This is topic Chapter 7 - Dragon in forum Fragments and Feedback for Books at Hatrack River Writers Workshop.


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Posted by Denevius (Member # 9682) on :
 


[ June 03, 2015, 06:27 PM: Message edited by: Denevius ]
 
Posted by Denevius (Member # 9682) on :
 
Any comments are appreciated. As always, thanks!
 
Posted by Tank1982 (Member # 9959) on :
 
Hey. It was easy to read through and the imagery was clear. I felt like I could see what was happening. I started getting more curious as I read along. I would turn the page.
 
Posted by wetwilly (Member # 1818) on :
 
"Jang Jae Yoon dipped the cup in his shadow, placed it to his lips, and sipped."

I don't have any idea what this is referring to. If this has already been made clear in an earlier chapter or something like that, then no problem. If I'm supposed to have any idea what you're talking about from this, I do not.

"he sprang to his feet, curses bubbling forth to be screamed from a parched throat."

This line tripped me up. Very awkward wording. I'm honestly not 100% sure I understand what you're trying to say here.

The juxtaposition of showing this guy in junkie mode--some kind of occult junkie, I'm guessing--followed by showing him as a father when his ten-year-old son comes in is interesting. It made me form an opinion about this guy and then adjust it immediately. I like when stories do that.

The same positive stuff I have already said about your story in other place applies here, as well. Elegant writing style, interesting imagery, all that.
 
Posted by Denevius (Member # 9682) on :
 
Hey, thanks for the comments!

The first line is explained throughout the chapter, but I'm pretty happy that the fact that he's a junkie of some kind got through in the abstract characterization.

Thanks again!
 
Posted by extrinsic (Member # 8019) on :
 
I'm not sure what Tank1982 and wetwilly mean by "imagery." If you-all could elaborate, please.

Imagery has a generic connotation meaning visual sensations. For a literary denotation, imagery means tangible, material, concrete visual sensations with additional intangible, immaterial, abstract, or ideal symbolic meaning.

A hot, red sun setting on the horizon is an example of the former. An angry red sun broiling on the horizon is an example of the latter. The first is a stable visual sensation, meaning the sun is hot, red, and setting: no more, no less; unequivocal, objective. The second is subjective, not quite stable, equivocal, perhaps not as angry as the stasis statement, (to be existent statement), makes the sun out to be. The second expresses either a narrator or character's perception attitude about the sun's influence or a reflection of a viewpoint persona's emotional state, or both.

By not quite stable, I mean a figurative, ironic, perhaps inferrably different meaning underlies the literal one and is almost accessible, would be accessible with further context and texture development.

An unstable irony, or unstable symbolic meaning, is one where ambiquity isn't clearly satisfied to the point of unequivocalness. The second example is unstable from not developing whether the sun is itself angrily influencing the setting's ambience or is a reflection of a persona's mood. Can a sun be angry? No, except perhaps in a highly fantastical milieu. A broiling hot setting sun might feel like anger, though, and, of course, a dramatic persona can interpret a broiling hot sun as angry.

I see the visual sensations of this chapter opening as the generic sense of "imagery": visual sensations only, not symbolic expressions. On the other hand, a mite of context and texture development could imply several of the motifs are symbolic as well as concrete: the shadow, the dragon, the shotglass, the son, the Ildo mart, any of the character, object, setting, and event features.

[ November 25, 2013, 01:09 AM: Message edited by: extrinsic ]
 
Posted by extrinsic (Member # 8019) on :
 
quote:
Originally posted by Denevius:
The first line is explained throughout the chapter, but I'm pretty happy that the fact that he's a junkie of some kind got through in the abstract characterization.

I see an implication of a junkie's behavior traits shown through exquisite, artful imitation (mimesis): not told as explanation (exegesis). Neither do I see an "abstract characterization." I see well-crafted characterization, That, though, is powerful and clear writing.
 
Posted by Tank1982 (Member # 9959) on :
 
@extrinsic I used the wrong word then. I was trying to say that I could see the scene happening. I liked the dipping in the shadow and the pockets of darkness parts.
 
Posted by Denevius (Member # 9682) on :
 
quote:
I see the visual sensations of this chapter opening as the generic sense of "imagery": visual sensations only,
You're right. This darkness plaguing certain humans is a subplot of the novel. Nathaniel suffers the same affliction.

quote:
not symbolic expressions. On the other hand, a mite of context and texture development could imply several of the motifs are symbolic as well as concrete: the shadow, the dragon, the shotglass, the son, the Ildo mart, any of the character, object, setting, and event features.
And yeah, the visuals are concrete, but darkness and shadows are typical representations of evil. So it's also symbolic.

As always, Extrinsic, thanks for the comments!
 


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