posted
Sparrow wins.. hands down... duh... well.. unless the Iocane powder came into the mix.. That would be a cool addition to the trilogy.. Sparrow and Will have a little run in with Mr. Roberts.. Who would just so happen to be Boot Strap Bill at the time of course.. because everyone knows he isn't dead right? If he took a coin and sent it to his son, he must've taken a coin.. and if he did that, he was under the curse- he might've been sent to the depths of Davy Jones locker, but he had 10 years to get out..
Posts: 690 | Registered: Jul 2002
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I've thought a lot about that flaw... I've come to the conclusion that I think that Bootstrap Bill didn't take it from the chest itself. Remember that Jack Sparrow is not cursed -- therefore the mutiny that occured there was before they took the treasure. And it was said that Bootstrap didn't like what they did to Jack. So he must have gotten angry before they took the treasure, and refused to be a part of it.
Then, when the others had the treasure, he took one from them, and sent it to Will. Then, they drowned him.
Yes, that is probably wrong, but it's what I came up with, and it's not bad for something that I thought of at 4:30 in the morning. Posts: 7877 | Registered: Feb 2003
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I think he wouldn't be cursed if one of them gave him the coin, the same way the curse wasn't spread to his son, or to any of the people they tried to buy things from with it (since they had to track it all back down), I think haveing stolen it is what curses, so if he didn't take part in the theft, and was just payed with it for working on the ship, then he probably wouldn't be cursed
Posts: 733 | Registered: Sep 2003
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Right. That's what I was trying to get at... not that they gave it to him, but that he took it from THEM, so that they would remain cursed. Then he died. Thanks, Koga, for clearing that up. Posts: 7877 | Registered: Feb 2003
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What I want to know is how they reasonably managed to track down 882 pieces of gold in only ten years.
Posts: 8473 | Registered: Apr 2003
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Poor Bootstrap. You sit at the bottom of the ocean . . . counting fish, biding your time . . . ten long years drag by . . . then out of nowhere, you drown.
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He had to have been cursed. If he wasn't cursed then the crew wouldn't have needed his blood to lift the curse, they would have just needed the coin.
Posts: 3852 | Registered: Feb 2002
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I'm assuming they were able to wash the blood off of the coins after th blood was already given. That confused me for a while.
Posts: 4628 | Registered: Jul 2002
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.....there's a flaw in that, though -- the cursed pirates don't bleed. So there's no way Boostrap could've been cursed...
Posts: 1784 | Registered: Jun 2001
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If the cursed pirates don't bleed, then how did Jack cut his hand and put his blood on the coin he took after he was cursed?
And I always assumed that the rest of the pirates' blood was at the bottom of the chest, underneath the gold.
Posts: 3852 | Registered: Feb 2002
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You know, that raises an interesting question. How did the pirates get their blood onto the coins? How did Jack, for that matter?
Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
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I agree with Kasie, except that there's also a flaw in that... if the pirates don't bleed, how is it that when Elizabeth sticks a knife in Barbosa's chest, during dinner, he pulls it out and it's covered in blood?
posted
Just to make things clearer, I always assumed that the "blood to be repaid" meant blood from EVERYONE who took a coin, not just Bootstrap Bill. This explains why Jack had to add his blood, or else the curse wouldn't have been lifted.
Posts: 3852 | Registered: Feb 2002
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I don't think all the pirates needed to bleed, just Bootstrap or his son. I always assumed that Bootstrap wasn't under the curse, for one reason or another. When Will Turner cut himself he put the blood on both the coin that he had, and the coin that Jack threw to him, then he dropped them both in. Techically, it didn't matter which coin the blood was on, as long as the right blood was on one of the coins somewhere in the chest.
Posts: 8473 | Registered: Apr 2003
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Yes, but then WHY DID JACK ADD HIS BLOOD TOO?
I highly doubt that when they wrote and made the film that Jack cutting his hand to put blood on his own coin was a side note. He did it for a reason.
So, if Jack had the curse, and therefore had to add his blood, it seems to make sense that Bootstrap also had the curse, as did all the other pirates from the Black Pearl. Probably the monkey too.
Posts: 3852 | Registered: Feb 2002
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Does anyone else feel the overwhelming desire to try to mail this thread to one of the writers?
Posts: 9754 | Registered: Jul 2002
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posted
There's a part of a fight scene where three skeletonized pirates are stuck together with a spear or something, and Jack sticks a bomb into the ribcage of the middle one. Then he pushes them out of the moonlight, and the pirate can't reach into his own ribcage to remove the bomb.
The pirates physically change when they leave the moonlight. Barbossa's blood is on the blade after she stabs him, because he wasn't in the moonlight. And the pirates can bleed onto the gold for the same reason.
Makes sense to me.
What bothers me is that Jack suffers ten years of decomposition having only taken the gold a few minutes before. After all, the other pirates didn't notice they were dead until after they "killed" bootstrap Bill.
Did anyone else notice the pulse when the gold hits the water the first time?
Posts: 3735 | Registered: Mar 2002
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I think that no one (especially the writers) expected that people such as us would look so deeply into the plot of what was meant to be a swashbuckling (swash swash buckle buckle) pirate story. I doubt that even the writers know exactly how the curse works, and what happened.
The men noticed they were skeletons before they 'killed' Bootstrap, they just didn't know that they needed Bootstrap's (or their?) blood to break the curse.
I think the problem with Jack is a big one, because surely he would notice that he could no longer feel (assuming he immediately turned into a skelaton), and if he didn't although he would technically be dead in the interval that he went between stealing the medallion and replacing the medallion (from thirst), he wouldn't be completely decomposed. However, none the pirates are completely decomposed (some still have eyes, etc).
When the pirates first arrive at the cave, is the moon full? the moon is full when they attack Port Royal, and that night on the ship, and then again the second time they are in the cave. This is either two or one month. I am assuming it is one because another set of moonlit nights between when Jack steals the medallion and when he puts it back would complicated matters (assuming he turns directly into a skelaton).
Javert, did you find out whether Jack cut his hand or not? I didn't see it, and I have seen the movie quite a number of times, but not specifically watching for that point... so it's highly possible.
posted
I think that "pulse" when the gold hits the water is partly how they found all of the gold pieces in the first place. Like that one pirate said, it "calls" to them.
Posts: 9057 | Registered: Nov 2000
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Hmm... I did not notice Jack cutting his hand, but I could be wrong.
Teshi, you say "full moon" at first, but then switch to moonlight. I thought that it was any moonlight, but I am not at all sure on that point.
It struck me as odd during the movie that Jack seemed to take a real hit from his wound for a while, although he did not die from it. While this is probably reading too much into the story, it might be that his "newness" is what makes that happen, rather than him shrugging it off immediately. On the other hand, it is just as plausible to believe that he was faking it to screw with Captain B.
To my mind, the largest continuity problem is that the pirates did not turn to skeletons when they were raiding Port Royal.
Posts: 1364 | Registered: Feb 2003
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posted
Jack just bursted into the blacksmith's shop without fooling with anything to raise the 'lock'. Whenever Will came in he had to raise the lock and he acted normal meaning nothing was wrong. Therefore meaning the door was already locked. Mr. Brown couldn't of had locked it because he would've been to drunk. Ain't that just odd.
I also didn't get why Jack would try to take back some of the treasure. They all returned it and he knew of the curse, so why take some as well? Posts: 4628 | Registered: Jul 2002
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He was considering being the 'Immortal Captain Jack Sparrow'. And only the Aztec gold was curse. The crown and jewels weren't he was running off with, weren't.
Posts: 23 | Registered: Dec 2003
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I always thought the whole Bootstrap Bill thing was them leaving themselves open for a sequel, something like the line "Death.... is only the beginning..." at the end of The Mummy.
I'd like to see Bootstrap come back for the sequel...
Posts: 4816 | Registered: Apr 2003
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Personally, I wanted to see a prequel. Bloom could have still been in it, "he's the spittin' image of Bootstap..." and it would explain a lot better, and have a return of Geoffrey Rush.
Posts: 23 | Registered: Dec 2003
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I say The Dread Pirate Roberts would win, provided Captain Jack Sparrow was mortal at the time, but then since The Dread Pirate Roberts keeps getting replaced it is hard to say how good of a fighter the person would be who is The Dread Pirate Roberts when Jack is around.
..............
I just wondered why if Will apparently looked exactly like his father none of them seemed to notice it until he said his name. I don't think Bootstrap Bill could have been cursed, because one of the Pirates who was cursed thought Will might be his ghost, if he had been cursed too then they would all have known he couldn't possibly have a ghost, unless you considered each of them a ghost.
Also why wouldn't Jack leave the coin in the chest and just have Will put his back while the Pirates were heading out to the ship, Jack could suprise Barbossa and shoot him before he knew what was coming and then it is just Jack, Will and Elizabeth fighting a few Pirates who haven't had to worry about avoiding being harmed for the last ten years, which would make them fairly easy for those three. I know most of the Pirates under the water could probably swim and would surface fairly quickly unless they wearing stuff that was unimaginably heavy, but the second they surfaced the Naval guys could probably gun them down pretty easily. I know this would make it all too simple and boreing there, and would quite the anticlimax, I get why the writers wouldn't have him do it that way, I'm just wondering if anyone else here sees why that idea wouldn't work.
Posts: 733 | Registered: Sep 2003
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quote: Hmm... I did not notice Jack cutting his hand, but I could be wrong.
Teshi, you say "full moon" at first, but then switch to moonlight. I thought that it was any moonlight, but I am not at all sure on that point.
I seems like I am wrong. I really don't remember it, but I do have a memory like sieve and I am terribly unobservant... In that case, it is all the pirates who need to put their blood in- which of course means that Bootstrap was a skeleton.
Any moonlight makes the pirates turn, however it seems like whenever the turn in the movie, it is near to, or at, a full moon. I was using the moon as a calendar.
Posts: 8473 | Registered: Apr 2003
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"Also why wouldn't Jack leave the coin in the chest and just have Will put his back while the Pirates were heading out to the ship...."
I believe this is because Jack, for all Will SAYS he's a "good man" at the end of the movie, fully intended for the British navy to be slaughtered by the zombie pirates.
Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
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I don't think he really wanted the navy to be slaughtered, but at the same time I don't think he would have cared if they did.
What I think is, he took the coin because by doing so he was lowering the chances of being killed himself.
Posts: 3852 | Registered: Feb 2002
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I think he wanted somebody to be there to slaughter/capture the mutinous pirate crew when the curse was lifted.
Posts: 1784 | Registered: Jun 2001
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Probably time, yes. Perhaps it could be, that since Barbosa put them all back, even without the blood debt, that it resetted the new cursing group.
Posts: 23 | Registered: Dec 2003
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<--- Read half the thread, got frustrated and thus had to post.
Don't know if you've already come to this conclusion, but if you listen to the comentary with the writers everything is explained. Everyone who takes a coin directly from the chest is cursed, Bootstrap Bill was crushed, then drowned, and yes, the pirates still bleed.
Posts: 981 | Registered: Aug 2003
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-- Okay, lets set some rules down, I highly doubt the writers wrote a full movie about a certain topic 'The Curse of the Black Pearl' without thinking about this a little- You, on the other hand, just haven't quite thought enough.
- Simply enough. If one is to take a coin from the chest, one is under the curse until all is returned and the blood is repayed. - Everyone that takes one, puts it back with their blood- once all of this has been done. The curse is removed, start over again.
- Jack just wants his bloody ship (and his hat), so he'll take any measures to get it- he's also dragged by curiosity- why not take a coin? If his plan with Will fails, at least he won't be killed, he'll be cursed long enough for the next 'opportune moment'. It also puts him in a state of control. He decides howthe curse is lifted cause he's one ofthe only people left to repay the blood.
- When the moon light hits them that is uncovered by clouds, they're skeletons.. when the clouds are covering the moon, they aren't skeletons. - Watch the movie, they go through great efforts to show what state the moon is in.
- If they need Bootstraps blood, Bootstrap hasn't paid his blood yet, therefore he must be cursed- if he's cursed, he can't die.. though he may be scattered all over the place, he isn't dead till the curse is lifted. -- Most likely keeping it open for a sequal. - which it has now been decided that it'll be a trilogy- the next 2 movies will be shot back to back- much like the 2nd and 3rd Matrix movie. My hopes that there'll be a prequal and then a sequal. -- If you think about it there is alot to be told in the past- Bootstrap and Jack's story, how Barbosa got control of the ship, the way they got to the isle d'morta (spelling?)- I mean, all that treasure? Not guarded by something? And did you see all the ships sunk at the entrance?-- How about the compass? And if you noticed Mr. Gibbs was on the ship at the beginning afraid of pirates- but later on you find out somehow he became friends with Jack before he lost the Pearl.. - and Tortuga? Hello! What about all the women in Jack's past? So many stories untold, his escape from the island- there's alot of meat for the writers to chew on. They could even follow Bootstrap past the point of when this first movie takes place and show how he got free- which would be a perfect lee-way into the next movie- when Bootstrap returns and maybe another bad guy they ran into in the prequal returns after dissapearing from the second movie like Bootstrap.. But i'll stop rambling now.
Anyway about it- Bootstrap is alive until the curse was dropped- where was he when the curse went away? Who knows.. wait for the next 2 movies.
posted
I was trying to remember what I meant to ask about when I read the post before this.
What does th compass point to. Somewhere on the DVD, someone says the compass is explained, but it's not. I originally thought the compass pointed to the Black Pearl, but that's not right, because at the very end, Jack uses the compass on the Black Pearl.
Does it point to whatever he wants it to, or the Isle D'Moita (or whatever). Is he going back, at the end of the film, to collect the treasure? Makes sense, but is that it?
Posts: 8473 | Registered: Apr 2003
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It points to the island (I'm not even going to try and spell it).
Gibbs makes the comment: "The compass doesn't point north. But we're not trying to get north, are we?"
Posts: 3852 | Registered: Feb 2002
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I still want to know how Will Turner got out of the exploding ship... He just appeared!!! He was stuck! The ship exploded! What the heck!?!?
Posts: 4816 | Registered: Apr 2003
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But no one actually ever says "It points to the island."
However, "it points to the island" is now going to be my official reply from now on.
Ryuko, I think that is the one thing in the movie that has no explanation. The only feasible one is that there is a huge great hole in the hull, which is impossible, because the ship would sink far faster than it did. However, the ships are quite far apart by the time the explosion happens, so presumably some time has passed. It is possible that a hole was blown in the hull, but unlikely. (And most unlikely that Will could swim out the hole, against the incoming water.)
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I don't think Bootstrap Bill could have been cursed, because one of the Pirates who was cursed thought Will might be his ghost, if he had been cursed too then they would all have known he couldn't possibly have a ghost, unless you considered each of them a ghost.![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
In that case, it is all the pirates who need to put their blood in- which of course means that Bootstrap was a skeleton. 
