I was writing a revival scene set in a fantasy world. The Christian-like deity is referred to as the Maker. As I was writing along, I needed a kind of stock reply from the congregation. Something like "praise Jesus!" but obviously not that directly Christian based. So, I think to myself, the Maker makes things, so I type "Make it so!" and continue with the scene. After several paragraphs, I stopped. I swore. I wondered. Is the phrase completely owned by a certain space-faring captain? The phrase predates him by like a century, and I'm certainly using it in a different fashion and meaning, but I don't want to pull someone out of the story or make them think of that other iconic character. I mean, it isn't exactly "may the Force be with," material, but close.
Posted by extrinsic (Member # 8019) on :
"Make it so" is a nautical idiom used for centuries by English-speaking naval command staff speaking orders to subordinates. No, it's not "owned" by a certain spaceship captain; however, it will evoke associations.
I'm inclined to accept it regardless in a naval context. However, not in passionate call and response religious rituals. It's on the commanding side and might call down the rath of a deity for its presumptive blaspheme!?
In the context, I feel a pleading response to a ritual call might be called for. Or a somewhat sensible non sequitur. Dynamic dialogue's general forms are echo, colloquy (question and answer), non sequitur, and squabble, and melds of any of or all four.
Hallelujah! Amen! and the like are common responses to pulpit calls, echos, meaningful to penitents but non sequitur idioms for uninitiates. Praise be! and Blessed be! are less known, often used in Wiccan rites.
Consider exploring the call and response rites of a number of denominations to get a flavor of them and then artfully and uniquely follow their conventions.
Posted by LDWriter2 (Member # 9148) on :
Could be "Amen,the Maker" Or "He is the Maker indeed."
Posted by Reziac (Member # 9345) on :
quote:Originally posted by babooher: I was writing a revival scene set in a fantasy world. The Christian-like deity is referred to as the Maker. As I was writing along, I needed a kind of stock reply from the congregation. Something like "praise Jesus!" but obviously not that directly Christian based. So, I think to myself, the Maker makes things, so I type "Make it so!"
I like this. If you put them in close association the first time, it'll probably avoid the Certain Captain issue... which actually did not occur to me from your post!
Posted by Robert Nowall (Member # 2764) on :
"Make it so" makes it sound like the bald guy they called the captain on "Star Trek: The Next Generation"---whatever its origins.
Posted by babooher (Member # 8617) on :
LDWriter2, I thought about "He makes it so," but so far I've been able to avoid assigning a gender on this all-mighty. Linking that a bit to what extrinsic wrote, I think the normal responses are short, so "He makes it so," is about as long as I'd like it. Originally, I thought about "Praise Jesus!" or even "blessed be" being three syllables in length (I always think the blessed in blessed be is pronounced bles-sed) and then figured "make it so" was the same syllabic length. And while I can see it being an imperative, I hear it as more pleading. Even something like "Forgive me, Father, for I have sinned," is technically an imperative.
For right now, I'm not letting this stop the progression of the story because it is kind of minor. Sometimes the little details do really matter, but first must be the story. Then I can finalize in round 2.
Posted by rcmann (Member # 9757) on :
I suppose, "I wanna make it with you," would be considered inappropriate?
Posted by extrinsic (Member # 8019) on :
Be it so (so be it)? Or, By Almighty Grace.
I feel that a strong and clear yet askew revival call response could be unique, but recognizable from its patterns and conventions, for an alternate world scenario. Patterns and conventions is a folklorist's concept that identifies and analyzes texts, traditions, and materials for their underlying influences on and influences from folk groups' shared expressions, like an evangelical religious group's revival meeting. Whatever comes up, I feel also that it should in some small or large way develop the cultural milieu.
Posted by InarticulateBabbler (Member # 4849) on :
My first thought was "So be it," as extrinsic mentions above, because that is the definition of Amen. But that wasn't quite what you indicated. A few suggestions, take or leave:
Fashioned by Him
And thus it is
By Glory's design
From His hands
*Note all of the "His"s are interchangeable with "Hers," because it always seems to be a "Him" and you may not want that.
ALSO, and this is something not mentioned: Shai Hulud (the worms in Dune) are worshipped as the Maker or Makers.
Hope this helps.
Posted by babooher (Member # 8617) on :
I have always found Shai Hulud to be an awesomely sounding title. A lot of the original Dune just sounds so epic. I never thought Maker was super original, but I find it interesting that it links back to a book I treasure even though it wasn't my intention.
The intention behind a lot of this is for resonance. I don't mind this sounding a lot like Christianity, so long as it isn't Christianity. My names of places have all been designed to sound like, but not be, real. All of this is to enhance the cultural milieu. And I understand the importance these small details can make. Going back to Dune, think how powerful but somewhat small the Litany of Fear is. Or the Gom Jabber. Or Shai Hulud. It all builds and enriches.
Posted by Kathleen Dalton Woodbury (Member # 59) on :
For whatever it may be worth, OSC uses The Maker in his Hatrack River stories.
How about "Make it Be" as your response?
Posted by wetwilly (Member # 1818) on :
"Make it so" definitely makes me think immediately of Star Trek, and I'm not even a fan. "Make it be" actually has the same effect for me.
Posted by hoptoad (Member # 2145) on :
so be it... as extrinsic said, I like it because it is not florid and is more contemplative and has a sense of resolve to it.
Posted by babooher (Member # 8617) on :
Changed it to "As it is made." I think that will work. The change from an imperative to a declarative in the past tense fits better anyway.
Posted by Reziac (Member # 9345) on :
quote:Originally posted by babooher: Changed it to "As it is made." I think that will work. The change from an imperative to a declarative in the past tense fits better anyway.
It feels completely different (and far more religious) in what context we have, and I like it, a lot.