quote: On Valentine's Day, nothing says "I love you" like oral sex. It's a great way to express your appreciation or love for someone.
I can not believe this article made it into a school paper. the quote above is the least offensive of the entire article.
Don't get me wrong, sex, expressed however you wish to express it, is a good thing for a couples who wish to express there love for one another. But to put something like this in a paper, where kids have access to it is not a very good move by the editor.
These articles should probably stay where they belong, penthouse or playboy. That way I could, I mean...people, ya, people could choose to read them once I, uh..they were finished with all the other articles.
Posts: 1294 | Registered: Oct 2003
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posted
It's ridiculously inappropriate. Stunningly. The editor and the author should be suspended, if not let go immediately.
Posts: 37449 | Registered: May 1999
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posted
To have an online edition, I'm pretty sure it's college. Not to mention the vodka, assuming there are underage reading it. That just jumped out in a scan. I don't know of a religion that uses vodka- though a quote from Speaker comes to mind. Anyway, it does seem tasteless. But Oral Sex has kind of become PG-13 material.
Posts: 11017 | Registered: Apr 2003
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posted
I think this is a college paper. I believe in freedom of speech but this is rediculous. Perhaps the author could have handled the subject a little less graphically and then it may have been ok. But this is a how to piece the likes of which Larry Flint would be proud of. Do you really need that kind of detail when reading the friendly pages of your local college paper over your pancakes in the morning?
Posts: 1294 | Registered: Oct 2003
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posted
It's a university. Northern Arizona University.
I think it's incredibly inappropriate, because explicit sexual details, like how to give oral sex, don't belong in any medium where access by minors is probable. A university newspaper is not Penthouse or Playboy, it's not sold in a paper cover at adult book stores, where minors aren't supposed to be. It's something that gets dropped on the kitchen table by an older brother or sister, and is easily read by anyone in the family.
Free speech and all that, but we do have some standards of decency in society where minors are concerned. That's my only issue with it - I think it's in very poor taste and it should not have been published by a newspaper. After all, if it appeared in Penthouse, we wouldn't be having this discussion.
Posts: 14428 | Registered: Aug 2001
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posted
There's no way this would have been published in a high school paper -- they're almost never independent organizations.
At first I was pretty affronted by it. But the more I think about it, the more I think the paper has the right to print whatever it wants, but is ultimately responsible to its readership -- I know one professor wrote a letter responding to another one of this girl's columns calling for the paper to be shut down. Kids could stop reading it; maybe someone will try to set up a competing paper.
Maybe this is a little too free market for some....but I don't think we ought to be prohibiting bad taste.
Posts: 1784 | Registered: Jun 2001
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Yea, oral sex has become somewhat less threatening to see and hear about lately but that is usually in the form of jokes and sly comments. This is a little too in your face, parden the pun, to be acceptable. I'd rate this much more along the lines of XXX.
Posts: 1294 | Registered: Oct 2003
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posted
There may not be many minors who attend college but there are a lot who would have access to this article. Most professors have children and then there are the custodial staff, the dining staff, the office and clerical staff, and on and on and on...
Posts: 1294 | Registered: Oct 2003
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posted
I used to read the independent college paper when my sister was in college and I was in high school.
Posts: 11017 | Registered: Apr 2003
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Usually those people aren't going to be living on campus. And it's the responsibility of their parents, anyway, to protect them from this kind of material -- if there's something offensive in it, don't bring it home with you.
Posts: 1784 | Registered: Jun 2001
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posted
Look, when I was a "minor" I used to go to the local bookstore and buy Cosmo. Should they not have the right to publish, even though they discuss in detail various sexual positions, simply because a minor might accidently stumble upon it?
posted
This is indeed the online version of The Northern Arizona University paper. I personally think they should have put some kind of warning on the website or done something to limit access to the story by minors.
Posts: 4569 | Registered: Dec 2003
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posted
Hmmm. I can't tell - beatnix19 has said it shouldn't have been published, but not directly that it should have been prohibited. At least the way I read it.
I can see inferring the call for banning it from the remarks though.
beatnix19 - can you clarify, please?
Posts: 26071 | Registered: Oct 2003
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posted
This is a good way to get a little attention for NAU. And colleges seem to get tons of mileage from "controversial" stuff like this. Not presidential campaigns, but definitely colleges.
Posts: 5957 | Registered: Oct 2001
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posted
I'm advocating good taste, not censorship. Is a school paper really the place for this type of article? Definately not! Does that mean this kind of article should not be written? Again, definately not. In fact, my wife and I purchased Kim Catrell's book on this very topic last year. It was a very enlightening book and it was published in the right forum.
posted
I didn't suggest firing anybody, I called it inappropriate. The fact that it's an online version, well that helps a little. And you'll note I didn't say there were minors on campus, I said it's easy for a minor to get a copy of a campus newspaper from an older sibling or even a parent who is attending college.
It's a question of expectation. You want people to keep their kids from inappropriate material - I agree. But, while I know to keep Cosmo out of my house, I don't think about censoring a newspaper. While I don't let my kids watch "Sex in the City" I do let them watch the SuperBowl.
See the difference? We have a trust that the media will uphold certain standards, and that they'll let us know when we need to be monitoring our kids. For example, putting the more violent and sexually explicit programming later at night, and Blue's Clues on during the day.
A newspaper is not something a mother is going to snatch out of a child's hand, knowing that there is inappropriate content inside.
Now, as to this issue in particular - it's student-run, independent, (though I'm not sure if no university resources were used to produce it, that might change things) and this is an online version and any smart parent closely monitors online usage by their kids. So, I don't have nearly as much a problem with it as I did when I thought it was the university's main print newspaper.
Still think it's inapproriate, though.
Posts: 14428 | Registered: Aug 2001
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posted
I think it's extremely inappropriate, but not specifically because of the minors angle. University newspaper reporters and columnists are often aspiring to be reporters, columnists, or editors in the real world. Therefore, university newspapers are typically patterned after "real" newspapers (except in the sad cases where they bear more resemblence to high school papers). This topic would be inappropriate for either a real newspaper or a high school one. Also, community standards of what constitutes appropriateness or obscenity are not rooted specifically in the accessibilit of the material to children, but in what the standards of the community at large are. The community at large in this case is not, contrary to the belief of the students who published this, limited to 18 - 22 year-old college students. Finally, even if something is not explicitly deemed obscene, that does not mean that it is appropriate fodder for all venues. An article giving specific instructions in oral sex has no logical business being in a university newspaper.
I also don't believe that the aim of the students was to inform, but to push the envelope. That makes this whole article seem to me to be potty-mouthed immaturity.
And, whether it accomplishes anything or not, I think mailing a copy of the article to the families of the students (and faculty advisor) involved in publishing it is a pretty good idea.
Posts: 1112 | Registered: Jan 2003
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posted
Not something I particularly want in a paper, but we have the First Amendment for a reason. I have read much worse in books, not that it really matters. As long as they did not violate any valid, pre-existing policy of the newspaper then they should have no disciplinary action taken against them.
pooka - What is wrong with vodka? Alcohol producers advertise on television all the time, and my gut feeling is that any minor who would be interested in reading a college newspaper is going to be old enough to handle the fact that people drink.
Posts: 1364 | Registered: Feb 2003
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I wasn't talking about anything you said -- I was referencing Tom's post. I actually agree with most of what you've said Posts: 1784 | Registered: Jun 2001
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posted
The first ammendment doesn't change some things from being inappropriate. I'm not saying that you were suggesting it does, but I wanted to clarify, because I frequently see people use the first ammenment as justification that somethig vulgar should be expressed, or even rewarded. Just because one has the right to behave like an ass doesn't make one any less of an ass for behaving like one.
In any case, school newspapers don't enjoy first ammendment protection when it comes to violating the policies of their own administration and/or university. So while I have not advocated disciplinary action, it would not be unconstitutional.
Actually, I simply think the newspaper should face consequences, not the author. Specifically, the faculty advisor should be replaced and issues in the immediate future ought to have much closer supervision. They have abused their freedom and ought to have it curtailed for a bit. I also think the paper ought to (be made to) publish an apology for offending the standards of their community.
Posts: 1112 | Registered: Jan 2003
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posted
You know...I'm not seeing anything overly wrong with the article...it's from a college, likelyhood is that minors won't be reading it. Overall, it was well written...like it or not, it got your attention, and kept you all the way through...though possibly because of shock value. It promoted safe sex right from the start, as well as if you read between the lines, it gave the golden rule of sharing. It's a college newspaper, and should be taken as an article of such, likelyhood is that this is being taken as appaling by everybody because of the difference in cultures of generations, I can tell you right now that showing this article to a bunch of college students will produce less shock than if you showed it to their parents. Sex is rather apparent in the world, whether or not you want to acknowledge it, it's here, and it's on college campuses. Satyagraha
Posts: 1986 | Registered: Apr 2001
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The paper here at GW owns the building it's housed in, is independently funded, and is not overseen by the school.
They do, however, have the right to circulate the publication on campus. There may be a rule at NAU that would allow the school to disallow circulation.
Posts: 1784 | Registered: Jun 2001
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posted
..being taken as appaling by everybody because of the difference in cultures of generations, I can tell you right now that showing this article to a bunch of college students will produce less shock than if you showed it to their parents.
Not necessarily. Not all college students are alike, nor are all parents.
I'd want to know about the paper. Is this section known for its outrageousness, its sexual content, its advice column? Compared to the rest of the paper it seems inappropriate to me, and I'm a man who can appreciate a good oral sex article.
Posts: 7790 | Registered: Aug 2000
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posted
Good point - I assumed it was a general interest newspaper when I said it was inappropriate. Context matters here. Articles like this in Cosmo or risque humor mags or Playboy are not inappropriate (although they still may be tacky).
Now, some of the article's I'm not opposed to, even at the high school level -- such as those that compared different types of birth control and gave information (much like we did on a recent thread here).
But I guess parents thought it was all a little too much for this age level.
posted
Icarus - In general I believe the First Amendment is abused when it comes to freedom of speech and/or the press. I realize my opinions conflict with much legal precedent, but I am not even sure that I could ban yelling "fire" in a crowded theater, much less anything that has no chance of causing immediate physical injury. I do agree, of course, that if the college was connected with the paper then any existing policies should have been enforced, and certainly they would have the right to make new policies. However, if no such policy was in place then no action should be taken against anyone, even if the paper had been connected to the school. If that was in my school newspaper, or even my regular newspaper, I could scan the title and perhaps the first paragraph and just decide not to read further. No need to make a huge deal out of it.
Posts: 1364 | Registered: Feb 2003
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posted
The First Amendment protects speech. It doesn't guarantee distribution.
While the paper could not prohibit the author from writing what she liked, there's nothing that says they have to print it, or that the college has to distribute it. She is, of course, welcome to submit it to a more appropriate venue.
Alternately, if the paper set up an advice column or regular feature about sex, then the article would not have been as unexpected or (to me) as inappropriate. This came out of nowhere.
I don't think action should be taken beyond a "knock it off" letter. If inappropriate material continues to get printed, I could see the college revoking the campus distribution privileges.
[ February 26, 2004, 05:20 PM: Message edited by: Chris Bridges ]
Posts: 7790 | Registered: Aug 2000
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posted
....I actually think it's a regular column about sex. Try doing a search for the author's name on the website....it seems lots of people object to her columns, but she seems to be writing them regularly.
If that's the case, should judgment be as harsh? i.e. would proper action be to simply reprimand the writer and to encourage her to tone it down next time, or to still close the paper/fire the editor?
Posts: 1784 | Registered: Jun 2001
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posted
Ah-ha. It *is* a regular column, called "Something to Think About."
The column Ms. Fuller wrote the week of Feb. 19th is prefaced by the following disclaimer:
quote:Warning: The following column contains mature content, not suitable for young audiences
Some of her other column topics include condom sizes, chemical/sexual body odor ( ), and disparities in marriage and consent laws.
Posts: 1784 | Registered: Jun 2001
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posted
So it looks as if that was added after the oral sex article to try to defuse some of the complaints.
As long as some sort of disclaimer - or warning - is involved, and the college is not funding it, I'd leave it up to the editors to decide how to run their paper.
Posts: 7790 | Registered: Aug 2000
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posted
It's for college students, who probably already knew about oral sex before reading this article. I don't think it would really shock anyone, but perhaps would offend them. The majority of college students start out 18, and those who are not turn 18 within a few months or so. 18 is old enough to vote, get married, and buy a house. Why not read an article about oral sex? Besides, aren't kids having sex younger and younger now?
Posts: 91 | Registered: Nov 2003
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[I don't mean this as a crack or as an innuendo. It is just not particularly well-written, and I get surly when I think a writer believes I will be titillated merely by shock-value. Puh-leez. *yawn Reminds me of the XXXSEE-REAL-NAKED-GIRLS camera pop-up ads. Which is sad, because this _could_ be a very interesting topic from many perspectives. Instead it's just intellectually (and aesthetically) lazy. I'd much rather spend my time reading about what whomever gets out of his drain with the snake.
That'll be cool.
As far as this article goes, it ain't no Light as the Breeze. ]
posted
I read a lot of risque literature (yes, now you know something shocking about me), and I've been known to write...ahem...erotica. I believe in a frank discussion of sex in appropriate venues.
That newspaper article was, frankly, just really badly written. *shrug* To echo some of the other comments, it seemed to be written for shock value (a juvenile 'Tee-Hee, look at me, I'm *naaaughty*'). It didn't convince me to engage my partner in more fulfilling oral sex (the point of rhetoric is to convince, right?), it just made be go, "Oh, fer heaven's sakes" and roll my eyes.
Sheesh.
I hope the 'author' is not majoring in Journalism, but if she is, I hope she is minoring in something at which she is more skillful.
I'm suprised that happened in Salina, which tends to be more conservative than the other larger cities in Kansas. Had that been Manhattan, Topeka, or Wichita in the headlines, I probably wouldn't raise an eyebrow. I went to college in that town, and it's an aggregate of western Kansas. More like a small town than the college towns of Manhattan (KSU) or Lawrence (KU). I can understand why that poor principal's phone rang off the hook.
And to all you Hatrackers, that town is pronounced with a long "I" sound, not the hispanic "E"...Sa-LINE-a. hehe, pet peeve Posts: 1813 | Registered: Apr 2001
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posted
This isn't all that unusual. The thing is, many college newspapers have sex columns, including Yale, Brown, Berkeley, and NYU. That doesn't make it right, but it's getting more and more common.
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