the big Name pros -- transports me these days. Sometimes it amuses or entertains, but just as often I find myself kicking over into critique mode, and becoming frustrated because of what I perceive to be flaws or problems. I remind myself that probably nothing is wrong with the story, it's just not the kind of story that suits my tastes, but the problem remains: I enjoy fiction far less, as a reader, than I otherwise would have had I never wanted to become a writer myself.

Here, here.

Posted by Kathleen Dalton Woodbury (Member # 59) on :

I still enjoy fiction, but it is very rare when I can't put a book down. In fact, I can't think of the last time that happened, unless it was when the seventh Harry Potter book came out.

Now, the best thing I can say about a book is that I am anxious to get back to it, or that I thought about it a lot after I finished it, or that I didn't want it to end.

Or that I was so engaged in the story that I didn't notice the writing. Maybe that's the very best thing I can say of all.

Posted by Osiris (Member # 9196) on :

I agree Merlion, thats sort of what I'm thinking as well. For me I can be hooked by very specific things, and it doesn't always have to be action. The mystery of the monolith in 2001 is what hooks me in the movie, for example, while one of the stories in Asimov's started with a romantic scene being interrupted by two men falling from the sky (though that inherently has mystery as well; why they are falling from the sky in the first place?). That also hooked me.

@walexander: I once thought about becoming a video game developer. Someone told me that it completely ruins the joy of playing the video games.

[This message has been edited by Osiris (edited July 30, 2010).]