I'm guessing that EVERYONE, with sufficient imagination, can come up with a situation in which they'd willingly kill another human being.
Posts: 14554 | Registered: Dec 1999
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posted
Are you kidding? I'd kill someone who looked at me funny if I thought they might harm me. Obviously not to that extent. But if someone attacked me and I even THOUGHT that they might kill me, I'd kill them first before I gave them the chance. Too bad for them. It's a good reason to never attack me. I'd probably kill someone for breaking my leg or something. Anything that put me completely at their mercy. Maybe that's not a Christian viewpoint. I don't know. Oh well.
Posts: 6367 | Registered: Aug 2003
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posted
I'd have to agree with that, although the title made me think of all life. I just gotta kill to eat. Sorry. (but not too sorry) Posts: 1843 | Registered: Aug 2003
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posted
I think I could kill someone who was threatening my family. I have never been put into that situation, but I have thought about it and I am fairly sure I could do it.
So sometimes killing is right.
Murder is always wrong, but killing is not always murder.
posted
What is this attitude about plants not being alive? Eating plants is murder to, you heartless bastards.
Everytime something eats, something else dies. Even if you give up and subsist on motor oil. That oil is from things that died millions of years ago.
You wanna be truly decent? Stop eating altogether. But then youll kill yourself. For which you will surely go to heck. Oh my goodness! What is one to do?!
Posts: 2532 | Registered: Jul 2001
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posted
Yes Scott. I also have enough imagination to dream up reasons why I'd beat someone bloody senseless.
Posts: 3495 | Registered: Feb 2000
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quote:What is this attitude about plants not being alive? Eating plants is murder to, you heartless bastards.
I quite agree - the song below eloquently states the case:
quote:Carrot Juice Is Murder by Arrogant Worms
Listen up brothers and sisters come hear my desperate tale I speak of our friends of nature trapped in the dirt like a jail Vegetables live in oppression, served on our tables each night This killing of veggies is madness, I say we take up the fight Salads are only for murderers, coleslaw's a fascist regime Don't think that they don't have feelings, just cause a radish can't scream
Chorus: I've heard the screams of the vegetables (scream, scream, scream) Watching their skins being peeled (having their insides revealed) Grated and steamed with no mercy (burning off calories) How do you think that feels (bet it hurts really bad) Carrot juice constitutes murder (and that's a real crime) Greenhouses prisons for slaves (let my vegetables go) It's time to stop all this gardening (it's dirty as hell) Let's call a spade a spade (is a spade is a spade is a spade)
I saw a man eating celery, so I beat him black and blue If he ever touches a sprout again, I'll bite him clean in two I'm a political prisoner, trapped in a windowless cage Cause I stopped the slaughter of turnips by killing five men in a rage I told the judge when he sentenced me, "This is my finest hour, I'd kill those farmers again just to save one more cauliflower"
Chorus
How low as people do we dare to stoop, Making young broccolis bleed in the soup? Untie your beans, uncage your tomatoes Let potted plants free, don't mash that potato!
I've heard the screams of the vegetables (scream, scream, scream) Watching their skins being peeled (fates in the stir-fry are sealed) Grated and steamed with no mercy (you fat gourmet slob) How do you think that feels? (leave them out in the field) Carrot juice constitutes murder (V8's genocide) Greenhouses prisons for slaves (yes, your composts are graves) It's time to stop all this gardening (take up macrame) Let's call a spade a spade (is a spade, is a spade, is a spade, is a spade......)
quote:Murder is always wrong, but killing is not always murder.
Ah...that's the thought some of us have been trying to put in such simple terms for years. Maybe just me, but thanks for doing it. Makes good sense.
Posts: 6415 | Registered: Jul 2000
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posted
Wait a minute here. I can eat a peach without killing the tree and grapes without killing the vine. I need not kill the cow or the goat to drink its milk. We don't harvest the wheat until the plant has already died naturally. Not everything we eat requires killing -- ask the Jen (sp?).
Posts: 12591 | Registered: Jan 2000
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Odouls--only if you don't plant it. Just think--you have a moral responsibility to plant every seed you find. Every last one.
Posts: 16059 | Registered: Aug 2000
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posted
Hey, I never said I wouldn't kill someone who tried to seriously hurt my family or close friends. It doesn't mean it would be a thing I would like to have on my concience.
Posts: 3658 | Registered: Jan 2002
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posted
I agree with msquared -- I could kill someone that was an imminent danger to my kids or any part of my family. But that doesn't also mean that I wouldn't bother me for years afterward.
Posts: 9538 | Registered: Aug 2003
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quote: By eating the peach youre killing the fetus!
er, not quite. Only true if you don't plant the pit. Therefore, one can be a peachatarian with impunity! Posts: 168 | Registered: Aug 2003
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quote:Wow, I have a LOT of seed that hasn't been planted...
Jeez, Tick - 11 messages is all it took for the topic to go from killing to this?
Question - should I be proud or embarrassed that I already knew what "onanism" was when I first came across the term here? Posts: 4344 | Registered: Mar 2003
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posted
You know what I hate? When I say something serious, that I mean with all my heart, and people mock me for it. It's sick.
Posts: 3658 | Registered: Jan 2002
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quote:But the dairy kills the plants, so you are eating death once removed.
Not necessarily. Cows and goats can eat grasses without killing them, just as you can mow a lawn without killing it.
Posts: 12591 | Registered: Jan 2000
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I don't know who you were refering to but I was not mocking you. I was just telling you that I could kill to defend myself and my family and, I think, not lose any sleep over it.
posted
I've been in a situation where I honestly thought that I would have to kill someone to avoid dying, and didn't do it. (Note, by the way, that I didn't die.)
I have never been in a situation where I honestly thought I'd have to kill someone to save someone I loved, though, so I don't know how I'd react when it came to it.
I have, by the way, been in a number of situations where I thought I had to risk my life to save someone else, and I'm rather ashamed to say that I couldn't always bring myself to do it.
Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
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There are many causes for which I would die. There are fewer for which I would kill.
I believe that Murder is a subset of killing. Murder is killing those in your social group.
Hence God posts a commandment, Thou Shall Not Murder, and in the same book, orders the Isrealites to kill all the trespassers in Palestine, their wives, children, slaves and relations. Those people were not in the Isrealites social group.
Hence the largest sentence in the ancient world, especially in northern Europe, was to be cast out of society, or made "outlaw". It was perfectly legal to kill Outlaws. It wasn't murder.
Hence war was killing people who not only were outside your society, but were a threat to that society. Killing them was not only allowed, but it was encouraged for the continuation of the society.
Most of these attitudes are carried down to us today, but greatly reduced in scope: Capital Punishment has replaced Outlawing. Our soldiers focus on killing enemy soldiers, not civilians. "Thou Shall Not Kill" has expanded its meaning to include more people.
Why?
Because our view of who is in our society has grown. Most people believe that all humans are in their society. Some include the fetus of unborn children. Some do not. Some exclude convicted murderers. Some do not.
Some include animals into this society. Most do not--hence most of us enjoy a good steak.
In Isreal, social lines have been drawn between Arab and Jew--hence either is allowed to kill the other.
When is murder right? When the person you are killing has stepped so far out of what you consider society that it becomes right. They can do that by trying to murder you or a loved one. They can do that by abusing a child, or a dog, or a carrot.
Where you draw that line tells much about who You are.
Posts: 11895 | Registered: Apr 2002
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posted
Jebus, It does make me feel better. If I kill someone threatening me or my family, I know I only did it because I had to. I did not go out looking to kill some one. I did not go out looking to rob someone.
any offense was unintended. I knew that the thread title referred to a post you made on another thread, but it wasn't clear to me that you were in on the relocation effort and seemed like a nice place to jump in on some fun - and really really not intended to be at your expense.
Having said that, a couple of comments:
"Murder" is a legal term. It's specific to the set of laws one finds oneself governed by. Virtually all systems make distinctions between "homicide" - more or less a legal term for killing and while "murder" is a negotiated term - the law spells out what kinds of homicide qualify as "murder" and under what circumstances.
I have known people who feel all killing of another human being is morally unjustified. Most people, though, tend to argue about the boundaries between acceptable or excusable killing and murder - both informally and in courtrooms.
That's very broad strokes of course - there's the issues of those who feel that abortion is killing vs. those who don't. Those who feel that wittholding medical treatment is killing vs. those who feel it's just "letting nature take its course."
S'all - kinda not liking spending recreational time writing about killing - I get to do that on the job.
Posts: 4344 | Registered: Mar 2003
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posted
Human- sorry you're offended. This thread was not created to mock you. I am interested in examining the point of view you expressed in the 9/11 thread, though, so unless the Janitor or the Cards ask me, I do not plan on deleting it at this time.
If war to save culture/prevent genocide IS acceptable, why aren't more people hawking up to attack Iran/N. Korea/ West&East Africa?
Are there any examples (mm. . . perhaps India? Not sure, but input is welcome) of an oppressor being overthrown through peaceful coercion?
If not, does it even matter? Should we base our foreign policy on the failures of the past, and declare that NO tyrant has EVER, and will NEVER be overthrown peacefully?
On a personal note-- I have a great many people who I would kill for. I say this completely without experience in the subject.
Posts: 14554 | Registered: Dec 1999
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posted
I completely agree with that setiment. Killing is never right. You should never feel good about killing or celebrate it. It's an awful thing.
However, there are cicumstances where killing becomes necessary. Where, why it's still not right, it's not wrong either.
Gandhi talked about this in the guise of ahisma, which is a Hindi word that sort of translates to "destruction of life". Even he recognized that life is built on a foundation of ahisma. To live is to kill, sad but true. The task then is to lessen as much as possible the ahisma you cause and to make your life, your hisma, into as great a thing as possible to offset it.
Posts: 10177 | Registered: Apr 2001
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